68 in a 60 - was I dicing with death?

Tropheus

Got a fixed penalty charge in the post on Wednesday. Am I the only one that feels that I've been hit with a stealth tax?

It was on Pinnock Hill in Swords which is mostly dual carriageway.

ShatterProof

Were you over the speed limit?

Pique

Tropheus wrote: »

Got a fixed penalty charge in the post on Wednesday. Am I the only one that feels that I've been hit with a stealth tax?

It was on Pinnock Hill in Swords which is mostly dual carriageway.

Broke the limit, got caught, feels victimised.

Pay up, learn lesson, move on.

hedzball

If you were doing 136 in a 120 how would you feel?







'hdz

YbFocus

Tropheus wrote: »

Got a fixed penalty charge in the post on Wednesday. Am I the only one that feels that I've been hit with a stealth tax?

It was on Pinnock Hill in Swords which is mostly dual carriageway.

You were caught breaking the speed limit, you can't fight it.
Well you can but you were over it so......

Pay up and move on

Jesus.

I'm constantly amazed at the attitude toward fellow motorists on this of all forums. Its supposed to be a petrol-head Board for God's sake!

OP, you have been hit by a stealth tax. The limit there is too low and its on a straight stretch where I'd be surprised if there ever was a fatality or anything close to it. They're always hiding in at the dip of the hill there in a gap in the hedge. They also sit at the top of the hill around from the Coachman's as you're heading for the M1. Another fish in a barrel exercise.

No wonder motorists have little faith in the Gardai.

Hard luck mate, they got you. Its a pity someone else didn't do the decent thing and flash you a warning light.

bazz26

My definition of a stealth tax is that of one that is forced upon you indirectly. OP in this case I don't really think it is since you have the choice of sticking to the speed limit or not.

Now I'm not jumping on the high horse here around the rights and wrongs of breaking the speed limit, we all have and will flaunt with the speed limit but the reality is that if I get caught then there is very little I can complain about. It was my choice and I have to deal with the consequences.

Atlantic Dawn

Hardly a stealth tax when a private company gains from the system chosen and not the government due to one of the sheitist contracts in the history of the state been signed.

http://www.politics.ie/forum/transport/141278-private-speed-cameras-spectra-labs.html

Jesus.

On the former, you're right Bazz, fair enough.

On the latter though, I disagree. The OP has every right to complain when he was doing a lousy 5mph over a ridiculously low limit of 37. There is simply no other reason for the Cops to be there other than the fact that its a handy hunting ground for them. The chap wouldn't have been a danger whatsoever to anyone doing 42mph on that stretch. Its ludicrous.

Some folk have been drinking the Government kool-Aid for too long...

visual

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Hardly a stealth tax when a private company gains from the system chosen and not the government due to one of the sheitist contracts in the history of the state been signed.

http://www.politics.ie/forum/transport/141278-private-speed-cameras-spectra-labs.html

you can add M50 toll to that list too

but when you have old boys club in operation in department of transport what can you expect.

bazz26

But where do you draw the line? Someone doing 70kph would feel pissed too if they were caught and someone doing 68kph got off. There has to be a cut off point otherwise what is the point in having a speed limit. You also have the fact that if people know there is a leeway of say 10kph over the limit then you can be guaranteed that someone will feel hard done by if they do 12kph over the legal limit.

Atlantic Dawn

bazz26 wrote: »

But where do you draw the line? Someone doing 70kph would feel pissed too if they were caught and someone doing 68kph got off. There has to be a cut off point otherwise what is the point in having a speed limit. You also have the fact that if people know there is a leeway of say 10kph over the limit then you can be guaranteed that someone will feel hard done by if they do 12kph over the legal limit.

There does have to be a cut off point but there also has to be some common sense, plenty of dual carriageway (correct term?) roads with limits of 50 and 60kph around Dublin that are straight clear vision roads with no need for such limits, purely revenue generation on these roads unless someone is taking the mick.

brightspark

For those of you who think that a speed limit (anywhere) is too low.

If it was up to you to change it would you?

The problem is this...

When someone gets injured in the future (for whatever reason) and a barrister argues that the increase in the limit was a significant contributory factor holding you responsible will you still feel that you made the right decision?

Your decision has now potentially cost millions instead of earning a few thousand in speeding fines.

So your choice is really
A, increase the limit and loose millions
Or
B, leave the limit as it is and just collect the speeding fines (if the limits aren't enforced then the gardai are also potentially liable)

Would you really choose option A?

