Welfare Fraud Roadblock Ahead!

JRant

Jester252 wrote: »

Just because they're the tapes and other forms of corruption doesn't mean the SIU should not try and stop welfare fruad. If welfare fruad is the only thing tackled that just showes that the SIU are doing their jobs

By their statistics it is fairly obvious that this type of scaremongering is uncalled for.

suicide_circus

I guess you're right, it is a bit of a clumsy blunt instrument to finding welfare cheats. a national ID card, thats the ticket!

Celly Smunt

suicide_circus wrote: »

a national ID card, thats the ticket!

you mean like a passport?

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Jester252

steddyeddy wrote: »

Never said that it shouldn't be tackled. I'm saying it's the only thing tackled. If they are only tackling a sw fraud, a relatively small issue then they are not doing their jobs. As an citizen it is an insult that the public should be unlawfully stopped for this reason while corruption goes unpunished.

SIU is only to do will welfare fraud. Its not unlawful as its the garda that stop the cars. Any information they get from you is your fault. They can ask the question and you have the right not to answer them.

Fred Swanson

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dxhound2005

steddyeddy wrote: »

Never said that it shouldn't be tackled. I'm saying it's the only thing tackled. If they are only tackling a sw fraud, a relatively small issue then they are not doing their jobs. As an citizen it is an insult that the public should be unlawfully stopped for this reason while corruption goes unpunished.

Why are you saying it's the only thing being tackled? Are you not familiar with the quarterly list of tax defaulters published by the Revenue, which has been going since 1997? Part 2 has the big offenders.

Corruption is a separate issue from tax evasion and welfare fraud. Bring your evidence of corruption to the Gardai. And who was unlawfully stopped?

http://www.revenue.ie/en/press/defaulters/

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/arcade-king-quirke-on-list-of-tax-defaulters-29337892.html

According to Revenue, settlements were only published when the extensive voluntary disclosure options were not availed of and where the default was as a result of "careless or deliberate behaviour".

Topping the latest list of settlements was supermarket proprietor Ji Rong Zheng with an address at Parnell Street, Dublin, who made a settlement of €1,592,400 for underdeclaration of VAT and income tax. The payment included more than €580,000 in penalties.

Ivan Diver, listed as a retired employee, of Coolcholly, Ballyshannon, Co Donegal, settled for €1,511,257 for underdeclared income tax and capital- gains tax following a Revenue offshore-assets investigation and single premium insurance products investigation case.

Banjo String

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Why are you saying it's the only thing being tackled? Are you not familiar with the quarterly list of tax defaulters published by the Revenue, which has been going since 1997? Part 2 has the big offenders.

Corruption is a separate issue from tax evasion and welfare fraud. Bring your evidence of corruption to the Gardai. And who was unlawfully stopped?

http://www.revenue.ie/en/press/defaulters/

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/arcade-king-quirke-on-list-of-tax-defaulters-29337892.html

According to Revenue, settlements were only published when the extensive voluntary disclosure options were not availed of and where the default was as a result of "careless or deliberate behaviour".

Topping the latest list of settlements was supermarket proprietor Ji Rong Zheng with an address at Parnell Street, Dublin, who made a settlement of €1,592,400 for underdeclaration of VAT and income tax. The payment included more than €580,000 in penalties.

Ivan Diver, listed as a retired employee, of Coolcholly, Ballyshannon, Co Donegal, settled for €1,511,257 for underdeclared income tax and capital- gains tax following a Revenue offshore-assets investigation and single premium insurance products investigation case.

What's your opinion on civil servants questioning civilians at the roadi side, while having no authority to do so?

MadsL

Grand Moff Tarkin wrote: »

You just said it yourself that you spent some time in Mountjoy so it is obvious that you would be against any and all methods of law enforcement and ways and means to catch people who abuse the system.

Pretty big assumption there. I have been inside prisons in the UK and Ireland - I have never been arrested.

SamHall wrote: »

No I'm all for welfare fraud being stamped out.

I'm questioning the way in which gardai are being used to do it.

Nobody seems to fancy taking a stab at answering the question.

Are you legally obliged to provide pps numbers/ employment details to anyone at the side of the road?

If no offence has been committed by a driver/passenger they should not be hindered from going about their business.

Once again.

Are we legally obliged to answer any such questions where no offence has taken place?

No. You are not even obliged to give name and address unless stopped in a vehicle.

Jester252 wrote: »

Did you read the article?

The roadblock was not set up by the guards but by the SIU.

Assisted and initiated (the Gardai stop people first ) by Gardai.

SamHall wrote: »

I was stopped in Dublin a few weeks ago.
Stopped by the gards at a Check point in my non sign written/non marked work vehicle.

I was asked for my license, which I happily provided the gard with. He then checked me for tax/insurance etc.

Then some lady approached me, whom the gard handed my licence to, and she asked my pps details/employment status etc.

I'm unsure of the legality of the whole thing. I'm not against welfare fraud being combated, just for clarity.

Handing your licence to an official is a clear breach of your rights of privacy under the constitution, and a breach of Data Protection Legislation as it was without your consent.

suicide_circus wrote: »

i'm in favour of catching welfare cheats

No-one here has said they were not in favour.

KwackerJack wrote: »

Its quiet simple really.....only Irish Citizens should get social welfare!

If your not a citizen you should work at least 3/5 years before being able to claim a cent and even the be limited to 6 months.

The spouse of an Irish Citizen gets a rough ride in your world huh?

