Mass Effect 3: The Ending(s) [** Spoilers **]

G.J.

Another thing I want to discount about the ending is how the 'Star Child' completely ruined the image of the Reapers portrayed by Sovereign. I watched that conversation again, and it is one of the best parts of the entire series I think.

There's a line I love from ME3, where they have boarded the Geth ship and the exchange between Joker and Shepard is brilliant -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7j8xuzWDzIc

Mossay

G.J. wrote: »

Another thing I want to discount about the ending is how the 'Star Child' completely ruined the image of the Reapers portrayed by Sovereign. I watched that conversation again, and it is one of the best parts of the entire series I think.

Yeah the vibe I always got from that conversation was that Sovereign and the reapers were plain evil, making sure people used the Mass Relays to reach the citadel which would inevitably become a core part of the galaxy's military strength and a base for their leadership--- then Sovereign could get the reaper army to jump into the citadel as it was a giant Mass Relay and decimate the galaxy's military and ability to retaliate effectively so they could eat everyone nom nom nom.

But rewatching it if you take away the villainous background music and ignore that creepy machine voice, its easier to believe the "star child's" explanation for why the reapers exist: making sure the people in the universe don't bone themselves by making an AI army that eradicates all life. The one saving grace about the reapers is that they only harvested the intelligent space-faring life, and let the "lower lifeforms" have their chance for the next 50,000 years. Rinse and repeat. Better than having an AI army that indiscriminately kills every form of life.

I still hate the Star Child though and I think he was used just because he was the cheapest (in terms of development resources) way of wrapping everything up after the script changes over the years, not to mention the script leak from last year. The citadel had to come from somewhere, hell the star child had to come from somewhere. Someone had to put those signal receivers on the Keeper's backs. It just felt like bioware decided they couldn't be arsed explaining it properly.

I think they should have stuck with the Dark Energy plot which was alluded to in Mass effect 2. I know some people moan and say "GUUUUAH! If by allude you mean that one single mission with the quarians?! pfft noob", but there was so much more from news broadcasts and bits of conversations.

Still though indoctrination could explain it all. Really enjoyed the story up till those last 5 minutes.

Zero-Cool

Just finished and it thought the game, as well as the whole series, was absolutely brilliant. As far as the ending, the only thing I didn't like was not really knowing what my decisions would actually mean. I picked Sythesis ending and was just a bit confused. Joker and Edi on that planet, both looking a bit green and 'synthesised' I spose. I want to know what would have changed if my Effective Military strength was lower (it was over over 6000), I paragonned illusive man into shooting himself. Gonna go to youtube to see what the other endings were like.

This whole petition to change the ending is rediculous though but had to laugh when the screen came up at the end to continue Shep's story and play DLC.

Will be thinking about this for a while, which a good ending should do. The music was brilliant.

edit: oh, and was good to be able to check in with jack, samara, grunt, etc on the front lines. Would have been nice to see them in action but nice talking with them at least. I had full paragon but I still had renegade choices all the way through, was a bit strange.

I miss tali

If you decide to blow up the Reapers and not give them to Cerberus, are their soldiers weaker?

Kiith

sheehy83 wrote: »

edit: oh, and was good to be able to check in with jack, samara, grunt, etc on the front lines. Would have been nice to see them in action but nice talking with them at least. I had full paragon but I still had renegade choices all the way through, was a bit strange.

I miss tali

Do you mean on Earth? When did you get to do this? I got to talk to everyone i had in my team, but none of the supporting characters.

Zero-Cool

Kiith wrote: »

Do you mean on Earth? When did you get to do this? I got to talk to everyone i had in my team, but none of the supporting characters.

Ya, on Earth when you are left to wonder around on your own, you are supposed to walk down some alley but I went into a nearby building with a soldier outside. Inside was a Tech communications officer who would bring up a hologram thingy of anyone you wanted depending on who was alive. I was able to talk to Cortez, Jacob, Samara, Jack, Grunt and someone else, can't remember. It was just a way of saying bye to them I spose and they were saying they were all on the front lines.

Does Thane, Mordin and Legion die in every game or do some decisions keep then alive?

I read as well to get the highest military assets, you have to trick the krogan into only thinking you cured the genophage to get everyone on board.

I think they could potentially be kept alive - in my game Legion was still there, but Thane and Mordin had died (Mordin had died in ME2, so I can't comment on his survival in ME3), yet as far as I remember, you can tell Thane to stay there? I'm not entirely sure.

Zero-Cool

Well Thane is always goosed but I wouldn't have changed the decisions that got Mordnin and Legion killed, both were brilliant scenes.

I imported my character into a new playthrough on insanity. I thought I could just start a ng+ with a renegade femshep but I had to stick with my paragon male shep infiltrator.

imitation

I have to say the ending bothered me less than it did most people. I'm not saying it was a great ending, but I chose the synthesis option. It felt pretty fitting to me, considering that throughout the 3 games its pretty apparent that despite the advanced technology, civilization is determined to fight itself and its ultimately locked into a horrible cyclic fate by one of its own creations (the reapers)

The star child is a bit of a lame cliche, but I think it was probably better than some random VI. I guess the theory behind it is the same as the one the Geth server, its how his mind represents the catalyst.

