Garda called over crying child on bus

Femme_Fatale

Newaglish wrote: »

Because you can't have an opinion if you haven't had unprotected sex before

You can, provided you don't act like you're more of an authority than a parent.

I'm not a parent btw.

mattjack

Doc Ruby wrote: »

Sometimes kids just won't calm down. It's a fact of life. For all we know the bus driver was nursing a hangover and that's why he overreacted.


Are you kidding, any women with north Dublin accents should have their handbags regularly checked for heroin.*


*except Imelda May**
**no, her too

Imelda May is a Southsider ....

Czarcasm

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

You can, provided you don't act like you're more of an authority than a parent.

I'm not a parent btw.

I'm not getting at you FF but this is more of a general comment about why this kind of "as a parent" nonsense gets on my tits. Anyone can be a parent, but that's all they are, a parent to their particular child. They only have experience raising their own child.

There are psychologists, paediatricians, child minders and just people, that will know more about children than I ever will, that see more children and have more experience with children than I ever will, yet these people may not have children themselves.

Being a parent doesn't give anyone any special insight into children other than their own children, so to try and say someone can't be as informed or even more informed about dealing with children simply because they don't have children themselves is just a bit silly tbh.

There are parents who treat their children like crap, does this mean that people who don't have children have no right to point out that person treats their child like crap? I don't think so.

Femme_Fatale

Czarcasm wrote: »

There are parents who treat their children like crap, does this mean that people who don't have children have no right to point out that person treats their child like crap? I don't think so.

Yeh of course I'm talking about within reason. What I'm referring more to is when people say "They should have done this", "I'd do that" - nobody without kids knows what the heck they'd do. Obviously abuse is pretty cut and dry as a no-no, whether you're a parent or not. Your perspective does change when you have children - or even when you become an aunt/uncle. That's not having a go at non parents, it's just a fact.

I'd agree with you that childcare experts should be included in the same bracket as parents in terms of how to deal with the various more difficult situations (e.g. crying in public). To me, this little boy sounds very distressed, but small children can sound very distressed over run-of-the-mill stuff like wind/teething. My niece, like Legs.Eleven's, once went on a screaming, choking-sounding marathon, and oh Jesus it was absolutely harrowing. Thank Christ it wasn't out in public. I was wondering should we bring her to the doctor, and my dad told me to cop the **** on! :pac:
He was wondering why I was so freaked out by it - to him, it was just a case of: children go nuts crying sometimes.

I don't know how the mother was able to stay so passive, but I'd need far more insider details to make the call on it that the child's welfare was a concern. And calling the cops - wtf?!

Bogota

valknut wrote: »

If the bus driver told a group of people to stop drinking and they ignored him he would be dead right to call the guards.

If the bus driver asked her to calm her child down a few times and she ignored he might be concerned about the child and other passengers being uncomfortable. In that case, he was fully justified calling the guards.

I'll bet if this was a white mother with a North Dublin accent the same people defending the African lady would be calling for her head thinking the guards should check the babys buggy out for heroin etc.. Different standards for certain people.

So you are basically saying the only reason people are defending her is because she's black? I dont think that's the case at all.

I think the video is one that would evenly split people down the middle regardless of colour. On the one hand I can see the argument that she wasn't completely ignoring the baby, she was rocking the buggy back and forth and shushing it and at one point carassed the child's face. A baby having a tantrum for 50minutes is not uncommon, in fact, I've been on flights where babies have screamed like that for over 2-3 hours. As for the argument that she should have picked up the baby well I don't know if I agree, many parents refuse to give in to babies having tantrums as part of the learning process for the child's development. It's pretty common. So I sort of see where the lady was coming from saying "you don't know my child better than me", for all we know this child's tantrums may be regular and the more the mother gives in to them the more they happen. Add to to this, if she really was one stop away the bus driver should really have just let her off at her stop.

I feel absolutely zero sympathy for the bus driver. Bus drivers are paid really well for the skill set needed for their job and crying babies are part and parcel of the job. If a bus driver can't drive a bus with the distraction of a baby crying then he's a danger to his passengers because the fact is there will always be these sort of distractions on buses. I'm sorry but no job doesn't have its own negatives.

