Religion for animals

Kiwi in IE

recedite wrote: »

She was an aggressive atheist cat all along then.

Nope! The fight that resulted in the abscess was part of a religious conflict.

Peregrinus

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

Nope! The fight that resulted in the abscess was part of a religious conflict.

Necessarily so, since as we all know religion is at the root of all conflicts!

Kiwi in IE

The conflict may have occurred because promiscuity and fornication are against her beliefs.

Peregrinus

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

The conflict may have occurred because promiscuity and fornication are against her beliefs.

Knowing what I know of cats, that strikes me as wildy unlikely.

Animord

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

You are probably right I do need to just ignore it.

Don't ignore all of it, fighting it is the only way it will ever change. But I worry for your sanity :pac:

TwoShedsJackson

Not sure why the vet went to all the bother of qualifying to be a vet if a bit of an oul pray would do the trick.

gaynorvader

It may sound weird but being non-religious is the same as being an atheist. Atheism is just the absence of belief in any god. Though it has been used as meaning the belief that there is no god that I'm afraid of it going the way of "literally".

Dades

gaynorvader wrote: »

It may sound weird but being non-religious is the same as being an atheist. Atheism is just the absence of belief in any god. Though it has been used as meaning the belief that there is no god that I'm afraid of it going the way of "literally".

Not so sure. You can claim to be non-religious whilst being say, a deist, for example.

Animord

gaynorvader wrote: »

It may sound weird but being non-religious is the same as being an atheist. Atheism is just the absence of belief in any god. Though it has been used as meaning the belief that there is no god that I'm afraid of it going the way of "literally".

Of course it is. Technically we were all athiests, but when no one has any interest in the subject then there is no need of a label, was my point really.

gaynorvader

Dades wrote: »

Not so sure. You can claim to be non-religious whilst being say, a deist, for example.

Good point.

SpaceTime

I think a lot of it can be 'turn of phrase', especially for older people / more rural types. There's a lot of phrases that are more just worked into the language than religious, especially where some awkward situation comes up involving death / illness.

I found it actually a lot more shocking in the US to be perfectly honest. I turned up at people's houses and got forced to say grace before meals and had random preachers on streets threaten to save my soul.

I also found that some people couldn't understand how you could not be religious at all.

I find in England too they can chuck in the odd really religious thing into phrases too like "God Bless" instead of "Bye".

...

The Irish education system's ridiculous though at primary and secondary level anyway as it's all run by religious orders.

However, in most other aspects of life that's not the case at all. Even in nominally religious hospitals, I haven't found them THAT in your face to be quite honest.

...

As for the vet. I have to say I haven't encountered one like that in my many years here!
Our vet's just a complete cat-lover and spends all her time meowing and ooooing and awwwing over your cat. The cat thinks she's the best thing since sliced bread and bounds out to greet her when we bring him!

gaynorvader

SpaceTime wrote: »

I think a lot of it can be 'turn of phrase', especially for older people / more rural types. There's a lot of phrases that are more just worked into the language than religious, especially where some awkward situation comes up involving death / illness.

I found it actually a lot more shocking in the US to be perfectly honest. I turned up at people's houses and got forced to say grace before meals and had random preachers on streets threaten to save my soul.

I also found that some people couldn't understand how you could not be religious at all.

I find in England too they can chuck in the odd really religious thing into phrases too like "God Bless" instead of "Bye".

...

The Irish education system's ridiculous though at primary and secondary level anyway as it's all run by religious orders.

However, in most other aspects of life that's not the case at all. Even in nominally religious hospitals, I haven't found them THAT in your face to be quite honest.

...

As for the vet. I have to say I haven't encountered one like that in my many years here!
Our vet's just a complete cat-lover and spends all her time meowing and ooooing and awwwing over your cat. The cat thinks she's the best thing since sliced bread and bounds out to greet her when we bring him!

What is it about sliced bread? Shouldn't it be the best thing since the silicon chip?

I Heart Internet

SpaceTime wrote: »

I find in England too they can chuck in the odd really religious thing into phrases too like "God Bless" instead of "Bye".

Is this really a problem for you?

SpaceTime

gaynorvader wrote: »

What is it about sliced bread? Shouldn't it be the best thing since the silicon chip?

Yeah, but silicon chips don't really go with toasted cheese.

SpaceTime

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Is this really a problem for you?

No, I am pointing out that it's not necessarily someone trying to actually bless you or something like that it's just a turn of phrase.

