Aircoach Dublin-Cork express

SandyfordGuy

The two Volvo based Caeteno Levante's will certainly not be coming to Aircoach now. The two vehicles are being advertised for sale by the company who leased them to First in the UK.

https://www.santanderusedassets.co.uk/pages/CF014/asset/11264.asp

There is still one Levante that is not in Dublin that is still in First though, and that is 23504, 23501/2/3 are already operating for Aircoach. There is supposed to be a Plaxton Panther that is in the depot as well with a toilet but it hasn't been seen in the wild as of yet.

No other news on new vehicles.

bk

I don't think 4 or 5, 6 year old toilet equipped buses will be enough to compete with the new GoBus threat.

They need 100% toilet equipped fleet so that they can advertise their service as toilet equipped and compete.

Aircoach on facebook did say to are aiming to have a fully toilet equipped fleet to Cork. So the question is just when.

Perhaps they are also looking to buy/hire a couple of new toilet equipped buses.

devnull

bk wrote: »

I don't think 4 or 5, 6 year old toilet equipped buses will be enough to compete with the new GoBus threat.

Aircoach on facebook did say to are aiming to have a fully toilet equipped fleet to Cork. So the question is just when.

I don't either but that seems to be their response, hence why the six year old Levante's came over in the last month or so. That is not to mention the fact they are much more uncomfortable than the vehicles they replaced, even if they do have toilets and the others did not.

All the signs that have been heard suggest that the other vehicles coming into the operation will be further First Cymru vehicles from National Express work, all of which are between 5.5-8.5 years old, those Levante's were the newest, they were registered at the end of December 2006.

SandyfordGuy

bk wrote: »

I don't think 4 or 5, 6 year old toilet equipped buses will be enough to compete with the new GoBus threat.

They need 100% toilet equipped fleet so that they can advertise their service as toilet equipped and compete.

Aircoach on facebook did say to are aiming to have a fully toilet equipped fleet to Cork. So the question is just when.

Perhaps they are also looking to buy/hire a couple of new toilet equipped buses.

That is obvious without doubt, they need to offer a much better solution to the toilets problems that they have to date as it simply isn't good enough to cope with what is going to be thrown at it.

Even as one of the biggest admirers of what Aircoach have done for public transport in this country, I now believe they are very much on the back foot unless they have some brand new vehicles up their sleeves which are being kept very very quiet.

If they do not have a plan and are furiously trying to work one out as I type this, then it may be months before we see any proper response, such is the time needed to procure new vehicles, by that time they could be very much second best.

Now it really is time for First to either put up, or sell up.

Sponge Bob

FWIW a toiletless express bus is ( IMO) perfectly all right on a run of under 2 hours...so it may be that Aircoach have a fiendishly cunning plan to launch Dublin Airport - Dundalk or Dublin Airport - Waterford that they have not yet chosen to share with us.

bk

Sponge Bob wrote: »

FWIW a toiletless express bus is ( IMO) perfectly all right on a run of under 2 hours...so it may be that Aircoach have a fiendishly cunning plan to launch Dublin Airport - Dundalk or Dublin Airport - Waterford that they have not yet chosen to share with us.

Or maybe Limerick -> Dublin -> Dublin Airport I was thinking *.

Would allow them to make use of their existing buses, while bringing in brand new buses on the Cork route.

* Yes I'm aware it is about 2 hours 30 mins, so ideally they should have toilets on buses there too, but at least it isn't as long as Cork 3 hours and at least on the Limerick route they wouldn't be facing any competition with toilets.

devnull

As I stated many times before, really, how much quicker can the Limerick service go than what it is now under Dublin Coach?

bk

devnull wrote: »

As I stated many times before, really, how much quicker can the Limerick service go than what it is now under Dublin Coach?

It can't but it could bring you to Dublin Airport and it could offer late night services. Neither of which are offered by Dublin Coach.

Plus competition is good, it would be good to have two stronger competitors on this route, just like there is to Galway and Belfast and soon to Cork.

devnull

If they got in there before Dublin Coach I'd say they have a chance, but now there is no chance, there are already five operators operating public transport to Limerick.

Cash is tight and if you expand too much too soon you will encounter problems if the company is loss making anyway. The first priority for Aircoach should be to sort out the website and deal with the Cork and Belfast routes.

The thing is though it's a very key crossroads for the company here, First have to either decide they want to invest heavily in the company to attempt to return it to past glories or sell up/pull out. Carrying on as they have been for the last few years I don't think is an option after today's news.

Also strange as it seems, the fact they were encouraging online booking for the last few months may work against them. Because some people are of the impression you are required to do so. They now need to advertise you can buy on board as well, now this is an advantage over the competition, it's quite ironic really after all the pushing they did of online booking they now are going to need to do the reverse and shout about the fact they are flexible and you can just turn up to buy a ticket.

bk

devnull wrote: »

If they got in there before Dublin Coach I'd say they have a chance, but now there is no chance, there are already five operators operating public transport to Limerick.

