Iona vs Panti

Delirium

[dated 2007] VATICAN CITY (Catholic Online) – The Catholic Church is the one, holy, apostolic church of Christ, while other Christian Orthodox and Protestant denominations that “suffer from defects” share elements of “sanctification and of truth,” said the Vatican’s doctrinal congregation.

Released July 10 (2007) under the title "Responses to Some Questions Regarding Certain Aspects of the Doctrine on the Church," the 1,200-word document was signed by U.S. Cardinal William J. Levada, prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, and congregation secretary Archbishop Angelo Amato, and approved by Pope Benedict XVI before publication.

aloyisious

Some-how, I'd imagine that the wording of that statement: --- [dated 2007] VATICAN CITY (Catholic Online) – The Catholic Church is the one, holy, apostolic church of Christ, while other Christian Orthodox and Protestant denominations that “suffer from defects” share elements of “sanctification and of truth,” said the Vatican’s doctrinal congregation. --- could/would be seen as offensive by the other denominations. Still. it's nice to see that Gays are not the only "things" seen as having defects by the RCC HQ.

I believe that John Waters opinion on all things gay is viewed through the optics of a father who had custody of his child awarded to his ex by the courts. he has a bee-in-his-bonnet about the state, fathership and mariage and that view coincides with the RCC view on the family and children. Their separate interests coincide. they see them as best served by opposing the notion that non-traditional marriage of the kind that doesn't procreate children in their chosen view cannot be allowed. That also includes Civil Marriages outside the RCC purview. I wouldn't be surprised if the RCC in Para 1 above doesn't also include marriages performed by the other Christian denominations included there-in.

Zubeneschamali

Zillah wrote: »

You're the one who used that expression, I don't care if say "word" or "assembly" or whatever you like - it doesn't change the fact that they believe themselves to be God's representatives on Earth, and those that defy their laws are in error.

Wrong again, Doctor DooM used it:

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Isn't the whole point of the RCC that it's the one true word of God as passed through his one true voice piece?

I said no, and you jumped in telling me I don't know what I'm talking about.

Now you don't even care if the original statement was right or wrong or what words I use? How can anyone tell what the hell you're talking about, so?

sid waddell

John Waters has been only too happy to use the term "feminazis" in the past, and as that Fergus Finlay article shows, is still happy to throw around defamatory insults at his opponents.

He's nothing but a bully.

sid waddell

I do love it when members of the anti-SSM campaign show themselves up to be complete hypocrites.

John McGuirk ‏@john_mcguirk 13h
@Scullybones025 It's pointless stuff. They've no intention of listening. Intellectual masturbation is what they prefer. And shouting.

Bannasidhe

Just got this in my inbox - the mind boggles. Boggles I tells ya!

Doctor DooM

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Well, yes, he would say that, wouldn't he?

Suppose Enda Kenny appointed a bunch of ginger people to the Cabinet and passed a law saying that only red-haired people are Irish.

A black haired person objects, and you say "Why would you want to be Irish when the definition of Irish is anti-black-haired people, and the people who define Irishness don't want you? Just declare yourself British or something!"

Well, no. All Irish people are Irish, and Catholics are Catholics whether they agree with the Pope or not.

Actually, no.

Legally, only the red haired would be Irish. People could say whatever they felt like, and rationalise every which way to assert their Irishness, but in reality the law would remain until it were changed somehow.

The difference is, Enda represents an elected government and he couldn't do that because he'd lose the black haired vote.

The pope gets to decide and is apparently only responsible to someone most people here don't think exist.

Bannasidhe

How has this discussion become about the inner workings of the Roman Catholic Church?

Panti was accused of defaming members of the Iona Institute and RTÉ paid those people to go away yet nearly every recent post has been about the RCC...

I would like them to feck off out of this thread plz. :mad:

rughdh

SW wrote: »

[dated 2007] VATICAN CITY (Catholic Online) – The Catholic Church is the one, holy, apostolic church of Christ, while other Christian Orthodox and Protestant denominations that “suffer from defects” share elements of “sanctification and of truth,” said the Vatican’s doctrinal congregation.

The congregation of the 32 county Church of Ireland (Protestant Catholic) believe in "one, holy, catholic and apostolic church". Are they the indigenous Irish catholics and are members of the Roman Catholic Church essentially descendants of Italian immigrants?

My head hurts, Ted. Tell me about the cows again!

robindch

Bannasidhe wrote: »

How has this discussion become about the inner workings of the Roman Catholic Church?

The discussion about what constitutes "catholism" has been moved here.

Bannasidhe

robindch wrote: »

The discussion about what constitutes "catholism" has been moved here.

Thank you.

Now I can happily avoid it.

Links234

You know, I actually really love this quote from Jawn:

Waters: “But again they can’t stop talking about transsexuals and transsexual nuns and transsexual gays, you know, I mean, you know, we’re moving towards gay abortion, you know, how can we actually further, keep moving this? And really what that is, that’s very much tied up with the misunderstanding of human desire, that has arisen in the kind of post religion, post Christian era. Because intrinsic to Christianity, and I don’t think it’s in most other religions, is the idea that human desire is focused on something beyond. Now if you actually remove that from culture, then you have only what is the human being, and sexuality seems to be do, sexuality and money and obviously the money thing isn’t going so well.

He starts talking about transsexuals, but quickly realizes he doesn't actually know what he's talking about and trails off with no less than 3 "you know"'s in the same sentence. It's a gibbering mess towards the end.

