Grandouet

Huntley

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Might aswell get a thread going on this beast.

Personally I think Grandouet is the 2013 Champion Hurdler. He has an amazing engine on him with a sensational cruising speed. He will always be suited by flat tracks but he strengthened considerably last year and demolished any qualms about his ability to get up the hill when winning the Bula last year.

The ground is a worry tomorrow but I have no doubt he is a better animal than Rock on Ruby and that muppet Zarkandar and will prove that over the course of the season.

Loyalty is key in this game and I'm all in with this machine.

(I think he would win the Arkle backwards aswell for what it's worth but can't see connections going that route after he wins the Champion this year.)

mailburner

Huntley wrote: »

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that muppet Zarkandar

lol,
im on the muppet tomorrow
I don't see grand giving weight and a beating to zark and i think
he will be looking at zarkandars backside yet again
With the ground being a worry as you say its hard to see
him giving weight away also

Over the course of the season i do think grand will go on to
much greater things though

ft9

Ground was a concern for me too regarding Grandouet. Today I read somewhere Barry said it's ideal ground for him and that he's done nice pieces of work, and had a good blowout last Friday.

He will be a major player in the CH come March, Imo would have beaten ROR last year had he not got that infection, but that's nothing but speculation now at this stage.

He paid for Christmas last year and hopefully does the same this year.

Huntley, have you taken anything on him for the CH before the price contracts tomorrow?

Huntley

Huntley wrote: »

.......... but I have no doubt he is a better animal than Rock on Ruby and that muppet Zarkandar and will prove that over the course of the season.

Loyalty is key in this game and I'm all in with this machine.

........

Only came in to this forum just now to see what folks think of Rock on Ruby for tomorrow

I think RoR will win tomorrow, I don't rate Zarkandar anywhere near as good as the betting for the race tomorrow suggests, if RoR is available at 5/2 I'll be backing

I think 5/2 about either RoR or Grandouet offers great value due to the short price Zarkander seems likely to go off at.

Huntley

ft9 wrote: »

Huntley, have you taken anything on him for the CH before the price contracts tomorrow?

No, I'm just going to back him to the hilt in his races.

I think if he is going to be beat this season it will be tomorrow. Not sure why Barry thinks the ground will be ideal, if it was a quick surface they would be lucky to get a sniff of his tail.

Still hopeful he will beat the back off them all the same.

James - All about what you think is the likely winner mate, if that price does it for you I wouldn't put you off.

finbarrk

The OP was going well until he/she said 'that muppet Zarkander'.

3ndahalfof6

I will be having a few EW on ONE COOL SHABRA for the crack like (in case something insane happens, like 2 of the top three in the market taking each other out of the race)

ROCK ON RUBY I think will perform on the heavy ground better than GRANDOUET and is up for any battle, so I will be throwing a few on ROCK ON RUBY

but don't forget ONE COOL SHABRA once again top horses running and only 7 runners, takes value out of the race for me.

Johner

Grandouet is a machine. Even with it being his first run I think he will win well today.

handsomecake

Who's the muppet now

ft9

handsomecake wrote: »

Who's the muppet now

If those 2 met again next month grandouet would piss all over him.

handsomecake

ft9 wrote: »

If those 2 met again next month grandouet would piss all over him.

when someone calls a horse a muppet in the opening post they deserve to be pulled on it end of.

dont be mentioning future races.i didnt see any disclaimers in the OP

Morgans

Maybe, but they wont pay out on those who backed Grandouet today. I think that the winner is underrated and was cleverly punted by people today. (Not by me) but his attitude won him that race.

Huntley

handsomecake wrote: »

dont be mentioning future races.i didnt see any disclaimers in the OP

You need to look harder then.

Huntley wrote: »

I think if he is going to be beat this season it will be tomorrow.

Huntley wrote: »

The ground is a worry tomorrow but I have no doubt he is a better animal than Rock on Ruby and that muppet Zarkandar and will prove that over the course of the season.

handsomecake wrote: »

Who's the muppet now

As I said, I think Grandouet will prove to be a better animal over the course of the season.

Zarkandar won that race because it became a stamina contest, it doesn't surprise me that he won but he isn't a Champion Hurdler in a million years.

He won't beat Grandouet again this season.

Morgans

But backing him to the hilt in all his races is still the plan.