Also when do propose leaving the EU?

ted1

MadsL wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/chasing-the-cheats-my-day-with-the-welfare-fraud-police-29211815.html

Sorry for the old story, but I just became aware of these roadblocks from the other thread on 'gotcha' speeding fines.

Whilst I fully appreciate efforts to clamp down on Welfare Fraud, could someone clarify why on earth you would co-operate with roadside interrogation by a Government official. Surely stopping someone, pulling them out of the car seperately and then interrogating them cannot be constitutional?

Too far? I thinks so...what do you think AH?

Proper order

Fred Swanson

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ted1

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

No, if you have nothing to hide answer the questions if you a scumbag who is freeloading off the state I hope they find you, cut you off, lock you up and throw away the keys.

TireeTerror

ted1 wrote: »

No, if you have nothing to hide answer the questions if you a scumbag who is freeloading off the state I hope they find you, cut you off, lock you up and throw away the keys.

and the bill for their stay in the prison will be funded by you.....at an even greater cost! AGGGGGGHHHHHHH!

ted1

TireeTerror wrote: »

and the bill for their stay in the prison will be funded by you.....at an even greater cost! AGGGGGGHHHHHHH!

I have no problem paying for their detention. It's much better than paying for them ripping us tax payers off

Turtwig

I would love to know the cost breakdown of these measures. Is it actually cost effective setting up these road blocks to catch potential fraud? What % of SW people are anticipated of being fraudsters and how much resources are needed to be spent to weed out this %?

MadsL

Grand Moff Tarkin wrote: »

Only people with something to hide need fear this.

Forest Demon wrote: »

if you have nothing to hide there will be no problem will there ?

KwackerJack wrote: »

s for being stopped I've nothing to hide so ask away!

ted1 wrote: »

No, if you have nothing to hide answer the questions if you a scumbag who is freeloading off the state I hope they find you, cut you off, lock you up and throw away the keys.

For those with "nothing to hide".

Answers please.

What is your real name, address and PPS number
Who is your employer?
How much do you earn?
How much have you in the bank?
Do you gamble? What is the most you ever lost?
Have you cheated on your partner?
Can we tell them if yes?
Do you fantasise about your mother?
Have you ever stolen anything - may we tell your employer that?

Finally, what is your credit card number for verification purposes?


Be honest, you have nothing to hide right...:D

ted1

MadsL wrote: »

For those with "nothing to hide".

Answers please.

What is your real name, address and PPS number
Who is your employer?
How much do you earn?
How much have you in the bank?
Do you gamble? What is the most you ever lost?
Have you cheated on your partner?
Can we tell them if yes?
Do you fantasise about your mother?
Have you ever stolen anything - may we tell your employer that?

Finally, what is your credit card number for verification purposes?


Be honest, you have nothing to hide right...:D

Here's one for you, are you cllaing welfare while earning an undeclared income?

jjbrien

ted1 wrote: »

I have no problem paying for their detention. It's much better than paying for them ripping us tax payers off

You know the cost of putting them in prison per year is €65,404 If your willing to pay that yourself fair play to you I for one dont that nor should any other tax payer

http://www.iprt.ie/prison-facts-2

ted1

If one person goes to jail there will be 10 who may play by the rules and we save money or after 1 year in prison the scumbag will not make a fraudulent claim and the pay back period of the 65k could be as little as 3 years.

MadsL

ted1 wrote: »

Here's one for you, are you cllaing welfare while earning an undeclared income?

Dodging my questions Tony? Suspicious. I'm putting you on my list of suspicious people...

MadsL

ted1 wrote: »

Here's one for you, are you cllaing welfare while earning an undeclared income?

Are you?

Scan up your payslip there - we all want a look to make sure.

Oh, do you have something to hide?

ted1

MadsL wrote: »

Are you?

Scan up your payslip there - we all want a look to make sure.

Oh, do you have something to hide?

No, claiming no welfare or benefits what so ever. By your actions I Persume your a scumbag.


Who's Tony?

Jester252

MadsL wrote: »

Handing your licence to an official is a clear breach of your rights of privacy under the constitution, and a breach of Data Protection Legislation as it was without your consent.

So that was illegal. Too bad Sam didn't get the name of the garda

computer44

Thats wrong, but I would not know about your individual case. The Gardai in Ireland are probably the most educated in the EU and have a great record.

TireeTerror

computer44 wrote: »

Thats wrong, but I would not know about your individual case. The Gardai in Ireland are probably the most educated in the EU and have a great record.

May I ask you what facts you have to support that claim?

computer44

Welfare fraud goes on. I have seen it. The biggest fraud I have seen is a guy that claims disability and makes it to the off licence every morning and he watches Sky sports every night.

Gatling

computer44 wrote: »

Welfare fraud goes on. I have seen it. The biggest fraud I have seen is a guy that claims disability and makes it to the off licence every morning and he watches Sky sports every night.

Where's the fraud exactly

Fred Swanson

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MadsL

ted1 wrote: »

No, claiming no welfare or benefits what so ever.

You kinda missed the point I was making.

By your actions I Persume your a scumbag.

Steady on.

Who's Tony?

As your username is Ted I thought you might have got the reference

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GRQIm8nnNw

djflawless

MadsL wrote: »

How would that be fair or just?? Papers please!! Is this Ireland or 30's Germany?



I believe they are stopping everyone...



I'm asking how someone can be stopped on the road, when they have committed no traffic offence and then interrogated. Seems a bit much does it not?

But if they pull a young (under 25) male driver with a full licence and full windscreen, driving without fault, in something any bit sporty, they still interrogate them.
If theres justice in that surely theres justice in benefit fraudsters being stopped for the craic??