Well I was surprised they relaunched the Belfast route rather then going for Limerick. They face much steeper and more entrenched competition in the form of BE and Ulster Bus on the Belfast route, including their use of bus stations.

The competition on the Limerick route is much lighter, Dublin Coach are only new too. They don't operate 24 hours like BE/UB, they don't operate to Dublin Airport unlike BE/UB and they don't operate out of bus stations, unlike BE/UB.

Dublin Coach seems like much less competition then BE/UB on the Belfast route.

The only reason I can think of is that the crappy Kelly Travel service has the second license and thus Aircoach can't get a Limerick license. Just speculation on my part, but sucks if true. Kelly Travel should be forced to offer an extensive service or hand back their license if true.

Alternatively another company should be given a license that operate at the hours Kelly Travel don't operate (i.e. the rest of the day).

devnull

There are several reasons for the Belfast service relaunching, I believe they already have a base up there and offices up there with a number of staff who were kept on after the Belfast route was closed down firstly. They also must have a depot of some kind you would have thought and if these are on leases again that have years to run, it may have been decided to get some use out of them rather than paying for what would be essentially wasted money.

I do agree though that the Belfast market is a hard one to crack, you have two huge state companies teaming up together on the bus side of things and all the fun and games that has been happening with bus station access, and on the train side of things you have another two monopolies teaming up together as well to run a joint service, so that's not going to be easy to tackle.

The thing with Dublin to Limerick is that the loads are spread over JJ Kavanagh, Dublin Coach, Irish Rail and Bus Eireann as well as the Kelly Travel service. Starting a new service on a corridor you have never run before is a risk. This is proven in the case with GoBus, they clearly felt that they would be facing a tough and expensive battle to get established on Dublin to Cork, hence why they partnered up with BE in the end rather than taking on two big boys in BE and Aircoach.

I agree on the Kelly travel point, I don't think they're doing anything wrong, but as has been said before, there are creative ways to prevent competition if an all day operator gets a non stop license, then another operator runs two service each day just to block up a license. The all day operator would be delighted to see such thing happens, as it prevents proper competition and there would be incentives to try and get a small operator to provide exactly that to protect it. This is not happening now but if the NTA will not accept a new license because Kelly Travel exists, then sooner or later one operator may try and push such rule to their advantage on other corridors..

devnull

Aircoach have now reduced their fares to €9 single from Dublin to Cork and also reduced child and airport fares.

SandyfordGuy

I notice their Facebook page says it's until the end of September and availability is limited.

They have updated their banner on their website with a totally different colour blue from the rest of the site to advertise the fact, it looks completely out of place.

bk

So it turns out that the €9 fares are if you book online only.

God are Aircoach really this incompetent!!

Aircoach's strength is that they allow walk up tickets, unlike GoBus. But by doing this they are getting their customers use to booking online, which means people might be just as likely to book with GoBus online. Stupid.

At the very least they need to drop the walk up single fare from €15 to €11.

Also if Aircoach are going down the online bookings route, they need to allow bookings much closer to the departure, preferably 15 minutes before departure. Currently they only allow bookings up till 5pm the previous day. And they need to allow for the ticket to be shown on the smart phone. Many people don't have printers any more.

bk

So it looks like Aircoach are up for a fight, but how far will they take it.

Will they just try and weather the competition out with their existing coaches, perhaps until the leases are up and then get new toilet equipped coaches.

Or will they get new toilet equipped coaches now.

Suppose it depends on how long is left on the leases and what early breakage fees there might be.

Alternatively they might look at operating yet another shorter route, where the toiletless Jonkheeres would be fine or perhaps they could retrofit toilets onto the Jonck's.

SandyfordGuy

Actually it's a rather smart strategy if you ask me, it targets the customers who could possibly switch to a rival, who would need to book online anyway whilst not losing revenue from the ones who prefer paying a walk-up fare.

It also encourages people to book online, so they can mail them in future with special offers, countering a similar approach of which GoBE are no doubt planning to take in future. This is an excellent response to that.

It also most likely offsets any revenue lost by the €1 reduction of fares of that of GoBE. It's a very very smart move and it's good for both revenue, changing habits of customers and keeping the fight with GoBE.

It's no different to trains in most of Europe, online, booked ahead fares are cheaper, ones booked on the day are more expensive. Same with MegaBus and all other coach operators

They still have the walk-up advantage and giving you the option and allowing people to SAVE money by booking ahead and that is a very very good thing. The fact is reducing walk-up fares when there is no reason to is simply going to burn cash reserves quicker and play in to BE's hands. There is no real reason to do it.

