Diesel hauled 'Mystery Train' Sat 23rd June

Niles

Sligo Quay wrote: »

http://chrisplayfair.smugmug.com/Travel/2012-Photos/June-2012/23310780_mVmcVR#!i=1911248408&k=KVPjnVq&lb=1&s=X2 a law for some and no law for others, probably works for Irish Rail, climbing a signal post to take a snap then posting it up on the internet, a trainspotter without a brain is a very dangerous creature.

Indeed, same thought struck me when I saw that photo. I've seen cases where enthusiasts have been asked to step down from such fixtures on railtours, sadly you'll always get some who see themselves as 'above' instruction. Give others a bad name really.

Judgement Day

I think that you'll find that the enthusiast concerned is a well known and respected photographer in railway circles and has been around for a long time - too much H&S bs around everything these days.

Losty Dublin

Judgement Day wrote: »

I think that you'll find that the enthusiast concerned is a well known and respected photographer in railway circles and has been around for a long time - too much H&S bs around everything these days.

I won't say anything except that's the funniest description of him I've ever heard

Rud

Those are some great pictures.The shots of 113 in Dundalk are pure class.Plenty of colour

Sligo Quay

Chrisplayfair wrote: »

Secondly, I am unable to understand what picture you are talking about - The link takes you to a picture of 4001 at GVS???? I was standing on my own to feet on the platform....Talk about brains!


Link to photos from Connolly yesterday including the diesel tour -
http://chrisplayfair.smugmug.com/Travel/2012-Photos/June-2012/23310780_mVmcVR#!i=1923987080&k=Sk9bGT6

The picture Im talking about was taken from the top of the signal at the end of Platform2, Im very familiar with Connolly station as I used it for the Sligo train, you deleted the picture and changed the link around, maybe you have admitted your guilt and taken the picture down, trying to make a fool of me but only fooling yourself, nice pictures otherwise, anybody who has seen the picture before you removed it, Sligo Quay not a fool.

Chrisplayfair

Rud wrote: »

Those are some great pictures.The shots of 113 in Dundalk are pure class.Plenty of colour

Many thanks Rud!

Victor

Losty Dublin wrote: »

I won't say anything except that's the funniest description of him I've ever heard

Play nice.

Can I kindly ask people to refrain from (a) verbal abuse (b) revealing personal detail of people without their permission

Niles

Some nice footage here of 086 and the Cravens setting off from Connolly on the tour:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5FI-sYYd-Y

steamengine

CaptainFreedom wrote: »

Not to worry - important people have seen the photo that was removed.

It doesnt matter if 'your daddy drives the train', nor if your head is fairly rammed up the arse of every DTE going, trespassing on the railway, be it ontrack, a signal gantry or a staff footbridge is still a crime and Irish Rail are more than happy to punish offenders. There are a few photos on that site that only can be taken if the photographer was trespassing on IE property. Even better that said photographer is unemployed and is earning money from UK Railway publications, Im sure DSS would be interested in that.

Didn't hear too much from posters like yourself concerning the trespass that clearly took place regarding the grafitti/vandalism to RPSI's loco 186. :rolleyes:

CaptainFreedom

steamengine wrote: »

Didn't hear too much from posters like yourself concerning the trespass that took place concerning the graffiti vandalism to RPSI's loco 186. :rolleyes:

We are talking about so called enthusiasts here, not vandals/'artists'

steamengine

CaptainFreedom wrote: »

We are talking about so called enthusiasts here, not vandals/'artists'

Forgive my curiosity but you have selected the 'photographer' for criticism but not the 'artist'. The artist would have had to cross several tracks to grafitti 186, whereas the photographer, allegedly, only climbed up a pole on a platform. I am sure the artist was just as enthusiastic about his work of art as the photographer. Yet there is no criticism of the artist.

starhillroad

A cameraman with obvious experience of railway safety standards on a signal pole ladder is a lot less to worry about than a vandalising skanger in fairness.

The only problem is that the cameraman should be seen to lead by example, but in this aim to be 'holier than thou', what was once safe and accepted is now not tolerated. Granted its a more litigious culture, but what happened to common sense.

