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Mass Effect 3: The Ending(s) [** Spoilers **]
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Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »Or those two members of the Bioware team rumoured to have written it without consulting anyone else.
Say the rumor the entire ending sequence was written by just the two team members without consulting the rest was true, surely there would have been an opportunity for others to voice concerns before the game was sent to the publishers?
I was just wondering if there was any sort of review process of the game by the team once it was all written and that. Does this ever happen with games? I mean the staff holding a meeting and having a review of the game plot, story arcs, to look for inconsistencies and plot-holes before wrapping it up?
Whether it was the work of two or twenty two you'd think someone would have put up their hand in a meeting and asked things like "why the fcuk is the Normandy leaving Earth and wtf is up with our squadmates getting off the ship?"
I mean how would a writer just stick in a cutscene like that with no lead in reason and not think to them self why is this happening? 0 -
Say the rumor the entire ending sequence was written by just the two team members without consulting the rest was true, surely there would have been an opportunity for others to voice concerns before the game was sent to the publishers?
I was just wondering if there was any sort of review process of the game by the team once it was all written and that. Does this ever happen with games? I mean the staff holding a meeting and having a review of the game plot, story arcs, to look for inconsistencies and plot-holes before wrapping it up?
Whether it was the work of two or twenty two you'd think someone would have put up their hand in a meeting and asked things like "why the fcuk is the Normandy leaving Earth and wtf is up with our squadmates getting off the ship?" I mean how would a writer just stick in a cutscene like that with no lead in reason and not think to them self why is this happening?
The story goes that for most of the writing the whole team would get together and brainstorm/give feedback and whatnot, but that for the end sequence Casey Hudson and one other guy went into a room and wrote it without any input, and the voice actors were recording it by the time the rest of the team even knew what was going on.0 -
Regardless of whether they knew about it, there was absolutely nothing they could have done. He was the boss. He said it was happening this way. The end unfortunately.The story goes that for most of the writing the whole team would get together and brainstorm/give feedback and whatnot, but that for the end sequence Casey Hudson and one other guy went into a room and wrote it without any input, and the voice actors were recording it by the time the rest of the team even knew what was going on.
What could they have done? Go over Hudson's head and email Ray Muzyka about it? Know what happens to people like that?
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The indoctrination theory is built on the common theme of indoctrination throughout the whole series. There's no secret in that. Suggesting that Shepard is somehow immune to indoctrination is more nonsensical than us suggesting that he is indoctrinated. He has had more exposure to the reapers than all of the husks in the game put together remember.
Just noticed something on my second playthrough....the event which many people say disproves the Indoctrination Theory is that bit on Thessia with the Prothean VI. It says: "Indoctrinated presence detected" (or similar) when TIM and Kai Leng show up, and then closes down. Those who are anti-indoc theory say that if Shep was indoctrinated the VI would have detected and so would have closed down.
HOWEVER, there is a difference between undergoing indoctrination and being indoctrinated. TIM is obviously indoctrinated, as was Saren, but Shepard has been killing hundreds of Reapers and building up vast war assets for a counterattack on Reaper-held Earth. So clearly he isn't indoctrinated. It does not, however, rule out the possibility that he is undergoing indoctrination! I maintain that he is undergoing indoctrination and reaches a crisis point before the evilbadnotgood ending of the game, which would explain the destruction ending's extra scene if your assets were high enough. The Reapers attempt to placate his psyche with a choice- choose the path of Saren, the Illusive Man, (both of whom have fallen) or stick on the path you have been following for the three games. If Shepard chooses destroy, it is the right option. Why does he awaken in the destroy ending and not the synthesis or control endings? Also, why does he certainly die in the synthesis and control endings (he disintegrates), and not the destroy ending?
Also, notice Shepard's total subservience to the Catalyst. He simply does what it says, and does not question is obviously skewed logic, a fact which is made even more relevant by the relationship between EDI and Joker as well as the possible Geth/Quarian unity. Either a supermassive plot hole or else a symbol of the Reaper's control over Shepard, up until the superficial triple choice which the Catalyst grants him, and notice how biased the little bugger is against the Destroy (i.e the "break free" option)- "The Geth will be blown up, EDI will be blown up, you will blow up etc."
Those who believe the IT is tripe maintain that Shep is waking up on the Citadel but that is absolute hogwash. They maintain the IT is a leap of logic and unrealistic, but they insinuate that Shepard can survive a massive explosion (while being at the epicentre of said explosion), in space, and somehow be nestled in the debris of the Citadel/ land safely on Earth, with little armour, no breathing apparatus, a gun wound in the side and being in a bad shape in general! Plus, notice that Shepard actually wakes up in the destroy ending, which would have been impossible due to mass effect relay armageddon.
Also, there are other unusual coincidences/ schemes (Like why does Vega mention hearing "humming" on the Normandy? What is the purpose of this mention? Does Vega have tinnitus or something?? Did the Collectors place Indoc tech on the Normandy when they took over the ship in ME2?) and the surprising correlations between the words of the Rachni Queen and the dreams of Shepard. The Reapers are using the little kid to appeal to the inherently human Shepard. Humans naturally relate with children, and hate to see them suffer or similar. Hence why the Catalyst is the kid- its more relatable for Shepard. Not only because it is human-like, but because it is the kid from his "dreams"- its logic will appeal to him more if it is this kid.
