Star Wars: The Force Awakens [** SPOILERS FROM POST 4472 ONWARD **]

norrie rugger

Now someone just needs to convince me of Jumper and Last Stand:(

Kinski

Sad Professor wrote: »

The problems with the Jedi do indeed lie mostly with Lucas, but most of the good things about the film are Lucas as well. Kasdan worked off Lucas's treatment, same as on Empire. The whole Vader/Luke showdown was Lucas's idea and was in his original draft before Kasdan wrote a word. It's generally believed that Lucas directed all those scenes as well. Killing Han off was Ford's idea and Kasdan agreed, although he thought he should die at the start of the film. Killing him at the very end, as in the later drafts of the script, was kinda pointless. Kasdan probably wasn't too bothered either way as he was just a writer-for-hire and was keen to work on his own films.

Anyway, it's amazing how Kennedy was able to coax Kasdan back but Lucas couldn't. You have to wonder how much of the issues with Jedi and the prequels were due to Lucas's disputes with the DGA and WGA during the making of Empire, presumedly over money. He really burned all his bridges and isolated himself. American writers and directors won't risk incurring union wrath, not even for Star Wars.

That background just leaves me scratching my head again, wondering "What the hell happened with this guy?" The theory that Lucas' vision for Star Wars was always poorly-conceived, and that others refined his ideas into decent stories and good films is a neat one, since it explains how the prequels turned out so bad. But how could someone who did have a flair for cinematic storytelling lose his touch so completely that he showed such incompetence when making the prequels?

kitakyushu

Kinski wrote: »

That background just leaves me scratching my head again, wondering "What the hell happened with this guy?" The theory that Lucas' vision for Star Wars was always poorly-conceived, and that others refined his ideas into decent stories and good films is a neat one, since it explains how the prequels turned out so bad. But how could someone who did have a flair for cinematic storytelling lose his touch so completely that he showed such incompetence when making the prequels?

The theory (and I actually believe it) is that his divorce pretty much shattered him as a creative or ambitious force. After that he seemed to lose interest in making movies that would appeal to a wide audience and instead started refocusing his projects to suit his own interests and those of his family. For example, he started making movies like the "Ewok Adventures" for no other reason than to entertain his daughter Amanda and to reflect his relationship with her. So much so that in second movie of this series he actually kills the family (except the daughter of course) and makes the her the main character!

He continued this pattern with the prequels and the fourth Indy movie. TPM features a boy pretty much the same age as his own son Jett and in Crystal Skulls the Mutt character was originally supposed to be a teenage/20something girl (presumably to reflect his relationship with his daughter Katie?), but the choice got vetoed before production.

Basically, as far as I can tell, Lucas has spent the last 25-30 years making movies/tv to entertain nobody but himself and his children and to reflect his relationships with them. He knows the movies will sell no matter what crap he puts in them and as a result doesn't really care too much anymore what the audience thinks.

Kinski

Interesting theory, but saying he only made them to please himself and his family is probably pushing it; he probably made them mainly to make money. But perhaps changes in his personal life do account for his creative downfall.

Zubeneschamali

Kinski wrote: »

he probably made them mainly to make money.

Yes, because he's been so broke ever since Empire.

Nervous Wreck

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Yes, because he's been so broke ever since Empire.

People with money always want more money.

kitakyushu

Woops!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbTYiX5A3Bk&t=1m05s

Bullseye1

Mathew Vaughn confirmed for Star Wars.

http://www.totalfilm.com/news/matthew-vaughn-confirmed-for-star-wars

Sad Professor

The blogs are jumping the gun. I wouldn't be convinced that Flemyng was being serious. Until there's a press release from Disney, Vaughn hasn't been confirmed for anything.

Sad Professor

According to THR, Kasdan and Kinberg aren't working on Episode 8 and 9. Instead they may be writing separate spin-off films focusing on side characters, similar to the Marvel universe.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/post-george-lucas-star-wars-394910

Makes sense, I guess. Disney want to make their investment back as quick as possible. A film every 2 years isn't enough, especially when development problems could delay things considerably. When you think about it, Lucas didn't exploit the film brand nearly as much as he could have. He only made 6 films in 35 years. However, with spin-off films Disney could have a new Star Wars film ready to release in theatres every summer for the foreseeable future. In a few years time they could have multiple trilogies going, maybe several films a year.