Its hardly as if there were scores of railway enthusiasts suing the backside off CIE, British Rail and its descendant companies before, and its not happening now.

Some leeway should be given, although I can't blame Irish Rail staff for being paranoid from time to time, after all its their necks on the line, not the likes of Chairman Lynch in his Ivory Tower in Heuston.

LXFlyer

Any trespassing on the railway is unforgivable - it is potentially dangerous and damages relationships perhaps permanently between the railway company and the enthusiast community.

I would criticise all such trespassing in equal amounts.

I find it extraordinary that anyone is trying to defend this sort of behaviour.

Sligo Quay

steamengine wrote: »

Forgive my curiosity but you have selected the 'photographer' for criticism but not the 'artist'. The artist would have had to cross several tracks to grafitti 186, whereas the photographer, allegedly, only climbed up a pole on a platform. I am sure the artist was just as enthusiastic about his work of art as the photographer. Yet there is no criticism of the artist.

I don't see the connection, you don't benchmark 1 offence against another and say ''oh thats worse than that'' every offence is judged on its own merits.
Good news, traveling up on the 9 from Sligo earlier, I sat with a member of this forum we discussed this thread and guess what, he downloaded the offending picture before it was deleted, so if its made available I shall post it up in this thread and judge for yourselves, no copyright breach as the playfair person excepts no responsibility for the picture, according to him it doesn't exist.
To copyright, copyright is protected in books, documents, journals and magazines etc. not on the World Wide Web, once a picture is posted on the internet copyright goes out the window, not protected on the internet, so says my legal acquaintance on the train earlier.

zagmund

Erm, posting stuff on the internet doesn't mean you give up copyright. If it did, then BBC would be shooting themselves in the foot with iplayer for example.

z

Chrisplayfair

It's really sad to see that the railway has been turned into a place of danger, where lyes nothing but sad people who worry about what others are doing rather than what they're doing themselves.

I will certainly not have anyone make allegations regarding my personal status on the internet. It's clear cyber bullying. Whether its jealously or they don't have anything better to do, it's the latter.

starhillroad

Chrisplayfair "the railway has been turned into a place of danger"

Lets rephrase that. That remark needs a deeper analysis.

The railway is a place of POTENTIAL danger. The very operational nature of rail transport, its rules, its regulatory environment are such that it is always potentially dangerous. There is no margin of error, because if things go wrong, its unforgiving in a merciless fashion. Traffic levels are also substantially higher than before, so the previous 'happy go lucky' system we grew up with no longer exists.

Now, when I say 'happy go lucky', its not to detract from the professionalism of railway workers, and their flexibility with railway enthusiasts. The railway workers know very well that there is a heck of a difference between Clonmel and Connolly. At Clonmel, a railtour with enthusiasts will know exactly when the next train is due, and accomodate it accordingly. People will walk freely around the tracks, and working environment. It was the same with the railtours to Mullingar on Good Friday in the 1990's for example, and people knew what they were doing.

Connolly on the other hand, has a lot more traffic, and there is no muppetry with people walking on tracks taking snaps there for a reason. They know that drivers are worried about suicide risks and jumpers and exercise due consideration.

And yes.....when someone points, there are three fingers pointing back and a thumb pointed up at the heavens.

steamengine

Chrisplayfair wrote: »

It's really sad to see that the railway has been turned into a place of danger, where lyes nothing but sad people who worry about what others are doing rather than what they're doing themselves.

I will certainly not have anyone make allegations regarding my personal status on the internet. It's clear cyber bullying. Whether its jealously or they don't have anything better to do, it's the latter.

Welcome to boards - hope you stick around - your rail photography is brilliant !!!

Chrisplayfair

steamengine wrote: »

Welcome to boards - hope you stick around - your rail photography is brilliant !!!

I intend too...Thanks for the comments

Niles

I think this day and age it goes without saying that you don't climb up signal posts and the like. As lxflyer says such actions only serve to damage the relationship between the rail operators and the enthusiast community, not to mention setting a bad example for others.

Worryingly it seems to have already set a trend, noticed in that video of 086 leaving Connolly there's actually a photographer jumping from a signal. :eek:

Chrisplayfair

That'll give the Fishwives somethin to moan about now...

cmore123

May I step up to the plate and criticise not only whatever brainless moron graffitie'd 186, but also just about everything on the railway that doesn't move.

