Advice on SW tenant issue.

beauf

I'm guessing, you'd only want a combined unit if space was an issue.

spaceHopper

Check Done deal for a good second hand dryer, get a condesor one if you can as you just have to plug it in. Most washer/dryers are very bad at drying so if I were a new tennant I'd be happier with two machines.

Tell the tennant you will only deal with her but when you sit down to meet expect her father to be there, bring your own wittness if you can.

Give her a fair crack at clearing the arrears and warn her she had to stay uptodate. Check that she's not behind with the ESB, Gas.....

Personally I don't see why you can't keep the deposit to cover the missing rent.

whomitconcerns

spaceHopper wrote: »

Tell the tenant you will only deal with her but when you sit down to meet expect her father to be there, bring your own witness if you can.

Seconding this...if they are insisting on father being there you insist on your own independent person being there also..bring someone tough

TRS30

whomitconcerns wrote: »

em why would you deal with the father...ONLY deal with your tenant.

He rang me once to complain about the time taken to fix something and has rang me a few times since on a similar vein. However the last time on Friday about the leak he was very threatening, talking about legal action etc because of the water was turned off by the management company due to leak.

djimi wrote: »

Your dealings should be only with the tenants. If their father tries to get involved just hang up the phone/refuse to talk with them, especially if they are being unreasonable. If they are old enough to rent property then they are old enough to deal with it without needing to get their parents involved...

Wrt the dryer, yes you will need to replace it if needs be. Youre not however obliged to provide a seperate washer and dryer, so its up to you what you give them. If there was a washer/dryer there when they moved in then thats all they are entitled to expect. They have a right nerve making demands when they arent even paying the correct rent...

That's what I'm going to do if he rings me again.

It's just trying to decide if I get a new dryer or a new washer/dryer, it is only a 1 bed apartment so not that much space for two machines.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

I think that no one will ever want a washer/dryer, if the alternative is to have separate washer and dryer!

That would certainly make the decision easier if I do have to get a new dryer.

beauf wrote: »

I'm guessing, you'd only want a combined unit if space was an issue.

As per above, is 1 bed so not a lot of space so thinking some people might not want two machines taking up space.

spaceHopper wrote: »

Check Done deal for a good second hand dryer, get a condesor one if you can as you just have to plug it in. Most washer/dryers are very bad at drying so if I were a new tennant I'd be happier with two machines.

Tell the tennant you will only deal with her but when you sit down to meet expect her father to be there, bring your own wittness if you can.

Give her a fair crack at clearing the arrears and warn her she had to stay up todate. Check that she's not behind with the ESB, Gas.....

Personally I don't see why you can't keep the deposit to cover the missing rent.

I think I will bring my brother with me when I go to meet them and if the father is there then get him to come in as a witness.

As for the deposits, that's what I was thinking however think this will lead to more issues!

I forgot to mention in my last post that she has two kids living there as well. So not sure if that changes anything.

Any thoughts on my proposed plan of action in my previous post?

the_syco

TRS30 wrote: »

I know that I should give it back to them if they leave however if they owe me rent then I find it kind of hard to give money to them, even if it is the correct legal thing to do.

Use the deposit as leverage to get them out; she gets the deposit the day after she moves out. The moment she moves out, change the locks, give her the deposit, and then start cleaning up the mess.

TRS30 wrote: »

What kind of 'issues' are you talking about??

Blackmail.

spaceHopper wrote: »

Check that she's not behind with the ESB, Gas.....

On this note, the bills should be in the tenants name, and will follow the tenant. Not the OP's problem.

TRS30

the_syco wrote: »

Use the deposit as leverage to get them out; she gets the deposit the day after she moves out. The moment she moves out, change the locks, give her the deposit, and then start cleaning up the mess.


Blackmail.


On this note, the bills should be in the tenants name, and will follow the tenant. Not the OP's problem.

Might keep the deposit card up my leave once I see how things pan out.

Yes, all bills in their name.

beauf

Double the utility company don't transfer them back to the house owner, with outstanding debts on them. I've seen that happen once.

