Malaysia Airlines flight MH370-Updates and Discussion

V_Moth

vonbarracuda wrote: »

Could this Airfield on right at Car Nicobar handle a 777 I wonder?

Possibly, but it would be an odd choice as the airport is also used by the Indian Air Force (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_Nicobar_Air_Force_Base).

Tigerandahalf

Radar coverage image that was posted on numerous sites.
https://www.google.ie/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&docid=sKJ7012YzW5ahM&tbnid=k2GNaUGRFZlLAM:&ved=0CAYQjRw&url=%2Furl%3Fsa%3Di%26rct%3Dj%26q%3D%26esrc%3Ds%26source%3Dimages%26cd%3D%26cad%3Drja%26uact%3D8%26docid%3DsKJ7012YzW5ahM%26tbnid%3Dk2GNaUGRFZlLAM%3A%26ved%3D0CAYQjRw%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.flyertalk.com%252Fforum%252F22502131-post2140.html%26ei%3DgfQiU-yrCIPOhAffsYDgDQ%26bvm%3Dbv.62922401%2Cd.ZG4%26psig%3DAFQjCNGbFoaA-5hsIGLP5nXbdNVzPVzLMQ%26ust%3D1394886130014198&ei=gfQiU-yrCIPOhAffsYDgDQ&bvm=bv.62922401,d.ZG4&psig=AFQjCNGbFoaA-5hsIGLP5nXbdNVzPVzLMQ&ust=1394886130014198

Colser

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

It seems from what we have been told that the zig-zag pattern was attempt to avoid radar.
I presume these waypoints can be entered into the plane's autopilot which will then fly to the waypoint and then onto the next waypoint when its corrdinates have been entered.
It would clearly need a person to have knowledge of the waypoints around the area and the path that could be taken to avoid radar contact. Not sure if these waypoints would have a reference for altitude.

Seen a poster elsewhere discuss this also..and that if the plane has landed safely its like a cat and mouse game..pretty apt Id say...while on the one hand the authorities have to concentrate on the search they must surely be watching for some kind of terrorist action using the plane..pretty worrying and frightening to say the least.

cml387

I don't really buy the hijacking hypothesis.
Malaysia is a stable democracy with relatively good relations between the religious groupings.
If the target is China, would it not have been easier to hijack an internal flight where security is usually more lax?
Plus the object of hijacking is usually publicity. Secretly crashing the aircraft into the sea doesn't seem to achieve that.

RoryMac

cml387 wrote: »

I don't really buy the hijacking hypothesis.
Malaysia is a stable democracy with relatively good relations between the religious groupings.
If the target is China, would it not have been easier to hijack an internal flight where security is usually more lax?
Plus the object of hijacking is usually publicity. Secretly crashing the aircraft into the sea doesn't seem to achieve that.

Not fully convinced of the hijack idea myself but the fact that Malaysia is a stable country might make them an easier from which the hijackers can board undetected as they may be lax about passenger security.

If the target was China the plane would have continued on it's original route as it would have raised little suspicion due to the destination being Beijing. Indications that the plane went west would rule out China as the target I would have thought, unless they were interested in some passengers onboard?

geneva geneva4444

cml387 wrote: »

I don't really buy the hijacking hypothesis.
Malaysia is a stable democracy with relatively good relations between the religious groupings.
If the target is China, would it not have been easier to hijack an internal flight where security is usually more lax?
Plus the object of hijacking is usually publicity. Secretly crashing the aircraft into the sea doesn't seem to achieve that.

Are you including pilot intervention in that hypothesis?

lifeandtimes

if we were to entertain the idea of a possible hijack for a moment..have the list of passengers been confirmed that it was everyone who said they were bar the Iranians?

The reason im asking is would it be possible that someone on board was a high ranking organised criminal(triad,yakuza,mafia etc) who was being transferred undercover and a different name with officials, with the means and money to organize an ambush mid air to have him escape and say fly somewhere else...straight out of conair and far fetched i know but possible do you think?

Tigerandahalf

What direction is the investigation going to take if nothing is found over the next few weeks?
What responsibility and liability do MA, Boeing and Rolls Royce have?
Do Malaysian Authorities still retain responsibility for the overall investigation going forward?
Is the whole thing going nowhere unless the plane can be retrieved? Would MA, Boeing and Rolls Royce be free from litigation if no plane is found?

pugsnotdrugs13

Just taking a step back here and thinking how the hell is this possible? Something of such importance is just unanswerable after one week of looking for this plane? The plane couldnt have gone any further than the distance its fuel tank allowed, which I believe was 6 hours flying time after the plane disappeared off radar.

I've been keeping up with this thread everyday and it's so interesting (minus the bickering).

This plane has to be found? Like this really opens up possibilities for terrorism and really would put ideas into some psychopaths that the whole world is online picking at every single detail, around 50 ships and 50 military planes are searching for the plan, and 13 countries officially aiding the search. If this plane isn't found I really don't know whats next if its shown that this kind of thing is possible.

