Phil Hogan Got Cut-Price Mortgage

mikom

Ghandee wrote: »

Define foreigner?

Foreigner is a British-American rock band, originally formed in 1976 by veteran English musicians Mick Jones and ex-King Crimson member Ian McDonald

Biggins

wexie wrote: »

So how is it ever going to change then Biggins? If that's how it is (personally I think you're right) then the top three are simply going to perpetuate the status quo, they won't allow anybody in their ranks that won't stand for it and there aren't (from what I can see) any viable alternatives.....Are we just doomed forever?

What's the odds of a new party forming, gaining popularity and actually getting elected, then still remembering their election promises and clearing house?

Damn...that's a depressing thought.

(sorry for dragging the topic OT, just planting seeds in my Biggins for Taoiseach campaign)

Putting it in accuracy terms, change can only come by a majority,
A majority is needed to pass the legislation that would make transparency official and a retro-active where possible.
(The FG/Labour have brought in some changes - but then they watered down them! (Example: all TD's would have to clock in AND clock out. Watered down to... they can clock in, well some of the time, the rest of the time someone else can do it for them, and even if they did show up in the Dail, they don't even have to clock out now either.)*

The top three are are still perpetuating virtual status quo.
What we have got is pure window-dressing so far.

What is needed is a pure new clean sweep. End of story.
Within the first month of a clean sweep, transparency laws should be further enacted - and bloody stuck to!
The Dail is there to serve the people.
The Dail is not and should not be there to serve the TD's (and that includes its extra bonus tax free, bars and inner restaurants!).

Will the above happen?
Hell no - because the old, tired, musical chair shower thats currently in it are making sure of that.
They and they sycophancy fans frankly don't want change in processes and monetary terms - they want Euro notes's and the more the merrier!

What's the odds of a new party forming, gaining popularity and actually getting elected, then still remembering their election promises and clearing house?
Very unlikely - if only because the club of three and their fans have the electorate scared and fooled enough to think that all change is bad and no diversification should be made away from the top three current parties.

...And thats the state of play at the moment!

---

* Why alone is the above in brackets important?

...Because now they don't have to go down on record (which the public/media could apply to see under freedom of information) showing just how little time they actually attended the Dail in minutes/hours and/or even the days that they REALLY showed up (instead of their mates clocking them in).
...Which is all important as to how much they get in extra perks and allowances - you know like accommodation, travel and even parking allowances, etc.
...So on this issue alone, the data and real facts are clouded and confused, deliberative in order (I suspect) that the more accurate truth shall never be found out by a public that, god forbid, got outraged enough to vote out a charlatan and elect a more moral person!

...But hey, lets still get all those allowance's in for days that officially they might have been clocked in - but not really there, but also that the public never finds out out just really exactly how many few minutes as elected representatives, they spend in the Dail chamber, debating and more importantly, questioning every like aspect of laws that effect the people directly.

...You know - the job they were also elected for and should be doing!

Ghandee

mikom wrote: »

Foreigner is a British-American rock band, originally formed in 1976 by veteran English musicians Mick Jones and ex-King Crimson member Ian McDonald

I asked for that.......

Lawrence1895

Here we go again...Tweedledee and Tweedledum...the Blueshirts and their pals, the bankers and bondholders. As bad as the previous crowd. Time to wake up and get them out of government.

Ghandee

Legally can the public demand an enquiry by the fraud squad?

The govt are supposedly in power to work for us after all

wexie

Ghandee wrote: »

Are you entitled to a passport incidentally?

Yes, I'm guessing I could get an Irish passport if I so desired, which, incidentally I don't.

I see where you're going however I'd be completely unsuitable for a number or reasons :

- Yes I did inhale, maybe even more than once
- I'm terrible with money
- I know f**k all about politics and diplomacy
- I've a terrible work ethic
- I like the easy life
- My ethics are questionable

.......actually.... maybe this is something worth looking into
(although I'm guessing I'd be none to popular with the current religious establishment)

ilovesleep

Michael D Higgins said it last year before he retired from his seat, said that we need a new republic.

Many of the things that we see that we are un-happy about and are utterly insane like over inflated saleries, pensions, large bonuses, expenses, claims, nice working conditions, double pensions, even triple pensions, even going over the pay cap of advisors
- all these people have their hands tied with a contract. It's a form of greed. If their contracts are touched, all hell will break loose. But these contracts for the most part were done when the country was built on quicksand. It's collapsed now and we just can't afford it.

We need to scrap the constitution and rebuild from the start. Add in white collar crimes into the constitution (because FG won't do it).
A 2nd republic.
Why isn't this being done.

ilovesleep

FG - Fcuking Greedy pigs with their snouts in the trough.

philologos

Well at least we know now that inherent greediness isn't just a condition of Fianna Fáil.

So, what party is next? Labour? Sinn Féin?

ilovesleep

FG has absolutely no attention of digging us out from the hole that FF has left us in.

I was badly want that girly monkey and his gang out.

