Terminally ill 16-year-old takes his anti-suicide campaign to RTE

Lyra Fangs

pone2012 wrote: »

At what point was anyone told by him to "get over it". Unless my ears are broken i never heard him say that? Perhaps thats the way you took him up, but i never heard those words. What I heard was him saying people need to realize that suicide is never a solution. There is help there for everyone.

Where anyone can find a problem with that is beyond me!

He said in the article that before a person decides to commit suicide they should sleep on it, as if that will suddenly solve all the problems they've more than likely been dealing with for a long time.

In saying that I understand where you are coming from. His message is one of hope that his story might inspire some of those who have gotten lost in the darkness of depression to keep fighting. I just think the manner by which the message was communicated was poorly conceived and a major oversight by RTE.

Cantonesque

What a man. He brought a tear to my eye and I would be very proud if I was his father. One can not judge unless they are experiencing the impending doom. Give it a rest and admire the overall message that he is trying to convey.

Smidge

VanishingActs wrote: »

This, 100%. I'm not going to go into detail because they're not my stories to tell, but I know two people right now who are suffering from very serious depression and neither of them is getting the help they need. Waiting lists of MONTHS and MONTHS, appointments that aren't even nearby, doctors brushing them off. Getting help is NOT easy in this country. These people and their families have met huge obstacles everywhere they turn. It's appalling and horrifying.

+1

The mental health services here are woefully inadequate.

TBH I cannot fathom RTE's agenda in allowing a vulnerable and emotional young person(who before anyone jumps on me, I totally sympathise with his situation)to come on prime time television and speak about suicide in a fashion that totally mitigates what the sufferer of depression has gone through in order to reach the point(and believe me, a person suffering from depression does NOT reach the point on a whim)of taking their own life.

Does this misguided lad think that because his life has been cut short due to a horrible circumstance of illness, he has a right to shame(and that is what it boils down to, he is not going to "help" someone not commit suicide because he gets on television an says it's selfish) people who are also suffering from an illness?

Very bad judgement on RTE's behalf and offensive to a lot of families out there that have lost a loved one to suicide through depression.

CaraMay

Smidge wrote: »

offensive to a lot of families out there that have lost a loved one to suicide through depression.

Rubbish... I think the majority of those families will think that if his words save one other family from feeling the pain they feel then it will be worth it.

General General

Smidge wrote: »

+1

The mental health services here are woefully inadequate.

TBH I cannot fathom RTE's agenda in allowing a vulnerable and emotional young person(who before anyone jumps on me, I totally sympathise with his situation)to come on prime time television and speak about suicide in a fashion that totally mitigates what the sufferer of depression has gone through in order to reach the point(and believe me, a person suffering from depression does NOT reach the point on a whim)of taking their own life.

Does this misguided lad think that because his life has been cut short due to a horrible circumstance of illness, he has a right to shame(and that is what it boils down to, he is not going to "help" someone not commit suicide because he gets on television an says it's selfish) people who are also suffering from an illness?

Very bad judgement on RTE's behalf and offensive to a lot of families out there that have lost a loved one to suicide through depression.

I'm guessing it's because RTE think this is a fairly low risk way to keep up appearances that RTE is 'relevant', stimulating debate, etc.

I'd like to see the kid that says RTE is wasting bucket loads of money while cancer care & support for depression is grossly underfunded. I won't see him or her on RTE anyway.

jigglypuffstuff

This is absolutely outrageous

A dying child goes on TV with the intention to do some good, to send a positive message and let people who are experiencing suicidal thoughts know that there is light at the end of the tunnel, that there is hope and help there for them. and that suicide is not an option And mature adults pick apart his words, scathe and insult him and blame the media saying that they shouldn't allow it.

Words actually fail me!!!!

Vojera

IzzyWizzy wrote: »

But it isn't. Have you any idea what mental health resources are like? I phoned up asking for a counselling appointment because I was feeling desperate and like I was going to do something stupid (I'd just found out I had a serious physical illness among other things). I waited months and months for an appointment and when I got one, the therapist was next to useless.

Help is NOT really widely available! People still just don't get it. I turned to several people when I felt desperate and they all fobbed me off. Family members and friends. No doubt if I'd topped myself, they'd all have cried at my funeral and said how selfish I was, but when I needed them, not one of them was there for me. I got 'ah but sure your life's not that bad, 'we all have problems, not just you'. I'm sure many people have the same experience.

+1 to this. It's going back about 15 years now but when I went to my gp to talk about my depression (which took me months to work up to), I was told "Your granny is a good religious woman, go and get her to say a few rosaries for you". I realise that's an extreme example, but you can imagine how much that knocked me back. I couldn't talk to anyone else because I was afraid I wouldn't be taken seriously. I mean, if my doctor didn't take me on, I was obviously overreacting, right? I just wasn't working hard enough to get better. A few months after that I was checked into a psychiatric hospital after attempting suicide.

I sincerely hope things have improved since then, but anecdotally it doesn't seem to be the case. Long waiting lists for counselling, doctors handing out medication and thinking that's enough, and the stigma is just as bad.

Insect Overlord

pone2012 wrote: »

Words actually fail me!!!!

If only they would...

General General

I think that anyone who takes a view on this case that somewhat opposes my own should give it a rest, understand that they shouldn't judge others as they don't know what they're talking about as they've no real experience outside their own limited experience of things, whether that experience be academic or personal or whatever.

Just appreciate the essential rightness of the point of view that I have.

Nothing more need be said & everyone knows this, certainly those who know what they are talking about do.

I'd also like to point out that I am utterly outraged by those who take a view that significantly differs from my own & would wonder aloud what they were thinking if I wasn't rendered speechless by their being so obviously wrong.

CaraMay

CaraMay wrote: »

Rubbish... I think the majority of those families will think that if his words save one other family from feeling the pain they feel then it will be worth it.

And what about people he might push over the edge? How would their families feel?

Smidge

CaraMay wrote: »

Rubbish... I think the majority of those families will think that if his words save one other family from feeling the pain they feel then it will be worth it.

I am a family member of someone who lost their battle with suicide.

Do you really think that anyone who has lost their life due to this illness decided that they would just go and feck up everyone in the families lives because they were a bit "blue"????

Do you think that anyone who has suffered greatly with depression or mental health issues thought that the only way they felt they could get release from the torment they were living with on a daily basis for years and years and years was to "buck up" and they simple just took their own lives instead of said "bucking up"?

This young lad is NOT a professional in mental health but I can assure you that a lot of people who did take their own lives due to this illness, DID see professionals and if they couldn't stop them from doing what they did, what chance does this boy have?

As for "rubbish"...............
You clearly do not have a clue about mental health or suicide if you think things are so simple as you state.

I stand by my point the RTE should not have given this lad a national prime time forum for something so misunderstood and deep rooted.
It can only accomplish to further stigmatise an already stigmatised issue.

triseke

pone2012 wrote: »

This is absolutely outrageous

A dying child goes on TV with the intention to do some good, to send a positive message and let people who are experiencing suicidal thoughts know that there is light at the end of the tunnel, that there is hope and help there for them. and that suicide is not an option And mature adults pick apart his words, scathe and insult him and blame the media saying that they shouldn't allow it.

Words actually fail me!!!!

Have you read any of the comments posted by those who experience/d depression or suicidal tendencies?

They have explained how his message is anything but positive to those who actually have mental illness.

Its a positive message for everyone else. It's easy to digest for those without mental health concerns, and whitewashes over the very serious problems of stigma surrounding mental health and the provision of services. It tells those suffering with depression "to get over it". Surely if it were that simple, the person themselves would have figured it out?

I'm not for one second saying that this child is not suffering, nor his family, and my heart goes out to them at this horrific time in their lives.

Steve O

Cantonesque wrote: »

One can not judge unless they are experiencing the impending doom..

The irony.

Smidge

true-or-false wrote: »

And what about people he might push over the edge? How would their families feel?

Valid point.
People who are in the throes of depression already have low self esteem and self worth.
They already feel like a burden on their families and friends.

This programme then says "Buck up and don't be so selfish, shure you'll be grand"

Lunacy

Also, if this lad had come on and soley spoken about his battle with a terminal illness, how he has dealt with it at such a young age etc etc, I would have applauded him for his courage and bravery in the face of a heart wrenching fate.

But he did not.

And more is the pity

Lyra Fangs

pone2012 wrote: »

This is absolutely outrageous

A dying child goes on TV with the intention to do some good, to send a positive message and let people who are experiencing suicidal thoughts know that there is light at the end of the tunnel, that there is hope and help there for them. and that suicide is not an option And mature adults pick apart his words, scathe and insult him and blame the media saying that they shouldn't allow it.

Words actually fail me!!!!

You are grossly over-simplifying the many valid points that have been made on this thread. No one here has insulted him, in fact many people who may not agree with his beliefs about suicide commend his efforts and recognized the good intentions behind his actions.

jigglypuffstuff

triseke wrote: »

Have you read any of the comments posted by those who experience/d depression or suicidal tendencies?

TIts a positive message for everyone else. It's easy to digest for those without mental health concerns, and whitewashes over the very serious problems of stigma surrounding mental health and the provision of services. It tells those suffering with depression "to get over it". Surely if it were that simple, the person themselves would have figured it out?

I'm not for one second saying that this child is not suffering, nor his family, and my heart goes out to them at this horrific time in their lives.

In what universe did he say that??? he never said that!! funny how that lads words are being twisted on here!! amazing!

Everyone here is so sure he's doing a bad thing and they understand mental health, like it or not personal experience does not equate to understanding!! A personal experience will usually create a bias opinion

jigglypuffstuff

Lyra Fangs wrote: »

No one here has insulted him,

I suggest you go look back over the thread and you'll see that you are mistaken

triseke

pone2012 wrote: »

In what universe did he say that??? he never said that!! funny how that lads words are being twisted on here!! amazing!

Everyone here is so sure he's doing a bad thing and they understand mental health, like it or not personal experience does not equate to understanding!! A personal experience will usually create a bias opinion

I'm sure this has been answered numerous times but I'l give it a shot.

This child went on National TV to speak about suicide. He stated, in the article linked in the first comment, and so succinctly analysed several posts ago (http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=84016384&postcount=207), that those who commit suicide do so because they have a choice in the matter. This is not the case. Not by any stretch of the imagination.

Awareness of mental health is good, blaming those who have it by making them feel EVEN MORE guilty than they already do is not only bad, but downright dangerous.

CaraMay

He never said to get over it and don't patronize others smidge by insinuating you
Are the only person experienced in suicide.

Lyra Fangs

pone2012 wrote: »

In what universe did he say that??? he never said that!! funny how that lads words are being twisted on here!! amazing!

Everyone here is so sure he's doing a bad thing and they understand mental health, like it or not personal experience does not equate to understanding!! A personal experience will usually create a bias opinion

No one is twisting words his attitude towards suicide is clear from both the article and the interview. He actually says in the article that suicidal people should sleep on their decision as if that will somehow cure the depression that underlies such a decision.

And of course experience equates to understanding, a person with depression will have a much better understanding of their depression than those without the illness. Also if you're so against the use of personal experience on which to base ones understanding, I base the opinions I've shared on what I've learnt of depression from studying psychology.

triseke

CaraMay wrote: »

He never said to get over it and don't patronize others smidge by insinuating you
Are the only person experienced in suicide.

CaraMay, if you looked at my last post, you'll see in the post linked within that the young lad suggests that depressed people "sleep on it". If that's not the textbook definition of misunderstanding clinical depression, I don't know what is.