Kinski

I don't see that as saying there'll be more than one film every other year, but that the one film that comes out every other year won't necessarily be a numbered continuation of the mainline saga, but sometimes a spin-off. More than one film a year would definitely be overkill, and could end up destroying the franchise, financially as well as creatively.

Sad Professor

Maybe but that would mean a 4 year gap or more between episodes of the Skywalker trilogy. That's too long. If the Marvel franchise can survive having more than one film released a year then so can Star Wars.

Kinski

But Marvel isn't one franchise; it's many, with characters which are famous in their own right (Spiderman, Captain America, Thor). Same with DC universe: having a Superman and a Batman film both coming out the same summer would be no big deal, as they are both familiar characters long-established in popular culture, with their own distinctive settings (the bright, shiny optimism of Metropolis versus the dark, gloomy Gotham) and their own separate sets of villains. I doubt many people even realise that they are supposed to part of the same universe; it's the characters that are famous, not DC's world.

The same isn't true of Star Wars. Sure, you could have say a Han Solo spin-off showing what he got up to before he became embroiled in the rebellion, but the Star Wars universe doesn't have the same breadth as those comic franchises, and thus I don't think it has the same potential (yet) to have multiple big screen iterations in cinemas at the same time.

Also, there were 4 years between The Dark Knight and ...Rises, a trilogy which took a total of 7 years to complete, so I don't think a 4 year gap is that major a problem.

McLoughlin

Kinski wrote: »

But Marvel isn't one franchise; it's many, with characters which are famous in their own right (Spiderman, Captain America, Thor). Same with DC universe: having a Superman and a Batman film both coming out the same summer would be no big deal, as they are both familiar characters long-established in popular culture, with their own distinctive settings (the bright, shiny optimism of Metropolis versus the dark, gloomy Gotham) and their own separate sets of villains. I doubt many people even realise that they are supposed to part of the same universe; it's the characters that are famous, not DC's world.

The same isn't true of Star Wars. Sure, you could have say a Han Solo spin-off showing what he got up to before he became embroiled in the rebellion, but the Star Wars universe doesn't have the same breadth as those comic franchises, and thus I don't think it has the same potential (yet) to have multiple big screen iterations in cinemas at the same time.

Also, there were 4 years between The Dark Knight and ...Rises, a trilogy which took a total of 7 years to complete, so I don't think a 4 year gap is that major a problem.

The Star Wars universe is just as big as the Marvel and DC Universe and Disney could easily have a couple films out a year with loose connections/cameos just like Marvel.

Zubeneschamali

Kinski wrote: »

the Star Wars universe doesn't have the same breadth as those comic franchises

Most people watching Iron man and Thor movies have never seen either of those characters before. Black Widow, Nick Fury, that legolas guy, all new to the public. The first two Hulk movies were not hits.

What's different about the recent Marvel movies is not the deep background, dedicated fans or breadth of the franchise: it's that they are pretty good movies.

There's plenty of room in the Star Wars franchise for lots and lots of movies, but only if they are good.

Sad Professor

It looks like Zack Synder is going to be directing one of the Star Wars spin-off films that Kasdan and Kinberg are working on. This isn't Episode 7 but rather a standalone film which will apparently be based on Seven Samurai.

http://www.vulture.com/2013/01/zack-snyder-preps-non-trilogy-star-wars-film.html

pixelburp

300, Watchmen, Superman and now Star Wars - huh; I mean say what you like about Synders ability as a director, but as a geek he's pretty much getting to live out his dreams, so fair play to him.

Disney aren't kidding around though are they; the 3 new episodes, this Synder-driven vehicle & no doubt there'll be more announcements to come (wonder where all this leaves the mythical live-action TV show). I'd wonder if saturation point might be quickly reached.

roanoke

Sad Professor wrote: »

It looks like Zack Synder is going to be directing one of the Star Wars spin-off films

Marty McFly

pixelburp wrote: »

300, Watchmen, Superman and now Star Wars - huh; I mean say what you like about Synders ability as a director, but as a geek he's pretty much getting to live out his dreams, so fair play to him.