Be grateful that society has accepted a certain amount of death and injuries are worth the cost of being able to drive over 4mph!

As a driver..slow down, you won't get to your destination significantly faster, someone ahead will be inevitably be going slower and hold you up anyway. And you won't get fined!

MadYaker

No politician would go to court and be held accountable for the death of someone who died on a section of road where said politician had recently increased the speed limit.

Satanta

And yet I.can do 80 on a pretty much single lane country road. Dont get me wrong, when I see a sign for 60 that'ds what I stick to. But... I've been on back country roads with 80 as the limit and it's downright ludicrous. Dual carriageway for instance should be 100 at least.

But, op you were caught. Simples. It's a tough pill to swallow but watch for the roadsigns

Pat Mustard

Tropheus wrote: »

Got a fixed penalty charge in the post on Wednesday. Am I the only one that feels that I've been hit with a stealth tax?

It was on Pinnock Hill in Swords which is mostly dual carriageway.

It's for your safety, apparently.

There are plenty of stealth taxes, and I could be wrong, but I don't think that speeding is a major source of revenue in this country. But there is something stealthy about the constant further intrusion of regulation in Ireland. People say that a lobster doesn't feel it if he is boiled to death slowly. Well I've gone all red now, and my claws are starting to twitch.

I'm sick and tired of the constant beating that motorists get in this country. It's a persistent state of attrition against whatever rights you have, as matters become further and further regulated. Apparently, road deaths per capita have fallen dramatically since the 1980s, even though we have more vehicles on the roads than in previous decades; largely due to different attitudes to drink driving, or so I have been told.

Despite these improvements, we get further regulation every year, stricter laws, reduced speed limits (apart from motorways and dual carriageways) and increased chance of penalties.

It's all for your own safety, as well. The NCT is for your safety. Your car isn't roadworthy if the locks aren't up to scratch because it's for your safety. Never mind that the automotive sales industry lobbied the government for these changes, so that car sales could be improved, for your safety.

Bloody Gatso vans, heroically hiding in roadside ditches, bravely lying in wait for motorists on good stretches of road, far from any dangerous accident black spots.

Ten year old cars only had to be NCTd every two years previously. Now, it's every year. For your safety.

The Green Party wanted to bring in a carbon tax as a percentage of the price of fuel. Never mind the 23% luxury rate of VAT that is already charged on fuel. No, bring in a new tax because its new. Sure, the lads will love it. Pointless disincentives will be popular with the voters.

Some people say politicians are lazy and useless. Well, if they'd p1ss off and stop trying to break what works or fix what ain't broke, maybe we'd be better off.

Every time there's a road death, some bloody politician wants to pass a new law or have more Gardai on the roads. I wish that they'd look up some statistics or just fcuk off altogether before imposing even more on motorists. Wasters.

/rant

brightspark

Satanta wrote: »

And yet I.can do 80 on a pretty much single lane country road. Dont get me wrong, when I see a sign for 60 that'ds what I stick to. But... I've been on back country roads with 80 as the limit and it's downright ludicrous. Dual carriageway for instance should be 100 at least.

But, op you were caught. Simples. It's a tough pill to swallow but watch for the roadsigns

The limits are limits not targets, you aren't supposed to travel at unsafe speeds regardless of what the limit is on that stretch of road.

visual

Barrister is a professional liar and would argue anything if paying him/her enough.

The local councils set the limits and it’s not hard to see how wrong they get it
their unqualified answer to everything is slow down and stop.

Speed restrictions on roads 3 miles out from the town if that wasn't enough add in speed bumps, bus and bicycle lanes and top it off with traffic lights synced to restrict the flow of traffic until the town becomes a bottle neck and the only option is to build a ring road. Then the cycle repeats with roundabouts, traffic lights, speed restrictions until the only option is to bypass the town altogether.

what is most disheartening is everyone has bought into speed kills.
I'm not saying speeding is not or could not be a contributing factor but the reality is mistakes kill and most accidents are caused by human error.

Poor judgement, lack of ability and a stubbornness has a bigger factor in deaths on the road than a few kph over the limit.

dashcamdanny

I believe a good driver, driving at speed would be scanning the road ahead with enough attention to see the van and slow before they come into range.

If one got nabbed by a big white van with a massive fluorescent speed camera sign on the back, it would seem that they may not have had their attention on the road ahead, or be driving so fast they can't get slowed in time.

Either way , they may not be the driver they think they are .

