Munster vs Drive-For-Five buildup

Hagz · 28-09-2013 11:27pm

Tox56 wrote: »

Disagree, if we're talking big breakout performance I would say that MOTM game v Cardiff (up against the Lions skipper no less) would have to be up there, he was on fire that day

Sure, but I think the point where he started to get consistent starts was at 8.

Swiwi. · 28-09-2013 11:28pm

Tox56 wrote: »

Healy
Strauss
Moore
McCarthy
Toner
McLaughlin
SOB
Heaslip
Boss
Madigan
D Kearney
D'Arcy
BOD
McFadden
R Kearney

If Fitzgerald is fit I would be tempted to move Kearney junior to 15 where he has impressed, but best thing would probably be to introduce him from the bench as the back 3 from the Cardiff game is more than capable.

Madigan one last chance to demand a start for the H Cup

Depending on the fitness of Bent we have to trust Moore to come off the bench in a H Cup match. And so we have to trust him here, these are the games he will learn from regardless of his performance

Bring McGrath on early, both resting Healy and battle hardening McGrath in the process. However if you bench Moore I would also bench Healy

I prefer Kearney Jnr on the wing, I'd give Kearney Snr another go. I'm not sure about starting Luke if he was fit, he's just so injury prone and I'd rather see him successfully last 80 minutes in a less important fixture.

Fireball07 · 28-09-2013 11:30pm

Archer and Ryan have done pretty well so far this season, up against Healy/McGrath will be as good a test as any to see if they really are ready for regular HC action.

And, based on what I've seen of him so far, Cronin seems to be a better scrummager than Killer. Although, I think Penney will pick Kilcoyne for this game.

Tox56 · 28-09-2013 11:33pm

Swiwi. wrote: »

I prefer Kearney Jnr on the wing, I'd give Kearney Snr another go. I'm not sure about starting Luke if he was fit, he's just so injury prone and I'd rather see him successfully last 80 minutes in a less important fixture.

Fair enough and I would probably bench him too, but the next time there will be a less important fixture than this is a Pro12 game v Connacht almost exactly a month from today. I would hope he plays 80 mins for us at some point between now and then, he's too good a player. At the same time he should only be brought back if they are 100% sure he is ready (although I believe his injury this time was in itself pretty routine, not connected to any previous injuries)

Buer · 28-09-2013 11:38pm

Jordi Murphy starts list. Because I'm a saddo:

Senior team:
8 starts at 8
2 starts at 7

B&I team:
1 start at 8
6 start at 7
2 start at 6

Hagz · 28-09-2013 11:41pm

What about appearances from the bench?

Get on it Buer!

Buer · 28-09-2013 11:44pm

Hagz wrote: »

What about appearances from the bench?

Get on it Buer!

Gwanouttadat.

I will say that a good number, probably the majority, were at openside but match is on so no counting it up!

Fireball07 · 29-09-2013 12:49am

Buer wrote: »

I can see someone like Mike McCarthy being carded. He knows he's out of the Irish side unless he absolutely dominates Ryan physically.

A bit of an onus on Ryan to perform too. His performances at the end of last season weren't anything close to those that got him into the Irish team originally. Needs to get back to those levels because there's lots of competition... DOC is as solid as ever, had a good game again today. And Foley, in particular, has impressed a lot this season.

And with Henderson on the rise up North, and Toner really starting to impress, there are plenty of options in the row. (Tuohy and Stevenson are both good operators too).

danthefan · 29-09-2013 12:51am

Touhy, Toner, Stevenson are never going to be real international options imo.

Fireball07 · 29-09-2013 12:53am

danthefan wrote: »

Touhy, Toner, Stevenson are never going to be real international options imo.

Maybe not, but... once upon a time, people may have said that Ryan wouldn't either. If you have a prolonged period of form, you can force yourself into the reckoning.

And Ireland know as well as most that you need to have options in case of injury...we've been hit hard in recent times.

Hagz · 29-09-2013 12:54am

danthefan wrote: »

Touhy, Toner, Stevenson are never going to be real international options imo.