Regarding photographers, Judgement day mentioned all the H & S stuff that's about nowadays - true, but for all of our protection and must be obeyed irrespective of our opinions.

And as for criticising - in any way - those who work to maintain the stuff the RPSI has, these are volunteers, and few in number. Nobody who is not a member has any right to criticse what they do or don't do. In preservation, people either roll their sleevs up and dedicate their weekends to restoring and maintaining things, or they don't. Those who do, have a say. Those who don't, either join the RPSI (or whatever organisation) or shut up.

Downpatrick is a separate organisation. Losty above posts that you can drive there etc, but maybe doen't make it clear that it has to be subject to training etc, as they (as you might expect) have their own safety case and operating licence like RPSI or NIR or IE - but al are welcome to train to do these things.

lord lucan

Karsini wrote: »

Maybe we should take on another mod? Victor can't be here all the time.

Whilst not wanting to talk about Mod issues,that's only half the solution. If people can't be civil and have a constructive chat/debate online then there's no hope. Many other forums on Boards,much busier than here,have very few issues but Trains seem to bring out the worst in posters.

lord lucan

lord lucan wrote: »

Many other forums on Boards,much busier than here,have very few issues but Trains seem to bring out the worst in posters.

Unfortunately so and I don't understand why either. Then again I know very few enthusiasts in real life so maybe I'm missing something?

flyingsnail

Karsini wrote: »

Unfortunately so and I don't understand why either. Then again I know very few enthusiasts in real life so maybe I'm missing something?

Outside of this thread we all seem to have been getting along quite well recently

foggy_lad

starhillroad wrote: »

A cameraman with obvious experience of railway safety standards on a signal pole ladder is a lot less to worry about than a vandalising skanger in fairness. fool and a menace to any railway operation

The only problem is that the cameraman should be seen to lead by example, but in this aim to be 'holier than thou', what was once safe and accepted is now not tolerated. Granted its a more litigious culture, but what happened to common sense. such camera weilding enthusiasts are allowed free access and free reign in stations and beyond obviously because of their "connections" with whom it can be assumed they share a portion of the profits they make from their photographs.

Its hardly as if there were scores of railway enthusiasts suing the backside off CIE, British Rail and its descendant companies before, and its not happening now. It gives the impression that it is ok to trespass on the railway as long as you are doing something interesting like taking pictures or making videos or laying pennys on the track etc

Some leeway should be given, although I can't blame Irish Rail staff for being paranoid from time to time, after all its their necks on the line, not the likes of Chairman Lynch in his Ivory Tower in Heuston.

No leeway should be given! No person should be allowed enter any railway property or other state property weilding any form of camera without being challenged and told photography is forbidden without prior written authorisation and proper prior notice to all intending passengers that there will be people taking pictures on the premises

kingshankly

Trespassing aside nobody is allowed on or near the line with the exceptions of platforms unless the have appropriate safety shoes and hi vis vest pluse a certificate in personal track safety

starhillroad

foggy_lad wrote:

No leeway should be given! No person should be allowed enter any railway property or other state property weilding any form of camera without being challenged and told photography is forbidden without prior written authorisation and proper prior notice to all intending passengers that there will be people taking pictures on the premises

I'll be as polite as I possibly can in response to this.

This is not Eastern Europe pre 1989.

This is Ireland. We bend rules, we don't break them. There is an inherent intolerance of zero tolerance.

Cookie_Monster

foggy_lad wrote: »

No leeway should be given! No person should be allowed enter any railway property or other state property weilding any form of camera without being challenged and told photography is forbidden without prior written authorisation and proper prior notice to all intending passengers that there will be people taking pictures on the premises

grow up. public place, you can take photos all you want once complying with access restriction (ie on train / platform etc is fine) and there's nothing the likes of you and your moan can do about it.

Niles

Father Jack Hackett wrote: »

Same when you see people wandering all over railway lines in the picture that was posted a few minutes ago there hi

ANY COMMENTS FOLKS???? (****)

It's ironic - the photographer must have been standing on the PW in order to take it.