Disney aren't kidding around though are they; the 3 new episodes, this Synder-driven vehicle & no doubt there'll be more announcements to come (wonder where all this leaves the mythical live-action TV show). I'd wonder if saturation point might be quickly reached.

That was exactly the first thing I thought after reading it, with the new trilogy, this and plenty other announcements to come im fearful it will reach a point were people will grow sick of seeing everything Star Wars related with Disney throwing it at them from every angle.

Turtyturd

I think if the S.H.I.E.L.D tv show does well we might see a Star Wars one follow it. One interesting thing about the appointment of Snyder is how the movies will look. He has a certain visual style and it will be interesting to see if Disney try and maintain a similar aesthetic throughout their output or if each series of movies will have a different look.

roanoke

The problem I forsee is not saturation but that "Star Wars" will just become a rubber-stamp they put on any sci-fi script in the pipeline. In time the word "Star Wars" will no longer mean anything.

Already this news of a 'Shichinin no Samurai' in space seems to be confirming my suspicions.

They've already tried this with the Clone Wars TV show (several episodes are basically just rehashes of classic movies like Samurai and the Adventures of Robin Hood etc) and imho these result in very weak "locked-in" storylines that don't even feel like Star Wars.

Kinski

A loose-remake movie of Seven Samurai...original.

Kinski

roanoke wrote: »

The problem I forsee is not saturation but that "Star Wars" will just become a rubber-stamp they put on any sci-fi script in the pipeline. In time the word "Star Wars" will no longer mean anything.

Already this news of a 'Shichinin no Samurai' in space seems to be confirming my suspicions.

They've already tried this with the Clone Wars TV show (several episodes are basically just rehashes of classic movies like Samurai and the Adventures of Robin Hood etc) and imho these result in very weak "locked-in" storylines that don't even feel like Star Wars.

Star Wars itself was partly based on Hidden Fortress, though, so this is nothing new. But it would have to be pretty loose, since Samurai's story is already overfamiliar (though maybe not for viewers aged 14, so that might not even matter.)

don ramo

pixelburp wrote: »

I'd wonder if saturation point might be quickly reached.

there doing it right now with Sherlock Holmes, you have the BBC version (Sherlock), the american version (Elementary) and also the films with Robert Downey Jr,

they ran 2 Star Trek series at the same time in the late 90s (Voyager, DS9) while also making TNG films,

if they do it right theyll make a mint, hell even if they half arse it theyll make money, but with disney investing $4billion i think theyll want to do a god job,

i wouldnt mins seeing Snyder make a go of a film, hes a good director, he can make it look really good, i think it will come down to how good the script is and what actors they get for it,

Gbear

Kinski wrote: »

A loose-remake movie of Seven Samurai...original.

Doing it with Jedi. How can they go wrong?

I must've been the only person in the world who actually liked Watchmen. Although part of that was down to the incredible soundtrack.

snausages

The soundtrack was incredible in CD form. But not in the actual film itself.

Mickeroo

I think Snyder's visual flair could lend itself to a Star Wars film pretty well.

johnny_ultimate

Akira Kurosawa > 'Old' George Lucas > 'New' George Lucas ≥ Zack Snyder.

And we can all rest easy since the rumour is supposedly le **** de bull: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/zack-snyder-shoots-down-report-412336

Handsome Bob

Snyder is surely not behind "new" George Lucas. His hack level is most definitely overstated IMHO.

Sad Professor

And the director of Episode 7 is...


*drumroll*


J.J. Abrams


Let the whining begin!

http://www.thewrap.com/movies/article/jj-abrams-set-direct-next-star-wars-film-exclusive-74596

Liamario

Perfect choice if you ask me.
No, there won't be lens flare everywhere.

Now, I can get hyped. This man hasn't ****ed up yet and his star trek movie is a better star wars movie than the prequels.

Handsome Bob

No direct quotes sir, no direct quotes. For shame. :pac:

roanoke

Wow. That's a major bit of news! Can't say I'm happy about it in the slightest, but I'll save my whining for elsewhere.

