Republican Racism

sink · 08-11-2012 7:34pm

I don't think it's racist to support a racial/ethnic minority that has long suffered from a lack of representation in high office. So long as that person is both qualified and capable, the fact that they're a minority is positive attribute. It's positive because it symbolizes progression and inclusiveness. Obama acts a role model for young generations who will grow up with the view that there is no racial barrier to their ambition, which can only encourage them.

Nodin · 08-11-2012 7:55pm

Gbear wrote: »

It's hardly a coincidence or because black people are so well informed that 90% of them voted for him.

Seeing as well over 70% vote democrat on average anyway, its a bit much to say that they vote for him as a bloc because hes black.
http://atlantablackstar.com/2012/09/07/black-influence-on-democratic-party-is-far-greater-than-republican-party/

Corkfeen · 08-11-2012 10:43pm

Nodin wrote: »

Seeing as well over 70% vote democrat on average anyway, its a bit much to say that they vote for him as a bloc because hes black.
http://atlantablackstar.com/2012/09/07/black-influence-on-democratic-party-is-far-greater-than-republican-party/

Indeed. On The Daily Show, they spent a segment finding black people at the republican convention..... They didn't find many amongst the crowd if I remember correctly.

Nodin · 09-11-2012 12:45am

Corkfeen wrote: »

Indeed. On The Daily Show, they spent a segment finding black people at the republican convention..... They didn't find many amongst the crowd if I remember correctly.

....which is a direct legacy of this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_strategy

You'll note they don't like to mention it too often when talking about why they lost the black vote.

legspin · 09-11-2012 1:18am

COYW wrote: »

Personally, I think that there are serious racial issues in society as a whole in the USA. Look at the split of votes for Romney and Obama in terms of ethnicity.

Also, the democrats moved away from religion, as opposed to the republicans moving towards it. Religious freedom is at the core of the founding of the USA. The USA was the only country where it was possible for the likes of Mormons or the Amish to evolve in peace. The Amish had to flee to the USA, Pennsylvania iirc, from Europe to escape persecution.

True , but it was also the place the the Puritans went so they could persecute Quakers as so happens, after they were booted out of England for persecuting said Quakers.

(I like Quakers. They strike me as serious, well-meaning but most importantly, do no harm sorts).

That puritannical cruelty is still writ large within the GOP.

decimatio · 09-11-2012 1:46am

Few things.

Yes the USA does have a lot of issues with race, that's undeniable. A particular sore point of mine is how they group people based on skin colour and how ones skin colour actually does play a part in defining people or defining how people think of you. I do think however that the USA deserves the benefit of the doubt. Ireland, indeed most of the rest of the world, are still largely homogeneous societies so until we are as diverse as them then we don't know if we would be better or worse from a race relations perspective. I'd hope for the former but it's certainly not a given.

Did some/many black people vote for Obama because he's black? Undoubtedly. Did most? Probably not.

Is it racist to vote for a minority because they're a minority? Absolutely.

Duggys Housemate · 09-11-2012 12:20pm

Nodin wrote: »

Seeing as well over 70% vote democrat on average anyway, its a bit much to say that they vote for him as a bloc because hes black.
http://atlantablackstar.com/2012/09/07/black-influence-on-democratic-party-is-far-greater-than-republican-party/

Not really understanding the stats then Nodin? If the democratic black vote is 70% and it increases to 90%+ with a black president, then there is a clear link between the race of the president and his vote amongst blacks. Not that i think that is much of an issue, but it is there.

Obliq · 09-11-2012 1:31pm

Sarky wrote: »

I always reckoned those soft hands of his would be very... dexterous.

eWWW! Prefer hands that look like they could crush rock myself. Ideally, also be dexterous enough to tune a chainsaw, among other things.....;)

Dades · 09-11-2012 1:46pm

Obliq wrote: »

eWWW! Prefer hands that look like they could crush rock myself.

Sarky · 09-11-2012 1:56pm

Hey, if callouses and arthritis are what does it for you, go nuts.

Obliq · 09-11-2012 2:07pm

I like the hard life

Nodin · 09-11-2012 2:15pm

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

Not really understanding the stats then Nodin? If the democratic black vote is 70% and it increases to 90%+ with a black president, then there is a clear link between the race of the president and his vote amongst blacks. Not that i think that is much of an issue, but it is there.

....if it increases from 70% to 90% then its clearly ridiculous to say that 'the black population vote for obama because he's black'.

Gbear · 09-11-2012 3:51pm

Nodin wrote: »

Seeing as well over 70% vote democrat on average anyway, its a bit much to say that they vote for him as a bloc because hes black.
http://atlantablackstar.com/2012/09/07/black-influence-on-democratic-party-is-far-greater-than-republican-party/

Nevertheless, a 20% swing is quite significant.

The argument wasn't that "all white people voting for Romney are racists and all black people voting for Obama are too".

There's clearly an element of racialism on both sides - it's still a stretch to condemn positive discrimination as much as negative discrimination though.

Duggys Housemate · 09-11-2012 4:22pm

20% of total votes, of course.

Its a 28.5% increase in the black democratic vote and a 66% decrease in the black republican vote for a black candidate.

Galvasean · 09-11-2012 4:24pm

ShooterSF wrote: »

But logically it follows that white people know white people best and, understanding their needs better, will mean they should vote white.

