Overly demanding tenant

username_x

So I recently rented out my house to a new tenant and have an issue.

She calls me every single day. I got 24 phonecalls in one day from her and if I don't pick up, she keeps calling!! She's been saying she wants new this and new that. I got the carpet on the stairs redone cause it was awful. She wanted a professional painter in and I said no, bought the paint to do it myself and the paint is now gone.

She wanted a new sofa and beds which when I refused to pay for she said she would, I agreed but told her that it'd be a few weeks before I could get them outta the house, and she has called or text everyday asking me when. She wants a new shower cause hers is noisy, a new cooker because the timer button is broken (the cooker works without it), new kitchen chairs because the cushions on the current ones are "dirty", a new kitchen floor, and wants me to get rid of the blinds that she replaced.

Am I under any obligation to do any of this at all? I feel like just telling her to pack up her stuff and get out, it's ridiculous. I can't always answer the phone and I've told her this, but she just doesn't understand that my occupation is not "full time landlord". And if I don't answer she gets angry.

Media999

What happened to the paint?

JillyQ

Has she signed a lease?

athtrasna

If she has moved in and signed a lease she is only entitled to repairs and changes that bring the facilities in line with minimum standards. None of the issues you listed would warrant compulsory intervention. By acceding to her demands you set a dangerous precedent

foggy_lad

Tell her you will be doing nothing more with the property and that she does not have permission to paint or change any blinds or anything else as in your opinion the house is in good repair and clean and habitable.

Tell her that if she needs to contact you she can write to you but that she may only ring in an emergency. And if she has any problem with your conditions she may give a couple of weeks notice and get out.

The_Conductor

OP- you are under no obligation to do any of this whatsoever.
Normally- a tenant will contact a landlord only if there is an issue that requires your intervention.
Her being unhappy with the furniture, decorations, flooring, fixtures and fittings etc- is not your issue.
If she had an issue with these- this should have been brought up before she commenced the tenancy, and an agreement made vis-a-vis any work that might be necessary (or desireable)- not after the fact.

If someone called me 24 times in a day- I swear I'd be reporting to the local Gardai for harassment- I'm not joking.

Its your call what you want to do, at the end of the day- she is being wholly unreasonable and is making demands of you that you have no obligation whatsoever to accede to.

username_x

She threw the paint out as it was under the stairs so she assumed it "wasn't needed". She has signed her lease. I have someone coming today to collect the sofa because she wants to buy her own.

Thanks for all your advice. She told me it necessary for a landlord to paint every year and I haven't heard this before. Can anyone shed light on this? As I said I didn't mind recarpetting some of the house as it was needed, but with regards to everything else no. She also removed two bathroom cabinets and put her own on, she is now asking for a skip to get rid of these items. Am I obliged to do this?

ted1

username_x wrote: »

She threw the paint out as it was under the stairs so she assumed it "wasn't needed". She has signed her lease. I have someone coming today to collect the sofa because she wants to buy her own.

Thanks for all your advice. She told me it necessary for a landlord to paint every year and I haven't heard this before. Can anyone shed light on this? As I said I didn't mind recarpetting some of the house as it was needed, but with regards to everything else no. She also removed two bathroom cabinets and put her own on, she is now asking for a skip to get rid of these items. Am I obliged to do this?

Get rid of her, tell her she is a pain the arse you are not doing the work and you think its best for both parties if she just moves out.
Before the usual suspects come in and start going on about the PRTB , evevtio s etc. thus ethos is not an evection but a mutual agreement.

Pawwed Rig

username_x wrote: »

Thanks for all your advice. She told me it necessary for a landlord to paint every year and I haven't heard this before. Can anyone shed light on this? As I said I didn't mind recarpetting some of the house as it was needed, but with regards to everything else no. She also removed two bathroom cabinets and put her own on, she is now asking for a skip to get rid of these items. Am I obliged to do this?

LOL of course you do not need to paint every year!! You should paint as is needed. Generally I do it every 5 years or so or if the tenant really wants a different colur I will provide paint and they sort it.
Also I would be concerned that she is removing your fittings. What happens when she moves out? Do you need to buy a new sofa and cabinets etc?
You need to read up on your obligations as a landlord and hers as a tenant as this girl seems to be running rings around you.

