Your team for the summer tour to North America

its_phil

bilston wrote: »

Haven't seen much of Faloon since he left Ulster but while at Ulster he was a good player but my main gripe with him was that he always seemed to miss a couple of tackles in every game he played.

Yeah he misses a couple alright going by stats but it hasnt been that noticeable to be honest. I'm always surprised when I see he has missed them but the other side is he makes a lot of them too. He is an absolute fiend at the breakdown and a more than suitable replacement for JOC. In his 10 starts this year, going by ESPN, he has made an average of 10.9 tackles a game while missing 1.4.

blackhound

Surely McKeon has to tour as well, been very good for Connacht this season also I imagine Dave Kearney will be involved.

Tox56

bilston wrote: »

Haven't seen much of Faloon since he left Ulster but while at Ulster he was a good player but my main gripe with him was that he always seemed to miss a couple of tackles in every game he played. I'm not sure either that he would cut it at international unfortunately.

The impression I've always got from him is that he just isn't powerful enough. The Edinburgh-Ulster H Cup semi-final was a good example, just got blown away at the ruck and couldn't make any impact even at that level. Good player but not an international from what I've seen

iamjenko

blackhound wrote: »

Surely McKeon has to tour as well, been very good for Connacht this season also I imagine Dave Kearney will be involved.

I read yesterday McKeon is to miss the rest of the season through injury unfortunately! Been very impressed by him this year, big prospect!

Tim Robbins

Hype710 wrote: »

I'm very confident Heaslip will be with the Lions. 2 dedicated 8s will need to be taken. Faletau has one sown up. Ben Morgan has been injured. Tom Wood was a blindside covering 8. Johnnie Beattie plays in France which is a mark against his name and didn't have a better 6N than Heaslip. Not only that, Heaslip has 3 test starts from four years ago, has leadership experience and has been in very good form this past month or so.

SOB can play 8. And would be a better 8 than anyone else and it frees up someone else to play 6 and 7.

.ak

Tim Robbins wrote: »

SOB can play 8. And would be a better 8 than anyone else and it frees up someone else to play 6 and 7.

SOB can play at 8, but has never played a test game there, there's absolutely no way he'd play there for the Lions unless an injury crisis happened. He's a dynamic 8, and did a job there for Leinster, but he lacks the finer points of an 8's game, namely ball control at the base and cleaning up scrap ball.

biscuits22

i thought sob played 8 against italy in the 2011 6n......i think he was motm in that game as well

Buer

.ak wrote: »

SOB can play at 8, but has never played a test game there, there's absolutely no way he'd play there for the Lions unless an injury crisis happened.

Italy in the 2011 6N. I would agree on your overall points but players do play out of position on a Lions tour due to necessity. Wallace played 8. BOD played 15. Bowe played 13. Fitzgerald played 12.

Whilst I don't think they'll go as anything but flankers if selected, I wouldn't be surprised to see the likes of SOB or Brown line out at 8 at some point. If they take two players as specialists at No. 8, it will only take one injury to conceivably have someone else start at No. 8 due to rotation.

Hype710

Wallace played 8 pretty badly, in fact. Andy Powell was a laughing stock (in more ways than one) so the Lions were pretty fortunate to have Heaslip. I'm all up for giving SOB a go in one of the warm up games, but you need two specialist 8s if it doesn't work out (as it didn't with Wallace).

D87

Is Downey in with a shout for an international spot?

Buer

D87 wrote: »

Is Downey in with a shout for an international spot?

Only if it's due to absolute lack of options. The guy simply isn't near international standard nor, given he is 32, will he ever be. If he is capped, it will be purely due to no other options but I'd much rather see McSharry, Hanrahan, Olding or McFadden in the spot.

My first choice would be McSharry as he's a similar type of player but 10 years younger. Olding will be with the U20 side this summer. McFadden could have a run there just to settle in as a cover option in future. Hanrahan would be a bold choice but he's probably going to go on the development tour.