Maybe Aircoach have other plans, it would be unwise of them to show the opposition their hand too soon as that gives them time to counter it.

devnull

bk wrote: »

So it turns out that the €9 fares are if you book online only. God are Aircoach really this incompetent!!

From a customer point of view better to offer more expensive walk-up options than offer none at all. This strategy is to counter the online offer from the competition, not to bankrupt the company.

Aircoach's strength is that they allow walk up tickets, unlike GoBus. But by doing this they are getting their customers use to booking online, which means people might be just as likely to book with GoBus online.

Very unlikely when the price is cheaper. People will just stick to what they know unless they have a bad experience, the other has a better timetable, or can offer them something better. Aircoach is still cheaper so most people will not switch.

Both companies will be running a loss leader on this service for the first few months when such prices are being offered and taking a financial hit, the more financial hit you take, the stronger that makes your opponent.

bk

devnull wrote: »

Very unlikely when the price is cheaper. People will just stick to what they know unless they have a bad experience, the other has a better timetable, or can offer them something better. Aircoach is still cheaper so most people will not switch.

I think the toilets are a significant advantage for GoBus and will see many people switch over to them.

Personally I'm quiet willing to pay €2 more for the guarantee of a toilet onboard. I'm already saving €60 over the train, €2 for a little bit of piece of mind is fine for me.

devnull

I know but there has to be some kind of financial sensibility right now, such fares are not under any circumstance going to be sustainable long term as I've said before, if you go too low you end up financially crippling your company in order to win the war,

dowlingm

I don't know - they are matching Gobe's price with Gobe's conditions, plus they offer walkups. Why should they erode their profit margin by offering fares Gobe don't? Walkups means harder to plan capacity plus cash handling = extra cost.

J_Dublin15

It's interesting to see that the news items on the Aircoach site of late are TERRIBLE. They are lacking in detail, very half-baked and feature abysmal grammar and spelling with absolutely zero paragraphing.

It's one thing to have a bad website, but it's another for them to have a poor standard of English in a role which involves communicating with the public. It really is unforgivable and gives of an impression that they are a bunch of amateurs.

http://www.aircoach.ie/aircoach.news.php

Any of the last ten news articles are littered with grammar and spelling errors and sometimes do not make sense whatsoever. Seriously what kind of people do they have working there? Do they not even bother to proof-read what they post.

Take the one about the new service for instance, they could sell it a hell of a lot better than that, eg:

Aircoach is delighted to introduce new promotional pricing on our Dublin Airport - Dublin City - Cork Express route for the month of September.

Passengers who book online before the end of the month for travel any date will be able to avail of fares of just €9 adult single and €7 child single for travel from Dublin to/from Cork with return tickets priced at €18 for adults and €14 for children.

Discounted fares are also on offer from Dublin Airport to/from Cork with adult singles priced at just €15 and children at €9. Return trips offer even greater value, with adult returns available for just €25 and child returns priced at €18.

Not only does booking online save you money, it also guarantees you a seat on the timed journey of your choice whist also being flexible. Passengers may avail of earlier or later services than specified on the same date as booked without extra charge, but seats are only guaranteed on services specified at time of booking.

If you would like any further information or have any queries on our new Dublin to Cork promotion please do not hesitate to contact our Customer Service Team on 01 844 7118 between 09:00 and 17:30, 7 days a week, or by email at info@aircoach.ie where we will be pleased to assist you.

To keep up to date with the latest Aircoach service news and special offers and take part in exclusive competitions you may also follow us on twitter and like us on Facebook.

What you actually have is:

Book online on any Aircoach's hourly service between Dublin City and Cork City between now and the end of September and travel for just €9, from Dublin Airport to Cork City for just €15. Excellent return fares also on offer why wait go online now and book. Remember book now and travel anytime.

The website is effectively your sales pitch to customers, that is what Aircoach need to realise. What would you think if a company left a leaflet in your letterbox which was full of bad grammar and spelling? It would not create the best first impression would it?

I know that this is yet another moan on this thread, but I thought i would post this as I didn't see anyone post it yet and thought I would bring it up as it as I can be a grammar nit-picker and such thing really annoys me.

bk

One thing Aircoach should think of doing is adding a stop close to BusAras/Connolly.

The new GoBe service might be more attractive to people who will start/end their journey by DART or Commuter train from Connolly, bus from busaras or Red Luas line.

Aircoach pass there anyway on their way to and from the port tunnel and out to the airport. If they add a stop in this area, in addition to the city center stops, it might be stop them losing some customers to GoBe.

Likewise I think it would benefit GoBE to have stops on the quays near O'Connell St.

devnull

I actually earlier made comment about the content of the news articles and that article in particular being half hearted, but as you say the articles going back a couple of months or so are very poor. It's almost like the people who are writing the articles has absolutely no idea of how to provide good communication to the public, something which is essential in a public facing role.