The_Conductor

username_x wrote: »

She threw the paint out as it was under the stairs so she assumed it "wasn't needed". She has signed her lease. I have someone coming today to collect the sofa because she wants to buy her own.

Thanks for all your advice. She told me it necessary for a landlord to paint every year and I haven't heard this before. Can anyone shed light on this? As I said I didn't mind recarpetting some of the house as it was needed, but with regards to everything else no. She also removed two bathroom cabinets and put her own on, she is now asking for a skip to get rid of these items. Am I obliged to do this?

No- you're not obliged to provide her with a skip.
Is she fully there? Seriously- she sounds a little touched.
As for painting every year- lol- there isn't a house in the country- owner occupied, or rented, that is painted every year.
She sounds like a ridiculously high maintenance tenant.

Btw- if she has taken down your bathroom cabinets and thrashed them- without your express permission- she owes you for them.

What the hell game is she playing?

djimi

Do you have a clause in the lease that states that she may not make any changes to the property without your permission? Taking the bathroom cabinets off the wall would certainly constitute a breach of lease if you do...

Your best course of action is to inform her that that property will remain as it was when she moved in. No painting, no furniture changes/removal and certainly no changes to fixtures and fittings. Inform her that all future communication is to be in writing only (letter or email); that you will respond to all of her queries, in writing, within 24 hours of receiving them, but that you will not be answering the phone to her in future. What she is doing is borderline harassment, and you do not have to entertain it. None of the demands that you have outlined above are reasonable from what I can tell.

This may well be one of those times where the money that you spend on a letting agent could prove to be the best money you spend this year...

murphaph

Get rid of her if at all legally possible. Did you get a reference from her previous landlord by any chance?

JillyQ

username_x wrote: »

She threw the paint out as it was under the stairs so she assumed it "wasn't needed". She has signed her lease. I have someone coming today to collect the sofa because she wants to buy her own.

Thanks for all your advice. She told me it necessary for a landlord to paint every year and I haven't heard this before. Can anyone shed light on this? As I said I didn't mind recarpetting some of the house as it was needed, but with regards to everything else no. She also removed two bathroom cabinets and put her own on, she is now asking for a skip to get rid of these items. Am I obliged to do this?

I seriously hope you had a clause in the lease about her removing or damaging any items in the prooerty, if so its an immediate eviction. As for the painting every year thats total BS. Under know circumstances provide her with a skip.

odds_on

Just check your lease clauses and if she has broken anyone of them, then you can give her a 28 days notice of termination. No warning necessary. If you don't get rid of her during the first six months, she is entitled to remain for a total of 4 years without signing a new lease.

username_x

The sofa she demanded she wanted rid of was due to be collected today, and she was not home after me arranging a time that suited her. Now I am at a loss.

She also gave me a list of problems that were checked out last week and proven to be fine saying she wanted them fixed?

And yes I got a previous landlord reference and it was glowing. Starting to question the validity of it now.

pwurple

username_x wrote: »

The sofa she demanded she wanted rid of was due to be collected today, and she was not home after me arranging a time that suited her. Now I am at a loss.

She also gave me a list of problems that were checked out last week and proven to be fine saying she wanted them fixed?

And yes I got a previous landlord reference and it was glowing. Starting to question the validity of it now.

Reference was written or over phone? I always try to speak to them.

mrs vimes

Also, a landlord has to come around and hoover twice a week and do all the ironing. Do you have anywhere to let in Cork, I'm in the market for a landlord like you :-)

Sorry, shouldn't mock, you sound like a nice person but she is taking you for a ride and won't stop until you stand up for yourself. Tell her to replace the paint she threw out and leave the rest of the house as it was when she moved in. If she isn't happy then suggest that you could be persuaded to let her out of the lease.

mari2222

you can read up on landlord (and tenant) responsibilities on the website of www.prtb.ie

sunnysoutheast

username_x wrote: »

And yes I got a previous landlord reference and it was glowing. Starting to question the validity of it now.

...or the motives of the person providing it?