The two real problems with the ending are that

1. It was rushed, the videos for all 3 endings are effectively the same and I think Bioware realized at the last minute that as they made so many options they couldn't really create the detailed ending the game deserved. I was really suprised when I watched the other two endings on youtube, as I genuinely expected the "Control Reapers" option to be reset button option that made the reapers go away and returned things to business as usual.

2. The old man and the child at the very end is what annoys me the most, as they effectively indicate that a long dark age has befallen the galaxy and the rich Universe Bioware created is over. While they were supposed to give you a fuzzy feeling that Shepard was some kind of messiah, in reality they close the book on the universe. The thing is, all 3 options would easily lend themselves to a spin off series with the other characters (Mass effect with Liara as the lead ? Yes please !) The old man and kid will have to be dealt with using one of the unholy trinity (Retconned, Dues Ex Machina'd or Time traveled) in order to make any future games, which the suits in EA will demand

Considering they killed Shepard at the start of ME2 (completely unnecessary, but it was a great PR stunt) I think they could easily explain themselves out of the 3 endings, and to be honest it really seems like a ploy to get fans engaged with getting DLC to fill the missing gaps and maybe now to get an proper ending.

Shryke

There's some leaked stuff linked on the Bioware forums about upcoming dlc and a new game. I hate spoilers but I did read a bit. I NEED TO KNOW.
I won't say anything here about them. It seems to have come from a guy on the team and he emphasises that EA are the ones making Bioware look poorly and that there is still a great team of people there.
I don't know if it's legit or not but anyone interested can find the links.

degrassinoel

erm, just link it tbh

Overheal

imitation wrote: »

I have to say the ending bothered me less than it did most people. I'm not saying it was a great ending, but I chose the synthesis option. It felt pretty fitting to me, considering that throughout the 3 games its pretty apparent that despite the advanced technology, civilization is determined to fight itself and its ultimately locked into a horrible cyclic fate by one of its own creations (the reapers)

The star child is a bit of a lame cliche, but I think it was probably better than some random VI. I guess the theory behind it is the same as the one the Geth server, its how his mind represents the catalyst.

The two real problems with the ending are that

1. It was rushed, the videos for all 3 endings are effectively the same and I think Bioware realized at the last minute that as they made so many options they couldn't really create the detailed ending the game deserved. I was really suprised when I watched the other two endings on youtube, as I genuinely expected the "Control Reapers" option to be reset button option that made the reapers go away and returned things to business as usual.

2. The old man and the child at the very end is what annoys me the most, as they effectively indicate that a long dark age has befallen the galaxy and the rich Universe Bioware created is over. While they were supposed to give you a fuzzy feeling that Shepard was some kind of messiah, in reality they close the book on the universe. The thing is, all 3 options would easily lend themselves to a spin off series with the other characters (Mass effect with Liara as the lead ? Yes please !) The old man and kid will have to be dealt with using one of the unholy trinity (Retconned, Dues Ex Machina'd or Time traveled) in order to make any future games, which the suits in EA will demand

Considering they killed Shepard at the start of ME2 (completely unnecessary, but it was a great PR stunt) I think they could easily explain themselves out of the 3 endings, and to be honest it really seems like a ploy to get fans engaged with getting DLC to fill the missing gaps and maybe now to get an proper ending.

Ugh. The more I read the less I care about finishing ME2. They basically ripped off (among other things listed, like Gurren Laggan) The Dune series. In which, well, humans create thinking machines. Thinking machines revolt. Theres a huge Jihad between humans and machines. Machines disappear, but one lonely AI core ****s off into space on sublight. 10,000 years pass, all that normal Dune book stuff happens, messiah ****, bla bla bla. Another 10,000 years pass, oh look who's back, an entire galactic force of machines. How do we solve this? Oh good, one superhuman decides to take control of the entire machine organism, saving the galaxy which now has a free legion of robots to do it's farming.

Oh did I mention that at the end of one of the last books they symbolize the thinking machine overmind and his lieutenant as an old man and a woman?

EA is so original, like.

imitation

Overheal wrote: »

Ugh. The more I read the less I care about finishing ME2....

Well mass effect has always been a mash up of different science fiction stories, the quarians are almost lifted straight from BSG for example. The thing is though its delivered so well that the voice in your mind screaming rip off is silenced by its awesomeness. Mass Effect 3 is a brilliant game, but the ending was a complete rush job.

Kirby

imitation wrote: »

Well mass effect has always been a mash up of different science fiction stories, the quarians are almost lifted straight from BSG for example. .

Not really. "race creates machines, machines kill race" wasn't done first by BSG and there are alot of difference between BSG and ME. To say its lifted straight out is pretty inaccurate.