TRS30

beauf wrote: »

Double the utility company don't transfer them back to the house owner, with outstanding debts on them. I've seen that happen once.

I don't see how they could do this without my consent.

Also I have no idea what providers they use.

beauf

I thought that too. But they did it anyway.

TRS30

beauf wrote: »

I thought that too. But they did it anyway.

How would I find out what utilities companies they are using and make sure any unpaid amounts are not transferred to my name??

beauf

I can see the flaw in my own advice. You cant. I'd never heard of it before so maybe its not that common so just ignore what I said for now. Nothing you can do about it anyway. I'm just sending you off track for no good reason. Sry.

TRS30

beauf wrote: »

I can see the flaw in my own advice. You cant. I'd never heard of it before so maybe its not that common so just ignore what I said for now. Nothing you can do about it anyway. I'm just sending you off track for no good reason. Sry.

No worries. Have jotted down everything I want to cover/ keep in mind so will keep this on the list with a ? mark beside it.

Thanks.

the_syco

TRS30 wrote: »

How would I find out what utilities companies they are using and make sure any unpaid amounts are not transferred to my name??

Sounds like the tenants got the bills transferred back to the landlords name without the landlords consent. Keep an eye out for bills with your name on it, when the tenant moves out.

yankinlk

beauf wrote: »

I can see the flaw in my own advice. You cant. I'd never heard of it before so maybe its not that common so just ignore what I said for now. Nothing you can do about it anyway. I'm just sending you off track for no good reason. Sry.

Fair play for owning up to mistaken advice. BUT its not all together wrong advice either. I have learned that EVERY new tenant comes up with a new way to beat the system.

Be careful of tenants that install PAYasUGO meters for Gas or Electric. These can be left in the RED - and you will be stuck topping it up for the next tenant. (there is a monthly charge that adds up even when heat not used for example).

Look out for Littlewoods letters - a neat trick is ordering from your address - and a made up name. Bills will haunt you for years after at that address. Not really your problem - but its annoying.

Im sure there are others, i haven't seen it all yet. I have started asking for a forwarding address from exiting tenants - just so I can have that last piece of mind and evidence before they go. (One stole a lawn mower off me for example). You can send the deposit to the new address for example. They hate that tho.

TRS30

Thanks for all the advice, comments etc, great source of info.

Leak is now sorted so plan is get dryer looked at tomorrow, fingers crossed can be fixed, if not then will have to decide what to do re new one.

So hopefully then on Wednesday

-Meet them and issue first letter for rent arrears and give 14 days to pay also give them copy of spreadsheet with rent details (no rent book as they said they didn't want one).
-If no response then issue second letter giving 14 days to pay
-If no response to that then give 28 notice to vacate premises.

Any thing else or am I missing anything?

foggy_lad

TRS30 wrote: »

How would I find out what utilities companies they are using and make sure any unpaid amounts are not transferred to my name??

You just contact the supplier of your choice and sign the property up to whoever you want as a new customer, Nothing to do with previous customers or their debts!

the_syco

TRS30 wrote: »

-Meet them and issue first letter for rent arrears and give 14 days to pay also give them copy of spreadsheet with rent details (no rent book as they said they didn't want one).

Send by registered post. Do not mention you are sending it by registered post (so that they cannot refuse to sign for it). Sending it by anything else other than registered post, and you do not have proof that you sent it or that they had received it.

TRS30

the_syco wrote: »

Send by registered post. Do not mention you are sending it by registered post (so that they cannot refuse to sign for it). Sending it by anything else other than registered post, and you do not have proof that you sent it or that they had received it.

I was planning on calling and giving them the letter personally and to explain the situation as well.

The_Conductor

TRS30 wrote: »

I was planning on calling and giving them the letter personally and to explain the situation as well.

Don't.
Seriously- don't.
Send it by registered post.
If you call around to explain it- it could well turn into a 'he said, she said' at a PRTB tribunal, and you could end up on the wrong side of a loosing tribunal accused of bullying her.

TRS30

The_Conductor wrote: »

Don't.
Seriously- don't.
Send it by registered post.
If you call around to explain it- it could well turn into a 'he said, she said' at a PRTB tribunal, and you could end up on the wrong side of a loosing tribunal accused of bullying her.