In regards to the arguments against the lady, I can see where they're coming from as well. Maybe she should have picked up the baby and given in to the child's tantrum for the sake of her fellow passengers and bus driver. She was also disrespectful to the guards however I think anyone in that situation would be pissed especially if they were adamant that they had did no wrong. I know 99% of parents here would be very pissed off if someone questioned their parenting skills. She was probably already highly stressed and then realized not only was she being kicked off the bus and having her parenting questioned by a stranger but the guards had been called on her.

To be honest, I think a lot of the posters supporting the bus driver are just pissed off bus commuters who have to listen to babies crying all the time. I lean on the ladies side though without the full facts.

As soon as race is brought into an argument which is in no way race related, that argument is lost.

Khannie

Hootanany wrote: »

Well can you tell is she employed or hand out for her entitlements .

I can't quite tell that. Can you tell me how you figured that out?

VONSHIRACH

Babies cry, but what happened here was unacceptable on a bus with a parent making little or no effort to soothe her baby. The driver should have asked the woman if everything was ok with the baby and that she would have to leave the bus if she didn't attend to her baby re the distressing crying. The crying baby for 50 minutes would not be tolerated in a cafe/restaurant or a wedding/funeral service for example. I have been on guided tours on several occasions also where the crying baby with parents were politely asked to leave. I commend the bus driver for calling the Gardai assuming he was concerned for the baby's welfare. I like to think I would have said something to the woman about the baby if I was on that bus for 50mins. As a guy with no baby experience I have to admit I wouldn't understand the different types of baby cries, ie hunger, tired, pain, but I watched the video for about 4 mins only, I found the cries upsetting to listen to.

nlgbbbblth

JBTM wrote: »

Apparently Dublin Bus have video footage of the incident and are releasing a Directors Cut type DVD free in this Sundays Irish Times. 74 minutes long that one with 2 different camera angles, enhanced speakers and interviews with the driver, the two women central to the incident and 3 of the passengers. It also has a remade 'all-white' parody to give a non racist perspective on the situation. I think we should wait until we see that before discussing this further.

The Irish Times isn't published on a Sunday.

B.A._Baracus

nlgbbbblth wrote: »

The Irish Times isn't published on a Sunday.

He was being sarcastic, dude. "All white parody" really gave it away ...

valknut

[Deleted User] wrote: »

As soon as race is brought into an argument which is in no way race related, that argument is lost.

It is though, its the elephant in the room.

Often seen friends family acquaintances giving out about rude people in bar queues bus queues supermarkets etc. But as soon as its a black person they won't say near as much. Skin colour matters not to me, if your rude and ignorant I'll treat someone as such.

Seen an incident recently where a black lady was short changed at the check out, nothing wrong with that of course. But the way she never apologised to the cashier or people behind, but instead just rang someone till they came and gave her money. If that was a white person I'll bet the queue behind would be impatient and the cashier would make her make way for the person behind.

I have know doubt that if the lady on the bus was white it would be junkie skanger, ring social services etc.

nlgbbbblth

valknut wrote: »

It is though, its the elephant in the room.

Often seen friends family acquaintances giving out about rude people in bar queues bus queues supermarkets etc. But as soon as its a black person they won't say near as much. Skin colour matters not to me, if your rude and ignorant I'll treat someone as such.

Seen an incident recently where a black lady was short changed at the check out, nothing wrong with that of course. But the way she never apologised to the cashier or people behind, but instead just rang someone till they came and gave her money. If that was a white person I'll bet the queue behind would be impatient and the cashier would make her make way for the person behind.

I have know doubt that if the lady on the bus was white it would be junkie skanger, ring social services etc.

I don't think it's as black and white as that.

Czarcasm

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Yeh of course I'm talking about within reason. What I'm referring more to is when people say "They should have done this", "I'd do that" - nobody without kids knows what the heck they'd do. Obviously abuse is pretty cut and dry as a no-no, whether you're a parent or not. Your perspective does change when you have children - or even when you become an aunt/uncle. That's not having a go at non parents, it's just a fact.

I dunno FF, I just think people are going to pass judgement whether anyone likes it or not. It's up to the person or parent of the child themselves how they choose to interpret that as advice, or ignorance.