P.S Bioware saying that they will not change the ending does not invalidate the indoctrination theory, guys. The IT is an interpretation of the ending how it is, and assumes that the indoctrination is not revealed until the destroy ending is chosen. You then wake up, go up into the Citadel, use the Crucible and kill every single reaper in the galaxy, of course via DLC. You probably get blown up in the process but hey.
Current ending imo is a placeholder for the real indoctrination surprise dlc.0 -
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Join Date:Posts: 33867
Do you honestly believe that Bioware would still be keeping it as a big secret, even now, after facing one of the biggest PR disasters in the history of gaming?
The accounting department of Bioware might disagree with you there
Controversial the saga of its ending may be, but Mass Effect 3's sales have not been hurt by this kerfuffle. Quite the opposite by the looks of things.Whether he lives or not doesn't really matter. What's important is that it makes sense. If there's some logical way he could live it would be fine.
Being on the Citadel while it explodes and furthermore, having to reenter Earth's atmosphere, presumably, like a dog clinging to a piece of driftwood going over Niagara Falls, is not something that one could survive.
He 'survived' the very same scenario at the start of Mass Effect 2. Plus if anything, it was less believable in #2 because that was very definitely in the depths of space, whereas at least on the Citadel you could argue they were in low orbit or something more survivable (ala those high-altitude parachutists)
Granted, he didn't survive as such in #2, but when he got the 6-million-dollar man treatment you could argue he was in a better shape to survive a repeat orbital sky-dive 0 -
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He 'survived' the very same scenario at the start of Mass Effect 2. Plus if anything, it was less believable in #2 because that was very definitely in the depths of space, whereas at least on the Citadel you could argue they were in low orbit or something more survivable (ala those high-altitude parachutists)
Granted, he didn't survive as such in #2, but when he got the 6-million-dollar man treatment you could argue he was in a better shape to survive a repeat orbital sky-dive
That's an interesting take on it alright, but why would he be alive? I mean, Bioware have stated over and over again that he won't survive after saving the galaxy (or what ever it is that he has just done). The only reason I can see for him to be alive would be to round house kick Harbinger in the quads once and for all.0 -
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Join Date:Posts: 33867
That's an interesting take on it alright, but why would he be alive? I mean, Bioware have stated over and over again that he won't survive after saving the galaxy (or what ever it is that he has just done). The only reason I can see for him to be alive would be to round house kick Harbinger in the quads once and for all.
Well assuming there's nothing to the Indoctrination Theory and what we got was the actual ending, I would guess it was simply done as a little Hollywood-style cocktease at the end. The fact you only got the breathing scene if you chose the Destroy option does make me think there's more to it than this.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZOyeFvnhiI&feature=related
Another indocrination video.
Specifically, an additional scene about the boy. I didn't know he ran into the building at the start (you can actually see him if you are quick enough) and then the building is blown up by the Reaper ray but he still survives.
Good video; I'm already a paid-up member to the Indoctrination Theory, but watching this new video simply re-confirmed what I already thought. That said, the Crappy Writing Theory is equally compelling; a lot of what happened was so cookie-cutter I could equally believe it was simply slapdish writing rather than some final, sneaky powerplay by the Reapers Always thought it strange they never tried to trick or turn Shephard mind you... 0 -
Good video; I'm already a paid-up member to the Indoctrination Theory, but watching this new video simply re-confirmed what I already thought. That said, the Crappy Writing Theory is equally compelling; a lot of what happened was so cookie-cutter I could equally believe it was simply slapdish writing rather than some final, sneaky powerplay by the Reapers Always thought it strange they never tried to trick or turn Shephard mind you...
I am also signed up to the theory - and although I think it was brave/clever...I do agree that it sets a dangerous precident that you don't get the real game ending out of the box.0 -
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he won't survive after saving the galaxy (or what ever it is that he has just done)
Granted, he didn't survive as such in #2, but when he got the 6-million-dollar man treatment you could argue he was in a better shape to survive a repeat orbital sky-dive
He didn't really survive at all I don't think. He wasn't in a coma or anything. He was seriously very dead.
Cybernetics or no, being exploded and then riding massive heavy exploding debris through the atmosphere when you're wearing basically, a heavy tracksuit isn't something you'd tend to shrug off.
Even aside from the tinfoil-hatedness of the Indoc theory, I don't think it would work as an ending to ME3. It'd be better than the current one alright, but they'd have plenty of plot holes to fill for it to make sense as the game currently is.
I certainly like elements of the Indoc theory.
Like how it better explains the nightmares with the kid burning and how it could follow Shep's mental progress (the downer after Thessia). Rather than it being a case of game designers getting ideas above their station and pretending they're artists, the dream sequences would have an actual use.
Even if they were considering pretending like they meant it all along, I think they'd be better off just scrapping everything after you Thanix Missile the destroyer in the face and start again.
More Harbinger. Lots more Harbinger.0 -
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