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Ulster Bank League 2014-2015 talk/gossip/rumours

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12357…34

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    #122
    Stainalert
    Registered Users Posts: 1,258 ✭✭✭Stainalert


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    We'll agree to disagree but they wouldn't have been able. A team of 18/19 year olds over the course of 15 games wouldn't compete in 2A or 2B and a clean sweep of age grade titles means nothing when trying to use it to back up going into the full adult game against men every week. They would win some games no doubt but if UCD 20s are so strong their senior AIL side would be even stronger and the UCD club has never really been near winning an AIL title over the years.

    UCD 1sts finished 3rd last year in 1A and won 1B by a mile the previous season

    The 20s would win games against 2A and 2B sides no doubt but when winter sets in and the pitches slow and you have games where every one of the opposition is older, more than used to playing against sides where there isn't a dozen plus 18/19 year olds fresh out of school they wouldn't win and do that well. They wouldn't compete in 2A.
    Look at UCC. Their under 20s have regularly competed and won the Fraser McMullan(way more than UCD or other Leinster sides have done) and few made their AIL side last year that were at the top end of 2A. Last year UCD only beat UCCs under 20s 20-13 in Fraser McMullan All Ireland 1/4

    UCD Fraser McMullan team weaker than U20 league team due to difference in age qualification

    what do you think UCCs seniors would have done if UCD can only beat the Cork Universities 20s by 7 points
    No AIL teams are made up of loads of under 20 eligible players as the physicality is a step up and too much at that time for many under 20 players

    Lansdowne beat Clontarf (who were playing for the AIL title) with 8 U20 players in their squad 3 of which were in the front 5.


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    #123
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Stainalert wrote: »
    Lansdowne beat Clontarf (who were playing for the AIL title) with 8 U20 players in their squad 3 of which were in the front 5.
    Yes and there is several teams who will use significant numbers of under 20s players in games and through a season but a full under 20s team wouldn't be capable of what OP was suggesting and go through a season to win the 2A/B League


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    #124
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Fixtures are up online
    http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/32184.php


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    #125
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Any thoughts on the fixtures for your own club or league in general?
    Great idea to start division 1A with 5 games all in Dublin.

    UCD v Marys in 1A, Garryowen v Shannon in 1B on Friday 12th September to start each division is a fantastic idea as is Skerries Old Wesley in 2A on Friday 19th September


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    #126
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    I was once a regular AIL match goer, usually to a home Shannon match but went a few home games for any of the Limerick based clubs. Have dropped off over the last few years, I suppose being busy on Saturdays and less disposable income being the main reasons for my non attendance. Each year I think I must make an effort so this year hopefully I get to a few.

    The Friday night games have been a great idea but I think the fixtures clashing with provincial games or other AIL games in the same city/town doesn't help with attendaces. I haven't really looked at this years fixtures so this might not be an issue this season.


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    #127
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    I was once a regular AIL match goer, usually to a home Shannon match but went a few home games for any of the Limerick based clubs. Have dropped off over the last few years, I suppose being busy on Saturdays and less disposable income being the main reasons for my non attendance. Each year I think I must make an effort so this year hopefully I get to a few.

    The Friday night games have been a great idea but I think the fixtures clashing with provincial games or other AIL games in the same city/town doesn't help with attendaces. I haven't really looked at this years fixtures so this might not be an issue this season.
    Clashes with provincial games shouldn't be an issue for clubs if they do things right and get big screens, bar deals to get people into their club to watch the club rugby and watch the province on the big screen. Getting it into peoples head you can watch both your province and your club on the same day but only by going to your clubs game.
    Clashes with other AIL games in the same town will happen in Dublin in 1A and isn't an issue and while its more of an issue in Limerick clubs should be able to stagger kick off times from 2.30 at times if it means more people going to games


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    #128
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Clashes with provincial games shouldn't be an issue for clubs if they do things right and get big screens, bar deals to get people into their club to watch the club rugby and watch the province on the big screen. Getting it into peoples head you can watch both your province and your club on the same day but only by going to your clubs game.
    Clashes with other AIL games in the same town will happen in Dublin in 1A and isn't an issue and while its more of an issue in Limerick clubs should be able to stagger kick off times from 2.30 at times if it means more people going to games

    Having AIL games in Limerick when Munster play at home in Cork is mad or vice versa. Imho, big screens will only attract a small number of supporters if it clashes with home provincial games.