Thanks for this advice- registered post does seem a better option.

This is a draft of the first letter I'm going to issue;


To: [INSERT NAME(S) OF THE TENANT(S)


This is first notice that you have failed to pay rent in accordance with the terms of the tenancy agreement and your obligations under the Residential Tenancies Act, 2004 for your tenancy of the dwelling at [INSERT ADDRESS OF RENTED DWELLING]


You have until DD Month YYYY (14 days from date of this letter) to pay the arrears of €xxx

This arrears is due to monthly rent of €xxx being paid since May 2013 when the monthly agreed rent is €xxx.

If the outstanding rent is not paid by this time a 14 day Warning Notice will be issued to you. You will have 14 days to pay the outstanding rent arrears due at that time.

If you fail to pay the rent arrears due within 14 days of this second notice, the landlord is permitted to terminate the tenancy giving you 28 days notice and by serving a notice of termination on you.


Outstanding rent is to be paid to the account details below:


XXXXXX



Please note I will only discuss this matter with you directly.



This notice is served on [INSERT DATE OF SERVICE]


Signed: Landlord/Landlord's Agent




All comments welcome. Not sure about the sentence about dealing only with them.



Should I included the spreadsheet of all the rent details which I have been keeping instead of a rent book?

The_Conductor

Yes- include the spreadsheet (as an appendix to the main letter).
Its nice, to the point, business like, no bullsheet- and not open to misinterpretation.

I'd suggest leaving out the line about discussing it with them- altogether. Its not a discussion document- its a statement of affairs- its not open to discussion.

Go for it.

yankinlk

The_Conductor wrote: »

Yes- include the spreadsheet (as an appendix to the main letter).
Its nice, to the point, business like, no bullsheet- and not open to misinterpretation.

I'd suggest leaving out the line about discussing it with them- altogether. Its not a discussion document- its a statement of affairs- its not open to discussion.

Go for it.

Totally agree. You probably think it will help matters to discuss - and that you owe them an explanation in person. you are being too nice. Tenants have needs , landlords have needs, and when the needs differ, its time to look for a new arrangement. There are plenty of good tenants out there that will suit them to rent your house in full. If you aren't sure of that - try putting up an ad now and find out what your property is worth. If you are under selling it - that should focus your mind quickly.

TRS30

The_Conductor wrote: »

Yes- include the spreadsheet (as an appendix to the main letter).
Its nice, to the point, business like, no bullsheet- and not open to misinterpretation.

I'd suggest leaving out the line about discussing it with them- altogether. Its not a discussion document- its a statement of affairs- its not open to discussion.

Go for it.

Thanks.

Should I include all the rent details since the start of the tenancy (4 years) or just 2013 as this is the relevant period re arrears?

yankinlk wrote: »

Totally agree. You probably think it will help matters to discuss - and that you owe them an explanation in person. you are being too nice. Tenants have needs , landlords have needs, and when the needs differ, its time to look for a new arrangement. There are plenty of good tenants out there that will suit them to rent your house in full. If you aren't sure of that - try putting up an ad now and find out what your property is worth. If you are under selling it - that should focus your mind quickly.

The property has always let easily and I would have a pretty good idea of rent levels for similar properties in the area.

Rosier

Shocked and disgusted at how these tenants are behaving. , and I hope op that all gets sorted and settled soon for you

whatever else I go without ( and I am on rent allowance and deeply grateful for it ) the rent is sacred and always paid on time.

shocked to my core..

The_Conductor

I'd be inclined to put the whole lot in.
I'm not sure how far back you can go to claim arrears- I know the standard rule for Revenue and Banks- is 4 years.
At very least I'd claim the last year (to date)- but she does owe you the whole lot- come what may. For the purposes of simplifying this- and not giving her something to argue about- perhaps only chasing year to date might be the better way to chase it, though I would reserve the right to pursue her for the arrears in full.

Remember- this is a business arrangement- you don't need to explain it in baby language to her- she made an agreement, and has not kept her side of the agreement.