By the way, I'm 90% believing that the disappearance is due to a hijacking.

castor 1

If it is a hijacking, is there anyway the blackbox could be wiped.

If the plane was parked up in east Africa as has been suggested, how far back in time will the black box store its information ?

pugsnotdrugs13

castor 1 wrote: »

If it is a hijacking, is there anyway the blackbox could be wiped.

If the plane was parked up in east Africa as has been suggested, how far back in time will the black box store its information ?

I'm watching sky news now, and a few minutes ago it stated the black box will continue to give off sonar signals until up to 30days and then it will shut off. I'm unsure about after that, whether or not the data would be still there without some kind of data storage I'm assuming airlines do after flights.

A Primal Nut

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

What direction is the investigation going to take if nothing is found over the next few weeks?
What responsibility and liability do MA, Boeing and Rolls Royce have?
Do Malaysian Authorities still retain responsibility for the overall investigation going forward?
Is the whole thing going nowhere unless the plane can be retrieved? Would MA, Boeing and Rolls Royce be free from litigation if no plane is found?

Compensation will certainly be paid....most likely MA.

JONJO THE MISER

Am i right in saying that the black box has not given back sonar signals yet?
Does this mean its not in water and could be landed somewhere?

Tigerandahalf

From what we have been told I find a hijacking unlikely. Even if there were 4/5 hijackers onboard how do you stop 200 people onboard from restraining them. The hijackers couldn't actually shoot a few bullets so how would they subdue the passengers.

If what we have been told is true re the plane turning back I think the flight crew could be responsible. We haven't heard any info re relations between the flight crew and their employer. Had one of them being reprimanded or overturned for promotion or had any grievance with their employer. Given that there were only two of them in the cockpit one of them could have subdued the other and then taken the plane off route. I don't think the cabin crew have access to any radios to communicate. A scenario like this would be deeply damaging and embarassing to Malaysian Airlines.
I still wonder how the Malaysian defence forces would react if they spotted an unidentified plane/object on their radar. Surely they would have scrambled fighter jets to investigate it. It would be interesting to hear their take on this.

Thrill

USS Kidd arrives in Strait of Malacca to begin search west of Malaysia for Flight MH370; US P-3C Orion aircraft also searching to west.

murphaph

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

From what we have been told I find a hijacking unlikely. Even if there were 4/5 hijackers onboard how do you stop 200 people onboard from restraining them. The hijackers couldn't actually shoot a few bullets so how would they subdue the passengers.

Huh? Hijackers have successfully subdued a couple of hundred airline passengers with the threat of violence several times in the past. Anyway, the hijacker(s) only has to subdue 1 guy really....a pilot. If he can get to the flight deck and lock the door, the 200 people behind won't be able to do much about where the plane then flies.

Setun

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

From what we have been told I find a hijacking unlikely. Even if there were 4/5 hijackers onboard how do you stop 200 people onboard from restraining them. The hijackers couldn't actually shoot a few bullets so how would they subdue the passengers.

If what we have been told is true re the plane turning back I think the flight crew could be responsible. We haven't heard any info re relations between the flight crew and their employer. Had one of them being reprimanded or overturned for promotion or had any grievance with their employer. Given that there were only two of them in the cockpit one of them could have subdued the other and then taken the plane off route. I don't think the cabin crew have access to any radios to communicate. A scenario like this would be deeply damaging and embarassing to Malaysian Airlines.
I still wonder how the Malaysian defence forces would react if they spotted an unidentified plane/object on their radar. Surely they would have scrambled fighter jets to investigate it. It would be interesting to hear their take on this.

This seems more likely to me - a number of times Malaysian authorities brought up the issue of the pilot/crew's mental disposition. In the instance of a politically motivated hijacking, you would expect that a terrorist organisation would have already claimed responsibility. The other possibility is that it was a small group of 'lone wolves' without ties to any major terror groups, and never managed to release a statement.

sopretty

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

Am i right in saying that the black box has not given back sonar signals yet?
Does this mean its not in water and could be landed somewhere?

From what I have gleaned from the technical information posted here, a ship would need to be in close proximity to pick up on or 'hear' the sonar signal if you get me?

I presumed, until this very informative thread , that whatever signal was being emitted would be somehow immediately picked up on some screen somewhere in an office (by what means, I never ventured to wonder about! :eek:), but unfortunately it is not so.

Happyman42

The stuff Malaysia aren't telling us because it is 'too sensitive' could be negotiations with hijackers?

A Primal Nut

All islands in the Andaman Sea require Indian permission to land. Except one. Coco Island.

http://intellihub.com/malaysian-airliner-may-commandeered-taken-secret-coco-island-base-new-info-reveals-plane-flew-4-hours-transponder-deactivated/

The conspiracy that the Chinese devised this as a way to takeover the South China Sea has some weight. Or perhaps to kidnap the freescale engneers. Crazy, I know.