The tenant has asked YOU to provide a skip to throw away YOUR items that she has removed from the property without YOUR permission, having already thrown away several things.

Things aren't going to get any better, so......

username_x

I spoke to her previous landlord over the phone. To say I regret moving her in is an understatement. I got 10 missed calls in 7 minutes today. It's gone beyond a joke at this stage, I've asked her to be in this evening as I need to speak to her and have arranged for another collection of the couch.

MagicMarker

You haven't mentioned anything about trying to evict her.

I would forget about having the sofa removed and instead figure out how to have her removed.

username_x

She's only there two weeks into a 12 month lease

MagicMarker

username_x wrote: »

She's only there two weeks into a 12 month lease

And...?

The_Conductor

username_x wrote: »

She's only there two weeks into a 12 month lease

Do you really want another 11 months of this sort of crap?
Normally you can evict in the first 6 months- without reason.
What have you written into her lease?
Do you have a break clause?
You really are being taken for a fool here- I admire your patience with her- but you're only 2 weeks into a 12 month lease- what the hell is it going to be like further down the road?

moochers

Hey OP,

Tenants that make ridiculous demands are a total nightmare. You will probably have problems even getting rent from her as she will more than likely refuse to pay in full unless you pander to her needs. She has no right making changes to your property. Seek advice and get rid of her. Next time you rent, make sure you have a full itinerary and photos of all furniture,fittings, fixtures, utensils etc.

Best of luck OP.

abbeyrock

Holy C%rap

She sounds like my last tenant I had, what a nightmare, the dishwasher broke and i bought a new one the next day and had a delivery guy deliver it and install it and when he arrived she turned him away saying she wanted a black dishwasher instead, i refused and she held back rent until i would get her a black dishwasher, i eventually gave in and after a few more demands i kicked her out on the grounds she was with holding rent.

Giver her 30 days notice to get out

DoozerT6

OP this woman sounds unbalanced, tbh. Personally, I would not meet her on your own - I would refuse to meet her unless you BOTH have another person there to act as witness to whatever is said. If you meet her alone, she could say you said or did anything to her. If you meet her with someone with YOU only, she could say that she felt intimidated. If you meet her with only a friend of HERS there, they could make up anything as to what happened, with each other as back up.

Also could you bring a copy of the lease and ask her to point out where it says you are obliged to do everything she is asking you to?

the_syco

username_x wrote: »

She also removed two bathroom cabinets and put her own on, she is now asking for a skip to get rid of these items. Am I obliged to do this?

In the long run, it'll be cheaper to go to a solicitor now, with a view of evicting her.

okidoki987

she is entitled to remain for a total of 4 years without signing a new lease

Where does it say this anywhere?
Surely if it's a 12 month lease, it's renewed every year and if either party don't want to renew, they walk away?

djimi

username_x wrote: »

The sofa she demanded she wanted rid of was due to be collected today, and she was not home after me arranging a time that suited her. Now I am at a loss.

Deduct it from her deposit.

djimi

okidoki987 wrote: »

Where does it say this anywhere?
Surely if it's a 12 month lease, it's renewed every year and if either party don't want to renew, they walk away?

After 6 months a tenant aquires part 4 tenancy rights, which entitles them to remain in the property for a further 3 and a half years, signed lease or not. Only under very specific circumstances can a landlord terminate a part 4 tenancy, and if those circumstances cannot be met then they must wait until the first 6 months of the next 4 year cycle.

Mrs OBumble

username_x wrote: »

And yes I got a previous landlord reference and it was glowing. Starting to question the validity of it now.

Much like the one you're going to be giving to her next unlucky victim, I suspect.

Seriously, I agree with the sentiments re getting rid of her .. but that can only happen when she finds somewhere to go.

Good luck OP ... maybe you should hire a property management company now, and get them to do the "heavy lifting", so to speak.

djimi

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Good luck OP ... maybe you should hire a property management company now, and get them to do the "heavy lifting", so to speak.