FreezeUp

I'm more interested to see what extents Disney will market the new film, rather than the new film itself.

Mr E

Star Wars VII: The Lens Flare Strikes Back.

pixelburp

Wow, Star Wars and Star Trek?
Dunno why, but that kinda feels weird that he's directing both. Like he's playing for both teams or something hehe

Could be interesting though; the scriptwriter was the lynchpin in all this anyway, and with Michael Arndt announced my main concern about the film was lessened.

Handsome Bob

If true Abrams is probably done with Trek. It reminds me of Singer and how his "passion project" made him jump from a perfectly poised X-Men franchise to Superman Returns.

If he is directing Episode 7, I'd put money on him not doing another Trek film.

Sad Professor

My interest in this just shot up. I never in a million years thought it would be Abrams due to his current association with Star Trek. But tbh he is the perfect choice. He's the closest heir to late '70s/early '80s Spielberg, the guy who everyone kinda wishes had directed ROTJ. It's just a shame that this most likely means no J.J. directed Star Trek 3. And I can't help but fear that this may turn out to be a repeat of what happened when Bryan Singer abandoned X-Men 3 for his dream project.

EDIT: S. De Sousa just said the exact same thing. lol.

BlitzKrieg

pixelburp wrote: »

Wow, Star Wars and Star Trek?
Dunno why, but that kinda feels weird that he's directing both. Like he's playing for both teams or something hehe

Could be interesting though; the scriptwriter was the lynchpin in all this anyway, and with Michael Arndt announced my main concern about the film was lessened.

My feelings exactly.

Handsome Bob

It'll be interesting to see if Abrams taps the acting pool he's established in the trek series. Pine has the whole anti-hero Solo thing going on, while I reckon Cumberbatch and Quinto could give us a good Sith.

roanoke

I hear this is all phase one of a long term strategy Disney have to buy-up and merge both of the Star Trek and Star Wars brands.

The new merged brand will take the "Wars" from Star Wars and the "Star" from Star Trek and from then on be known as "Star Wars".

RobbingBandit

roanoke wrote: »

I hear this is all phase one of a long term strategy Disney have to buy-up and merge both of the Star Trek and Star Wars brands.

The new merged brand will take the "Wars" from Star Wars and the "Trek" from Star Trek and from then on be known as "Trek Wars".

Fyp.

FreezeUp

roanoke wrote: »

I hear this is all phase one of a long term strategy Disney have to buy-up and merge both of the Star Trek and Star Wars brands.

The new merged brand will take the "Wars" from Star Wars and the "Star" from Star Trek and from then on be known as "Star Wars".

Or just "Star"

Sad Professor

I'm really surprised that Disney went with such a big name director. I think almost everyone expected them to go with someone little smaller and easier to control. Abrams is used to having complete creative control over his films. I assume this will be no different, although I can't help but wonder. Will he be shooting this on 35mm? He has been fairly outspoken in his preference for celluloid over digital. But I imagine Disney will demand that this be shot in 3D. Unless Abrams convinces them to let him do it in 70mm IMAX. Lucas (who I suspect still has some say) wouldn't be too happy about this.

FreezeUp

Sad Professor wrote: »

I'm really surprised that Disney went with such a big name director. I think almost everyone expected them to go with someone little smaller and easier to control. Abrams is used to having complete creative control over his films. I assume this will be no different, although I can't help but wonder. Will he be shooting this on 35mm? He has been fairly outspoken in his preference for celluloid over digital. But I imagine Disney will demand that this be shot in 3D. Unless Abrams convinces them to let him do it in 70mm IMAX. Lucas (who I suspect still has some say) wouldn't be too happy about this.

Does Lucas have a say anymore?

Goldstein

What are people on about? This will be Abrams' 3rd Star Wars film.

OctavarIan

(seriously, happy with the choice of director)

FreezeUp

Random image placement lol

JP Liz V1

Wow never expected him to named as director :eek:

johnny_ultimate

Interesting choice, certainly the second finest blockbuster director of the moment. Curious to see what level of control he's granted.