    Having more than 2 or 3 Limerick teams playing at home across Div 1&2 on the same Saturday should be a no no, staggering the ko times will attract a few at best. I certainly couldn't afford the time to attend two games on the same day.

    With Friday night games then this might not be an issue anymore.


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    #129
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    Having AIL games in Limerick when Munster play at home in Cork is mad or vice versa. Imho, big screens will only attract a small number of supporters if it clashes with home provincial games.

    Having more than 2 or 3 Limerick teams playing at home across Div 1&2 on the same Saturday should be a no no, staggering the ko times will attract a few at best. I certainly couldn't afford the time to attend two games on the same day.

    With Friday night games then this might not be an issue anymore.
    There is, including Bruff, 8 Limerick clubs in the entire league. There will always be more than 2-3 sides at home due to simple organisation of fixtures.
    The same with having AIL games in Limerick when Munster play in Cork. Trying to work around that is too difficult. What would you want done about it.


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    #130
    Risteard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,698 ✭✭✭Risteard


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Any thoughts on the fixtures for your own club or league in general?

    First home Friday night game this year for us, derby as well so should be good, though I probably won't get to make it. New clubhouse should be ready by then too so hopefully will be a good night.

    Still three rounds to be announced though? Only see 12 games showing up for 2B?


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    #131
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Risteard wrote: »
    First home Friday night game this year for us, derby as well so should be good, though I probably won't get to make it. New clubhouse should be ready by then too so hopefully will be a good night.

    Still three rounds to be announced though? Only see 12 games showing up for 2B?
    All rounds of games should have been announced. Problem with website and not all fixtures uploaded if not all up on website.


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    #132
    Risteard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,698 ✭✭✭Risteard


    Was thinking that alright, doesn't make sense to hold off on the three, not like there's TV schedules to work out. :pac:


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    #133
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    I see James Rael is going to Belvedere after getting released by Connacht. It's a shame it didn't work out for him (he got injured I think?) there. At Munster he was unlucky to be in the same age bracket as the other good hookers Munster have produced. Maybe he can get a contract abroad eventually or get into the B&I Cup scene with Leinster?


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    #134
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Risteard wrote: »
    Was thinking that alright, doesn't make sense to hold off on the three, not like there's TV schedules to work out. :pac:
    At the same time some of the Limerick derbies would be worth televising for the comments on the side-lines especially in Canal Field and Liam Fitz.
    thomond2006 wrote: »
    I see James Rael is going to Belvedere after getting released by Connacht. It's a shame it didn't work out for him (he got injured I think?) there. At Munster he was unlucky to be in the same age bracket as the other good hookers Munster have produced. Maybe he can get a contract abroad eventually or get into the B&I Cup scene with Leinster?
    He had injuries and was very unlucky. He's definitely good enough to play pro at some level or another. Hopefully can pick up a championship contract or similar for at least a year and work back into Ireland if chance arises


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    #135
    Not Playing Tiddlywinks Vinny
    Registered Users Posts: 509 ✭✭✭Not Playing Tiddlywinks Vinny


    Tarf Munsters is a tasty opener. No love lost there!

    Interesting note, altho the fixtures aren't complete for 2B. Bruff have EVERY Munster based side named thus far at home, and away to all others. Thats a touch unfair...............even the financial implications of that could end the small club!!


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    #136
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Not Playing Tiddlywinks Vinny wrote: »
    Tarf Munsters is a tasty opener. No love lost there!

