Sat 13th Sept

Harry Angstrom

I'd be surprised if Billy Lee doesn't get a holiday after that. He went for half a gap and knocked Joseph out of the way.

mailburner

Mustajeeb home and hosed if the betting is to be believed, hard enough to see past it

don't fancy glb or darwin myself, think tonto might be a bigger danger

Harry Angstrom

Howjoe1

Poor ride Joseph. Went too soon and picked off by the master Ryan Moore

andyman

Well. That was unexpected.

Ryan Moore has beaten the top middle-distance three olds of both sex's this year then.

UrbanFret

No surprise there. Another coolmore hyped up donkey stuffed. And some were wondering why he wouldn't run in the arc.:o

Peintre Celebre

Ryan Moore didnt beat him. I said last time how poorly Hughes was on him just watch it again, he let Australia get first run and he was never going to get near him. It was a shocking ride

boomtown84

Pit stop in the last?

FIVE2_THREE

UrbanFret wrote: »

No surprise there. Another coolmore hyped up donkey stuffed. And some were wondering why he wouldn't run in the arc.:o

I trust the you made a killing laying him right ?

Mgoraf

Double derby and international winner a donkey lol...

He's probably run half a furlong further than the winner why JOB had him that wide is a mystery

mailburner

Peintre Celebre wrote: »

Ryan Moore didnt beat him. I said last time how poorly Hughes was on him just watch it again, he let Australia get first run and he was never going to get near him. It was a shocking ride

you were right, backed him that day myself
today the first day since the dante that I didnt get involved sadly

mailburner

paddy paid out on australia on all ap bets up till 10am yester/thurs, not sure which


that is good news

UrbanFret

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

I trust the you made a killing laying him right ?

What has that got to do with coolmore hyping up an average horse! He has never performed to anything above a rating of 125 in my opinion and never will. It's O brien that's going around saying he's the best he's trained and he wasn't right at york you will see the real Australia today. All Bull****!

FIVE2_THREE

UrbanFret wrote: »

What has that got to do with coolmore hyping up an average horse! He has never performed to anything above a rating of 125 in my opinion and never will. It's O brien that's going around saying he's the best he's trained and he wasn't right at york you will see the real Australia today. All Bull****!

Once again people reading way too much into what the trainer says. Muhammad Ali said he was the greatest of ALL TIME!!! how much stock do you put into that? as Far as Australia being an average horse that could't be further from the truth how many "average horses" win two Derbies ?

UrbanFret

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

Once again people reading way too much into what the trainer says. Muhammad Ali said he was the greatest of ALL TIME!!! how much stock do you put into that? as Far as Australia being an average horse that could't be further from the truth how many "average horses" win two Derbies ?

Oh come on the 2nd derby he won was akin to a morning gallop at ballydoyle. Ali was a better boxer than Australia is a racehorse to boot.

mailburner

australia is very good no doubt about that but so is the grey gatsby
dont think folks are giving the winner enough credit

FIVE2_THREE

UrbanFret wrote: »

Oh come on the 2nd derby he won was akin to a morning gallop at ballydoyle. Ali was a better boxer than Australia is a racehorse to boot.

May I suggest that you take your winning that you made from laying Australia today. head over to the sales to purchases a horse and see if it's easy to win an Irish Derby. I guarantee your opinions will change.

jimjamcos

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

May I suggest that you take your winning that you made from laying Australia today. head over to the sales to purchases a horse and see if it's easy to win an Irish Derby. I guarantee your opinions will change.

Be fair, he's correct, the Irish Derby was as poor as we've seen. In fairness to him, the English Derby had one other horse in Kingston Hill who could go onto better but that was no great field either. He won well against the elders in Juddamonte but, be honest, has he ever given you the visual impression of a true world beater, a horse who was beating those fields at his ease? He didn't put distance between himself and KH in Derby, and his Juddamonte was not near as comfortable as reported with TGG left with a lot to do before staying on. Australia is a very good horse, a proper Grp1 animal, but now beaten 3 times he's no superstar. The only superstar in training is the mighty Kingman!

FIVE2_THREE

jimjamcos wrote: »

Be fair, he's correct, the Irish Derby was as poor as we've seen. In fairness to him, the English Derby had one other horse in Kingston Hill who could go onto better but that was no great field either. He won well against the elders in Juddamonte but, be honest, has he ever given you the visual impression of a true world beater, a horse who was beating those fields at his ease? He didn't put distance between himself and KH in Derby, and his Juddamonte was not near as comfortable as reported with TGG left with a lot to do before staying on. Australia is a very good horse, a proper Grp1 animal, but now beaten 3 times he's no superstar. The only superstar in training is the mighty Kingman!

This is reminiscent of the people who call boxers and other athletes bums. it's easy to stand on the sidelines and judge.

jimjamcos

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

This is reminiscent of the people who call boxers and other athletes bums. it's easy to stand on the sidelines and judge.

Hyperbe. Nobody's saying he's a seller but if you think the Derbies he won were strong, well you need to pull your head out of your ass. Not every race/horse has to be glossed over because uneducated people such as fans are not entitled to comment. You'll go far with that opinion, a real open mind you have there..

