Sam Harris on the Israel-Palestine Conflict

R P McMurphy

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

100 tons bombs? Never heard of any of those in any military inventory anywhere in the world. What other imaginary weapons can you dream up?

The Israeli operation destroyed tunnels, tunnel entrances, rocket launchers, rocket stores and eliminated terrorist cells and terrorists leaders.

Hamas uses its own people as human shields while firing rockets at Israeli civilians.

There is nothing that Israel did that Ireland would not do if we were attacked by a terrorist organization using civilian human shields.

The Gazans voted for Hamas. They sowed the wind and are reaping the whirlwind. I have no pity or sympathy for them whatsoever.

Do you think the israelis should dismantle the settlements in the west bank?

Delirium

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

100 tons bombs? Never heard of any of those in any military inventory anywhere in the world. What other imaginary weapons can you dream up?

The Israeli operation destroyed tunnels, tunnel entrances, rocket launchers, rocket stores and eliminated terrorist cells and terrorists leaders.

Hamas uses its own people as human shields while firing rockets at Israeli civilians.

There is nothing that Israel did that Ireland would not do if we were attacked by a terrorist organization using civilian human shields.

The Gazans voted for Hamas. They sowed the wind and are reaping the whirlwind. I have no pity or sympathy for them whatsoever.

Which exist because of the actions of Israel.

Brown Bomber

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

100 tons bombs? Never heard of any of those in any military inventory anywhere in the world. What other imaginary weapons can you dream up? .

I mispoke. I meant to say 100 1-ton bombs.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article21546.htm


What other weapons of mass-murder, torture and collective punishment do the Butchers of the IDF use?


We can start with chemical weapons?
<li class="g">Israel admits white phosphorus use - Al Jazeera

And this is especially sick http://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/nov/03/israel


Israel is deploying a terrifying new tactic against Palestinian civilians in the Gaza Strip by letting loose deafening "sound bombs" that cause widespread fear, induce miscarriages and traumatise children.
The removal of Jewish settlers from the Gaza Strip opened the way for the military to use air force jets to create dozens of sonic booms by breaking the sound barrier at low altitude, sending shockwaves across the territory, often at night. Palestinians liken the sound to an earthquake or huge bomb. They describe the effect as being hit by a wall of air that is painful on the ears, sometimes causing nosebleeds and "leaving you shaking inside".

The Palestinian health ministry says the sonic booms have led to miscarriages and heart problems. The United Nations has demanded an end to the tactic, saying it causes panic attacks in children. The shockwaves have also damaged buildings by cracking walls and smashing thousands of windows.

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

The Israeli operation destroyed tunnels, tunnel entrances, rocket launchers, rocket stores and eliminated terrorist cells and terrorists leaders. .

More importantly they have also literally destroyed many human beings, many of them Children. They have destroyed their ability to function as human beings in the Cage Israel has forced them into. They have also destroyed any chance of Peace and their barbarity has also destroyed any international good will left (that isn't paid for by Sheldon Adelson or the Israel Lobby) as people finally see past their delusions and see the Israeli government for the messianic, racist, violent, right-wing lunatics they are.

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

100 Hamas uses its own people as human shields while firing rockets at Israeli civilians.

Prove it, or shut up about it.

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

There is nothing that Israel did that Ireland would not do if we were attacked by a terrorist organization using civilian human shields.

Utter nonsense. Ireland has been attacked by terrorists. We didn't start using our military to slaughter Children of the same race as the accused.

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

The Gazans voted for Hamas. They sowed the wind and are reaping the whirlwind. I have no pity or sympathy for them whatsoever.

Which makes you sound like an extremist yourself.


What kind of human being has no sympathy for a Child screaming in agony after being
hit by shrapnel from a bomb?

Azwaldo55

SW wrote: »

Which exist because of the actions of Israel.

Hamas exists because of Islam.

The Koran and Hadiths command Muslims to kill Jews and fight jihad.

kylith

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

The Arabs do not want good relations.

They want to destroy Israel and kill all the Jews as I said.

But that's not what I asked.

Do you, or do you not, think that the Israelis should evacuate the settlers and dismantle the illegal settlements they have built on Palestinian land?

kylith

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Hamas exists because of Islam.

The Koran and Hadiths command Muslims to kill Jews and fight jihad.

And the Torah and Bible contain similar commandments. You going to show them some hate too?

Delirium

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Hamas exists because of Islam.

The Koran and Hadiths command Muslims to kill Jews and fight jihad.

I suggest you re-read the text. Hamas was formed after Israel had killed hundreds of Palestinians. So Israel must accept the part it played in helping form Hamas with those killings.

Brown Bomber

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Hamas exists because of Islam.

The Koran and Hadiths command Muslims to kill Jews and fight jihad.

Try to educate yourself. This is from Victor Ostrovsky, Mossad Whistleblower.