    Interesting note, altho the fixtures aren't complete for 2B. Bruff have EVERY Munster based side named thus far at home, and away to all others. Thats a touch unfair...............even the financial implications of that could end the small club!!
    There will be anomalies like that but there is worse ones in the league. In 2B Boyne have just one of the seven Munster sides in the division at home and have to travel south to all four teams from Cork(Kanturk, Midleton, Sundays Well, Highfield)


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    #137
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    There is, including Bruff, 8 Limerick clubs in the entire league. There will always be more than 2-3 sides at home due to simple organisation of fixtures.
    The same with having AIL games in Limerick when Munster play in Cork. Trying to work around that is too difficult. What would you want done about it.

    Too difficult? Is it though, some games might clash but having 3 Div1a or Div1b games in Limerick on the 6th of December is not fair to the clubs, this is also a Hcup weekend. Same again on 28th March 3 games in Limerick with Munster down to play Connacht at home the same weekend.

    Someone needs to put a bit of effort into the fixtures if the AIL is to grow.


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    #138
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    Too difficult? Is it though, some games might clash but having 3 Div1a or Div1b games in Limerick on the 6th of December is not fair to the clubs, this is also a Hcup weekend. Same again on 28th March 3 games in Limerick with Munster down to play Connacht at home the same weekend.

    Someone needs to put a bit of effort into the fixtures if the AIL is to grow.
    Its perfectly fair to clubs and clubs regularly use such weekends to their advantage and have done so in the past and will do so again. Better to have the sides playing at home and giving people a chance to go to both than have the club sides playing away on those dates.
    What do you want done about the fixtures?


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    #139
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Its perfectly fair to clubs and clubs regularly use such weekends to their advantage and have done so in the past and will do so again. Better to have the sides playing at home and giving people a chance to go to both than have the club sides playing away on those dates.

    Not in my experience but that's dated by about 2 seasons so perhaps clubs have turned it around in getting supporters back to AIL games.
    What do you want done about the fixtures?

    I would have thought that was obvious. To repeat, AIL games clashing in the same city bar Dublin is crazy, more so if they also clash with a home provincial game.


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    #140
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    Not in my experience but that's dated by about 2 seasons so perhaps clubs have turned it around in getting supporters back to AIL games.
    Im well used to doing it in Thomond and Thomond Park and regularly did it when going to games in Liam Fitz then TP.
    I would have thought that was obvious. To repeat, AIL games clashing in the same city bar Dublin is crazy, more so if they also clash with a home provincial game.
    But how would you do it? I don't think its much of an issue and clubs have an input into fixtures and would clearly ask where possible not to play if their province was playing in the same city on a certain weekend.


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    #141
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Im well used to doing it in Thomond and Thomond Park and regularly did it when going to games in Liam Fitz then TP.
    But how would you do it? I don't think its much of an issue and clubs have an input into fixtures and would clearly ask where possible not to play if their province was playing in the same city on a certain weekend.

    That's you but has the number of people a attending AIL games increased? I wouldn't have thought so and in my experience people are slow to go to two games on the same weekend not to mind the same day.


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    #142
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    That's you but has the number of people a attending AIL games increased? I wouldn't have thought so and in my experience people are slow to go to two games on the same weekend not to mind the same day.
    Plenty will go to two games on same day depending on what the games are. Middling pro12 game no but if the provincial game is a big one, versus another province, a European cup game then yes you will see people at both. AIL games kick off at half two and are finished by five past four you would see exodus in ground after final whistle of AIL game for people going into Thomond for the half five/six o clock game from my experience in Munster. Maybe other provinces are different but north Munster you will see plenty of people going to both


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    #143
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Plenty will go to two games on same day depending on what the games are. Middling pro12 game no but if the provincial game is a big one, versus another province, a European cup game then yes you will see people at both. AIL games kick off at half two and are finished by five past four you would see exodus in ground after final whistle of AIL game for people going into Thomond for the half five/six o clock game from my experience in Munster. Maybe other provinces are different but north Munster you will see plenty of people going to both

    My point is that if the games didn't clash then those that you talk about will still go to the AIL games and you'll get more to make the effort to get to an AIL game.