They tell us on the website where they are going to be.

http://www.garda.ie/gosafe.htm

Spook_ie

Tropheus wrote: »

Got a fixed penalty charge in the post on Wednesday. Am I the only one that feels that I've been hit with a stealth tax?

It was on Pinnock Hill in Swords which is mostly dual carriageway.

Pinnock Hill is NOT mostly dual carriageway

Satanta

brightspark wrote: »

The limits are limits not targets, you aren't supposed to travel at unsafe speeds regardless of what the limit is on that stretch of road.

I'm not suggesting that, Mr Gay Byrne. If the road limit is 80 and it's unsafe to travel at that speed I dont. I'm just saying that in some areas illogical limits are applied. I'm in Donegal and we don't have speed limits*


*Popular belief amongst those from the pale

CiniO

Tropheus wrote: »

Got a fixed penalty charge in the post on Wednesday. Am I the only one that feels that I've been hit with a stealth tax?

It was on Pinnock Hill in Swords which is mostly dual carriageway.

You might enjoy the fact that you were probably awarded highest penalty for such offence (speeding by 8 km/h) in Europe. I don't believe many (if any) countries issue such heavy fines for it.

Sam Kade

dashcamdanny wrote: »

I believe a good driver, driving at speed would be scanning the road ahead with enough attention to see the van and slow before they come into range.

If one got nabbed by a big white van with a massive fluorescent speed camera sign on the back, it would seem that they may not have had their attention on the road ahead, or be driving so fast they can't get slowed in time.

Either way , they may not be the driver they think they are .

They tell us on the website where they could be.

http://www.garda.ie/gosafe.htm

CiniO

bazz26 wrote: »

But where do you draw the line? Someone doing 70kph would feel pissed too if they were caught and someone doing 68kph got off. There has to be a cut off point otherwise what is the point in having a speed limit. You also have the fact that if people know there is a leeway of say 10kph over the limit then you can be guaranteed that someone will feel hard done by if they do 12kph over the legal limit.

You don't draw any line.
For someone being 8km/h above the limit, fine should be small. For someone being 30 over the limit, fine should be moderate, and for someone being 70 over the limit fine should be heavy.
That's how it's done nearly everywhere else and it works well. Not in Ireland though for some reason.

daveohdave

Jesus. wrote: »

I'm constantly amazed at the attitude toward fellow motorists on this of all forums. Its supposed to be a petrol-head Board for God's sake!

This is specifically a motorists forum, unfortunately. Drivers need to go to the likes of BackRoads.ie to get away from the high horsing and NIMBYism.

The thing that annoys me the most is there is no or very little speed checks in Towns and Villages where traffic regularly speeds at well above the 50 kph limit.

It's obvious they're out to collect revenue, they are not serious about speeding or they wouldn't be only on the decent roads.

They're always sitting on the Castledermot Road in Kildare as you come off the motorway heading for Carlow town, always. They brought the limit down from 100 kph to 80 kph once the Carlow/Castledermot bypass opened. When it was 100 kph there wasn't even a shoulder on a good stretch of that road. 80 kph is ridiculous and you can do 80 kph on the numerous broken country roads close by.

Cars fly down the Green road in Carlow Town and down the Hill into Castledermot and through the Village, no speed checks there, so basically they're saying it's O.K to speed in the towns and villages.

OP I'd say if it was a good stretch and safe then I feel for you, I have to drive on local main roads here that are suitable for 100 kph at 80. This country is a joke. Meanwhile I take my life in my hands every time I try to get out the entrance of my estate onto the road because cars speed at 60-80 kph in a 50 kph zone and never a speed check.

_Kaiser_

Speed traps in this country are a revenue exercise pure and simple. Between cynical speed traps and tax checks, the Traffic Corps might as well just slap big Revenue stickers on the sides of the cars rather than Garda as in my experience they have feck all interest in doing anything else.

As has happened in this thread you'll get the "don't speed and you won't get caught" type attitudes but it's that bow-the-head-and-doff-your-cap attitude so common in Ireland (outside of the pub that is!) that allows stuff like this to go on.

We've had a(nother) massive scandal involving AGS and penalty points (among other things) and people still think that the Gardai as an organisation is fit for purpose or serving the interests of the people?

rwg

Health n Safety gone Mad!!!!!!

djimi

Jesus. wrote: »

I'm constantly amazed at the attitude toward fellow motorists on this of all forums. Its supposed to be a petrol-head Board for God's sake!

