If you are pregnant , don't bother with MY school

Cedrus

Delancey wrote: »

What is to be society's ' moral compass ' when it comes to teenage pregnancy ?
It seems to me that we have all become totally immersed in the view that our past treatment of the matter was utterly backward/dickensian/guilt ridden , etc.
Now to question or criticise this liberal consensus is to invite the wrath of hordes down upon oneself - now call me an old-fashioned git but children having children no longer seems to be viewed as undesirable - in otherwords there is no shame attached .
......................................................................................................
Not suggesting that is appropriate of course but have we moved too far to the ' liberal ' agenda ?

It's hardly become desirable for children to be pregnant but when it happens it's up to the adults to pick up the slack. In the first instance the parents and if we are to claim to be a society then all adults must follow to ensure both mother and childs lifes are better. There certainly is also a degree of shame, this may well be why the girl at the centre of this thread felt the need to move from her previous school, but I don't see why you think 'shame' is a good thing after the fact.

I would say that we have not moved too far and in some respects certainly not far enough to the 'liberal' agenda, the laundries are shut but there is no alternative that this girl can rely on. As has been pointed out she didn't have an abortion (she couldn't without leaving the country) all she wants for now is to go to school.

humberklog

gypsy_rose wrote: »

Well yeah, obviously, cos it was on LiveLine, the Last Word, etc. It's only become a big deal because of that judgemental bollocks of a principal in the first place.

Keeping your nose out of other's affairs starts and ends with one's self. The principal shoulda known this too.

micropig

micropig wrote: »

She got an education in another school. She also got a home tutor when she was in late pregnancy. She was not denied an education.

She did not match the criteria for this school. Why is she so determined to go to this particular school, especially half way through the leaving cert cycle? Her only reason is because her friends are there. She had only 6th year to go, she could have just knuckled down to here studies in a school sympathetic to her predicament.

B*llocks to them and their sh*tty criteria. They should clean up their church before they start looking down on others. It should be absolute none of their business if this girl has a kid or not, except for maybe if she is pregnant while attending school in case of a medical emergency and/or for insurance purposes.

Honest to god, only in Ireland would we have a religion controlling our schools in the year 2012. A religion i might also add which has fundamentally FAILED the Irish people with its web of deceit, its abuse of human dignity and the subsequent cover up's.

If they have any respect for people and remorse for their actions they would just get lost and keep their nose out of peoples lives. They SHOULD NOT get to decide who goes to what school and for how long. If this government has any cop on they'll cut the strings loose and rid us of the church's integration within education and start running a proper discrimination free education system that works for a change.

micropig

mishkalucy wrote: »

Was this the school she was in previous to getting pregnant?

.

Yes

micropig

Deleted User wrote: »

B*llocks to them and their sh*tty criteria. They should clean up their church before they start looking down on others. It should be absolute none of their business if this girl has a kid or not except for maybe if she is pregnant while attending school in case of a medical emergency and/or for insurance purposes.

Honest to god, only in Ireland would we have a religion controlling our schools in the year 2012. A religion i might also add which had fundamentally FAILED the Irish people with its web of deceit, its abuse of human dignity and the subsequent cover up's.

If they have any respect for people and remorse for their actions they would just get lost and keep their nose out of peoples lives. They SHOULD NOT get to decide who goes to what school and for how long. If this government has any cop on we'll cut their strings loose and start running a proper discrimination free education system that works for a change.

then don't send you children to the school they run

omega666

eviltwin wrote: »

So a girl gets pregnant she can't go to school. She can't have an abortion. She claims welfare and is forever classed a scrounger and slapper by the ones who put obstacles in her way in the first place. She might as well jump in front of a bus.

you know perfectly well that she was not stopped getting an education.
She was refused admission to ONE particular school and when refused
she went to another one and finished her education.

I don't know why people are thanking your posts, just shows that sheep will thank anything.

eviltwin

omega666 wrote: »

you know perfectly well that she was not stopped getting an education.
She was refused admission to ONE particular school and when refused
she went to another one and finished her education.

I don't know why people are thanking your posts, just shows that sheep will thank anything.

Have you tried getting a school place midcycle? Very hard to do. She was lucky to get one but seeing as she was pregnant could have done without the stress. There was no need for any of it. Mountains out of molehills, the girl was pregnant not selling drugs.

eviltwin

micropig wrote: »

then don't send you children to the school they run

Not an option for a lot of parents

Smidge

micropig wrote: »

.

Yes

So this girl had been in this school for a number of years and as you say had friends there. So to make your point she was expected to leave this school, as you say, half way through her LC year. STRESSFUL

Leave the friends that she will surely need at this difficult time. STRESSFUL

Are pregnant women not supposed to avoid stress???

Or do this not apply to her as clearly she doesn't deserve the same standards?