He is 0 for 3 against Zarkandar.

handsomecake

Huntley wrote: »

Zarkandar won that race because it became a stamina contest

of course, thats why ruby rode him up near the front. its not cheating to turn it into the stamina contest.

zarkandar was first off the bridle and grafted all the way.

for what its worth ,i agree with a lot of your points but when you call a horse a muppet and say your going "all in" and he gets beat your bound to be pulled on it.

if i didnt ,someone else would have.

mailburner

mailburner wrote: »

im on the muppet tomorrow
I don't see grand giving weight and a beating to zark and i think
he will be looking at zarkandars backside yet again
With the ground being a worry as you say its hard to see
him giving weight away also

go wan you muppet :pac:

today was zarks day to be fair and although he won't be a
pushover for the ch it's hard to see him finishing ahead of
both the other two off level weights and different ground

if fly is 100% he should take care of the three of them imo

Morgans

I think the fundamental mistake is that "loyalty is key".

You bet on the horse that will be best on the specific day. There are few bookies taking bets that Grandouet will prove himself better than Rock on Ruby and Zarkandar over the year.

handsomecake

mailburner wrote: »

go wan you muppet :pac:

today was zarks day to be fair and although he won't be a
pushover for the ch it's hard to see him finishing ahead of
both the other two off level weights and different ground

if fly is 100% he should take care of the three of them imo

good post. reasonable points.

i think ill still back zarkandar out of loyalty ( albeit a foolish way to gamble). hes won me a nice few quid over the last year

mailburner

handsomecake wrote: »

good post. reasonable points.

i think ill still back zarkandar out of loyalty ( albeit a foolish way to gamble). hes won me a nice few quid over the last year

if i get 9s or above i'd back him ew myself
i can't recall the horse ever letting me down

Huntley

Morgans wrote: »

But backing him to the hilt in all his races is still the plan.

He is 0 for 3 against Zarkandar.

Yes.

Excuses for all three in reality, idiotic to take results at face value.

1. Zarkandar was more forward in the Triumph,
2. 99% sure Grandouet would have beat him had he not been brought down in the juvenile at Aintree at the last.
3. Zarkandar race fit and receiving 4lbs over conditions that emphasized stamina.

It's all here to review at the end of the season anyway. It's not like there is any blurred lines.

handsomecake wrote: »

for what its worth ,i agree with a lot of your points but when you call a horse a muppet and say your going "all in" and he gets beat your bound to be pulled on it.

I still think Zarkandar is a muppet. I wasn't surprised he won today and didn't write him off prior to the race. I did invest heavily in Grandouet, so what? I did highlight that I thought he was vulnerable. If you think I have egg on my face or something you are wrong, I don't.

Morgans wrote: »

I think the fundamental mistake is that "loyalty is key".

As for anyone who questions my gambling techniques, I have two threads in the gambling section for anyone to view should they wish.

Cracking run from Grandouet anyway all things considered.

handsomecake

Huntley wrote: »

If you think I have egg on my face or something you are wrong

Cracking run from Grandouet anyway all things considered.

i dont think you have egg on your face.

it was a cracking run.

Morgans

Huntley wrote: »

Yes.

Excuses for all three in reality, idiotic to take results at face value.

1. Zarkandar was more forward in the Triumph,
2. 99% sure Grandouet would have beat him had he not been brought down in the juvenile at Aintree at the last.
3. Zarkandar race fit and receiving 4lbs over conditions that emphasized stamina.

The only time I backed Grandouet is in that Aintree race. Thought he was a bet to nothing each way. I think the 99% that he would have won is completely misleading. Zarkander responds to pressure and had Grandouet fell at the second last today, Im sure you would have been 99% sure he would have won today as well. I was cursing when he was brought down at Aintree, but looking back now, I think its a 50/50 that he would have won.

He is a strong traveller but there is still a huge doubt whether or not he finds as much as he threatens. Give me a tough type like Zarkandar or Countrywide Flame all day every day in the Champion Hurdle. Horses that have the balls for races like the Tote Gold Trophy or the Cesarwitch.

Even after the last today, Grandouet was never going to get past. A stronger pace in the Champion Hurdle will clearly suit. And Zarkander would have beaten him with 4lbs extra today. Conditions suit, and if it came up heavy/soft in the Champion, going to the hilt on Grandouet would still be silly.

