Question About unfair Irish Rail fine

Dublinfan

hi was just looking for advice on a fine i got on Sunday, i was travelling To drogheda for a family party and was already delayed due to having to get a bus to malahide due to the train repairs now i got on in all faith i would be picked up in donabate by a relative so thats where i bought my ticket so i then got the call this would not be possible and i would have to go to drogheda so two ticket inspectors got on in donabate and i approached them and told them the story i mean what else could i do i told them i would be willing to pay any fare at the other end they then told me no i was a fare evader for having an invalid ticket and charged me 113 euro

So Irishrail had already delayed me then when i had no other choice unless get off and wait 1 hour on my own and i went up and told them the situation i get fined 100 euro surely they could of said no get out in rusk and lusk even can i contest this did they have the right to give me such a hefty fine for somthing i clearly couldnt control ?

coolock94

don't pay it,, did u give ur name??? or address ?

Dublinfan

coolock94 wrote: »

don't pay it,, did u give ur name??? or address ?

was forced to but surely i can contest did given the fact i had ticket and wasent even given the option to get out a stop after

Hilly Bill

What bus did you get?

Dublinfan

Hilly Bill wrote: »

What bus did you get?

had to get the 32 from raheny

Hilly Bill

Dublinfan wrote: »

had to get the 32 from raheny

How where you delayed? The buses where running ok. You got on in Malahide and paid in Donabate?

coolock94

http://www.irishrail.ie/media/FixedPenaltyDLLeafletV.4180620121.pdf


17. IS THERE A RIGHT OF APPEAL AGAINST A
FIXED PENALTY NOTICE?
If you wish to appeal against a Fixed Penalty Notice, with
which you have been issued, you must do so in writing or
via email to the addresses shown on the receipt given to
you by the inspector within 21 DAYS. Failure to pay will
lead to a prosecution and a Criminal conviction plus a
fine of up to a €1000 in the District Courts.


I would have said I am unable to pay at the moment but will send the money via postal order, give a false name and address and leave it at that.

Dublinfan

Hilly Bill wrote: »

How where you delayed? The buses where running ok. You got on in Malahide and paid in Donabate?

because i would normally get from howth junction i paid as far as donabate presuming i would be picked up from there when i wasent i approchaced the two ticket inspectors who got on in donabate explain the story and got thrown 113 euro fine

Hilly Bill

Great advice, well done.

GreeBo

Dublinfan wrote: »

hi was just looking for advice on a fine i got on Sunday, i was travelling To drogheda for a family party and was already delayed due to having to get a bus to malahide due to the train repairs now i got on in all faith i would be picked up in donabate by a relative so thats where i bought my ticket so i then got the call this would not be possible and i would have to go to drogheda so two ticket inspectors got on in donabate and i approached them and told them the story i mean what else could i do i told them i would be willing to pay any fare at the other end they then told me no i was a fare evader for having an invalid ticket and charged me 113 euro

So Irishrail had already delayed me then when i had no other choice unless get off and wait 1 hour on my own and i went up and told them the situation i get fined 100 euro surely they could of said no get out in rusk and lusk even can i contest this did they have the right to give me such a hefty fine for somthing i clearly couldnt control ?

Sorry but I dont see why your travel arrangements changing have anything to do with Irish Rail?

Basically you stayed on the train for longer than you had paid for...so what did they do wrong exactly?

You being delayed earlier is irrelevant tbh.

Dublinfan

GreeBo wrote: »

Sorry but I dont see why your travel arrangements changing have anything to do with Irish Rail?

Basically you stayed on the train for longer than you had paid for...so what did they do wrong exactly?

You being delayed earlier is irrelevant tbh.

i would of happily got off next stop if requested and was hardly evading when i was honest straight away..

Stheno

Dublinfan wrote: »

i would of happily got off next stop if requested and was hardly evading when i was honest straight away..

TBH they've probably heard every excuse in the book.

At the end of the day you'd no ticket, so you got fined.
Not their fault your lift didn't show up.

Dublinfan

Stheno wrote: »

TBH they've probably heard every excuse in the book.

At the end of the day you'd no ticket, so you got fined.
Not their fault your lift didn't show up.

they could of told me to get off at rusk and lusk though which is 5 mins away rather then give me 100 euro fine for something i genuinly didnt meant to do...

corktina

I expect they've heard that one before.