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    #144
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    My point is that if the games didn't clash then those that you talk about will still go to the AIL games and you'll get more to make the effort to get to an AIL game.
    The provinces have 30+ games and 15 at home. There is 8 internationals to take into account as well. Its very difficult not to get games to clash. How would you arrange the season for little to clash?


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    #145
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    The provinces have 30+ games and 15 at home. There is 8 internationals to take into account as well. Its very difficult not to get games to clash. How would you arrange the season for little to clash?

    I'm not getting into drawing up fixtures and I given two examples where 3 Limerick city clubs in Divisions 1a&1b clash the same date & time, there's no need for that in a sport that needs every spectator it can get.

    There's 31 weekends from the first AIL game to the last pool game, they use 19 weekends and still mange to clash as I just given in the examples. IMHO, there's absolutely no need for it in particular the games on a Hcup weekend.


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    #146
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    I'm not getting into drawing up fixtures and I given two examples where 3 Limerick city clubs in Divisions 1a&1b clash the same date & time, there's no need for that in a sport that needs every spectator it can get.

    There's 31 weekends from the first AIL game to the last pool game, they use 19 weekends and still mange to clash as I just given in the examples. IMHO, there's absolutely no need for it in particular the games on a Hcup weekend.
    3 Limerick clubs clash on some weekends. That's bound to happen. The AIL doesn't play on International weekends so there is bound to be clashes with provincial games. What are you going to do to ensure no clash?

    Clubs don't appear to have that concern or they would have mentioned it in the questionnaire sent out to all clubs last season.
    AIL has always kicked off 2.30pm with the odd exception I don't see any need or desire from clubs for that to change


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    #147
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    3 Limerick clubs clash on some weekends. That's bound to happen. The AIL doesn't play on International weekends so there is bound to be clashes with provincial games. What are you going to do to ensure no clash?

    Clubs don't appear to have that concern or they would have mentioned it in the questionnaire sent out to all clubs last season.
    AIL has always kicked off 2.30pm with the odd exception I don't see any need or desire from clubs for that to change

    Only bound to happen if its allowed happen and I'm pretty sure the AIL has fixtures on international weekends for this season.


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    #148
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    Only bound to happen if its allowed happen and I'm pretty sure the AIL has fixtures on international weekends for this season.
    There is 18 weeks in the season and due to the way the fixtures are repeats of last season, teams getting promoted and relegated from divisions there are going to end up with 3 games on the one weekend every so often in Limerick. It isn't an issue. It has never been an issue or something would have been done about it before.
    Yes AIL has on some international weekends had games taking place but in the main the AIL and Internationals don't clash


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    #149
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    There is 18 weeks in the season and due to the way the fixtures are repeats of last season, teams getting promoted and relegated from divisions there are going to end up with 3 games on the one weekend every so often in Limerick. It isn't an issue. It has never been an issue or something would have been done about it before.
    Yes AIL has on some international weekends had games taking place but in the main the AIL and Internationals don't clash

    You're giving excuses for the clashes rather than accepting that with a small bit of work these clashes can be avoided.

    To me its crazy that teams clash fixtures when gate receipts at AIL games are so small.


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    #150
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    phog wrote: »
    You're giving excuses for the clashes rather than accepting that with a small bit of work these clashes can be avoided.

    To me its crazy that teams clash fixtures when gate receipts at AIL games are so small.
    Im not making excuses. The clubs clearly don't see what you're talking about is an issue or at least serious enough of an issue for it to be bought up at IRFU level so that changes are made.


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    #151
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,769 ✭✭✭✭phog


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Im not making excuses.


    Certainly looks that way to me.
    The clubs clearly don't see what you're talking about is an issue or at least serious enough of an issue for it to be bought up at IRFU level so that changes are made.

    So clubs are happy with their lot with regards to attendances?


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