"Transsexuals, transsexuals... I don't actually know what a transsexual is but I know I'm against it, down with this sort of thing!"

Bannasidhe

Links234 wrote: »

You know, I actually really love this quote from Jawn:



He starts talking about transsexuals, but quickly realizes he doesn't actually know what he's talking about and trails off with no less than 3 "you know"'s in the same sentence. It's a gibbering mess towards the end.

"Transsexuals, transsexuals... I don't actually know what a transsexual is but I know I'm against it, down with this sort of thing!"

Soon it will be transsexual gays having abortions in the lobby of shopping centres while the floods rise and all the wood for the crosses will be used to make gates and then where will be be?

:eek:

Sarky

Note the flagrant overuse of "[anything Jawn doesn't like], quote unquote".

Who the f*ck says "quote unquote" that much? Once per interview is surely more than enough, but I lost count with Waters.

Bannasidhe

Sarky wrote: »

Note the flagrant overuse of "[anything Jawn doesn't like], quote unquote".

Who the f*ck says "quote unquote" that much? Once per interview is surely more than enough, but I lost count with Waters.

May I quote unquote you on that?

I wonder if he did the wiggly fingers thing when he said that...?
I fecking hate the wiggly fingers thing.

Zubeneschamali

Sarky wrote: »

Note the flagrant overuse of "[anything Jawn doesn't like], quote unquote".

The same miserable bástard would probably get a weeks wage for a column giving out about kids and their "air quotes".

Bannasidhe

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

The same miserable bástard would probably get a weeks wage for a column giving out about kids and their "air quotes".

If people have air guitars when playing along to guitar solos should people have air quotes when singing along?

I wonder what Jawn would quote unquote?

Lou.m

Waters: “But again they can’t stop talking about transsexuals and transsexual nuns and transsexual gays, you know, I mean, you know, we’re moving towards gay abortion, you know, how can we actually further, keep moving this? And really what that is, that’s very much tied up with the misunderstanding of human desire, that has arisen in the kind of post religion, post Christian era. Because intrinsic to Christianity, and I don’t think it’s in most other religions, is the idea that human desire is focused on something beyond. Now if you actually remove that from culture, then you have only what is the human being, and sexuality seems to be do, sexuality and money and obviously the money thing isn’t going so well.

By the way what is gay abortion?

aloyisious

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Just got this in my inbox - the mind boggles. Boggles I tells ya!

trying to plant seeds of doubt in your mind

Obliq

Links234 wrote: »

You know, I actually really love this quote from Jawn

I'm intrigued by his mentioning transsexual nuns. Sounds like he's been watching dodgy porno to me, as he doesn't usually ascribe "intrinsic disorders" to his precious religious folk, does he?

PopePalpatine

sid waddell wrote: »

I do love it when members of the anti-SSM campaign show themselves up to be complete hypocrites.

John McGuirk ‏@john_mcguirk 13h
@Scullybones025 It's pointless stuff. They've no intention of listening. Intellectual masturbation is what they prefer. And shouting.

[IMG.]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfpFi3fCYAALwJl.png[/IMG]

Hey, at least our masturbation is intellectual rather than the knuckle-dragging style that McGuirk and his troglodyte friends perform.

Brian Shanahan

Penncil Dick wrote: »

Exactly. The Church won't change because the Church can't change. Their entire doctrine is based on what they believe to be the word of God. They can't change it. If they change one thing because it's what the majority of its followers want, then it opens the door to demands for changing other things."

I don't think it's an idea of the church can't change, more than the church can't be seen to have changed. Like with BB in Nineteen Eighty-Four, changes happen all the time, but the changes themselves have to be disguised, all memory of them erased and everybody to believe that things were always that way.

That's the way I see the church operating. And at the moment they cannot change on things like contraception, women's rights, abortion, gay rights or divorce because those things are too big and too visible to disguise the change, and the church doesn't have the censorious power it used to have.

Brian Shanahan

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Did anyone say it was?

Nobody did, but then again it is argumentum ad "hey, look there's something shiny that has nothing got to do with the topic at hand. Let's all look at that and forget the issue being debated!"

Brian Shanahan

Lou.m wrote: »

By the way what is gay abortion?

Probably one where everybody's singing a Gilbert & Sullivan musical right the way through.

aloyisious

Lou.m wrote: »

By the way what is gay abortion?

Probably some peoples way of expressing an opinion on how God should rid the earth of un-naturals

robindch

Fintan O'Toole doesn't think that newspaper columnists should threaten legal action when somebody hurts their feelings.

http://www.irishtimes.com/culture/media/a-columnist-s-job-confers-some-privileges-and-obligations-1.1686487?page=2

robindch

Did this get posted? Bock The Robber on Iona's PR own-hat-trick.

http://bocktherobber.com/2014/02/iona-institute-provides-master-class-in-bad-pr/

Bannasidhe

robindch wrote: »

Did this get posted? Bock The Robber on Iona's PR own-hat-trick.

http://bocktherobber.com/2014/02/iona-institute-provides-master-class-in-bad-pr/

Annnnnd bookmark bock.

Thank ee Rob.

robindch

FWIW, there's a petition up on change.org requesting RTE to apologize and for Waters, Quinn et al to return the loot:

https://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/rte-publicly-apologize-for-its-handling-of-the-rory-o-niell-scandal-and-demand-the-payments-to-john-waters-and-the-iona-institute-be-returned

Sarky

Fox News are now ridiculing the Iona Institute. When FOX of all media organisations are mocking you for being too intolerant...