I know some people's perspective changes, but my perspective on parenting or how to treat other human beings never changed simply because one day I'm not a parent, next day I am. There was no sudden flash of I don't know what you'd call it that went off in my head that said "This, changes, everything".

I'd agree with you that childcare experts should be included in the same bracket as parents in terms of how to deal with the various more difficult situations (e.g. crying in public). To me, this little boy sounds very distressed, but small children can sound very distressed over run-of-the-mill stuff like wind/teething. My niece, like Legs.Eleven's, once went on a screaming, choking-sounding marathon, and oh Jesus it was absolutely harrowing. Thank Christ it wasn't out in public. I was wondering should we bring her to the doctor, and my dad told me to cop the **** on! :pac:
He was wondering why I was so freaked out by it - to him, it was just a case of: children go nuts crying sometimes.

Exactly - different people will have different opinions on parenting depending on their experience. We were all children once and we all have parents, therefore we all have experience of parenting, and we all have experience of being a child.

Only two weeks ago my child fell in the school yard and I was called to collect him from the school. The teacher was beside herself with worry. I took one look at him, he wasn't crying so I figured he'd just sprained his wrist - take him home, put an ice pack on it, be grand in the morning. He was still able to take notes for me in a meeting. I met my wife afterwards and she said just to be on the safe side she'd take him out to the hospital. Turned out he'd broken two bones in his wrist.

The other night I came home and he'd managed to get his hands on a scissors and cut lumps out of his hair while my wife thought he was playing in his room. I'd no choice but to shave it all off. My wife spent the next hour freaking out wondering how would she take him to school in the morning with his arm in a cast and a bald head. She was worried about what the other parents might think. I told her other people are going to think what they want regardless.

I don't know how the mother was able to stay so passive, but I'd need far more insider details to make the call on it that the child's welfare was a concern. And calling the cops - wtf?!

Bus driver made the right call IMO; the parent may have been able to cope with a crying child, but she wasn't trying to concentrate on driving a bus on a wet evening in the middle of Dublin traffic. The bus driver is responsible for more people than just accommodating the discomfort of one child. Had the bus driver asked the woman to leave the bus, he would've opened himself up to accusations of discrimination, racism, sexism, etc.

He made the right call to let the authorities handle the situation.

valknut

nlgbbbblth wrote: »

I don't think it's as black and white as that.

It really is that simple imo, have seen it far two often in public in this county.

A lot of Irish people avoid confrontation in situations as this out of some misguided guilt.

nlgbbbblth

valknut wrote: »

It really is that simple imo, have seen it far two often in public in this county.

A lot of Irish people avoid confrontation in situations as this out of some misguided guilt.

Do you agree with this?

Someone who is unwilling to criticise behaviour based on skin colour is also likely to excuse it based on class

shootermacg

What amuses me, is that these babbas complaining about a crying child, will have a permanent record of the fact on boards for them to read when they mature and realise what absolute crying babbas they themselves were.

And when you come in here screaming about about already being mature, read this: You really aren't. Here you are arguing about stuff only us grown-ups know about.

This point keeps having to be made...over and over again...you cannot reason with kids, when they are upset. Kids will rant on like you've just shot their dog, for hours, on a whim.

Good parenting means keeping the kid in the pram in the bus, why is this? because of the parenting rule number one. You give in once and it'll keep happening. Parents have to think of the big picture, unlike some of you.

Questioning a mother's love for their child, just shows how immature some of you guys are. Being a mother is an entirely selfless act + an exhausting one.

If you are reflective of society in general, then god help us. We have regressed as a society if this is the case.

anncoates

Charlie Rock wrote: »

Ann is a happily married woman. Leave her alone you brutes.

I feel so objectified.

clairefontaine

I see both sides of this.

When my child has been screaming in the back of the car, I have to pull over because I can't fully concentrate on the road.

I was also on a bus once when my child was nearly a newborn and he was screaming crying and h was sweet FA I could do about it until I get to a place to change or feed. I cold feel the stares stripping me down, which only added to he anxiety. I could get off the bus and be stranded in the middle of nowhere with a newborn or I could just ride it out and the whole bus would just have to deal with it.