This is exactly what I would be looking to do. Put a buffer between you and the tenant; inform her (in writing) that the letting agent will now be handling the tenancy and then block her number. Let them deal with her; they charge enough so let them earn it!

cmore123

And keep her deposit to pay for paint, skip hire and the like. She wouldn't get a red cent out of me!

odds_on

okidoki987 wrote: »

Where does it say this anywhere?
Surely if it's a 12 month lease, it's renewed every year and if either party don't want to renew, they walk away?

Once a tenant has been in occupancy (either under a fixed term agreement or a periodic agreement or a verbal agreement) for six months, the tenant acquires Part 4 tenancy rights and part of those rights is that the tenant may remain in the property for a total of 4 years without signing a new lease.

A tenant does not have to sign any lease at the end of a fixed term agreement. If the tenant wishes to remain in the property, it is the tenant's choice to decide whether s/he wants the security (and difficulty of leaving) of another fixed term agreement, or using the Part 4 rights, move over to a Part 4 tenancy which gives less security but ease of leaving.

rovoagho

Part 4 is irrelevant here, the tenant has only been in situ a couple of weeks.

athtrasna

rovoagho wrote: »

Part 4 is irrelevant here, the tenant has only been in situ a couple of weeks.

Which is why the OP needs to end her tenancy before she gets near Part 4 territory

The_Conductor

rovoagho wrote: »

Part 4 is irrelevant here, the tenant has only been in situ a couple of weeks.

Hopefully the OP hasn't hamstrung himself with clauses in the lease, giving the tenant rights they do not necessarily have.

GerardKeating

djimi wrote: »

Deduct it from her deposit.

Along with the cost of the paint she "disappeared"

The_Conductor

GerardKeating wrote: »

Along with the cost of the paint she "disappeared"

+1
And also the costs of the bathroom cabinets that she removed without your prior consent.

Duckjob

Jaypers, she sounds like a carbon-copy of a tenant that was in another apt in the house we were in when we rented-
- Non-stop stream of unreasonable demands (often looked for in exchange for payment of already late rent)
- Extremely careless with property furtniture, kitchen equipment etc of LL, and demanding replacement for all the stuff she had broken/damaged.
- Went back to her home country for 2 months at a time leaving him in the lurch for unpaid rent.
- Finally did a runner leaving unpaid rent and bills.

He was a very conciensous LL, well liked by all his tenants, and she had the poor guy heartbroken.

happyoutscan

Wow she is certainly trying to take you for all she can! Definitely listen to the advice you've been given here! Get a solicitor and get her out. No one should have to put up with bs like this.

walrusgumble

username_x wrote: »

So I recently rented out my house to a new tenant and have an issue.

She calls me every single day. I got 24 phonecalls in one day from her and if I don't pick up, she keeps calling!! She's been saying she wants new this and new that. I got the carpet on the stairs redone cause it was awful. She wanted a professional painter in and I said no, bought the paint to do it myself and the paint is now gone.

She wanted a new sofa and beds which when I refused to pay for she said she would, I agreed but told her that it'd be a few weeks before I could get them outta the house, and she has called or text everyday asking me when. She wants a new shower cause hers is noisy, a new cooker because the timer button is broken (the cooker works without it), new kitchen chairs because the cushions on the current ones are "dirty", a new kitchen floor, and wants me to get rid of the blinds that she replaced.

Am I under any obligation to do any of this at all? I feel like just telling her to pack up her stuff and get out, it's ridiculous. I can't always answer the phone and I've told her this, but she just doesn't understand that my occupation is not "full time landlord". And if I don't answer she gets angry.

Didn't she not inspect the house before agreeing to a lease? Why did she sign up if the house did not meet her standards?

You have some obligations, ie to ensure that the house remains habitable. Some of this seems over the top. Some landlords would tell them to swing for it

If you were a more full time / professional landlord, however, few would sympathise with you. However, that does not seem to be the case. Simply do not answer the phone until you are free to do so. Sounds like an utter nutcase.

anncoates

Get rid of her and don't give in to any more of her demands.

We would do a fair bit more than is necessary for our tenant as she is long term and a great tenant and person but your tenant is taking the piss.

Jhcx

Wow thats some tenant.
I was always under the impression of what you(person renting) broke owes the landlord by deposit. IE student accommodation you break a window you fix a window. you damage the furniture you replace the furniture by providing money to the landlord. or your deposit is used for the repairs.