Lawrence1895

ilovesleep wrote: »

FG has absolutely no attention of digging us out from the hole that FF has left us in.

I was badly want that girly monkey and his gang out.

FF threw the country into the coffin, FG are putting the lid on top

noodler

philologos wrote: »

Who else gets an interest free mortgage? - Don't you think such liberal lending could have played a part in the financial crisis at all?

During the Celtic Tiger?

Plenty of people!

People with less means than Phil Hogan as well.

Its funny some people want to play the banks alone when it is the average Joe but if a well-to-do politician happened to get preferential terms then there is uproar.

Such liberal lending of course played a huge part in the crisis but at least Hogan was able to pay back his debts, albeit by selling the house.

noodler

hondasam wrote: »

I'm not happy he is asking me to sign up for a charge when I have no idea what it will cost me.
He knew what he was signing when he bought the villa.

Nobody is happy about the Charge but the voters knew it was necessary and they still voted for FG.

K-9 wrote: »

If you've no problem with politicians like McCreevey in a cosey club with bankers like Fingleton, probably no issue.

Hyperbole.

K-9 wrote: »

My problem is Burton and Varadkar criticising McCreevey for this and silence on this issue so far. I'd expect some condemnation in the next couple of days. I hate double standards like that. The Government parties aren't the only ones at it either, Higgins and his free envelopes spring to mind.

For the love of God - there might be more revelations to come but if getting an interest-free mortgage (which he did pay back in full apparently) is the height of it then I wouldn't exactly call it corruption!

If I had had the same means as him during the boom, sufficient collateral etc then with the way the banks were ledning it would have been entirely possible to get without requiring outright corruption.

God, I am sounding like a right Blueshirt here.

paddy147

Did FG tell everyone that there would be a household charge and house tax though,when they were all looking for the publics votes??????

I dont think so,so trying to use that excuse wont wash here.

Biggins

...if getting an interest-free mortgage (which he did pay back in full apparently) is the height of it then I wouldn't exactly call it corruption!

If thats all - but then what if its was given in quiet understanding of things to come in the then times or in the future to come?

Certainly questions need to be asked!
...And should we allow our politicians be open to these temptations - maybe so that those giving them could at another date use it against them if they don't get their later way?

Ghandee

Bad week for FG.

Hogan in cut price mortgage scandal.

Then James Reilly defaults on 1.9million debt.


This won't end well.

K-9

ilovesleep wrote: »

Michael D Higgins said it last year before he retired from his seat, said that we need a new republic.

Many of the things that we see that we are un-happy about and are utterly insane like over inflated saleries, pensions, large bonuses, expenses, claims, nice working conditions, double pensions, even triple pensions, even going over the pay cap of advisors
- all these people have their hands tied with a contract. It's a form of greed. If their contracts are touched, all hell will break loose. But these contracts for the most part were done when the country was built on quicksand. It's collapsed now and we just can't afford it.

We need to scrap the constitution and rebuild from the start. Add in white collar crimes into the constitution (because FG won't do it).
A 2nd republic.
Why isn't this being done.

You are chatting a root and branch reform of Irish society. I'll tell you one thing, ULA and SF will not give anybody that going on their policies.

I'm all for radical PS reform, we'd also need SW reform (and I'm no Welfare basher), a whole new order on tenders.

That would be the Government expenditure side looked at. Hospital consultants, doctors, chemists, Accountancy & Solicitor fees, that's just tipping at the tip og the iceberg when it comes to the Private Sector. Petrol and drink comglomerates would be 2 obvious sectors outside it.

noodler wrote: »

Nobody is happy about the Charge but the voters knew it was necessary and they still voted for FG.





Hyperbole.



For the love of God - there might be more revelations to come but if getting an interest-free mortgage (which he did pay back in full apparently) is the height of it then I wouldn't exactly call it corruption!

If I had had the same means as him during the boom, sufficient collateral etc then with the way the banks were ledning it would have been entirely possible to get without requiring outright corruption.

God, I am sounding like a right Blueshirt here.

Well if you seen nothing wrong with McCreevey at least you are consistent!

What I find wrong is Fingleton taking politicians, builders and others in the know into his office and giving preferential terms, ignoring normal checks on loans and giving them to those he knew. You say nothing wrong went on but how do you know? Same as I can't say something definitely wrong happened.

Corruption has moved on, the brown envelope has gone unless somebody is dumb enough to use it. What we have is the promise of some directorship when a minister retires or a nod, nod, you scratch my back approach. The potential for corruption is still huge and also far harder to prove.

I was a customer of INBS and I can tell you they didn't tell me of offers like this. This is a Building Society that screwed customers in the late 90's and early 00's, charging them huge penalties when they fell into arrears, making it near impossible to catch up. There was a reason they were extremely profitable and the lowest cost base out there.

Many INBS members wanted them to go public 10 years ago. Fingleton delayed to get friendly legislation passed and low and behold it was passed.

ArmaniJeanss

philologos wrote: »

Who else gets an interest free mortgage? - Don't you think such liberal lending could have played a part in the financial crisis at all?