Youve got to draw a line between motoring discussion and the ranting and raving forum though! I dont disagree with you; the speed limits are too low and the Gardai use them as a revenue generating exercise, however the speed limits are clearly posted on all roads, and whether they are too low or not, its up to drivers to stick to them. Get caught breaking them and you will be punished. Its not stealthy or a scam or anything else; every one of us knows full well the consequences of breaking the speed limit, and can have no complaint if we get fined for exceeding them.

R.O.R

If caught doing 68, what would the Speedo be showing? 72,73 ish?

Not that hard to figure out you are over the limit when take Speedo is 10km more.

I do agree, the limit is a bit slow for the road though. Pretty hard to keep it back to 60 on the downhill stretch from Airside to the Coachmans

djimi

djimi wrote: »

Get caught breaking them and you will be punished. Its not stealthy or a scam or anything else; every one of us knows full well the consequences of breaking the speed limit, and can have no complaint if we get fined for exceeding them.

A come on now,

Course it's a scam, put the speed vans in the Towns and Villages where people go well beyond the 50 kph and not just a few kph above on the open road.

In Germany they have fixed traps hidden in hedges and behind bus shelters, but they have suitable speed limits, they even have a 40 kph for those narrow streets or where in very difficult places for people to get onto a road.

Event he 50 kph limit for some of Ireland's streets is too fast.

dr.fuzzenstein

brightspark wrote: »

The limits are limits not targets, you aren't supposed to travel at unsafe speeds regardless of what the limit is on that stretch of road.

That argument is the equivalent of a cow throwing up in its own mouth and chewing the cud. Maybe you want to cone up with something original?
Though I tried it once, the car was shaking, the road ahead was in tunnel vision, everything behind me was a blur as I did... 100 kilometers an hour! Wow! I'll never forget it.
Actually no, no speedlimit is some kind of unobtainable target, I wish twats going 20 under could understand that.

Has anyone got google street view of the location ?

dr.fuzzenstein

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I wish twats going 20 under could understand that.

Exactly, you see now you got idiots doing 60 in an 80 and so on out of fear of being caught, drives me mental. An I'm a prius driver !

dr.fuzzenstein

OP, check if there's an equivalent if this site in you area
https://m.facebook.com/GardaCheckpointsClare?refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Fsearch&_rdr

I wouldnt leave the house without checking it.

djimi

Deleted User wrote: »

A come on now,

Course it's a scam, put the speed vans in the Towns and Villages where people go well beyond the 50 kph and not just a few kph above on the open road.

In Germany they have fixed traps hidden in hedges and behind bus shelters, but they have suitable speed limits, they even have a 40 kph for those narrow streets or where in very difficult places for people to get onto a road.

Event he 50 kph limit for some of Ireland's streets is too fast.

The OP was driving in excess of the speed limit. They got caught. In what way is it a scam?

I agree that the way that speeding is policed is a sham, and that it is used purely for revenue generating rather than the bollox line about safety that the Gardai love to peddle. But that doesnt change the fact that in order to get caught up in a revenue generating exercise you have to be breaking the law in the first place. The limits might be unfair, but they are still the legal limits.

No Pants

Pinnock Hill? ****. I don't think I've stuck to the speed limit anywhere on the R132.

Will it be my fault if I get caught speeding there someday? Absolutely.

Will it stop me giving out about it if it does? Not a chance.

djimi

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

OP, check if there's an equivalent if this site in you area
https://m.facebook.com/GardaCheckpointsClare?refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Fsearch&_rdr

I wouldnt leave the house without checking it.

In fairness I am about to drive 45 minutes across the county. I can tell you right now the 2-3 spots where the speed vans/Gardai are likely to be (one of them beign right outside my door!); it shouldnt require a Facebook page to avoid being caught!

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

Youve got to draw a line between motoring discussion and the ranting and raving forum though! I dont disagree with you; the speed limits are too low and the Gardai use them as a revenue generating exercise, however the speed limits are clearly posted on all roads, and whether they are too low or not, its up to drivers to stick to them. Get caught breaking them and you will be punished. Its not stealthy or a scam or anything else; every one of us knows full well the consequences of breaking the speed limit, and can have no complaint if we get fined for exceeding them.

It's not that speed limits are too low.
It's that speed limits idea is wrong in general.
You can't limit everyone in every conditions to the same speed - and unfortunately that's exactly how speed limits work at the moment.

Experienced driver fully focused on what he's doing, with very good reaction time, in vehicle in perfect condition, brand new premium tyres, in good weather and no traffic around, might be perfectly safe to drive at 200km/h on certain stretch of the road.
While on the same stretch of the road, old driver with very long reaction time, who is tired and probably just about recovered from last days hangover, driving and eating his chips, in his 25 year old banger with cheap chineese tyres with 2mm tread, on windy and rainy day with fog and plenty traffic around doing 40km/h might be a big danger to anyone else.

