The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2014

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I heard the ref was dealing out yellows for fun to both sides - but it has to be said Tipp lost the rag near the end - The aim for senior Tipp is to try and get two or three senior players out of a crop - hopefully that might happen

Kerry, in football, don't win much at minor level considering their status in terms of ALL-Irelands but they produce a steady line of lines players from each crop

From what i understand its a young team. Isnt it absolutely insane though for a ref to dish out yellows for sport to minor hurlers? Some murderers of the game out there.

evolving tipperary

Was it the All-Ireland minor final or one of the semis which was ruined by over zealous referring last year too...wonder if it was the same guy...

The Lost Sheep

Deleted User wrote: »

From what i understand its a young team. Isnt it absolutely insane though for a ref to dish out yellows for sport to minor hurlers? Some murderers of the game out there.

Not really insane at all. Unless you were at game you don't know. Isn't insane for a ref to give loads of yellows especially if sides are coming in from all sides with mental tackles. From most reports the first red was harsh but most other cards were well deserved for reckless challenges.
Last sentence completely OTT.

The Lost Sheep

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Not really insane at all. Unless you were at game you don't know. Isn't insane for a ref to give loads of yellows especially if sides are coming in from all sides with mental tackles. From most reports the first red was harsh but most other cards were well deserved for reckless challenges.
Last sentence completely OTT.

Maybe not in tonight's case but I remember seeing Damien Fox ref inter Munster final in Thurles last year and he killed it stone dead with his carry on giving frees for nothing. Few harsh reds dished out also in senior championship last year

evolving tipperary

Did Gar Ryan train?

Mantis Toboggan

Two bad defeats for the minors. Very disappointing.
IIs that the end of them in this year's championship?

looder

Buddy Holly wrote: »

Two bad defeats for the minors. Very disappointing.
IIs that the end of them in this year's championship?

Yep, they're out now.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cahill is out on his ear too.

premierstone

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Not really insane at all. Unless you were at game you don't know. Isn't insane for a ref to give loads of yellows especially if sides are coming in from all sides with mental tackles. From most reports the first red was harsh but most other cards were well deserved for reckless challenges.
Last sentence completely OTT.

Harsh? It was the most redicilous decision I have ever seen on a field and thats saying alot! There were Clare lads beside me in the stand going mental when he blew the whistle, they assumed he was giving a free in for the keepers follow through, always a bad sign when a ref blows the whistle and no-one even knows which way the free is going!

premierstone

looder wrote: »

Yep, they're out now.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cahill is out on his ear too.

Very good trainer but not management material IMO, in fairness too him though this age group have won nothing all the way up and it was generally accepted they were weak enough with a large number of the panel under age next year, also the ever increasing number of dual players is doing neither code a service when it comes to preparation and training.

The Lost Sheep

premierstone wrote: »

Harsh? It was the most redicilous decision I have ever seen on a field and thats saying alot! There were Clare lads beside me in the stand going mental when he blew the whistle, they assumed he was giving a free in for the keepers follow through, always a bad sign when a ref blows the whistle and no-one even knows which way the free is going!

Ah PS don't be so OTT most ridiculous??
Not a bad sign at all especially with a game that clearly had plenty of niggle etc
The first card to put it in words of the match reports ive seen was "the only dismissal you could argue against".

premierstone wrote: »

Very good trainer but not management material IMO, in fairness too him though this age group have won nothing all the way up and it was generally accepted they were weak enough with a large number of the panel under age next year, also the ever increasing number of dual players is doing neither code a service when it comes to preparation and training.

So not head coach material but good to be part of the coaching team??
As there was so many of the squad dual players and underage next year as well that as you say will completely have affected the side.
What can you do about dual players then? Don't think we should go down the line of insisting/looking for players to pick one code over the other so what can be done?

premierstone

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Ah PS don't be so OTT most ridiculous??
Not a bad sign at all especially with a game that clearly had plenty of niggle etc
The first card to put it in words of the match reports ive seen was "the only dismissal you could argue against".
So not head coach material but good to be part of the coaching team??
As there was so many of the squad dual players and underage next year as well that as you say will completely have affected the side.
What can you do about dual players then? Don't think we should go down the line of insisting/looking for players to pick one code over the other so what can be done?

Not OTT at all it was a farcical decision, he actually let play go at the time, resulting in a Tipp point and then brandishes a straight red. He booked two Clare players in the first 10 minutes for what I have no idea, the seconfd one was actualy a free to Clare!

Yes a coach and a manager are two completley seperate roles, surely you are aware of this and the fact that been good at one does not equate to the other, would you for example be happy with Paul Kinerrick as the Clare manager?

9 Dual players involved and 13 of last nights panel underage next year.

Nothing you can really do about dual players and I agree you can insist on lads picking one over the other, but it most certainly has a detremental affect on a teams preperation.