We've two games this summer. I'd be very disappointed if anyone over the age of 30 is handed their first cap on it. It should be a chance for others to develop with one or two older heads such as DOC and Chris Henry brought along to guide things.

thomond2006

Tommy O'Donnell should definitely tour, been in great form for Munster.

CIARAN_BOYLE

D87 wrote: »

Is Downey in with a shout for an international spot?

I'd have Marshall (probably out for the rest of the season with his concussions) Darcy McFadden or McSharry ahead of him on a quality level. I'd probably cap Hanrahan or Olding ahead of his just based on potential.

the baby bull elephant

What do people think of our winger playing in England's chances? Morris and Monahan.

Hype710

Would definitely have Morris in the Emerging Ireland squad. Not sure about Monahan tbh.

Podge_irl

Morris has a decent enough chance. The best chance these players will get is on year end tours as they don't have to be returned to their clubs.

Beery Eyed

Has there been any indication about when the squad will be announced for this tour?

I noticed England & Scotland have announced squads for their summer tours so hopefully ours won't be far away. I'm excited to see who will make the list anyway. It should be a very interesting tour in terms of the next group of internationals coming through. It may seem odd, but I'm personally looking forward to watching these games as much, if not more than the Lions games this summer, given the level of talent that seems to be coming through with Madigan, Jackson, Henderson, Hanrahan, etc.

RoundBox11

Anyone know from previous years whether we'll see many players (e.g. Ross and Ryan) who've played a lot of games this season being rested. We definitely dont need them for North America, more a case of are we even allowed to rest them?

Presuming guys like Luke Marshall, Deccie Fitz and Stephen Ferris are out, my team for the North America tour would be along the lines of:

15. Zebo
14. Trimble
13. Cave
12. McFadden
11. Gilroy
10. Madigan
9. Marshall

8. POM
7. Henry
6. Henderson
5. McCarthy/Tuohy
4. Ryan/Toner
3. Hagan
2. Strauss
1. Kilcoyne

Beery Eyed

Well England are resting Robshaw, Flood, Care, Ashton, Barritt & probably a few others for their tour, in the interest of bringing younger players & giving them a chance.

Wales have done this to an extent as well with Ryan Jones & James Hook not being brought into the extended squad, plus they have 15 players on the Lions squad.

It's an individual call on each position, so there's no hard & fast rule. I'd bring a couple of guys with strong international experience anyway, so that they can lead the group & keep the mentality right. Other than that, where it's a fairly 50/50 call I'd rest the experienced player if he's not essential & give the younger player a chance instead

Ruck Inspector

1. Kilcoyne
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Toner
5. Henderson
6. POM
7. Henry
8. Murphy
9. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. McFadden
13. Cave
14. Trimble
15. Jones
16. Cronin
17. Court
18. Loughney
19. Touhy
20. TOD
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. Gilroy

CatFromHue

I don't think we have the luxury of resting senior players as we've two tours to fill at the same time.

Ruck Inspector

CatFromHue wrote: »

I don't think we have the luxury of resting senior players as we've two tours to fill at the same time.

Could be done in my opinion. Just have to get creative.

[Jackass]

Summer Tour:

1. Black
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Ryan
5. Toner
6. Ruddock
7. Henry
8. O'Mahony

9. P. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. L. Marshall
13. O'Malley
14. Bowe
15. D. Kearney

16. Cronin 17. Kilcoyne 18. Archer 19. Henderson 20. O'Donnell 21. Cooney 22. Keatley 23. Jones

Left some of the old guard at home, as tour should be to further develop fringe international players and give opportunities to those who should have got some already but for Deccies tunnel vision.

Emerging Ireland:

1. Jack McGrath
2. Mike Sherry
3. Martin Moore
4. Ian Nagle
5. Ben Marshall
6. Dave O'Callaghan
7. Dominic Ryan
8. Jordi Murphy

9. Luke McGrath
10. JJ Hanrahan
11. Luke O'Dea
12. Stuart Olding
13. Dave McSharry
14. Tiernan O'Halloran
15. Robbie Henshaw

16. Jason Harris-Wright 17. AN Other 18. Tadgh Furlong 19. Dave Foley 20. Conor Gilsenan 21. Paul O'Donohue 22. Noel Reid 23. Adam Byrne

Really running out of ideas for that bench, not familiar with other provinces youth as much as Leinster, hence mostly blue bench.