TRS30

The_Conductor wrote: »

I'd be inclined to put the whole lot in.
I'm not sure how far back you can go to claim arrears- I know the standard rule for Revenue and Banks- is 4 years.
At very least I'd claim the last year (to date)- but she does owe you the whole lot- come what may. For the purposes of simplifying this- and not giving her something to argue about- perhaps only chasing year to date might be the better way to chase it, though I would reserve the right to pursue her for the arrears in full.

Remember- this is a business arrangement- you don't need to explain it in baby language to her- she made an agreement, and has not kept her side of the agreement.

Thanks again.

I have been thinking about this some more. I know that they have been paying less that the lease amount for the previous number of years however this has only become an issue since May last year when the amount from Welfare dropped significantly.

If I include previous years, it might be an issue that I never highlighted this to them previously and why did I wait so long to address it with them?

If I just include last years rent details and not previous years could this make the termination process invalid?

The_Conductor

To be honest- I think you need to get some advice on this.
Personally I think the whole lot from the get-go should be documented, in a spreadsheet style- and the running deficit accumulated on a week-by-week basis over the entire course of the tenancy- but I think you need to get some advice on this.

Also- without diluting your rights in any way- you need to give her an incentive to leave- aka her deposit back, and you're not going to chase the accumulated deficit- providing she meets certain criteria (aka the property is left in good condition and vacated finally for once and for all, by a certain date).

In all of this- I would ensure that I didn't dilute my rights- the entire accumulated amount outstanding- is outstanding. That this commenced pretty much from the start of the tenancy is neither here nor there.

You signing off on the form for Social Welfare was a mistake- and helped her shirk her duties.

I think you need to get some proper advice on this- and make 100% certain you do absolutely everything by the book.

yankinlk

You are overthinking this. You can only claim for the exisiting lease - not a previous arrangement. Give them incentive to leave and they will. Let them pick the leaving date - at which time, IF they clean the house and nothings broken, they get the deposit back in full - no rent reducted.

TRS30

The_Conductor wrote: »

To be honest- I think you need to get some advice on this.
Personally I think the whole lot from the get-go should be documented, in a spreadsheet style- and the running deficit accumulated on a week-by-week basis over the entire course of the tenancy- but I think you need to get some advice on this.

Also- without diluting your rights in any way- you need to give her an incentive to leave- aka her deposit back, and you're not going to chase the accumulated deficit- providing she meets certain criteria (aka the property is left in good condition and vacated finally for once and for all, by a certain date).

In all of this- I would ensure that I didn't dilute my rights- the entire accumulated amount outstanding- is outstanding. That this commenced pretty much from the start of the tenancy is neither here nor there.

You signing off on the form for Social Welfare was a mistake- and helped her shirk her duties.

I think you need to get some proper advice on this- and make 100% certain you do absolutely everything by the book.

Are you talking about legal advice? I was hoping if at all possible to avoid having to get solicitors involved due to the cost.

yankinlk wrote: »

You are overthinking this. You can only claim for the exisiting lease - not a previous arrangement. Give them incentive to leave and they will. Let them pick the leaving date - at which time, IF they clean the house and nothings broken, they get the deposit back in full - no rent reducted.

I'm a little confused about this advice.

One hand it seems that I should do everything by the book, issue termination letters etc and then it seems that I should use the deposit as a way to bribe them to leave.

Sorry maybe I'm not picking it up right.

McDook

TRS30 wrote: »

Are you talking about legal advice? I was hoping if at all possible to avoid having to get solicitors involved due to the cost.



I'm a little confused about this advice.

One hand it seems that I should do everything by the book, issue termination letters etc and then it seems that I should use the deposit as a way to bribe them to leave.

Sorry maybe I'm not picking it up right.

A solicitor wont cost you as much as you think. Maybe even a visit for just a chat will give you all the info you need.

And you can ask your tennant for everything thats owed to you no matter which lease it was on and. You are owed what you are owed. end of.

But like every rat, the best way is to leave it a gap and let run away through it. If you trap it its a much dirtier fighter than you are and it may do even more damage.