Please read post in context

I Heart Internet

SpaceTime wrote: »

No, I am pointing out that it's not necessarily someone trying to actually bless you or something like that it's just a turn of phrase.

Please read post in context

Forgive me. I read it as a further example of the American situations which you found shocking.

From my experienc eof living in the UK, I found that "God Bless" was a much rarer parting that things like "See ya later, Duck"

Hotblack Desiato

As I said in another thread here recently Kiwi, you'd really have to have grown up here in the 70s/80s (and most of it was still around in the 90s) to make sense of this sort of thing.

There was an excellent documentary series produced some years ago about the relationship between the RCC and late 20th-century Irish society. Topics addressed include the role of women, the sometimes strained relations between the clergy and the laity, rural isolation, the position of the hierarchy, changing sexual mores, censorship, and marital breakdown in a pre-divorce society.

You can buy the DVDs here - most enlightening viewing even for those of us who grew up in this environment.

SpaceTime

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Forgive me. I read it as a further example of the American situations which you found shocking.

From my experienc eof living in the UK, I found that "God Bless" was a much rarer parting that things like "See ya later, Duck"

Depends where you are. I keep hearing it from certain phone-in radio show hosts.

robindch

ninja900 wrote: »

There was an excellent documentary series produced some years ago about the relationship between the RCC and late 20th-century Irish society. Topics addressed include the role of women, the sometimes strained relations between the clergy and the laity, rural isolation, the position of the hierarchy, changing sexual mores, censorship, and marital breakdown in a pre-divorce society.

There's also this 1967 film which satirizes a fictional Potato Republic populated by an urbanized peasantry beneath the heel of an obscurantist clerical dictatorship. The film efficiently conveys the colors of that simplistic, metaphorical time and place, so it's shot in black and white, separated by a strictly limited number of shades of gray:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocky_Road_to_Dublin_(film)

Obliq

SpaceTime wrote: »

I think a lot of it can be 'turn of phrase', especially for older people / more rural types. There's a lot of phrases that are more just worked into the language than religious, especially where some awkward situation comes up ....

I think it's really interesting that in our religious country, we don't have equivalent non-religious expressions. I was only thinking about this on Sunday on the way back from Cork. I'd stopped to get petrol in Buttevant in my Clare car covered in Clare flags (flying defiantly in the face of the multidude of Cork supporters) and was thoroughly questioned by the cashier as to my reasons for being in their county - "Did you have a nice trip? - Shopping, was it? For the weekend?" and when I answered "Nope - looking after my sick aunt for the week", he nearly fell over himself with the "Ah, God bless you", "God bless her and save her", etc.
For the next few miles, I wondered what catch phrase would trip off my tongue to indicate the same wishes....and came up with nothing so automatic to us Irish as a blessing from god. Any thoughts on equivalent atheist "best hope for her/his health" or "well done for caring" phrases?

SpaceTime

I think it very much depends on the age and location of the person you're speaking to as well.

I mean, I can't think of any of my peers or immediate relatives (in urban areas) who would come out with phrases like that.

My granny would be more likely to come out with "I hope it's nothing serious!.. I hope she gets well soon .. Aren't you great for going up to look after her".

The only religious phrase which I hear a lot is Like, OMG! which is LIKE TOTALLY, imported from the USA.

That and people using religious phrases as swear words, or alternatives like "jaysus"

England's full of it too though:

Cor blimey! - A cockney version of : God Blind me! which is pretty extreme when you think about it.
I keep hearing "Aww Bless!" when certain people find something 'cute' in England too.
Or even "aww bless his cotton socks" in reference to babies.
I've had people say "Bless you" in England when I sneeze.
I've also had people say "God bless!" instead of "Good bye" in parts of the SW of England too.

coffee_cake

Obliq wrote: »

I think it's really interesting that in our religious country, we don't have equivalent non-religious expressions. I was only thinking about this on Sunday on the way back from Cork. I'd stopped to get petrol in Buttevant in my Clare car covered in Clare flags (flying defiantly in the face of the multidude of Cork supporters) and was thoroughly questioned by the cashier as to my reasons for being in their county - "Did you have a nice trip? - Shopping, was it? For the weekend?" and when I answered "Nope - looking after my sick aunt for the week", he nearly fell over himself with the "Ah, God bless you", "God bless her and save her", etc.
For the next few miles, I wondered what catch phrase would trip off my tongue to indicate the same wishes....and came up with nothing so automatic to us Irish as a blessing from god. Any thoughts on equivalent atheist "best hope for her/his health" or "well done for caring" phrases?