Also, may have forgotten one or two for either side...

Beery Eyed

I wouldn't necessarily call it a luxury. The senior tour is the only priority, and even at that it is undoubtedly a development tour so it shouldn't be viewed with a win at all costs mentality. I watched a second string Italy side beat Canada last year, so we shouldn't be making selections out of fear of failure.

If there is a position where the younger backup is not of sufficient quality yet, then by all means bring a senior player for that position. However, I really don't think there's too many situations where that would be the case.

Bringing the likes of O'Callaghan, D'Arcy, or even Ross wouldn't be ideal in my opinion, since there are other options who would benefit much more from the opportunity.

The Tiblisi cup & the Emerging Ireland team looks like a setup aimed at bringing younger players into the international fold, so again I wouldn't be too worried if we sacrificed results in the pursuit of developing players who have the potential to develop into international options.

Beery Eyed

[Jackass] wrote: »

Summer Tour:

1. Black
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Ryan
5. Toner
6. Ruddock
7. Henry
8. O'Mahony

9. P. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. L. Marshall
13. O'Malley
14. Bowe
15. D. Kearney

16. Cronin 17. Kilcoyne 18. Archer 19. Henderson 20. O'Donnell 21. Cooney 22. Keatley 23. Jones

Left some of the old guard at home, as tour should be to further develop fringe international players and give opportunities to those who should have got some already but for Deccies tunnel vision.

Emerging Ireland:

1. Jack McGrath
2. Mike Sherry
3. Martin Moore
4. Ian Nagle
5. Ben Marshall
6. Dave O'Callaghan
7. Dominic Ryan
8. Jordi Murphy

9. Luke McGrath
10. JJ Hanrahan
11. Luke O'Dea
12. Stuart Olding
13. Dave McSharry
14. Tiernan O'Halloran
15. Robbie Henshaw

16. Jason Harris-Wright 17. AN Other 18. Tadgh Furlong 19. Dave Foley 20. Conor Gilsenan 21. Paul O'Donohue 22. Noel Reid 23. Adam Byrne

Really running out of ideas for that bench, not familiar with other provinces youth as much as Leinster, hence mostly blue bench.

Also, may have forgotten one or two for either side...

There are plenty of options when you start going down through the provinces and indeed some of the exiles currently playing abroad.

However, there are a few that you've named in those squads who have already been made unavailable or are currently injured & unlikely to go. L. Marshall is rested due to concussion & Bowe is on Lions duty. The likes of Gilroy, McFadden & Jackson should be available though. Also, Olding, Henshaw & A. Byrne are all eligible for U20's & may travel to the world cup, depending on priorities.

Still, I'm only nitpicking really because the point you're making is valid. There's plenty of options to fill the two squads, particularly for the Emerging Ireland squad, when you start going down through the eligible players that are around.

Ruck Inspector

Summer Tour:

1. Kilcoyne
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Toner
5. Henderson
6. POM
7. Henry
8. Murphy
9. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. McFadden
13. Cave
14. Trimble
15. Jones
16. Cronin
17. Court
18. Loughney
19. Touhy
20. TOD
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. Gilroy

Emerging Ireland
1. McGrath
2. Sherry
3. Lutton
4. Nagle
5. Kearney
6. DOC
7. Ryan
8. McKeon
9. Heaney
10. Keatley
11. Conway
12. Olding(although I'd rather he went with the 20s over this side)
13. Griffen
14. TOH
15. Henshaw(although I'd rather he went with the 20s over this side)
16. JHW
17. Cronin
18. Moore
19. Marshall
20. Browne
21. Sheridan
22. Hanrahan
23. O'Dea

lurtz

[Jackass] wrote: »

Summer Tour:

1. Black
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Ryan
5. Toner
6. Ruddock
7. Henry
8. O'Mahony

9. P. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. L. Marshall
13. O'Malley
14. Bowe
15. D. Kearney

16. Cronin 17. Kilcoyne 18. Archer 19. Henderson 20. O'Donnell 21. Cooney 22. Keatley 23. Jones

Left some of the old guard at home, as tour should be to further develop fringe international players and give opportunities to those who should have got some already but for Deccies tunnel vision.

