Season 4 Episode 1 "Two Swords" : HAVE read the books

Kunkka

Well the wait is nearly over. Really looking forward to seeing how the Red Viper is portrayed among other things. From what I've read about the first episode on a few sites it sounds brilliant. There is obviously going to be more changes from the books to suit the show like how Jaime is in KL's too early. Can't wait!

Sleepy

Clearly we're going to see Ice melted down and Oathkeeper & Widow's Wail forged.

username123

Judging by the trailers the Red Viper is going to be portrayed as an excellent passive aggressive alpha badass! I love that scenes with Cersei and Tywin where she tries to belittle Ellaria Sand and the Red Viper keeps smiling, smiling, smiling.....

Looking forward to seeing Cersei's reaction to Jaime with the missing hand - all we got to see last season was a look of relief from her followed by a downward look of shame/worry from him. Now lets see how she handles the enormity of how much he has changed and not just physically.

Mr Freeze

Sleepy wrote: »

Clearly we're going to see Ice melted down and Oathkeeper & Widow's Wail forged.

Opening scene I believe.

Duckworth_Luas

Episode Preview

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9pCpRSLi5c

Sleepy

The dragons are looking big!

Turtyturd

Sleepy wrote: »

The dragons are looking big!

I'd expect Cersei to ban Jamie from the wedding...a simple way to get Jamie more sympathy from the tv audience, and further the tension between them quickly.

December2012

Turtyturd wrote: »

I'd expect Cersei to ban Jamie from the wedding...a simple way to get Jamie more sympathy from the tv audience, and further the tension between them quickly.

It would also resolve the problem about Jamie not being in Kings Landing for the wedding.

Turtyturd

December2012 wrote: »

It would also resolve the problem about Jamie not being in Kings Landing for the wedding.

Yep, dunno why my original post quoted Sleepy.

Rosy Posy

Looking forward to seeing Cersei's reaction to Jaime with the missing hand - all we got to see last season was a look of relief from her followed by a downward look of shame/worry from him. Now lets see how she handles the enormity of how much he has changed and not just physically.

I can't believe they missed the opportunity to film the scene of their first meeting in the books- riding on the alter of the mother over the dead body of their incest begotten son seems right up the TV series' alley. I only read the books since last series but I was irked by the fact that they sacrificed lots of important plot points to gratuitous sex scenes.

I also wonder where they're going with the iron born storyline and Stannis at the wall. Afair Asha was off to rescue Theon, but will Balon die and the kingsmoot be held first? I'm wondering how they'll fit this in with her capture/Deepwood Motte?

Part of me thinks that Jofferys wedding should be early on in the season with Tyrions escape and Tywin and Shaes murders as the big finale, but I'm not sure how it will play out.

Witcher

Rosy Posy wrote: »

I can't believe they missed the opportunity to film the scene of their first meeting in the books- riding on the alter of the mother over the dead body of their incest begotten son seems right up the TV series' alley.

I think they're going ahead with that, it's just not their first scene together.

Stannis is going north too but he's stopping off in Braavos according to the trailers. Presumably to introduce the Iron Bank so when they turn up in KL looking for their gold dragons and Cersei tells them to get lost, the show people understand why they fund Stannis.

username123

Surprised S04E01 hasn't leaked somewhere yet, I seem to remember the first ep of season 3 leaking early last year.

Sir Chops

Will there be much of the knob-less Reek?

Mickeroo

username123 wrote: »

Surprised S04E01 hasn't leaked somewhere yet, I seem to remember the first ep of season 3 leaking early last year.

That happened with an episode in season 2 iirc and only once I'm pretty sure it was the second episode and not the first one but not entity sure.

Son0vagun

Mickeroo wrote: »

That happened with an episode in season 2 iirc and only once I'm pretty sure it was the second episode and not the first one but not entity sure.

HBO Go released episode two of season two straight after the season two premier of episode one. That was leaked. Lots of fans regretted it because they then had to wait two weeks for episode three.

Rosy Posy

Blay wrote: »

Stannis is going north too but he's stopping off in Braavos according to the trailers.