I would have been guilty of saying close to the same thing about Ryan pre '11 though.

danthefan · 29-09-2013 12:55am

Fireball07 wrote: »

Maybe not, but... once upon a time, people may have said that Ryan wouldn't either. If you have a prolonged period of form, you can force yourself into the reckoning.

And Ireland know as well as most that you need to have options in case of injury...we've been hit hard in recent times.

Hagz wrote: »

I would have been guilty of saying close to the same thing about Ryan pre '11 though.

What held Ryan back mostly was being at Munster. I don't think those I named are of the requisite quality, just my opinion.

Swiwi. · 29-09-2013 1:25am

danthefan wrote: »

Touhy, Toner, Stevenson are never going to be real international options imo.

Touhy definitely not. Stevenson I couldn't comment. Toner is playing well for Leinster but I agree I don't know that he could make the step up consistently at international level.

Fireball07 · 29-09-2013 1:27am

I don't know but there were a fair amount of people saying that Tuohy should have been picked ahead of DOC a year or two ago..... and say what you want about DOC, he has always been very solid at international level.

Mahatma Geansai · 29-09-2013 2:42am

Fireball07 wrote: »

I don't know but there were a fair amount of people saying that Tuohy should have been picked ahead of DOC a year or two ago..... and say what you want about DOC, he has always been very solid at international level.

That was more people wanting Kidney to pick a non Munster player than anything. The calls to replace Doc reached a furore in the same 6N he put in great tacking stats.

Most people and fans have no idea what a lock does outside the line out. There's a reason why the top sides always have at least one great lock.

DOC isn't the Lion he was, but he is still one of our better options.

jamiedav2011 · 29-09-2013 3:17am

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

That was more people wanting Kidney to pick a non Munster player than anything. The calls to replace Doc reached a furore in the same 6N he put in great tacking stats.

Most people and fans have no idea what a lock does outside the line out. There's a reason why the top sides always have at least one great lock.

DOC isn't the Lion he was, but he is still one of our better options.

#unseenwork
#pashun

danthefan · 29-09-2013 9:19am

Fireball07 wrote: »

I don't know but there were a fair amount of people saying that Tuohy should have been picked ahead of DOC a year or two ago..... and say what you want about DOC, he has always been very solid at international level.

He should have been. DOC had been dropped by Munster but was still first choice for Ireland - figure that one out. I'll point anyone towards our results over the last year or two if they think Kidney had selections right. Touhy hasn't been able to maintain his form though. I'm sure he'd be capable of a one off decent performance for Ireland but what I meant is I don't think he'd ever be a guy you could give 40 caps to, because you wouldn't get 40 performances from him.

Swiwi. · 29-09-2013 9:37am

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

That was more people wanting Kidney to pick a non Munster player than anything. The calls to replace Doc reached a furore in the same 6N he put in great tacking stats.

Most people and fans have no idea what a lock does outside the line out. There's a reason why the top sides always have at least one great lock.

DOC isn't the Lion he was, but he is still one of our better options.

Mahatma, I think virtually everyone on this forum makes their Irish selections purely based on form. Ok, for 50/50 calls, a bit of home-town bias might come into play. But I can't think of anyone who has a "Anyone-But-Munster" approach to their selections. On the other hand, I have no difficulty thinking of at least 3 posters who suffer from a Munser persecution complex "The world is out to get Munster". I agree that DOC's form has picked up, but he definitely went through a plateau a while there back. And therefore Munsterman Ryan took his starting spot.

jamiedav2011 · 29-09-2013 9:39am

Swiwi. wrote: »

Mahatma, I think virtually everyone on this forum makes their Irish selections purely based on form. Ok, for 50/50 calls, a bit of home-town bias might come into play. But I can't think of anyone who has a "Anyone-But-Munster" approach to their selections. On the other hand, I have no difficulty thinking of at least 3 posters who suffer from a Munser persecution complex "The world is out to get Munster". I agree that DOC's form has picked up, but he definitely went through a plateau a while there back. And therefore Munsterman Ryan took his starting spot.

Better when bitter, and by god can they be bitter!

Howard Juneau · 29-09-2013 9:46am

I think by the end of this thread we're going to see a lot of closed accounts & be saying hello to a lot of "new" friends!