Emerging Ireland:

1. Jack McGrath
2. Mike Sherry
3. Martin Moore
4. Ian Nagle
5. Ben Marshall
6. Dave O'Callaghan
7. Dominic Ryan
8. Jordi Murphy

9. Luke McGrath
10. JJ Hanrahan
11. Luke O'Dea
12. Stuart Olding
13. Dave McSharry
14. Tiernan O'Halloran
15. Robbie Henshaw

16. Jason Harris-Wright 17. AN Other 18. Tadgh Furlong 19. Dave Foley 20. Conor Gilsenan 21. Paul O'Donohue 22. Noel Reid 23. Adam Byrne

Really running out of ideas for that bench, not familiar with other provinces youth as much as Leinster, hence mostly blue bench.

Also, may have forgotten one or two for either side...

well your right winger will probably be wearing a red jersey this summer so that might rule him out.

I like the look of that emerging team though!
But Luke Mcgrath and stuart olding,and probably adam byrne and maybe henshaw will be in the 20s JWC.
James Mckinney and eamonn sheridan are going to be involved with some team according to the rotherham website.

I wonder would we see some top AIL players like Ronaldson,Gerry Hurley,Rick Byrne or Danny Kenny involved with the emerging team?

bilston

[Jackass] wrote: »

Summer Tour:

1. Black
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Ryan
5. Toner
6. Ruddock
7. Henry
8. O'Mahony

9. P. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. L. Marshall
13. O'Malley
14. Bowe
15. D. Kearney

16. Cronin 17. Kilcoyne 18. Archer 19. Henderson 20. O'Donnell 21. Cooney 22. Keatley 23. Jones

Left some of the old guard at home, as tour should be to further develop fringe international players and give opportunities to those who should have got some already but for Deccies tunnel vision.

Emerging Ireland:

1. Jack McGrath
2. Mike Sherry
3. Martin Moore
4. Ian Nagle
5. Ben Marshall
6. Dave O'Callaghan
7. Dominic Ryan
8. Jordi Murphy

9. Luke McGrath
10. JJ Hanrahan
11. Luke O'Dea
12. Stuart Olding
13. Dave McSharry
14. Tiernan O'Halloran
15. Robbie Henshaw

16. Jason Harris-Wright 17. AN Other 18. Tadgh Furlong 19. Dave Foley 20. Conor Gilsenan 21. Paul O'Donohue 22. Noel Reid 23. Adam Byrne

Really running out of ideas for that bench, not familiar with other provinces youth as much as Leinster, hence mostly blue bench.

Also, may have forgotten one or two for either side...

You really really really don't rate Jackson do you?!

Bridge93

Ruck Inspector wrote: »

Summer Tour:

1. Kilcoyne
2. Strauss
3. Hagan
4. Toner
5. Henderson
6. POM
7. Henry
8. Murphy
9. Marshall
10. Madigan
11. Zebo
12. McFadden
13. Cave
14. Trimble
15. Jones
16. Cronin
17. Court
18. Loughney
19. Touhy
20. TOD
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. Gilroy

Emerging Ireland
1. McGrath
2. Sherry
3. Lutton
4. Nagle
5. Kearney
6. DOC
7. Ryan
8. McKeon
9. Heaney
10. Keatley
11. Conway
12. Olding(although I'd rather he went with the 20s over this side)
13. Griffen
14. TOH
15. Henshaw(although I'd rather he went with the 20s over this side)
16. JHW
17. Cronin
18. Moore
19. Marshall
20. Browne
21. Sheridan
22. Hanrahan
23. O'Dea

If as he should Olding goes to the JWC maybe they should bring someone like O Malley/Macken/Barnes?