Spirit of 67

premierstone wrote: »

Not OTT at all it was a farcical decision, he actually let play go at the time, resulting in a Tipp point and then brandishes a straight red. He booked two Clare players in the first 10 minutes for what I have no idea, the seconfd one was actualy a free to Clare!

Yes a coach and a manager are two completley seperate roles, surely you are aware of this and the fact that been good at one does not equate to the other, would you for example be happy with Paul Kinerrick as the Clare manager?

9 Dual players involved and 13 of last nights panel underage next year.

Nothing you can really do about dual players and I agree you can insist on lads picking one over the other, but it most certainly has a detremental affect on a teams preperation.

Waterford have plenty of Dual players as well at Minor and are going well on both fronts ! Wasn`t a problem for us in 2012 when we won Munster in both and an All Ireland in Hurling . It`s just a handy excuse , you`ll get the one`s saying they should play Hurling because we are "a Hurling County" but these lads want to play both , if they didn`t they have the option , nobody is forcing them to play both .

Now that we are out of the Hurling hopefully we have some success this year in the Football and the whole County gets behind the Lads !

premierstone

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

Waterford have plenty of Dual players as well at Minor and are going well on both fronts ! Wasn`t a problem for us in 2012 when we won Munster in both and an All Ireland in Hurling . It`s just a handy excuse , you`ll get the one`s saying they should play Hurling because we are "a Hurling County" but these lads want to play both , if they didn`t they have the option , nobody is forcing them to play both .

Now that we are out of the Hurling hopefully we have some success this year in the Football and the whole County gets behind the Lads !

I never said anything of the sort about picking one code over the other, please don't put words in my mouth and if you actually think that having 9 players missing from training sessions and challenge matches wouldn't have a detremntal affect on a team then I give up!

PS Waterford have won one minor football match in 5 years, yeah they are a real powerhouse!

Spirit of 67

premierstone wrote: »

I never said anything of the sort about picking one code over the other, please don't put words in my mouth and if you actually think that having 9 players missing from training sessions and challenge matches wouldn't have a detremntal affect on a team then I give up!

PS Waterford have won one minor football match in 5 years, yeah they are a real powerhouse!

Where did I say you did , I just mentioned we are not the only County with Dual Players , in fact probably most Counties do . Having 9 Players missing from the Football training sessions must be detrimental , I agree with you .

At least the Waterford lads give it a go , they are aware that they have a poor record , these things change though look at us ! Also they are young lads so I wouldn`t be too harsh on them .

premierstone

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

Where did I say you did , I just mentioned we are not the only County with Dual Players , in fact probably most Counties do . Having 9 Players missing from the Football training sessions must be detrimental , I agree with you .

At least the Waterford lads give it a go , they are aware that they have a poor record , these things change though look at us ! Also they are young lads so I wouldn`t be too harsh on them .

Really not been harsh on the lads at all Spirit, I don't blame them for a minute in this.

When I said 9 players missing training and challenge matches would have a negative affect I meant on both codes, this is not ideal for either sets of management.

I can tell you aswell that its very much hurling that gets the preference in Waterford and football is very very badly treated down there. In recent times we have divided all resources and time equally between both codes and our improved performances in football are as a result of this.

Spirit of 67

premierstone wrote: »

Really not been harsh on the lads at all Spirit, I don't blame them for a minute in this.

When I said 9 players missing training and challenge matches would have a negative affect I meant on both codes, this is not ideal for either sets of management.

I can tell you aswell that its very much hurling that gets the preference in Waterford and football is very very badly treated down there. In recent times we have divided all resources and time equally between both codes and our improved performances in football are as a result of this.

Which is great to see as a Football fan . I remember the 70`s and 80`s when we couldn`t win a Hurling or Football game in The Senior Championship , now we have had 2 bad years at Minor level in Hurling and people here and on Tipp Supporter Pages on Facebook are pulling their hair out ! Relax Lads these things happen in Cycles .

Xenophile

I have been reliably told by someone in the know that Tipp do not have too much expectations this year from the Minor footballers, in fact they were described "as rather weak".

On a positive note they have a great manager in Charlie McGeever and I know that they will work their socks for him. With a bit of luck we can overcome Kerry, but keep in mind that Kerry have been under performing at underage level and there are many in the county who want to see this situation improve.

To the minors I say "you did it before and you can do it again"

evolving tipperary

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/maher-tipp-can-lay-down-a-marker-267130.html

Will Brendan Maher be strong enough for center back in the championship if Kilkenny shifted Michael Fennelly there - then again who is strong enough for Fennelly...

Maher certainly has the hurling, skill, engine, and reading of the game for center back but I do think he can be out muscled - but that seems to be this team's problem whenever they face KK - getting out-muscled - as every other team throughout the years

Anyway, the time for laying down markers is in the championship....