Anyone know where they filmed Braavos? In my mind it's like Venice in winter. If they're transposing Stannis' meeting with the banker to Braavos I wonder how they'll contrive to get him to the wall, although they could just leave that out.

Sir Chops wrote: »

Will there be much of the knob-less Reek?

I hope not. They really dragged it out last season, I thought so even before I read the books. I found it weird that they focused on the Theon torture to establish what a cúnt Ramsey is without expanding on all of the other heinous stuff he does in the books- forcing Lady Hornwood into marriage and her subsequent imprisonment and starvation; murdering his own half brother and Roose's legitimate heir, using women for hunting practice.

Paddy Cow

Rosy Posy wrote: »

I hope not. They really dragged it out last season, I thought so even before I read the books. I found it weird that they focused on the Theon torture to establish what a cúnt Ramsey is without expanding on all of the other heinous stuff he does in the books- forcing Lady Hornwood into marriage and her subsequent imprisonment and starvation; murdering his own half brother and Roose's legitimate heir, using women for hunting practice.

That is a particularly twisted hobby of his. If they give him a good chase, he'll be merciful and only rape and kill them. If they give up to soon, he'll rape them and flay them alive :eek:

Rosy Posy

Paddy Cow wrote: »

That is a particularly twisted hobby of his. If they give him a good chase, he'll be merciful and only rape and kill them. If they give up to soon, he'll rape them and flay them alive :eek:

He also named his dogs after the ones that give him the best sport...the misogyny runs that deep. He's one of the scariest characters in the book IMO along with Biter and the Mountain. Pity the actor who plays him is a bit lacking.

December2012

Rosy Posy wrote: »

I found it weird that they focused on the Theon torture to establish what a cúnt Ramsey is without expanding on all of the other heinous stuff he does in the books- forcing Lady Hornwood into marriage and her subsequent imprisonment and starvation; murdering his own half brother and Roose's legitimate heir, using women for hunting practice.

Yeah but in the tv show they have him give hope to Theon, release him, send the guards after him, rescue him, KILL 6 OF HIS OWN MEN, bring him to his sister, and straight back to the very same cell just to see that look on Theons face and to fû ck him up mentally. And the temptation with the girls too - all just to make the torture worse.

I reckon season 4 will have Bolton will give some exposition on ramsays murder of Domeric, and the Bastards boys.

Paddy Cow

December2012 wrote: »

Yeah but in the tv show they have him give hope to Theon, release him, send the guards after him, rescue him, KILL 6 OF HIS OWN MEN, bring him to his sister, and straight back to the very same cell just to see that look on Theons face and to fû ck him up mentally. And the temptation with the girls too - all just to make the torture worse.

I reckon season 4 will have Bolton will give some exposition on ramsays murder of Domeric, and the Bastards boys.

Between the tv show and books, my memory is getting blurred. Is the Ramsay/Arya wedding due this season? He's not exactly husband material.

Duckworth_Luas

Rosy Posy wrote: »

I found it weird that they focused on the Theon torture to establish what a cúnt Ramsey is without expanding on all of the other heinous stuff he does in the books- using women for hunting practice.

Trailer #4 for Season 4 has one of Ramsey's lady friends shooting an arrow at an unidentified girl!

iamanengine

I haven't read past book 3 so simply popping in to say "OMG I AM SO EXCITE"

Now, good day book readers, I dare not get spoilered!

bur

Me for the next few hours...

December2012

The big decision - to nap until 1.45 am or try to stay awake?

Witcher

Oberyn kicking ass from the get go:pac:

Witcher

'What the ****'s a Lommy?':pac:

That inn scene was hilarious:pac: Fcuking love the Hound

mr.jingle

Blay wrote: »

'What the ****'s a Lommy?':pac:

That inn scene was hilarious:pac: Fcuking love the Hound

Arya and the Hound are great together. The Hound love's a chicken

Gbear

Every single scene just ****ing nailed it. Nailed it so good.

God I missed this show.

I completely lost my **** when Jamie waved goodbye to Qyburn with his golden hand.