Tigerandahalf

murphaph wrote: »

Huh? Hijackers have successfully subdued a couple of hundred airline passengers with the threat of violence several times in the past. Anyway, the hijacker(s) only has to subdue 1 guy really....a pilot. If he can get to the flight deck and lock the door, the 200 people behind won't be able to do much about where the plane then flies.

But a lot needs to go right for the hijackers to bring about that situation. Getting access to the cockpit would take timing and for the flight crew not to be able to communicate a warning first. Since 9/11 as well it is doubtful that passengers would not attempt to overcome the hijackers.

A Primal Nut

A Primal Nut wrote: »

All islands in the Andaman Sea require Indian permission to land. Except one. Coco Island.

http://intellihub.com/malaysian-airliner-may-commandeered-taken-secret-coco-island-base-new-info-reveals-plane-flew-4-hours-transponder-deactivated/

The conspiracy that the Chinese devised this as a way to takeover the South China Sea has some weight. Or perhaps to kidnap the freescale engneers. Crazy, I know.

they also have a report about the coming false Flag....
Maybe take their words with a grain of salt

''Following the coming false flag, how will the powers-that-be get the country to fall into line and willingly participate in their demise as we race towards World War III

By Dave Hodges

(INTELLIHUB) — It is important to note that the people must be brought to their knees by denying food and through unconstitutional incarcerations as provided for under the NDAA and EO 13603.

The powers that be have ....'''

and I like a great CT as much as the next woman )

MuffinsDa

Question for commercial pilots here, or those who know one or two:
How many pilots have a home-made simulator at home? The chief pilot seem to have/had a fairly nice (not that advanced but adequate to practice ...) setup at home. Now I don't really know if it's common for pilots to have something like that, considering that they fly the real thing all the time, and that they have also access to proper simulators as part of the training. Wouldn't they be sick of the sight of the cockpit and would they really set one up at home to work on/play with in their spare time?
Genuine question, I don't know the answer. If yes then all good!

Maximus Alexander

MuffinsDa wrote: »

Question for commercial pilots here, or those who know one or two:
How many pilots have a home-made simulator at home? The chief pilot seem to have/had a fairly nice (not that advanced but adequate to practice ...) setup at home. Now I don't really know if it's common for pilots to have something like that, considering that they fly the real thing all the time, and that they have also access to proper simulators as part of the training. Wouldn't they be sick of the sight of the cockpit and would they really set one up at home to work on/play with in their spare time?
Genuine question, I don't know the answer. If yes then all good!

I've seen Wayne Rooney playing FIFA.

A Primal Nut

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

But a lot needs to go right for the hijackers to bring about that situation. Getting access to the cockpit would take timing and for the flight crew not to be able to communicate a warning first. Since 9/11 as well it is doubtful that passengers would not attempt to overcome the hijackers.

What if someone threatened the pilots family? The family themselves might not know but perhaps someone told the pilots this is what they have to do or their family will be killed. They could have been threatened on the ground, not necessarily by someone on the plane.

I still think that whoever was flying this plane had a plan for it, but the passengers overpowered him and the plane was crashed.

What that plan could be I have no idea.

Happyman42

MuffinsDa wrote: »

Question for commercial pilots here, or those who know one or two:
How many pilots have a home-made simulator at home? The chief pilot seem to have/had a fairly nice (not that advanced but adequate to practice ...) setup at home. Now I don't really know if it's common for pilots to have something like that, considering that they fly the real thing all the time, and that they have also access to proper simulators as part of the training. Wouldn't they be sick of the sight of the cockpit and would they really set one up at home to work on/play with in their spare time?
Genuine question, I don't know the answer. If yes then all good!

Has come up earlier in thread, seems it is quite common and wouldn't allow him to practice necessary real life actions, needed here.

mickmackey1

MuffinsDa wrote: »

Wouldn't they be sick of the sight of the cockpit and would they really set one up at home to work on/play with in their spare time?

Well I remember Steve Davis being asked how he liked to relax when he wasn't playing snooker and he said... playing billiards :cool:

MuffinsDa

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I've seen Wayne Rooney playing FIFA.

Yeah but that's a game, and gives instant gratification.

Lots of software engineers have a computer at home too!! So what?

My specific question was for those who are pilots or know pilots. If you don't have anything useful to add then it's best to stay quiet!

MuffinsDa

mickmackey1 wrote: »

Well I remember Steve Davis being asked how he liked to relax when he wasn't playing snooker and he said... playing billiards :cool:

Sorry you were beaten in Smart A. competition by Maximus, the same reply applies here.

Maximus Alexander

MuffinsDa wrote: »

Yeah but that's a game, and gives instant gratification.

Lots of software engineers have a computer at home too!! So what?

My specific question was for those who are pilots or know pilots. If you don't have anything useful to add then it's best to stay quiet!

Seriously? It's exactly the same thing. Check the attitude at the door please.