But continue reasurring yourself that Zarkandar is a muppet, that Grandouet will prove better. If neither win another race this year, you were wrong to go all in, or bet him to the hilt today.

mailburner

it's hard to criticise a horse like zark imo
when you money is on you know the horse with give all

he might not win a ch but there'll be less heartbreak as he
won't jump the last pulling double like harchibald

mdwexford

Huntley wrote: »

I still think Zarkandar is a muppet. I wasn't surprised he won today and didn't write him off prior to the race. I did invest heavily in Grandouet, so what? I did highlight that I thought he was vulnerable. If you think I have egg on my face or something you are wrong, I don't.


As for anyone who questions my gambling techniques, I have two threads in the gambling section for anyone to view should they wish.

Cracking run from Grandouet anyway all things considered.

Not sure what calling him a muppet is supposed to mean, hes clearly a high class hurdler with a fantastic attitude.

Gambling section is generally for "special" people I thought.

Grandouet's run was ok, any less than that would have been poor.

klairondavis

If Hurricane Fly is back to his best he should take the Champion Hurdle. Big if for a 9yo Montjeu though. Zarkandar, Rock On Ruby and Grandouet are all nice horses but none of them have that real star quality. Oscar Whiskey was the best hurdler on show today.

UrbanSea

I think it's dangerous to assume that Grandouet will beat him next time out just because he hadn't a run. Henderson was never going to have him half fit going for the race today.

Morgans makes a good point. Zarkandar is a real battler, love to see that in a horse. Not sure why people keep writing off the horse, if he went and won a Champion there'd be excuses fired left right and centre

hucklebuck

It's ridiculous calling Zarkandar a muppet and folly to suggest he has no chance in the Champion, plenty of tough horses who lack an overdrive have won Champion Hurdles and in the last two years Peddlers and Overturn have been there or there about.

Huntley wrote: »

Zarkandar won that race because it became a stamina contest, it doesn't surprise me that he won but he isn't a Champion Hurdler in a million years.

He won't beat Grandouet again this season.

He only won it because it turned into a stamina race is a stupid comment. If you have a stamina horse you ride him so stamina comes in to it and to try blunt the speed of the horses with a turbo.

You can be sure they will ride him the same come March too.

RichieLawlor

Pretty sure Zarkandar is just better. But this isn't a Zarkandar vs Grandouet thread. They will both win plenty of races.

Henderson saying they are going straight to Cheltenham with the horse basically gives him zero chance in the champion in my mind.

mdwexford

mdwexford wrote: »

........

Gambling section is generally for "special" people I thought.............

What do you mean by that?

It's hardly Huntley's problem that most of the challenges/logs etc end in a loss and display lack of knowledge, basic gambling smarts and often common sense.

His threads were quite profitable iirc.

Harry Angstrom

Huntley wrote: »

I still think Zarkandar is a muppet.

I wouldn't mind owning a muppet who could win a Triumph Hurdle, a Grade 1 at Aintree, a Tote Gold Trophy and a Bula Hurdle.

RichieLawlor

Huntley wrote: »

Yes.

Excuses for all three in reality, idiotic to take results at face value.

1. Zarkandar was more forward in the Triumph,
2. 99% sure Grandouet would have beat him had he not been brought down in the juvenile at Aintree at the last.
3. Zarkandar race fit and receiving 4lbs over conditions that emphasized stamina.

Its laughable that you just completely make up stuff to suit your argument.

So, Zarkandar, a horse who hasn't seen a hurdle a month before the festival and had one run around Kempton (polar opposite to Cheltenham) was more forward than a horse who had been on the go over hurdles since the end of October and had reasonable course form with the would be triumph favourite.

Lol.

99% would have won at Aintree, lol. I'll leave it at that.

And today, he didn't lack for fitness, he got there cruising, and has hammered the reigning champion hurdler. Grandouet has run the race of his life today and wasn't good enough.

What's the next excuse. Look I've no doubt that Grandouet is open to vast improvement and may improve past Zarkandar, maybe, but you just refuse to be wrong and thus ridicule yourself with this nonsense.

We all make outlandish statements at times and end up looking silly, but I'm sure you'll be back on to try disprove my arguements.