Generally you can't just say that 80km/h is a speed limit, and that's a safe point. Below it you are safe, above it you aren't. That's nonsense.

daveohdave

R.O.R wrote: »

If caught doing 68, what would the Speedo be showing? 72,73 ish

Speedos can both under and over estimate.

Guy:Incognito

Jesus. wrote: »

I'm constantly amazed at the attitude toward fellow motorists on this of all forums. Its supposed to be a petrol-head Board for God's sake!.

Can you only be a petrol head if you break speed limits?

Guy:Incognito

daveohdave wrote: »

Speedos can both under and over estimate.

Not unless you've done something to the car from stock.

Youd probably have to have a 10% swing in the tyre size to go from over to under, going from say 225/55's to 225/45's.

CiniO

CiniO wrote: »

old driver with very long reaction time, who is tired and probably just about recovered from last days hangover, driving and eating his chips, in his 25 year old banger with cheap chineese tyres with 2mm tread, on windy and rainy day with fog and plenty traffic around doing 40km/h might be a big danger to anyone else.

Very bad view of elderly drivers don't you think ?

What about the 20 year old putting on her make up or the 21 year old fella texting away ?

CiniO

Deleted User wrote: »

Very disrespectful view of elderly drivers don't you think ?

Average 80 years old person will have much worse reaction time than average 20 year old person. That's a fact, and nothing disrespectful about it.

What about the 20 year old putting on her make up or the 21 year old fella texting away ?

Even worse probably.

Guy:Incognito

CiniO wrote: »

Average 80 years old person will have much worse reaction time than average 20 year old person. That's a fact, and nothing disrespectful about it.


.

The average 80 year old is probably not doing all the other crap you tacked on for effect though. Hes also much less likely to be talking on his mobile or texting, blaring music , chatting to his 4 mates in the car that are bouncing around the place, smoking spliffs or any number of other things.

He'll also most likely be driving much slower than the speed limit.

CiniO

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

The average 80 year old is probably not doing all the other crap you tacked on for effect though. Hes also much less likely to be talking on his mobile or texting, blaring music , chatting to his 4 mates in the car that are bouncing around the place, smoking spliffs or any number of other things.

He'll also most likely be driving much slower than the speed limit.

Yes, that's all correct - but that has nothing to do with my point.
I tried to show two extremes - sorry you didn't like my examples.

My point is though, that set speed limit of 80km/h and different drivers sticking to it, will mean different levels of safety among them - and that's not good thing.

CiniO

CiniO wrote: »

Average 80 years old person will have much worse reaction time than average 20 year old person. That's a fact, and nothing disrespectful about it.

Not disagreeing with you, on reaction time, but the rest of you post wasn't very respectful ? I'm not on my high horse by the way but this just annoyed me.

CiniO wrote: »

old driver with very long reaction time who is tired and probably just about recovered from last days hangover, driving and eating his chips, in his 25 year old banger with cheap chineese tyres with 2mm tread, on windy and rainy day with fog and plenty traffic around doing 40km/h might be a big danger to anyone else.

rwg

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

The average 80 year old is probably not doing all the other crap you tacked on for effect though. Hes also much less likely to be talking on his mobile or texting, blaring music , chatting to his 4 mates in the car that are bouncing around the place, smoking spliffs or any number of other things.

He'll also most likely be driving much slower than the speed limit.

rwg

rwg wrote: »

Great show of respect for his father al right, muppet. Putting a video of his father on you tube, and I bet didn't even ask his permission !

I've seen plenty of younger drivers trying to park like this ? what does this prove ?

Some people have a severe lack of respect for elderly people and seem to forget they themselves will be old some day.

dr.fuzzenstein

djimi wrote: »

In fairness I am about to drive 45 minutes across the county. I can tell you right now the 2-3 spots where the speed vans/Gardai are likely to be (one of them beign right outside my door!); it shouldnt require a Facebook page to avoid being caught!

The flash4cash isn't the problem, they are very predictable. The gards with hairdryers can be easy to miss though. And its handy to avoid checkpoints and being stuck in a massive holdup.

Odyssey 2005

brightspark wrote: »

The limits are limits not targets, you aren't supposed to travel at unsafe speeds regardless of what the limit is on that stretch of road.

Hope you dont get hurt if you ever fall off your horse.:mad: