No such thing as road tax.

stoneill

I'm just posting this as it keeps coming up in the car hates cyclist hates car threads.

There is NO SUCH THING AS ROAD TAX.

Motor tax is for the privilege of owning a motor vehicle.
Road repairs come from central funds which ALL tax payers (including cyclists) fund.

Kxiii

And this is news?

Absolutezero

stoneill wrote: »

I'm just posting this as it keeps coming up in the car hates cyclist hates car threads.

There is NO SUCH THING AS ROAD TAX.

Motor tax is for the privilege of owning a motor vehicle.
Road repairs come from central funds which ALL tax payers (including cyclists) fund.

Ya gotta love central funds.

ThreeLineWhip

Time to lie down.

Scortho

Kxiii wrote: »

And this is news?

Most likely due to the number of treads about people paying road tax.
Especially seen during threads involving a cyclist and cars and you'd generally see something along the lines off: I pay road tax I've more right to be on this road than you do kinda thing.

Cereal Number

stoneill wrote: »

I'm just posting this as it keeps coming up in the car hates cyclist hates car threads.

There is NO SUCH THING AS ROAD TAX.

Motor tax is for the privilege of owning a motor vehicle.
Road repairs come from central funds which ALL tax payers (including cyclists) fund.

Homer Tax??

Pilotdude5

Bears should pay the bear tax. I pay the Homer tax.

jhegarty

stoneill wrote: »

Motor tax is for the privilege of owning a motor vehicle.

No , it's for using it on the road. If you don't use it on the road you don't need to pay the tax.

ThreeLineWhip

Bear tax?

Iwannahurl

jhegarty wrote: »

No , it's for using it on the road. If you don't use it on the road you don't need to pay the tax.

It's for using a motor vehicle.

Spook_ie

One and only contribution to this thread....

Because it comes from a central fund and Road Fund License is paid into the central fund, it does go towards paying for roads, as well as hospitals, schools, bail outs etc.

Motorist paying €1000 income tax + €500 RFL Motor Tax though only payable if you use/keep the vehicle on a road

Cyclist paying €1000 income tax

Net gain to central fund €500


Edit

Not to mention the extra tax paid for the fuel to actually use it! which also goes into the central fund, so cyclists get off our ****ing roads and stick to the footpaths you lawbreaking criminals

2nd edit in relation to someone pedanticly refering RFL as motor tax

Hijpo

jhegarty wrote: »

No , it's for using it on the road. If you don't use it on the road you don't need to pay the tax.

How long before they bring in a peddle tax?

Bad Santa

No, it's not a bloody privilege tax.

It's an easy target environment based tax is what it is.

Which is why large engine sized / greater Co2 emissions cars get taxed more than small ones.

Yet, someone who drives their 2.0l car 10,000 miles per year, while having less of an effect on the environment that someone driving the same spec'd car for for 100,000 miles a year still gets charged the same amount of car tax, as our government sees no distinction between the two.

Motor tax / Car tax / Road Tax / Automo-fcuking-bile, call it what you like - it should be sought at the pumps, no where else.

nelly17

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It's for using a motor vehicle.

No its for generating Revenue

De Hipster

Psycholysts should use psycholypaths.

Iwannahurl

Spook_ie wrote: »

Motorist paying €1000 income tax + €500 RFL

Cyclist paying €1000 income tax

Net gain to central fund €500

Motorists creating more wear and tear on roads: €?
Motorists producing more CO2 and particulate emissions: €?
Motorists causing more road fatalities and injuries: €?
Motorists creating larger burden on health services: €?
Proliferation of expensive infrastructure promoting car dependence and leading to adverse population health outcomes: €?

ThreeLineWhip

De Hipster wrote: »

Psycholysts should use psycholypaths.

The irony of that statement is delicious.

Iwannahurl

Hijpo wrote: »

How long before they bring in a peddle tax?

Or a spelling tacks?

Iwannahurl

nelly17 wrote: »

No its for generating Revenue

From people using motor vehicles.

ejmaztec

Spook_ie wrote: »

One and only contribution to this thread....

Because it comes from a central fund and Road Fund License is paid into the central fund, it does go towards paying for roads, as well as hospitals, schools, bail outs etc.

Motorist paying €1000 income tax + €500 RFL

Cyclist paying €1000 income tax

Net gain to central fund €500


Edit

Not to mention the extra tax paid for the fuel to actually use it! which also goes into the central fund, so cyclists get off our ****ing roads and stick to the footpaths you lawbreaking criminals

Motor Tax.

Hijpo

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Or a spelling tacks?

Oh no iwanttohurl is a spelling nazi

ThreeLineWhip

AH regulars may not be aware of IWH's agenda.

Iwannahurl

AGENDA:

1. -
2. -
3. -
4. -
5. AOB

smash

stoneill wrote: »

There is NO SUCH THING AS ROAD TAX.

There used to be. That's why people still get confused.

Please Kill Me

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Motorists creating more wear and tear on roads: €? Who cares? The roads are there for the motorist! :rolleyes:
Motorists producing more CO2 and particulate emissions: €? And??
Motorists causing more road fatalities and injuries: €? Can't deny this really.
Motorists creating larger burden on health services: €? I would have thought that would be smokers/the elderly??
Proliferation of expensive infrastructure promoting car dependence and leading to adverse population health outcomes: €? If there was a better public transport infrastructure, people wouldn't NEED to use their cars more.

As above. The reality is (for me anyway) when cyclists pay costs/taxes the same as other road users, I'll have more respect for the mobile roadblocks.

Hijpo

Please Kill Me wrote: »

As above. The reality is (for me anyway) when cyclists pay costs/taxes the same as other road users, I'll have more respect for the mobile roadblocks.

perhaps a 30% levy applied to cycling accessories would do the job.

Iwannahurl

Please Kill Me wrote: »

The roads are there for the motorist! The reality is (for me anyway) when cyclists pay costs/taxes the same as other road users, I'll have more respect for the mobile roadblocks.

Great, more quotable quotes to add to my collection.

Keep 'em coming!

Iwannahurl

Hijpo wrote: »

perhaps a 30% levy applied to cycling accessories would do the job.

There's already a 21%, er, "safety tax".

http://debates.oireachtas.ie/dail/2011/10/25/00079.asp

Not enough?

dearg lady

pedestrians shouldn't be allowed cross the roads, they should be trapped on a block forever unless they buy a car

corktina

Hijpo wrote: »

Oh no iwanttohurl is a spelling nazi

spelling Nazi surely...

Cienciano

Great thread OP, this is going to eliminate all hatred towards cyclists from motorists

Phill Ewinn

Can we introduce an A55HOLE tax? Most cyclists own cars. It's only a minority of drivers who treat cyclists with contempt

Guy:Incognito

smash wrote: »

There used to be. That's why people still get confused.

It's not. Its because the UK have road tax and people just assume thats what it is here.

It's perpetuated by the likes of manufacturers calling it road tax.

Spook_ie wrote: »

2nd edit in relation to someone pedanticly refering RFL as motor tax

It's not pedantry. Using road fund licence is as wrong as using Road tax. Road fund licence is what the Uk has. Motor tax doesnt have any other names.

Iwannahurl

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

It's not. Its because the UK have road tax and people just assume thats what it is here.

The UK has not had a "road tax" for 75 years.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/bike-blog/2011/nov/22/cycling-road-tax-confused

Spook_ie

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

It's not. Its because the UK have road tax and people just assume thats what it is here.

It's perpetuated by the likes of manufacturers calling it road tax.



It's not pedantry. Using road fund licence is as wrong as using Road tax. Road fund licence is what the Uk has. Motor tax doesnt have any other names.

I was going to try and avoid this thread but whatever...

It's a motor tax that is only applicable if the vehicle is used on a road therefore that's why people often refer to it as a road tax. If the motor tax was to be paid/due regardless of if the vehicle is used on a road or not then the name motor tax would be accurate, however, as it stands it's a tax that is misnamed.

Now the question becomes, why is the name motor tax used instead of the correct name of road tax?

Hijpo

Iwannahurl wrote: »

There's already a 21%, er, "safety tax".

http://debates.oireachtas.ie/dail/2011/10/25/00079.asp

Not enough?

Nope

corktina wrote: »

spelling Nazi surely...

Sorry, natsee????

Iwannahurl

Spook_ie wrote: »

I was going to try and avoid this thread but whatever...

It's a motor tax that is only applicable if the vehicle is used on a road therefore that's why people often refer to it as a road tax. If the motor tax was to be paid/due regardless of if the vehicle is used on a road or not then the name motor tax would be accurate, however, as it stands it's a tax that is misnamed.

Now the question becomes, why is the name motor tax used instead of the correct name of road tax?

It's a tax on the use of motorised vehicles, which is why it's called Motor Tax.

No confusion there. The government policy is clear.

I pay Motor Tax on my car, even though it sits in the driveway >95% of the time. I don't get any rebate, btw.

El Horseboxo

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It's a tax on the use of motorised vehicles, which is why it's called Motor Tax.

No confusion there. The government policy is clear.

I pay Motor Tax on my car, even though it sits in the driveway >95% of the time. I don't get any rebate, btw.

But for the approx 5% you have it on the road you need tax. I still have a car I have not sold back in Ireland. It's in storage. It has no tax disc the past few years because it has been off the road 100%. I can go back and get into the car. Start it up and operate any of it's functions without moving it out onto public roads and have no need to pay tax. So how can I use a motorized vehicle in one circumstance and not require tax but I need it in another situation. The other situation requiring it's operation on public roads. I never thought of It like that before but I'd agree that it is a wrongly named tax.

Spook_ie

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It's a tax on the use of motorised vehicles, which is why it's called Motor Tax.

No confusion there. The government policy is clear.

I pay Motor Tax on my car, even though it sits in the driveway >95% of the time. I don't get any rebate, btw.

Correct you get no rebate if it's used on the road, therefore it's a tax for the use of the road, NOT a tax for owning a motor.

The tax for owning a motor would probably be the VAT, seeing (in theory) you could have a vehicle that was unregistered and therefore not have paid VRT

seamus

smash wrote: »

There used to be. That's why people still get confused.

There used to be...in the 1930s, in the UK.

There has never been road tax in Ireland.

Spook_ie

seamus wrote: »

There used to be...in the 1930s, in the UK.

There has never been road tax in Ireland.

Just because it's not ring fenced for use on updating/maintaining the road networks doesn't preclude it from being a road tax, if a vehicle isn't used on the road network it isn't liable for Motor tax so defacto it is indeed a road tax

gibraltar

Hijpo wrote: »

perhaps a 30% levy applied to cycling accessories would do the job.

Good idea, tax cycling and discourage it, fill the roads with even more cars because we dont spend enough time stuck in traffic as it is.

McTigs

For those who think cyclists should pay a "road Tax", how would you compute it?

The motor tax on my 1.4 ltr petrol car is €381 per annum, what should my bike be taxed at and why?

ThreeLineWhip

Iwannahurl wrote: »

AGENDA:

1. -
2. -
3. -
4. -
5. AOB

We all know your real intent. How is Gay Byrne?

seamus

Spook_ie wrote: »

if a vehicle isn't used on the road network it isn't liable for Motor tax

Incorrect. Any vehicle used in a public place is required to display a valid motor tax. A public place is any place which a member of the public has access to by way of right or permission. "Public place" includes a lot of places which are not part of the road network, but motor tax is required anyway.

Spook_ie

gibraltar wrote: »

Good idea, tax cycling and discourage it, fill the roads with even more cars because we dont spend enough time stuck in traffic as it is.

Actually a very good idea, proceeds if ring fenced, could then be used to bring in a scheme similar to the UK's and USA's Bikeability training ( replaced the old cycling proficiency test )

Guy:Incognito

Spook_ie wrote: »

Now the question becomes, why is the name motor tax used instead of the correct name of road tax?

To stop stupid people starting or contributing threads with the line "I pay road tax and the roads are I bits

Hijpo

gibraltar wrote: »

Good idea, tax cycling and discourage it, fill the roads with even more cars because we dont spend enough time stuck in traffic as it is.

Theres a tax on toilet paper, does that discourge anyone from wiping there arse?

If you want to do something/need to do something, you will pay for it. Everyone always has and everyone always will.

Water will soon be charged for, will everyone start drinking from puddles and washing at the beach instead of turning on a tap?

Spook_ie

seamus wrote: »

Incorrect. Any vehicle used in a public place is required to display a valid motor tax. A public place is any place which a member of the public has access to by way of right or permission. "Public place" includes a lot of places which are not part of the road network, but motor tax is required anyway.

Examples please?

Spook_ie

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

To stop stupid people starting or contributing threads with the line "I pay road tax and the roads are I bits

Or likewise cyclists saying there is no such thing as road tax

seamus

Spook_ie wrote: »

Examples please?

A shopping centre car park. A private estate which does not have gates.

To give some non-road examples - if you were to drive along the path in a public park, ignoring whether that's legal, the vehicle would need to be taxed, insured and NCTed.