"Supporting the radical elements of Muslim fundamentalism sat well with he Mossad's general plan for the region. An Arab world run by fundamentalists would not be a party to any negotiations with the West, thus leaving Israel again as the only democratic, rational country in the region. And if the Mossad could arrange for the Hamas (Palestinian fundamentalists) to take over the Palestinian streets from the PLO, then the picture would be complete."
Victor Ostrovsky - The Other Side of Deception - pg. 197




This is from Dr Robert Pape, international expert on suicide terrorism and will explain to you why some Palestinians want to kill Jews
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL2F5A077275CED491


And can you quote the Quran on where it says to kill Jews?

tayto lover

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Are you going to admit you were utterly wrong?

This is the smoking gun of smoking guns.

Ha ha imagine finding that after you have murdered and bombarded those same "human shields".
Gullible is gullible.

tayto lover

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Anyway there is now a ceasefire and Israel has announced that it has completed eliminating the terror tunnels.

Hamas has got its ass comprehensively handed to them.

Job well done!

If Hamas does this again they will get the same medicine.

Wonderful victory for Israel.

I just want to congratulate the IDF and the Israeli people and most of all their heroic leader Benjamin Netanyahu! HERO!

I was going to post pictures of murdered dead children but what the hell.
Funny how the IDF lost many soldiers when they came into Gaza and fought on the streets. They are great as Nancy Griffith says "from a distance".

Akrasia

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Anyway there is now a ceasefire and Israel has announced that it has completed eliminating the terror tunnels.

Hamas has got its ass comprehensively handed to them.

Job well done!

If Hamas does this again they will get the same medicine.

Wonderful victory for Israel.

I just want to congratulate the IDF and the Israeli people and most of all their heroic leader Benjamin Netanyahu! HERO!

And we should all look forward to another bombardment in 4 years time when the tunnel network has been restored

The people of Gaza do not like Israel more today than they did a month ago.

If there were any moderates in Gaza, they have absolutely no hope after this. Even if all military action ends today, the suffering in Gaza continues, more people will die from wounds and infection and exposure and disease in the refugee camps.

There are now a new generation of children who have had to watch their friends and family and neighbours getting massacred in front of their eyes.

When the grief and shock subsides, it will be replaced with hatred and given that their own lives have no hope of peace and security, and their very lives can be taken from them at any moment by a fresh round of Israeli air strikes, they may feel that they have literally nothing to lose from joining in the resistance.

Corkfeen

I think most military people would struggle to find any form of a victory in this. Primarily killing civilians, displacing hundreds of thousands. Creating new generations of extremists because they and their families were unfairly targeted. Plus it's a pr disaster for Israel, most are perfectly aware that they've committed war crimes and behaved like complete arseholes. But Azwaldo can have a little party for himself.

robindch

tayto lover wrote: »

I was going to post pictures of murdered dead children but what the hell.

None of that please.

Azwaldo55

tayto lover wrote: »

Funny how the IDF lost many soldiers when they came into Gaza and fought on the streets. They are great as Nancy Griffith says "from a distance".

Hundreds of Hamas terrorists have been killed for the loss of 64 IDF soldiers.
The tunnels have all been blown up, thousands of their rockets have been destroyed and Hamas infrastructure is in rubble.
If you cared about the Palestinians at all you would be telling them to stop attacking Israel.
This is the third time since 2007 they have got their asses handed right back to them.
If they want to do this again in a few years then fine, Israel will oblige them!:D
I mean how many times to these idiots want to lose? LOL

Icepick

Corkfeen wrote: »

In relation to the human shield stuff, most journalists in Gaza are stating that they see no evidence of it.

How many bomb shelters have Hamas built for the civilians?
And if 0, why?
They are preparing for a war every day and are aware of Israel's capabilities.

Delirium

Icepick wrote: »

How many bomb shelters have Hamas built for the civilians?
And if 0, why?
They are preparing for a war every day and are aware of Israel's capabilities.

Because Israel would never bomb them for building underground bunkers/tunnels.:rolleyes:

robindch

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Hundreds of Hamas terrorists have been killed for the loss of 64 IDF soldiers.

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius, eh?

Brian Shanahan

SW wrote: »

Which exist because of the actions of Israel.

You have to remember to that it was money, and other support such as the organisation of talks amongst various islamist Palestinians, from the Mossad and Shin Bet which facilitated the founding of Hamas.

The original purpose of Hamas for Israel was to destroy the unity of the PLO, thus making easier the Israeli take-over of Jerusalem, Gaza and the West Bank.

And like, say, Al-Qaeda Hamas have morphed out of their original purpose of being a cat's paw to being an enemy of their creators (in the case of Al-Qaeda substitute the US and KSA for Israel).

Brian Shanahan

robindch wrote: »

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius, eh?

Shouldn't that be "Romanes Eunt Domen?":P

After googling, I get what you mean. But the Israeli response is closer to Wir Mussen die Muslamen auszuroten than "kill them all, god shall know his own".

Azwaldo55

Corkfeen wrote: »

I think most military people would struggle to find any form of a victory in this.

The tunnels have all been blown up, hundreds of dead jihadis are fattening the worms, rocket fire has stopped and rocket stores are depleted etc etc. Hamas is in real trouble.