The one below is woeful too:
http://www.aircoach.ie/news.article.php?ID=371 (Note bad spelling)

There's also now another PR fail::
http://www.facebook.com/aircoach.ie/posts/368439943226988

Nothing really to gleen from it other than the fact someone else has had their email ignored on several occasions and the fact customer service are clearly not allowed to post on social networking sites.

All it seems to show is deep down they don't trust such people doing so. What they need to do is to hire someone who can do Twitter, Facebook, Emails and the website in the style of article wrote by J_Dublin15, it would give off a much better impression of the company. Such person would pay for themselves.

SandyfordGuy

The last thing a service needs is another stop, it's supposed to be non stop and the current stopping pattern is as much as it should have, else you will start having requests form people to stop at Heuston, the Red Cow and all these kind of places, it's better the way the situation is now, after all, Batchelors Walk is not THAT far from Tara Street or Abbey Street.

As for the PR from Aircoach it is rather poor, that I would agree with. I wouldn't say the marketing itself is bad, I don't think it is as bad as it used to be and the email shots they are sending out suggests that they finally are starting to up their game when it comes to this, I would say they are using an external company but it's good to see some progress. I do agree though however that there is still room for improvement on general customer communications but their marketing is much better and people are too critical on here of it.

Facebook is not a pretty sight at the moment though and there's several complaints on there that haven't really been that well addressed. I wonder if they have recruited some new customer care guys in Belfast, with the cost of wages lower and are not paying them too much in order to save money? Clearly they have added some new staff as the poor articles is something that is only very recent, some of the previous articles were very well written, I wonder where the person is who wrote them now?

If customer service are not posting on Facebook who is? Is it management? If so then it's rather disappointing they are not more pro-active like other companies. Dublin Bus, for all of their many faults and telling everyone to email them, at least embrace social media a little bit more and are more interactive.

kieran4003

I only looked at the Aircoach Facebook page last night. There appears to be a growing rate of complaints and most of the time there appears to be no response from Aircoach. What I found most disturbing was some posts made last week by a person claiming to have worked for Aircoach in the past and criticising the company. These posts were just left there by Aircoach - It's not going to do them any favours.


I think the Go Bus page on the other hand is far superior, they seem to keep on top of all the posts, 'like' positive feedback and promote the company really well by posting photos of their fleet, staff etc. BE & IR pages are also highly commendable.

devnull

There is also several people also making it known that they are unhappy with the fact that they appear to have emails ignored which backs up what some others have said on here about exactly the same thing. Also the tone of some of the replies is less than friendly and whoever is answering sounds annoyed. You need to remain friendly and nice to customers all the time and they don't seem to be very welcoming of constructive criticism, something I see one gentleman has pointed out.

I looked at Twitter and it seems they are not answering any questions at all on there and are just using it for announcements etc. As you say GoBus on the other hand is far better when it comes to social networking, IR and BE are not bad (but better than Aircoach), but they don't allow you to post your own new discussions, which I think is not really a good thing.

J_Dublin15

kieran4003 wrote: »

I only looked at the Aircoach Facebook page last night. There appears to be a growing rate of complaints and most of the time there appears to be no response from Aircoach.

I've actually looked at that page this morning, and there is a thread that seems to be developing with regards to people being unhappy that there is no response from Aircoach to emails etc something that I have experienced once before as I brought up here before, and I've read others have experienced.

What staggered me was the reply from Aircoach: "I can assure you Aircoach reply to all queries that are received, you may find that due to spam filtering and suspected virus emails sometimes not all emails are received and therefore that it why we also have both a UK and Ireland telephone number at which you can ring and the Customer Services Team can answer any query that you may have."

From what I have read on here and the several people, including myself that have posted a response to that post, that couldn't be further from the truth and if something is blocking emails their end, then surely that is something they need to deal with? Yet it seems they are just washing their hands of the problem and putting it back to the customers end rather than pro-actively deal with issues that crop up.

devnull

They appear to have fixed a few of the issues with the website, although still issues are remaining.

How are the loads standing up now that the GoBus service is live?

SandyfordGuy

They replied to a question on their Facebook wall to a question saying: "Yes, we have toilets on our Express coach to Cork"

Clearly though, they still only have this on the coaches previously outlined unless I have missed something and they have got several additional coaches in the last few days?

Saying that GoBus only appear to have some of their Coaches with toilets also, as they've been hiring in many coaches from other operators, there is only one coach running in GoBE colours.

devnull

Seems that some new vehicles have arrived, a white 2006 Plaxton Panther was on the Cork run today. Unsure if there is any more than this one vehicle but it has a toilet.