Don't tell me she wasn't discriminated against, it won't wash

Delancey

omega666 wrote: »

just shows that sheep will thank anything.

How eloquent , how accurate - well I DID say that questioning the liberal agenda would invite the wrath of the hordes.........:)

hattoncracker

micropig wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

B*llocks to them and their sh*tty criteria. They should clean up their church before they start looking down on others. It should be absolute none of their business if this girl has a kid or not except for maybe if she is pregnant while attending school in case of a medical emergency and/or for insurance purposes.

Honest to god, only in Ireland would we have a religion controlling our schools in the year 2012. A religion i might also add which had fundamentally FAILED the Irish people with its web of deceit, its abuse of human dignity and the subsequent cover up's.

If they have any respect for people and remorse for their actions they would just get lost and keep their nose out of peoples lives. They SHOULD NOT get to decide who goes to what school and for how long. If this government has any cop on we'll cut their strings loose and start running a proper discrimination free education system that works for a change.

then don't send you children to the school they run

She didn't.. She's in another school... She complained about their reasons for Not being admitted.. Theyre discriminatory.. The school is run badly, by one man and his son, no BOM, and no published admissions policy.

When questioned by the Ombudsman for Children, he as good as told her to keep her nose out of his school, he is operating under the assumption that he is answerable to no one.

Regardless of how you feel about teenage pregnancy, you cannot deny he is in the wrong.

micropig

micropig wrote: »

then don't send you children to the school they run

They have a certain amount of influence on every school from what i can see. I went to a vocational school and I had to attend mass with the school on numerous occasions.

Now that hopefully might have changed the last few years but i think if Catholic/Muslim/Protestant/etc orders wish to have a religious ethos within their schools then they should be PRIVATE and not state funded and even at that there should be strong legislation overruling any crackpot discriminating decisions like this.

hattoncracker

tipp_Gunner wrote: »

micropig wrote: »

then don't send you children to the school they run

They have a certain amount of influence on every school from what i can see. I went to a vocational school and I had to attend mass with the school on numerous occasions.

Now that hopefully might have changed the last few years but i think if Catholic/Muslim/Protestant/etc orders wish to have a religious ethos within their schools then they should be PRIVATE and not state funded and even at that there should be strong legislation overruling any crackpot discriminating decisions like this.

I went to a VEC school and we said an our father at assembly every morning.

K-9

The girl is amazing, an example. Young, pregnant teen mother battling through the odds.

That threatens many in AH for some reason. Stereotypes challenged is very endangering for some.

hondasam

mishkalucy wrote: »

So this girl had been in this school for a number of years and as you say had friends there. So to make your point she was expected to leave this school, as you say, half way through her LC year. STRESSFUL

Leave the friends that she will surely need at this difficult time. STRESSFUL

Are pregnant women not supposed to avoid stress???

Or do this not apply to her as clearly she doesn't deserve the same standards?

Don't tell me she wasn't discriminated against, it won't wash

The young person had attended two previous post primary schools. She changed school in October 2008, after completing her Junior Certificate as she was unhappy in that school.
She attended the second post primary school for a short period but stopped attending as she did not settle there and then worked for a short period. In 2009 she became aware that she was pregnant. She made a decision that she wanted to return to school and her preference was to attend School A as she had friends attending that school and also wanted to attend a
school outside the city. S

She was actually not attending any school when she got pregnant. I don't think she ever attended this school.

LH Pathe

Is it not enough that they're allowed have sex at such an age now. Give em an inch man.. Reeks to me as wanting to be seen as having had sex; from miles away. practically shouting it out loud, but obviously its worse than that as she got up the duff too

girls see that n they think it's the done thing/ want one too; good luck with that.

Funny I see absolutely nothing in Article 42 of our constitution (education), which would remotely suggest that pupils must follow a strict religious ethos for the given school they attend.

Law > AND != Religion

Law 1-0 Religion

Smidge

LH Pathe wrote: »

Is it not enough that they're allowed have sex at such an age now. Give em an inch man.. Reeks to me as wanting to be seen as having had sex; from miles away. practically shouting it out loud, but obviously its worse than that as she got up the duff too

girls see that n they think it's the done thing/ want one too; good luck with that.

I love how that is done by "these girls" in an Immaculate Conception fashion;)

micropig

eviltwin wrote: »

Have you tried getting a school place midcycle? Very hard to do. She was lucky to get one but seeing as she was pregnant could have done without the stress. There was no need for any of it. Mountains out of molehills, the girl was pregnant not selling drugs.

so, she got one place but wanted 2.

mishkalucy wrote: »

So this girl had been in this school for a number of years and as you say had friends there. So to make your point she was expected to leave this school, as you say, half way through her LC year. STRESSFUL

Leave the friends that she will surely need at this difficult time. STRESSFUL

Are pregnant women not supposed to avoid stress???