Primarily killing civilians, displacing hundreds of thousands.

This is what happens when civilians are used as human shields. Anyway these people voted for and support Hamas. They sowed the wind and have reaped the whirlwind. The deaths of their children is their own fault.

Creating new generations of extremists because they and their families were unfairly targeted.

Hamas fired rockets from homes, schools, mosques, hospitals and the population support them. Cry me a river.

Plus it's a pr disaster for Israel

No it isn't. The Arabs have learned once again that if you attack Israel you will get your asses kicked.

most are perfectly aware that they've committed war crimes and behaved like complete arseholes.

Boo hoo! You are just sorry more Jews weren't killed right?:D

Azwaldo55

Brian Shanahan wrote: »

You have to remember to that it was money, and other support such as the organisation of talks amongst various islamist Palestinians, from the Mossad and Shin Bet which facilitated the founding of Hamas.

The original purpose of Hamas for Israel was to destroy the unity of the PLO, thus making easier the Israeli take-over of Jerusalem, Gaza and the West Bank.

And like, say, Al-Qaeda Hamas have morphed out of their original purpose of being a cat's paw to being an enemy of their creators (in the case of Al-Qaeda substitute the US and KSA for Israel).

And? Hamas still have to be taken out.

You have actually reinforced the morality of going to war with them.:D

Turtwig

Mod: Azwaldo is on a holiday through the event horizon.

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Boo hoo! You are just sorry more Jews weren't killed right?:D

Akrasia

Icepick wrote: »

How many bomb shelters have Hamas built for the civilians?
And if 0, why?
They are preparing for a war every day and are aware of Israel's capabilities.

Em, Israel have a blockade which does not permit construction materials that could be used to make bunkers. If Hamas made bomb shelters, they would need to first dig a load of 'illegal' tunnels in order to smuggle concrete and iron bars through to build re-enforced bomb shelters. And even if Hamas did build bomb shelters, they would be destroyed by the IDF because the IDF will claim that Hamas are using them to store weapons or as headquarters for their militia (just like they claimed the U.N. buildings were being used to stage attacks against Israel.

Corkfeen

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

The tunnels have all been blown up, hundreds of dead jihadis are fattening the worms, rocket fire has stopped and rocket stores are depleted etc etc. Hamas is in real trouble.



This is what happens when civilians are used as human shields. Anyway these people voted for and support Hamas. They sowed the wind and have reaped the whirlwind. The deaths of their children is their own fault.



Hamas fired rockets from homes, schools, mosques, hospitals and the population support them. Cry me a river.



No it isn't. The Arabs have learned once again that if you attack Israel you will get your asses kicked.



Boo hoo! You are just sorry more Jews weren't killed right?:D

Ah lovely, implying that I'm anti-Semitic because I object to a primarily civilian kill count. You still haven't provided independent verification on those manuals so human shields still haven't proven by you but given your previous post history, I never expected you would even attempt to.

In Western Europe,a fair proportion of the public is disgusted by the actions of Israel and in terms of media portrayal,it's probably one of the most negative Israel have received in recent years. Most people don't hold your rather horrible perspective on Palestinians plus most don't approve of blowing up schools, hospitals and playgrounds. Or shooting teens on a beach from a distance. It all comes across as rather barbaric and abhorrent tbh.

Edit: Written prior to his ban...

tayto lover

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

Hundreds of Hamas terrorists have been killed for the loss of 64 IDF soldiers.
The tunnels have all been blown up, thousands of their rockets have been destroyed and Hamas infrastructure is in rubble.
If you cared about the Palestinians at all you would be telling them to stop attacking Israel.
This is the third time since 2007 they have got their asses handed right back to them.
If they want to do this again in a few years then fine, Israel will oblige them!:D
I mean how many times to these idiots want to lose? LOL

You fell into the same trap as the Israelis.
The world now hates Israel.
They have lost the most important war of all, the propaganda war.
Only a complete idiot would fail to see that.

marienbad

tayto lover wrote: »

You fell into the same trap as the Israelis.
The world now hates Israel.
They have lost the most important war of all, the propaganda war.
Only a complete idiot would fail to see that.

When did they nor hate Israel ?

Nodin

Azwaldo55 wrote: »

The Palestinians (..........) Israel conquered by the Islamic Caliphate.

There's no evidence of that.

When was the last time Israels neigbours attacked it?

If Islamic fundamentalism is the problem, why is the west Bank and Arab East Jerusalem and the Golan being colonised?

Azwaldo55 wrote:

The Arabs do not want good relations.

Who are these "Arabs"?

(I see he'll be a while responding now)

Nodin

marienbad wrote: »

When did they nor hate Israel ?

Pre 1967.

Icepick

Nodin wrote: »

Pre 1967.

So they started to hate them after an all out arab attack on Israel? Are you actually serious?

marienbad

Nodin wrote: »

Pre 1967.

I'd say much much longer and the Jews even longer still . Not that that makes much difference to the current situation.

I don't think Israel looses too much sleep over it to be honest .