I'd just say something like sorry to hear that I hope she recovers soon!
Fair play to you?

Obliq

SpaceTime wrote: »

I think it very much depends on the age and location of the person you're speaking to as well.

I mean, I can't think of any of my peers or immediate relatives (in urban areas) who would come out with phrases like that.

That's just it, yes. I've been living in rural Ireland so long that the first phrase that comes to my parrot brain is usually god related, as it's what I hear ALL THE TIME. God willing/God rest her/God help him/with the help of God.....you name it, I've had to try NOT to say it! The only phrase I've picked up here that isn't religious is "Well wear", to be used when someone gets a new car.

SpaceTime

Actually some of my relatives / neighbours in Cork City would just patronise the hell out of you for that

"Sure, aren't you great! Good man yourself... Well done!"

I think though sometimes people need some kind of stock phrases for difficult situations like shaking hands with someone who has had a relative / friend die recently.

The stock phrase in Dublin and also from what I could see in Cork City was just "I'm sorry for your troubles" which seems kind of odd and a bit stilted too.

I know I've been in that position (e.g. lost a grandparent) and you'd a mixture of stuff like that, the odd slightly religious stock phrase and then the odd person going COMPLETELY over the top and hugging you and nearly picking you up off the ground (I'm 6'2!)

I think some of it is just automatic response phrases.

Obliq

bluewolf wrote: »

I'd just say something like sorry to hear that I hope she recovers soon!
Fair play to you?

Well done! Was a bit befuddled from the week at the time, so came up with nothing. Not much better this morning, clearly...
3 hours sleep will do that to me

SpaceTime

bluewolf wrote: »

I'd just say something like sorry to hear that I hope she recovers soon!
Fair play to you?

To use some old people supportive language :

Good man yourself! Well done for figuring that out! Aren't you great! Sure you've brains to burn! Fair play to ya! It'll be a lucky woman/man that marries ya!

(see: you can talk like a befuddled awlwan without any religious phrases at all!)

Animord

I had to go to a funeral mass recently and it was only after the third time in the hand-shaky bit that I realised I was saying "pleased to meet you" instead of whatever it is you are meant to say.

I don't know if anyone noticed. :P

Brian Shanahan

Obliq wrote: »

I think it's really interesting that in our religious country, we don't have equivalent non-religious expressions. I was only thinking about this on Sunday on the way back from Cork. I'd stopped to get petrol in Buttevant in my Clare car covered in Clare flags (flying defiantly in the face of the multidude of Cork supporters) and was thoroughly questioned by the cashier as to my reasons for being in their county - "Did you have a nice trip? - Shopping, was it? For the weekend?" and when I answered "Nope - looking after my sick aunt for the week", he nearly fell over himself with the "Ah, God bless you", "God bless her and save her", etc.
For the next few miles, I wondered what catch phrase would trip off my tongue to indicate the same wishes....and came up with nothing so automatic to us Irish as a blessing from god. Any thoughts on equivalent atheist "best hope for her/his health" or "well done for caring" phrases?

All I know is that when I bash myself or other wise self harm, and don't want to use an expletive, I use "Primitive and Outmoded Concept on a Crutch." Trips right off the tongue.

Edit: I had a friend from toastmasters when I was down in Cork in his eighties, who I'd often ring the day of a meeting to remind him of it. He knew of my atheism, and was ok with it. But every time we'd finish talking on the phone he'd say "god bless" (out of habit) and then immediately apologise to me for using religious language. Never once offended me, and after a while we both treated it as a bit of a joke.

@Obliq, "well wear" does for anything from an new t-shirt all the way up to a new baby.

Hotblack Desiato

SpaceTime wrote: »

That and people using religious phrases as swear words, or alternatives like "jaysus"

Hey as an ex-catholic and proud Dub I'm allowed to say 'jaysus', it's almost compulsory

When I was a kid, it took me a while to realise what my grandad (b.1900) was trying not to say, when he said 'jakers', 'bejakers', 'jaypers' and other variations on the theme...

Sarky

If Jesus Christ didn't want us to take his name in vain, he wouldn't have made it such a guttural, harsh, rude-sounding affair.

Nobody would shout "Henry Christ!" after stubbing their toe on a doorframe, is all I'm saying.