Or do this not apply to her as clearly she doesn't deserve the same standards?

Don't tell me she wasn't discriminated against, it won't wash

she had never been to this school before. it's obvious you haven't read the report.

K-9

hondasam wrote: »

She was actually not attending any school when she got pregnant. I don't think she ever attended this school.

I remember a girl of 14 or so getting expelled for getting pregnant in my school, more than 20 years ago now. Felt sorry for her then, never mind now.

Ireland has managed to reduce the teen pregnancy rate so the best hope is education. Ostracising women who get pregnant doesn't work, I'm from a generation who saw the punishment teens got for getting pregnant.

They probably seen it as an improvement from the Magdalene Laundries.

omega666

Deleted User wrote: »

Funny I see absolutely nothing in Article 42 of our constitution (education), which would remotely suggest that pupils must follow a strict religious ethos for the given school they attend.

Law > AND != Religion

Law 1-0 Religion

why would there be??

It already been confirmed by Ombudsman that there is currently no enrolment legislation that would prevent a school from acting in this way.
The school was 100% within their rights.

Law 0-1 Religion

LH Pathe

LH Pathe wrote: »

Is it not enough that they're allowed have sex at such an age now. Give em an inch man.. Reeks to me as wanting to be seen as having had sex; from miles away. practically shouting it out loud, but obviously its worse than that as she got up the duff too

girls see that n they think it's the done thing/ want one too; good luck with that.

WOW. Hold the back page....Teenagers in sexual urges shocker!!! :rolleyes:

Im pretty sure most teenagers dont want the burden of being a parent at such a tender age if they can help it and the guilty party in all of this is probably our attitude as a society to sex. it needs to change. we shouldnt be ashamed of sex but society shouldnt be over sexualised which tv and the media are very culpable of.

The issue here is not the fact the girl is sexually active or is having or has a child, it is whether the decision taken by one man to stop a child from enrolling in a school citing 'The catholic ethos' of the school as his reason for preventing her enrolement due to the fact that she has or has had a baby.

quite frankly this is discrimination and the man is a bigot.

LH Pathe

it's not a long wait til after the leaving. In my opinion underage.. sex is the new rebellion where previous forms of rebellion are played out; that is my view. And it's only getting younger.. grant her entry if only to expel her. It's trashy imo, I'd be making assumptions about her background.

eviltwin

omega666 wrote: »

why would there be??

It already been confirmed by Ombudsman that there is currently no enrolment legislation that would prevent a school from acting in this way.
The school was 100% within their rights.

Law 0-1 Religion

This has nothing to do with religion. There is no sin in being a teen parent. Its a sin to have premarital sex so why not chuck all the sexually active students out. Better still chuck out the ones who are not regular mass goers, who take the lords name etc.....all sins too

Don't hide your bigotry behind religion. It makes you look a fool.

Smidge

LH Pathe wrote: »

it's not a long wait til after the leaving. In my opinion underage.. sex is the new rebellion where previous forms of rebellion are played out; that is my view. And it's only getting younger.. grant her entry if only to expel her. It's trashy imo, I'd be making assumptions about her background.

omega666

omega666 wrote: »

why would there be??

It already been confirmed by Ombudsman that there is currently no enrolment legislation that would prevent a school from acting in this way.
The school was 100% within their rights.

Law 0-1 Religion

Its general discrimination even if it isnt stated in enrolment legislation. Can he deny a traveller entry so? Or a muslim who grew up in ireland?

LH Pathe

mishkalucy wrote: »

If it baffles you so; threefold then I'll be making assumptions about you

eviltwin

LH Pathe wrote: »

it's not a long wait til after the leaving. In my opinion underage.. sex is the new rebellion where previous forms of rebellion are played out; that is my view. And it's only getting younger.. grant her entry if only to expel her. It's trashy imo, I'd be making assumptions about her background.

And what assumptions might they be?

Smidge

eviltwin wrote: »

This has nothing to do with religion. There is no sin in being a teen parent. Its a sin to have premarital sex so why not chuck all the sexually active students out. Better still chuck out the ones who are not regular mass goers, who take the lords name etc.....all sins too

Don't hide your bigotry behind religion. It makes you look a fool.

It is also a sin, as you may well know from the recent diatribe of a certain female politician(lets not go there;)) for married people to have sex if it is not solely for the purpose of procreation.
It is also a sin for a women to refuse her husband his "marital rights"

Damn, we bitches be fu*ked:D:D

micropig

hondasam wrote: »

She was actually not attending any school when she got pregnant. I don't think she ever attended this school.

You are attributing a post made by Mishkalucy to me in this post. I did not say what you have quoted me as saying if you check back.