Liam O

Winced a lot at changes from the books. After Oberyn's gay scene I was ready to write it off, throwing in sex scenes for cheap character growth rather than grow the character through dialogue. Ellaria being shunted for a conversation with Tyrion completely goes against his book character too where if I remember correctly he made a point of saying that she was to hear everything he did.

The Hound and Arya saved it, even though I'd read the books I was still finding it difficult enough to keep up with some things, maybe because I was trying to get their non-butchered version of their characters.

Witcher

Saw someone moaning over on Westeros.org because the necklace Sansa got wasn't purple..christ almighty:pac:

Promo for the next episode:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jq2QMCHvs_U

mewso

Definitely going with the jealous/spurned Shae approach. Ridiculous.

Liam O

mewso wrote: »

Definitely going with the jealous/spurned Shae approach. Ridiculous.

Forgot about that, so fùcking silly.

Son0vagun

People need to let the show do their own thing. I see both the books and show as two totally enjoy different things. Can't let changes to the book get to you, that's just silly.

That was a awesome episode, probably the best season opener!

Son0vagun

mewso wrote: »

Definitely going with the jealous/spurned Shae approach. Ridiculous.

We didn't get to see Shaes POV in the book. What else other then jealously do you think drove Shae into Tywins bed?

bur

I thought a lot of that was terrible quite frankly. Was there just something wrong with my copy, but there was no score for most of the final scene, sound is so important, it was robbed of all drama for me personally. Oberyn scenes were great because they had a noticeably excellent score along with them.

Lots i liked too, but the stuff in the North really bummed me out, they seem to have none of the budget of King's Landing and everything at the wall seemed different from before, did anyone else get that, like they've changed sets or something? It didn't even seem cold there. The Daario scene just made laugh, as did the Thormund one. That new character is so badly realised. Badly acted too and the makeup is....eh.
Shae...I just think of the inevitable pay-off and smile.

It's not about them deviating either. Often the scenes i like best are the ones i know have been made up completely.

I need to freshen up on the books too cause i was struggling to remember what was from the books or not.

Witcher

bur wrote: »

Lots i liked too, but the stuff in the North really bummed me out, they seem to have none of the budget of King's Landing and everything at the wall seemed different from before, did anyone else get that, like they've changed sets or something? It didn't even seem cold there.

What do you expect? Castle Black isn't supposed to be as fancy as KL. I'd say the upcoming battle there has bitten into the budget more than anything else this season.

It didn't look cold where the Wildlings were because they're a good bit south of the Wall in the Gift.

Liam O

Son0vagun wrote: »

We didn't get to see Shaes POV in the book. What else other then jealously do you think drove Shae into Tywins bed?

She's a greedy whore.

Liam O

Son0vagun wrote: »

People need to let the show do their own thing. I see both the books and show as two totally enjoy different things. Can't let changes to the book get to you, that's just silly.

That was a awesome episode, probably the best season opener!

It's nothing to do with that. They ignore character development for sex scenes which are only there to add to the edginess of the show. It's like 2 teenage boys were given writing privileges at times. Now obviously I don't mind the sex scenes from a testosterone filled standpoint but it's like every character no matter how big or small seems to have time given to a sexual objective rather than progression of their character and insights.

I mean even fùcking Grey Worm is now getting a romantic subplot, like come on!

mewso

Son0vagun wrote: »

People need to let the show do their own thing. I see both the books and show as two totally enjoy different things. Can't let changes to the book get to you, that's just silly.

I have no problem with changes that make sense and work well. Not just letting Shae be simply a whore (and doing it for money since you asked) is weak imo.

Mr Freeze

Haven't seen the episode yet, but at this stage now, I don't really mind the changes the show makes.

The odd thing does bug me like, the Jon/Tormond rapport that's in the books, hasn't been replicated on screen, I really like how them two get on in the ASOS.

Still, that can be remedied in the Parley scene if it hasn't been cut.

Nerdlingr

The Garden scene with Dontas. Are they going with the necklace or a head-dress for the Sansa's poison receptacle? Always liked the idea of her be a Medusa-like figure with the poisoned snakes in her hair.