Mantis Toboggan

evolving tipperary wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/maher-tipp-can-lay-down-a-marker-267130.html

Will Brendan Maher be strong enough for center back in the championship if Kilkenny shifted Michael Fennelly there - then again who is strong enough for Fennelly...

Maher certainly has the hurling, skill, engine, and reading of the game for center back but I do think he can be out muscled - but that seems to be this team's problem whenever they face KK - getting out-muscled - as every other team throughout the years

Anyway, the time for laying down markers is in the championship....

Sunday will be extremely interesting.

There will be no hiding place in Thurles.
We will know where we stand Sunday evening.

Great warm up for for the summer.
With silverware the added bonus.

evolving tipperary

I want a win against Limerick with a good clinical level of performance - as a priority.

As for Sunday...we can't afford to keep losing to KK...but we need to see Calinan perform and not get cowed - we need the team to show a pattern and clinicalness. We need stability in the full back line - we need the midfield to be able to cope and show steel

digzy

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I want a win against Limerick with a good clinical level of performance - as a priority.

As for Sunday...we can't afford to keep losing to KK...but we need to see Calinan perform and not get cowed - we need the team to show a pattern and clinicalness. We need stability in the full back line - we need the midfield to be able to cope and show steel

+1

I've been thinking along the same lines after the Clare win. If Galway had beaten the cats I wouldn't have been bothered too much about Sundays final knowing that the squad had to have one eye on limerick. However, the cats are a different matter. They really are our bogey team, though a lot of other counties could say that. I think Sundays game is vital for the development of the team. I think it's clear to us all that there are issues with the "top 6 inches"-after all why else has mx geeny been brought in? A good performance is a minimum requirement, we can't afford a capitulation like in Nolan park a few months ago in the 2nd half. A win would be fantastic, even by a point as it would help maintain what I imagine is a feel good factor about the squad with the wins over cork and Clare.

I hope I'm correct, but I'm convinced we'll beat limerick in the first round, and with a bit to spare too.They're in disarray and our lads will surely be smarting after last years defeat.

The cats never seem to play badly against us, even in Declan's last game they still piled on the scores. I absolutely hate them and they're arrogant supporters and sincerely hope we come out on top. A defeat may not damage our lads too badly but a heavy one would have implications for our longevity in this years championship. We need this one more than they do I feel. Guys like callinan need a big one against them too. He's a great league so here's hoping we see him and noël mc garth play close to their best on Sunday.

evolving tipperary

I don't think Kilkenny do the law of averages!!!

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/league-form-indicates-tipperary-s-progressive-profile-ahead-of-championship-1.1780402?page=1

premierstone

digzy wrote: »

+1

I think it's clear to us all that there are issues with the "top 6 inches"-after all why else has mx geeny been brought in?

All top teams engage the service of a sports physologist/motivation speaker type person and Tipp have had one in place since 2008, a big deal was made of this at the time because McGeaney is well known, its a nothing story and his input is quite minimal.

digzy

premierstone wrote: »

All top teams engage the service of a sports physologist/motivation speaker type person and Tipp have had one in place since 2008, a big deal was made of this at the time because McGeaney is well known, its a nothing story and his input is quite minimal.

Who's kilkennys one?

evolving tipperary

http://www.thescore.ie/kieran-shannon-gaa-sports-1233932-Dec2013/

premierstone

digzy wrote: »

Who's kilkennys one?

Gordan Ryan has given them talks over the years, why? Do you feel that Kilkenny are the leaders in this field of preparation or something, I can tell you who Clare and Dublin had and they are both AI champions!

evolving tipperary

The days of the priest or chaplain are gone!!!

premierstone

evolving tipperary wrote: »

The days of the priest or chaplain are gone!!!

Ah no, bring back Fr. Tom, he had it all sussed. Is there anything to be said for an auld mass!

digzy

premierstone wrote: »

Gordan Ryan has given them talks over the years, why? Do you feel that Kilkenny are the leaders in this field of preparation or something, I can tell you who Clare and Dublin had and they are both AI champions!

you're allright. you aint the only one who can use google;)

As I said, you can come up with various theories regarding the teams underperformances over the last few years. A lot of us feel there's a mental portion to that, others may feel its ability. If it's mental, I hope our guy in 2012 has his p45.

premierstone

digzy wrote: »

you're allright. you aint the only one who can use google;)

As I said, you can come up with various theories regarding the teams underperformances over the last few years. A lot of us feel there's a mental portion to that, others may feel its ability. If it's mental, I hope our guy in 2012 has his p45.

No theories at all digzy, they simply were'nt good enough end of. It seems to be the last possible reason Tipperary people are willing to accept but it's the most obvious.

Since 2008 the only county to have knocked Tipp out of championship hurling is KK, widely regarded as the greatest team of all time, sometimes 2+2 does equal 4!