Other factors come in too. For example, big business men voted for Romney because as a big business man they felt he'd help them out etc. etc.

ShooterSF · 09-11-2012 4:31pm

Galvasean wrote: »

Other factors come in too. For example, big business men voted for Romney because as a big business man they felt he'd help them out etc. etc.

That's more logical though. Blacks are as diverse as whites. There's rich black people and poor, educated and not, conservative and liberal, religious and atheist. I think those issues are more important than sharing skin colour. You (royal you) could maybe argue for it as a tie breaker.

Doctor DooM · 09-11-2012 5:47pm

I'm amazed more people aren't discussing the effect of the internet on this election. Last time around, everyone was.

Romney got hammered on the internet. He ended up having to constantly talk about all the nasty things his party had said over the prior months, at times, instead of pushing his message forward. Then there was binders full of women...

old hippy · 09-11-2012 6:00pm

Doctor DooM wrote: »

I'm amazed more people aren't discussing the effect of the internet on this election. Last time around, everyone was.

Romney got hammered on the internet. He ended up having to constantly talk about all the nasty things his party had said over the prior months, at times, instead of pushing his message forward. Then there was binders full of women...

MetalDog · 09-11-2012 9:36pm

Fuckin' hell . . . . with attitudes like that in the States, it wouldn't surprise me if there was a Second American Civil War.

I wonder though how these rednecks find the time to go on twitter when their usually too busy screwing their own sisters or appearing on Jerry Springer.

09-11-2012 9:45pm

COYW wrote: »

Also, the democrats moved away from religion, as opposed to the republicans moving towards it.

On the national stage maybe, there's still close links through black baptist churches and the like.

ShooterSF wrote: »

But logically it follows that white people know white people best and, understanding their needs better, will mean they should vote white.

The ****?

Nodin wrote: »

Seeing as well over 70% vote democrat on average anyway, its a bit much to say that they vote for him as a bloc because hes black.
http://atlantablackstar.com/2012/09/07/black-influence-on-democratic-party-is-far-greater-than-republican-party/

Ok so an increase from 70% to over 90% is purely down to a couple of million black people discovering that they really agree with the Democrats around the time of the presidential elections that Obama runs in.

ShooterSF · 09-11-2012 9:48pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The ****?

I was attempting to show why it's a bad idea for black people to vote for balck people because they're black people. I didn't mean we should all go out and start voting based on our race.

09-11-2012 9:52pm

ShooterSF wrote: »

I was attempting to show why it's a bad idea for black people to vote for balck people because they're black people. I didn't mean we should all go out and start voting based on our race.

That's what I get for skimming. :P

enfant terrible · 09-11-2012 9:54pm

MetalDog wrote: »

Fuckin' hell . . . . with attitudes like that in the States, it wouldn't surprise me if there was a Second American Civil War.

I wonder though how these rednecks find the time to go on twitter when their usually too busy screwing their own sisters or appearing on Jerry Springer.

Do people really think the US is a much more racist place than Ireland.

Maybe they are just more vocal about it because from my experience of Limerick it is a very racist place.

[-0-] · 09-11-2012 10:21pm

Nodin · 09-11-2012 11:08pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Ok so an increase from 70% to over 90% is purely down to a couple of million black people discovering that they really agree with the Democrats around the time of the presidential elections that Obama runs in.

While theres no doubt some of those extra numbers have voted for Obama because of his race, they're hardly a majority, given the high numbers already voting for the democrats.

09-11-2012 11:15pm

Nodin wrote: »

While theres no doubt some of those extra numbers have voted for Obama because of his race, they're hardly a majority, given the high numbers already voting for the democrats.

But there's a seemingly acceptable narrative of tonnes of whites voting against Obama because he's black when proportionally there was pretty much no change in whites' party affiliations.

Nodin · 09-11-2012 11:20pm

Deleted User wrote: »

But there's a seemingly acceptable narrative of tonnes of whites voting against Obama because he's black......

Realistically theres little way to tell. The fact is the US Republican party essentially went for the racist vote decades ago, so nobody has much reason to change their vote there. Its also true that many who fall into the "I'm not racist but..." category may be suspicous of a black man, but would still vote for the party ticket over the opposition.

09-11-2012 11:26pm

Nodin wrote: »

Realistically theres little way to tell.

About whether or not that's a pretty widely-held view? I think it pretty much is among any liberals or "mdoderates". Statistically the effect of a black man has had the effect of more black people voting for that party rather than scaring away white voters or causing whites to vote against that party.

Nodin · 09-11-2012 11:30pm

Deleted User wrote: »

About whether or not that's a pretty widely-held view? I think it pretty much is among any liberals or "mdoderates". Statistically the effect of a black man has had the effect of more black people voting for that party rather than scaring away white voters or causing whites to vote against that party.

No, its impossible to tell how many "white" people voted against Obama because of his race.

09-11-2012 11:40pm

Nodin wrote: »

No, its impossible to tell how many "white" people voted against Obama because of his race.

So basically there's no way to tell how many whites did so yet it seems an acceptable proposition to suggest that a load did because they're racist. On the other hand there's an obvious and sizable portion of the black population who voted Democrat with Obama as candidate but that's totally fine obviously.
Then there's the Bradley effect, loads of white people won't admit in polling to voting against a black guy because they don't want to look racist. Oh wait, that didn't happen either.

Republican Racism

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