Once again, no one is insulting the lad. Merely that he is 16 years old and does not have the understanding of what clinical depression is, and therefore should not be given a national platform to broadcast what he thinks will help those who have depression.

CaraMay

CaraMay wrote: »

He never said to get over it and don't patronize others smidge by insinuating you
Are the only person experienced in suicide.

You don't need to be the only person experienced in suicide to be able to say that the message is a dangerous one.

No one knows how every person watching will react. Maybe he might even do some good. But it's worth pointing it out if you feel that the message is well meaning but ultimately insensitive. Which I and others here do.

If I had seen it when I had depression, I certainly would have tortured myself over it. I think that's worth stating. I find it inconceivable that there aren't people out there who will be hurt by this message. People in an already delicate state. His position is understandable, but the fact that he's been supported to put it out on national TV and labelled as a brave and strong standpoint is unacceptable.

Smidge

CaraMay wrote: »

He never said to get over it and don't patronize others smidge by insinuating you
Are the only person experienced in suicide.

I am not patronizing anyone, it was you who said my statement was "rubbish" so if anyone was patronizing it was you.

And CLEARLY I am not the only person here who has experienced suicide within the family given the amount of posters on here have their views on tonights programme.

starlings

triseke wrote: »

Awareness of mental health is good, blaming those who have it by making them feel EVEN MORE guilty than they already do is not only bad, but downright dangerous.

awareness of mental health is good, but a thread full of "you don't understand" is just as ridiculous and ineffective as "pull yourself together." Downright dangerous too - I've almost stopped caring.

CaraMay

Smidge wrote: »

And CLEARLY I am not the only person here who has experienced suicide within the family given the amount of posters on here have their views on tonights programme.

Well I have experienced it too and I have a different view so don't assume that all families who have suffered will share your view.

CaraMay

true-or-false wrote: »

You don't need to be the only person experienced in suicide to be able to say that the message is a dangerous one.

No one knows how every person watching will react. Maybe he might even do some good. But it's worth pointing it out if you feel that the message is well meaning but ultimately insensitive. Which I and others here do.

If I had seen it when I had depression, I certainly would have tortured myself over it. I think that's worth stating. I find it inconceivable that there aren't people out there who will be hurt by this message. People in an already delicate state. His position is understandable, but the fact that he's been supported to put it out on national TV and labelled as a brave and strong standpoint is unacceptable.

This is the most balanced post yet

Smidge

CaraMay wrote: »

Well I have experienced it too and I have a different view so don't assume that all families who have suffered will share your view.

I do not assume that all families who have experienced suicide will share my point of view.

But then, I did not go on a national prime time television programme and air MY views, this lad did.

Lyra Fangs

starlings wrote: »

awareness of mental health is good, but a thread full of "you don't understand" is just as ridiculous and ineffective as "pull yourself together." Downright dangerous too - I've almost stopped caring.

I hope you never suffer from depression or work in the field of mental health with that attitude.

jigglypuffstuff

Lyra Fangs wrote: »

And of course experience equates to understanding, a person with depression will have a much better understanding of their depression than those without the illness. Also if you're so against the use of personal experience on which to base ones understanding, I base the opinions I've shared on what I've learnt of depression from studying psychology.

That is in no way true. depression isnt the same for everyone so therefore you cannot say you know how it feels for someone else!! Ive had my stints in the past, do you know how that felt for me? didnt think so!!

triseke wrote: »

CaraMay, if you looked at my last post, you'll see in the post linked within that the young lad suggests that depressed people "sleep on it". If that's not the textbook definition of misunderstanding clinical depression, I don't know what is.

Once again, no one is insulting the lad. Merely that he is 16 years old and does not have the understanding of what clinical depression is.

Have you looked back through the thread? there are clear insults there!

CaraMay

Smidge wrote: »

I do not assume that all families who have experienced suicide will share my point of view.

But then, I did not go on a national prime time television programme and air MY views, this lad did.

You are airing them very publically and more vehemently than he did on a national website.