I would in my backside be changing anything in my house if it wasnt broken and certainly not the furniture because they dont like it. I hope she knows or that you put into the contract that she will not be getting her deposit back because she has broken her lease by removing your fixed fittings and disposing of them(or trying to)

OP i hope you dont give into any more changes/demands the only demands should be. take it or get out. or my favourite Put up or Shut up unless its broken dont touch it but dont tell her that cause she might go and break everything.

Good luck for the future op hope you get sorted

firestarter51

i feel sorry for you op, im a tennant, and would never ask for this list of demands, i did ask if i could change the sofa, the existing one was shocking, the landlord asked me to wait a few weeks, he put it on donedeal and got cash, we were both happy.
you seem like a nice guy willing to paint ect but get rid of this woman,the tennancy board should help you, good luck and let us know what happens

pwurple

username_x wrote: »

I spoke to her previous landlord over the phone. To say I regret moving her in is an understatement. I got 10 missed calls in 7 minutes today. It's gone beyond a joke at this stage, I've asked her to be in this evening as I need to speak to her and have arranged for another collection of the couch.

Stop arranging for collection of couch, and start getting her to arrange for collection of her stuff. I can tell you from experience it will not get better.

You're trying to appease her now to prevent the hassle of re-advertising etc. I've made that mistake myself (although they weren't THIS bad). It just draws out the unpleasantness. She sounds like the type that will never be happy. You are costing yourself a fortune. You didn't rent this out unfurnished, is she planning on leaving all this stuff there when she moves out eventually, or are you effectively having all your furnishings binned, and will have to replace?

If she expects a repainting every year it's bonkers.

Save yourself some heartache and a lot of money. End this. You'll be subsidising this person's lifestyle expectations for a long time otherwise.

Ray Palmer

Strangely I would not be in a rush to kick her out. Unless you have explained to her what she can and can't do she is acting as she sees is appropriate.

Arrange a meeting and explain to her:
1) What your obligations are
2) What her obligations are
3) The phone is not to be used unless an emergency or prior arrangement
4) The equipment in the house was sight as seen and unless something is broken it will not be replaced. It may also be repaired
5) Any changes to the property require written consent
6) Any requests will be considered but must come writing and will receive a written response and that decision is final

If she doesn't like it then it will be easier to get her to move out.

I would also point out additional costs due to her not being at a greed appointment will have to be paid for her on top of the rent. Do not take anything out of a deposit as that is security for when the tenant leaves not a running account.

If you haven't cleared what is acceptable she may not be aware. If she breaks the rules then you have a t least grounds to prove she is being unreasonable. Keep a diary of events

ruthloss

I would strongly advise you take a third party along with you to witness any meeting you may have with this lady.

Brussels Sprout

Is this lady foreign? Just wondering is she from a country where there are more obligations on landlords (although I'm sure there's nowhere that would do the things that she seems to demand)

Fooster King

I had a tenant like this once, a lady from Austria. Ended up having windows realigned (for a draught), mattress replaced (too soft), carpet replaced with wooden floor, numerous electrical checks, etc. I explained to her that the apartment was let as it was seen at the viewing and not in some other "imagined" state. I told her that if she wasn't happy with these things at the viewing she should never taken out a lease (or at least without checking with me first if these things would be rectified later).

Eventually had enough and was about to ask her to leave when she told me that she had spoken to some of her work colleagues and that they had told her that she was too demanidng and was lucky to be still in the apt and that most landlords would have done nothing for her. She said that in Austria it it typical to have a long list of demands for landlords and that they get addressed, i.e. it can take hours to go through the lease, checking every item that is listed, that they are actually there, what condition they're in, etc. (even things like cups, toilet seats,.....)

When she realised it was different here she was fine and there were no more issues. She stayed for nearly 3 years without further problems.

My advice to you would be to tell she she signed the lease on the basis of what you showed her and if she's not happy with that she should leave (minus her deposit or whatever portion you need to cover the cost of advertising and loss of rent while you try and get a new tenant).

If you don't nip this in the bud it will be a 12 month (or longer) nightmare

Good luck