Podge_irl · 29-09-2013 9:53am

Fun fact: Connacht have beaten Leinster as many times over the last 4 and a bit seasons as Munster have.

Buer · 29-09-2013 9:56am

DOC is a great player but 2-3 years ago he was playing like a drain. He fully deserved to be dropped from the Irish side and most Munster fans were tearing their hair out with his performances too. His most noteworthy contributions were concentrated on niggle with the opposition where he got caught once or twice in high profile games, notably the Ospreys in the HEC.

The dropping appears to be just what he needed because last season he was much more like the old DOC, industrious and a massive work rate around the field, tackling anything that moved, slamming into every ruck and getting on his carriers shoulder more often than not. But there's no doubt he deservedly fell well down the pecking order for Ireland when he did so.

durkadurka · 29-09-2013 10:18am

I'll stick me neck out. Leinster coming together better after some tough tests.

Munster a bit more undercooked so far.

Leinster by 5

phog · 29-09-2013 10:39am

durkadurka wrote: »

I'll stick me neck out. Leinster coming together better after some tough tests.

Munster a bit more undercooked so far.

Leinster by 5

Based on the two games this weekend you're being generous to Munster though I was happy enough with our defence. However poor Leinster were they at least had a decent attack, lead in the main by BOD.

Howard Juneau · 29-09-2013 10:51am

I'm not overly worried about the game, players coming back from injury, great to see Felix back again. POC looked up for it & Murray should be back next week.
I am wonderful if Madigan starts or will Gopperth get the nod?

Tox56 · 29-09-2013 10:53am

Howard Juneau wrote: »

I'm not overly worried about the game, players coming back from injury, great to see Felix back again. POC looked up for it & Murray should be back next week.
I am wonderful if Madigan starts or will Gopperth get the nod?

I'd be amazed if it wasn't Madigan

Swiwi. · 29-09-2013 10:57am

Tox56 wrote: »

Is be amazed if it wasn't Madigan

I think Madigan should get the nod. Gopperth has shown what he can do, but Madigan was fine on Friday, and in combination with last season's form should start. However, it's comforting to know Gopperth is on the bench if required. That's assuming Leinster don't require Madigan at 15, but I don't think there were any new injuries luckily.

Buer · 29-09-2013 11:02am

I expect Madigan to get it and hope he does. Gopperth has been great and I'm a big fan but Madigan is an 85%+ kicker and, with no other regular kicker in the side, you can't leave that out. Gopperth hasn't hit his straps on his goalkicking quote yet. Madigan is also a better tackler which will be needed for this game.

Leinster's back row has really failed to spark. I reckon POM will have a big game. He's playing well and has a couple of games under his belt. Heaslip has one poor game. SOB has nothing. Munster have a distinct advantage at lock too if POC is back in which he will be. Throw in the Munster scrum and how Leinster have really been hit and miss in adjusting to the new rules and I think this is Munster's game.

The only place I can see Leinster causing them real trouble is their maul (which Munster are equally strong at) and in midfield with their angles of running and BOD's sleight of hand.

Normally, I always think Leinster will edge it due to having a much more cohesive and talented back row but currently, that simply isn't the case. Munster by 7.

Tox56 · 29-09-2013 11:03am

Swiwi. wrote: »

I think Madigan should get the nod. Gopperth has shown what he can do, but Madigan was fine on Friday, and in combination with last season's form should start. However, it's comforting to know Gopperth is on the bench if required. That's assuming Leinster don't require Madigan at 15, but I don't think there were any new injuries luckily.

Not so much about last seasons form as it is he has only played 1 game at 10 this season, whereas Gopperth has played 5. He was good last week but he's inevitably going to be rusty, if nothing else we have to be prepared for him to start at least one of the upcoming H Cup games, even if he doesn't start both.

errlloyd · 29-09-2013 11:06am

I hope this isn't an awful game. We hardly ever get a cracker between the sides. I want to see both teams playing positive rugby, I want to see players trying to impress a new national coach.

Young lads, the likes of Moore, mcgrath, Cronin, dineen, Sheridan, have **** loads to play for with Joe watching.

Munster vs Drive-For-Five buildup

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