Hilly Bill

Dublinfan wrote: »

because i would normally get from howth junction i paid as far as donabate presuming i would be picked up from there when i wasent i approchaced the two ticket inspectors who got on in donabate explain the story and got thrown 113 euro fine

Irish Rail didnt delay you and you did not get an unfair fine. You should have got off in Donabate when you found out that the lift wasn't happening and bought a ticket to Drogheda. You chose to travel past the point that you had paid for, its not the fault of Irish Rail that a relative failed to pick you up.
The best that you can do is just go through the appeal process and explain to them what happened and that you had intended to get off in Donabate and when you got the call that you had to make your way to Drogheda instead ,you approached the RPU (not them approaching you ) thinking that you could pay them the excess to Drogheda.

Hilly Bill

Dublinfan wrote: »

i would of happily got off next stop if requested and was hardly evading when i was honest straight away..

You didnt want to get off in Donabate and wait another hour on your own then why would you have been happy to get off at Rush and wait an hour on your own?

Dublinfan

Hilly Bill wrote: »

You didnt want to get off in Donabate and wait another hour on your own then why would you have been happy to get off at Rush and wait an hour on your own?

rather an hour on my own then pay 113 euro

Hilly Bill

Dublinfan wrote: »

rather an hour on my own then pay 113 euro

Sorry to be harsh but you should have thought of that in Donabate.

corktina

why do you suppose the RPU get on the train at Donabate? No brainer really

Dublinfan

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Sorry to be harsh but you should have thought of that in Donabate.

i agree but when i seen them get on i thought me approaching them and explaining to them they would understand my honesty ect

MarkR

You were already caught at that stage, bar that they were undercover ticket inspectors. Was either of them wearing a fake moustache?

glic71rods46t0

Dublinfan wrote: »

i agree but when i seen them get on i thought me approaching them and explaining to them they would understand my honesty ect

Honest what? You honestly paid as far as Donabate and then, dishonestly stayed on the train. Inspectors board the train and you panic and approach them saying, I really meant to get off already ....right!!!

bikeman1

As the TV licence ads say :

"We've heard all the excuses, and none of them work"

If you had a leap card, you would have got passed the check at Donabate, if they got you after Balbriggan (where leap finishes) you could have said you thought leap went all the way to Drogheda as thats where the Commuter Train terminates.

I'm afraid you're going to have to pay up on this one.

robertxxx

Dublinfan wrote: »

was forced to but surely i can contest did given the fact i had ticket and wasent even given the option to get out a stop after

How were you forced to? Did they twist your arm, could you not just give your neighbours name and address?

cmore123

Unfortunately, Irish Rail are legally right, OP, as it was yourself / family rather than them who changed the plan, as I read it.

Having said that, I think if you appeal as other posters have suggested, they might be lenient. To be fair to them, they do hear all sorts of fairy tales, and are right to come down uncompromisingly hard on these, but your case sounds genuine to me. I wish you luck.

Victor

coolock94 wrote: »

I would have said I am unable to pay at the moment but will send the money via postal order, give a false name and address and leave it at that.

Please do not give advice that could get people into more trouble.

Moderator

AltAccount

Give the fine to your relative who changed the plans after you paid for a ticket and got on the train?

cgcsb

while the ticket inspectors were operating under the rules, they could've been nice and charged you for another ticket instead.

corktina

they couldn't. They can't sell tickets.

Hilly Bill

cgcsb wrote: »

while the ticket inspectors were operating under the rules, they could've been nice and charged you for another ticket instead.

The amount of young fellas trying to avoid the fare on that route is unreal so im not suprised that the op was fined.
Funny enough though that the majority of the fare dodgers on that route are going to Balbriggan.

end of the road

irish rail are wasting their time with this policy of charging people 100 euro or more for avoiding tickets and so on, while a good system in theory it just isn't working and is creating bad will and losing the company customers, just throw people off the next stop instead, still its a small source of revenue so their not going to throw it away

corktina

it's a great deterrent. Throwing them off will do nothing.

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

it's a great deterrent.

yeah, right, when we have no fair avaiders come back to me

Dravokivich

end of the road wrote: »

yeah, right, when we have no fair avaiders come back to me

I've been seeing them a lot more frequently on the Maynooth line, so it seems they are really driving for fines to be handed out and to be seen to do so.