Gringo180

jimjamcos wrote: »

Hyperbe. Nobody's saying he's a seller but if you think the Derbies he won were strong, well you need to pull your head out of your ass. Not every race/horse has to be glossed over because uneducated people such as fans are not entitled to comment. You'll go far with that opinion, a real open mind you have there..

Just thinking, the last few Derbys have been absolutely shockers, Camelot, Rule The World and Australias. Were due a good crop of middle distance 3yo's soon.

chinguetti

If Australia was as good as we were told and from what they said the last day, he was not fully fit at York. Therefore he was being aimed for today so he should have won pulling away tonight and he didn't.

I'm not saying he's useless but he's not the horse they claim him to be. Where they go next will be interesting as his reputation has been dented for the breeding shed.

Harry Angstrom

You could run that race again next week and Australia would win it. He was sucker punched by The Grey Gatsby today. I can't believe TGG is the better horse of the two.

tryfix

Harry Angstrom wrote: »

You could run that race again next week and Australia would win it. He was sucker punched by The Grey Gatsby today. I can't believe TGG is the better horse of the two.

T'was a terrible ride by Joseph, all the way around I kept thinking to myself what the hell is he at. He had the notion in his head of sweeping around the bend at the end and drawing clear but he kept travelling on the outside around all the bends covering an insane amount of extra ground.

T'was actually a top class performance by both horses, just look at how they far they left the rest behind. It's the second time that Australia has given a 7l beating to Mukhadram, and if Joseph had laid into him at the finish he'd have held off The Grey Gatsby.

Not so sure whether Australia needs further, he probably does cause he did eventually start to pull away at the end of the Derby from the Leger winner, but he should win the rematch with the Grey Gatsby at Champions day cause Junior won't be allowed to take the scenic route again..

FIVE2_THREE

jimjamcos wrote: »

Hyperbe. Nobody's saying he's a seller but if you think the Derbies he won were strong, well you need to pull your head out of your ass. Not every race/horse has to be glossed over because uneducated people such as fans are not entitled to comment. You'll go far with that opinion, a real open mind you have there..

You people keep going back to how strong this race was or that race was. Listen Nobody has access to a time machine. We can't bring back Ribot, Sea Bird or Nijinsky. all you can do is run against who shows up.

Harry Angstrom

tryfix wrote: »

T'was a terrible ride by Joseph, all the way around I kept thinking to myself what the hell is he at. He had the notion in his head of sweeping around the bend at the end and drawing clear but he kept travelling on the outside around all the bends covering an insane amount of extra ground.

T'was actually a top class performance by both horses, just look at how they far they left the rest behind. It's the second time that Australia has given a 7l beating to Mukhadram, and if Joseph had laid into him at the finish he'd have held off The Grey Gatsby.

Not so sure whether Australia needs further, he probably does cause he did eventually start to pull away at the end of the Derby from the Leger winner, but he should win the rematch with the Grey Gatsby at Champions day cause Junior won't be allowed to take the scenic route again..

I can kind of understand why Joseph wanted to stay wide. I don't like Leopardstown's flat track. It's a tight track and if you get stuck on the rail, you're goosed. Obviously Joseph took the point of view that he was on the best horse in the race and took the calculated risk of keeping him wide. The pacemakers went a crazy pace and Australia was undone by this. Australia showed great cruising speed all the way round and Joseph probably committed too soon because of this. If you pause the race just before the home turn, Australia is more or less cruising and The Grey Gatsby is struggling. Granted, in hindsight, Joseph went too soon but he most probably felt he had the field covered and wanted to win impressively. Ballydoyle have never really mastered the art of pacemaking and they weren't helped by the inclusion of Sheikh Hamdan's rag either. Run the race again and Australia would be the winner.

mailburner

when australia cruised alongside tgg it looked like there would only be one winner
I feel job possilby thought he would win the race no matter where the horse was but credit goes to the winner and equally to ryan moore
australia the better horse but not by much

Peintre Celebre

Think people are disrespecting the winner saying how bad a ride the runner up got and how he'd reverse the tables. Does no one else thing Gatsby got a woeful ride the last day? Just look at Hughes giving Australia first run whilst he was in a pocket. Shocking

jimjamcos

FIVE2_THREE wrote: »

You people keep going back to how strong this race was or that race was. Listen Nobody has access to a time machine. We can't bring back Ribot, Sea Bird or Nijinsky. all you can do is run against who shows up.

Jesus Christ, that is some poor logic. What do you expect 'us people' to judge the horse on? Believe, like you clearly do, that he's one of the great horses just because his trainer tells us, standard of race is irrelevant eh!? Fact is the horse won two average Derbies, was never pulling away in the English. Those are facts.

UrbanFret

One thing is now certain. Coolmore have a really big decision to make. They won't go for the arc (although by winning that his star would rise again). so that leaves the champion or the QE2, either way there's an ambush waiting for him in both. Free eagle certainly looked the part(backed up by the time) The grey Gatsby won't shirk the issue either plus several other more than capable performers will turn up in the former whilst kingman lies in wait in the QE2. Not sure the breeders will come running with their mares just yet!