Kunkka

Thinking of asking my boss to get off early.....

"Why?"

"Winter is coming"

Wonder how that'll fly... roll on 5:30!

Mickeroo

mewso wrote: »

I have no problem with changes that make sense and work well. Not just letting Shae be simply a whore (and doing it for money since you asked) is weak imo.

Yeah I agree, in general and I don't mind changes from the books at all (didn't read them until after season 2) i even welcome them as it keeps me guessing but I don't like the Shae stuff. I actually prefer her portrayal in the show to the book, she genuinely likes Tyrion and seems really intelligent, but I just don't buy show Shae acting the same way as book Shae in the end because they seem like 2 different characters to me. It's early days yet though I suppose.

Paddy Cow

Mickeroo wrote: »

Yeah I agree, in general and I don't mind changes from the books at all (didn't read them until after season 2) i even welcome them as it keeps me guessing but I don't like the Shae stuff. I actually prefer her portrayal in the show to the book, she genuinely likes Tyrion and seems really intelligent, but I just don't buy show Shae acting the same way as book Shae in the end because they seem like 2 different characters to me. It's early days yet though I suppose.

It will be interesting to see in the show if they have her in bed with Tywin. I found that part really unbelievable in the books. Tywin despises whores with a passion and I just don't buy into him sleeping with Shae to get back at Tyrion. If Shae came onto Tywin it would be more believable for him to kill her.

Mickeroo

Paddy Cow wrote: »

It will be interesting to see in the show if they have her in bed with Tywin. I found that part really unbelievable in the books. Tywin despises whores with a passion and I just don't buy into him sleeping with Shae to get back at Tyrion. If Shae came onto Tywin it would be more believable for him to kill her.

I think it kind of hinted that Tywin is just a big hypocrite which I was ok with in the book, but again the way Dance plays him I just don't see it either.

Gbear

Liam O wrote: »

Winced a lot at changes from the books. After Oberyn's gay scene I was ready to write it off, throwing in sex scenes for cheap character growth rather than grow the character through dialogue. Ellaria being shunted for a conversation with Tyrion completely goes against his book character too where if I remember correctly he made a point of saying that she was to hear everything he did.

Oberyn was bisexual.
We know what the Dornish are like. Non-book readers haven't met any before.

They showed every element of Oberyn's character as it was in the books - he's incredibly reckless, dangerous but also this sort of progressive, sexy libertine.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

Enjoyed it overall - the final scene with Arya and the Hound in the tavern was class. In both the books and the show I had always considered Arya to be bad-ass, but this point in the books was where she just exceeded my expectations of awesomness, and they didn't disappoint here in the show either...

Lots of love for Oberyn amongst non-readers, as well as a lot of 'em claiming The Hound is their new favourite character... Oh they're all gonna be so disappointed later this season.
I love them both as characters too, but at least I know their fate going in to this season...

Next week, I'll be expecting the internet to blow up around 3am after the episode has aired...

Nerdlingr

Also Starring LeVar Burton wrote: »

Enjoyed it overall - the final scene with Arya and the Hound in the tavern was class. In both the books and the show I had always considered Arya to be bad-ass, but this point in the books was where she just exceeded my expectations of awesomness, and they didn't disappoint here in the show either...

Lots of love for Oberyn amongst non-readers, as well as a lot of 'em claiming The Hound is their new favourite character... Oh they're all gonna be so disappointed later this season.
I love them both as characters too, but at least I know their fate going in to this season...

Next week, I'll be expecting the internet to blow up around 3am after the episode has aired...

Gonna so miss Joffrey/Jack Gleeson when it happens. Even last night, he was in it for 2 minutes and was outstanding again. Such a brilliant character to hate.

Mickeroo

Is joffrey next week? nice thought that wasn't until episode 3!

Also Starring LeVar Burton

Mickeroo wrote: »

Is joffrey next week? nice thought that wasn't until episode 3!

Next week's episode is called The Lion and The Rose, so I'd be quite surprised if it wasn't next week...

Gbear