Previously you'd only see'em every 3/4 months. Now it's every 3/4 days.

n97 mini

The punishment doesn't fit the crime, IMHO.

Fine them double the single fare, which is what they do in the UK.

n97 mini

corktina wrote: »

they couldn't. They can't sell tickets.

OP was given a €100 fine and a €13 ticket, was he not?

Dravokivich

n97 mini wrote: »

OP was given a €100 fine and a €13 ticket, was he not?

The fine is "the fare + 100euro." No ticket is issued.

Dublinfan

was talking to the rp and they said i have a strong appeal so hopefully, this has really turned me off irishrail though think ill stick to the bus from now on cheaper and alot more helpful and friendly

Losty Dublin

n97 mini wrote: »

The punishment doesn't fit the crime, IMHO.

Fine them double the single fare, which is what they do in the UK.

Change traveling for zero or chance it for maybe double €1.65, the lowest commuter/suburban rail fare. That's no deterrent, whatever you feel about the €100 standard fare.

GreeBo

Dublinfan wrote: »

was talking to the rp and they said i have a strong appeal so hopefully, this has really turned me off irishrail though think ill stick to the bus from now on cheaper and alot more helpful and friendly

FYI
The bus also requires you to pay for a ticket that covers your entire journey.
You'll find all public transport is this same in this regard; you are expected to pay for *all* of your journey, not just when you get caught.

Dublinfan

GreeBo wrote: »

FYI
The bus also requires you to pay for a ticket that covers your entire journey.
You'll find all public transport is this same in this regard; you are expected to pay for *all* of your journey, not just when you get caught.

yes i know they do but if this ever happened i could pay extra at the top of the bus... iv never seen them treat people as bad..

GreeBo

Dublinfan wrote: »

yes i know they do but if this ever happened i could pay extra at the top of the bus... iv never seen them treat people as bad..

Also shops....shops like you to pay for all your items, not just when you get caught trying to leave without paying for them all.

In fact, yeah, pretty much everything in life you are expected to pay for...mad.

corktina

Dublinfan wrote: »

yes i know they do but if this ever happened i could pay extra at the top of the bus... iv never seen them treat people as bad..

I don't care how they treat fare evaders, whether it be on the train or the bus.... so long as they catch as many as possible

Hilly Bill

Dublinfan wrote: »

was talking to the rp and they said i have a strong appeal so hopefully, this has really turned me off irishrail though think ill stick to the bus from now on cheaper and alot more helpful and friendly

What are you going to do if you get caught doing the same on the bus? It was your own fault so their is no point giving out.

Gatling

Hilly Bill wrote: »

What are you going to do if you get caught doing the same on the bus? .

Probably open a thread on here complaining about unfair treatment and fine by a bus company

sonny jim bob jones

Would throwing people off the moving train be a deterrent?

Hilly Bill

end of the road wrote: »

irish rail are wasting their time with this policy of charging people 100 euro or more for avoiding tickets and so on, while a good system in theory it just isn't working and is creating bad will and losing the company customers, just throw people off the next stop instead, still its a small source of revenue so their not going to throw it away

Its working fine (no pun intended ). They are not customers if they are not paying in the first place.

Hilly Bill

Dublinfan wrote: »

was talking to the rp and they said i have a strong appeal so hopefully, this has really turned me off irishrail though think ill stick to the bus from now on cheaper and alot more helpful and friendly

Has it turned you off the person that was meant to pick you up and who costed you the fine?

MarkR

Dublinfan wrote: »

was talking to the rp and they said i have a strong appeal so hopefully, this has really turned me off irishrail though think ill stick to the bus from now on cheaper and alot more helpful and friendly

What's a rp?

n97 mini

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Change traveling for zero or chance it for maybe double €1.65, the lowest commuter/suburban rail fare. That's no deterrent, whatever you feel about the €100 standard fare.

There is a minimum. I think for NIR it's £20.

n97 mini

Dravokivich wrote: »

The fine is "the fare + 100euro." No ticket is issued.

They charge the cost of the ticket, and allow you to continue to your destination. That materially amounts to a ticket.

Edit, in S.I. No. 576 of 2006, the fine is €100. No mention of any other fee.