Fairly sure it was an interest-only mortgage, not an interest free mortgage.
Huge difference really - the full capital plus interest still has to be eventually paid on an interest-only loan.

They truely weren't that unusual a concept, a huge amount of second homes and investment properties mortgage were on this basis.

However 10 years of interest-only, and interest-only on a primary residence (if thats what the D4 home was) do seem quite unusual.

Ghandee

I'm just wondering if James Reilly will have to resign now?

As he's defaulted on a 1.9 million euro debt, can we assume he may have to declare bankruptcy ?

If he does he can no longer serve in the dail.

Ironic really as FG's Policy was 'we do not default on our debts'

ArtSmart

noodler wrote: »

For the love of God - there might be more revelations to come but if getting an interest-free mortgage (which he did pay back in full apparently) is the height of it then I wouldn't exactly call it corruption!

If I had had the same means as him during the boom, sufficient collateral etc then with the way the banks were ledning it would have been entirely possible to get without requiring outright corruption.

Well the thing is this. On what basis does a bank lend half a mil to someone already holding a mortgage. For investment purposes the loan rate was 40% of price, or thereabout - though it may have increased.

question is increased to what amt, AND why interest only? interest only for an investment property?


the release of equity for the Portugal purchase might be valid - but again, not on an interest only basis.

So assuming the indo is correct about the loan conditions, this is dodgy, with a capital D .

paddy147

Ghandee wrote: »

I'm just wondering if James Reilly will have to resign now?

As he's defaulted on a 1.9 million euro debt, can we assume he may have to declare bankruptcy ?

If he does he can no longer serve in the dail.

Ironic really as FG's Policy was 'we do not default on our debts'

Yeah,Endas "dail speech" might just come back to haunt him and his ministers allright.:D

ArtSmart

Ghandee wrote: »

I'm just wondering if James Reilly will have to resign now?

As he's defaulted on a 1.9 million euro debt, can we assume he may have to declare bankruptcy ?

If he does he can no longer serve in the dail.

Ironic really as FG's Policy was 'we do not default on our debts'

where's the link for Reilly?

Ghandee

ArtSmart wrote: »

where's the link for Reilly?

None yet, was shown on Vincent Browne though, will be headlines in the indo in the morning apparently.

ArmaniJeanss

ilovesleep wrote: »

Michael D Higgins said it last year before he retired from his seat, said that we need a new republic.

Many of the things that we see that we are un-happy about and are utterly insane like over inflated saleries, pensions, large bonuses, expenses, claims, nice working conditions, double pensions, even triple pensions, even going over the pay cap of advisors
- all these people have their hands tied with a contract. It's a form of greed. If their contracts are touched, all hell will break loose. But these contracts for the most part were done when the country was built on quicksand. It's collapsed now and we just can't afford it.

We need to scrap the constitution and rebuild from the start. Add in white collar crimes into the constitution (because FG won't do it).
A 2nd republic.
Why isn't this being done.

Because its not actually what people want, despite what the average After Hours poll would suggest come election or referendum time.

People don't want radical change - there was enough SP/ULA/SF/radical Indo candidates in the last election to give them a majority in the Dail if people wanted major change.

People are content to muddy along with an ever so slightly left/right of centre non-threatening coalition.

ArtSmart

Ghandee wrote: »

None yet, was shown on Vincent Browne though, will be headlines in the indo in the morning apparently.

Well until then, no real point speculating. Cant see Phil surviving this, if the indo is correct on the % only for 10 yrs thingy

paddy147

ArtSmart wrote: »

Well until then, no real point speculating. Cant see Phil surviving this, if the indo is correct on the % only for 10 yrs thingy

Can you imagine the final goodbye chat between Hogan and Enda.

Something like this perhaps??:D

K-9

Ghandee wrote: »

None yet, was shown on Vincent Browne though, will be headlines in the indo in the morning apparently.

He owns the big mansion and opens it to get the tax incentives. Look forward to reading that.

Zebra3

Ghandee wrote: »

Bad week for FG.

Hogan in cut price mortgage scandal.

Then James Reilly defaults on 1.9million debt.


This won't end well.

I'd like to think that way, but they just don't really give a toss, do they?

Fat pensions for the rest of their life. They'll be all right. :mad:

philologos

noodler wrote: »

During the Celtic Tiger?

Plenty of people!

People with less means than Phil Hogan as well.

Its funny some people want to play the banks alone when it is the average Joe but if a well-to-do politician happened to get preferential terms then there is uproar.

Such liberal lending of course played a huge part in the crisis but at least Hogan was able to pay back his debts, albeit by selling the house.

I'm really doubting that many got an entirely interest free mortgage. Banks operate on capitalist principles, I.E - How are you ever going to make a profit from an interest free mortgage?

Why is it one standard for a few, and another standard for the weakest in society?

wexie

ArtSmart wrote: »

where's the link for Reilly?

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/reilly-left-redfaced-as-hes-named-on-debtdefault-list-3165020.html