The cylons just killed everyone when they became self aware and caught the humans totally unawares. The Geth didn't. The quarians noticed they were self-aware and just started killing the Geth out of fear. The Geth tried to avoid fighting and it was the the quarians who tried to murder them.

The Geth were a Hive mind where as the cylons were individuals.

The Geth also let them go and didn't hunt them like the cylons did once they left their planet. BSG involves Cylons actively hunting humans where as the Geth don't hunt for the flotilla.

The quarians live in suits for 90% of their lives. Don't recall anyone in BSG ever doing that.

imitation

Kirby wrote: »

Not really. "race creates machines, machines kill race" wasn't done first by BSG and there are alot of difference between BSG and ME. To say its lifted straight out is pretty inaccurate.

Lifted may not be the most accurate word, but its a case of taking the idea and changing the details. Race develops AI, AI drives race off home world, Race survives in a folatilla fighting the AI. The Quarian/Geth sections are my favorite part of Mass Effect, so I don't think the similarities ruin it or anything, it just brings me back to my original point that the 3rd game shouldn't be ignored because it has similarities with other Sci-Fi.

Enkidu

Funnily enough one thing I thought about the ending was I never really felt like the Reapers needed an explanation. I mean Sovereign tells us that they arrive in cycles to harvest organic races at their apex and then in the second game we find out what harvesting is, creating a gestalt machine mind out of a race of organics, which is how Reapers reproduce. The third game could have explained who originally built the first reaper, but I don't think it was necessary for them to have some secret higher purpose. It was fine that they were "lethal Lovecraftian space locusts".

Secondly I thought the secret higher purpose was somewhat odd. Given that they had a higher purpose, it possibly would have made more sense to have the Reapers harvest the races to make room for new organic life, i.e. in every cycle the dominant races would stifle evolution and the Reapers come in to free up the ecosystem. However the fact that they come in to prevent an organic-synthetic war is a bit odd considering this was never presented as a major theme in the universe. I mean if most races were on the way to dangerous AI, fair enough, but the game actually showed us that the quarians and the geth could live in peace and EDI liked humans.

Maybe some of this is silly, but just my thoughts.

Zillah

Deleted User wrote: »

in my game Legion was still there

Wait, what? My understanding was that Legion always dies (he kills himself to uplift the Geth, or Tali kills him when he turns on you).

Anyway Thane always dies, his name shows up silently on the plaque if you don't talk to him. There is a way to save Mordin but Wrex and Eve have to be dead, you had to delete Maelon's data and Mordin is something of a broken man after it all. Kinder to let him finish his goal.

Shryke wrote: »

There's some leaked stuff linked on the Bioware forums about upcoming dlc and a new game. I hate spoilers but I did read a bit. I NEED TO KNOW.
I won't say anything here about them. It seems to have come from a guy on the team and he emphasises that EA are the ones making Bioware look poorly and that there is still a great team of people there.
I don't know if it's legit or not but anyone interested can find the links.

It looks incredibly fake and it came from 4chan so I wouldn't take it seriously at all.

Kiith

I feel sorry for anyone who didn't have Mordin and help the Krogan. His death was probably the best part of the game, if not the series. Absolutely loved it.

Jester252

Well I shot him

Zillah

Zillah wrote: »

Wait, what? My understanding was that Legion always dies (he kills himself to uplift the Geth, or Tali kills him when he turns on you).

Anyway Thane always dies, his name shows up silently on the plaque if you don't talk to him. There is a way to save Mordin but Wrex and Eve have to be dead, you had to delete Maelon's data and Mordin is something of a broken man after it all. Kinder to let him finish his goal.



It looks incredibly fake and it came from 4chan so I wouldn't take it seriously at all.

Oh sh1t, you're right. Legion gave himself up.

Zero-Cool

Kiith wrote: »

I feel sorry for anyone who didn't have Mordin and help the Krogan. His death was probably the best part of the game, if not the series. Absolutely loved it.

Pity he didnt have the same voice actor from 2 but ya that was some scene. Wouldnt of having it any other way. So many epic moments like that in the game, pity the ending is over shadowing them. I see more topics about how bad the ending was than how great the rest of the game was. Real pity

degrassinoel

yeah, shame he wont get to run those tests on the seashells

Zillah

sheehy83 wrote: »

Pity he didnt have the same voice actor from 2

Apparently you're right. I am so glad I didn't notice.

Potential-Monke

Kiith wrote: »

I feel sorry for anyone who didn't have Mordin and help the Krogan. His death was probably the best part of the game, if not the series. Absolutely loved it.

I feel Legions was better.

imitation

Potential-Monke wrote: »

I feel Legions was better.

Legion was definitely my absolute favorite in the Mass Effect series, I loved the concept and the voice acting. I wish there had been more of him in ME3, but his mission in the Geth server was fantastic, I was pretty bummed when he died.

Jester252

I sold him

Kiith

Zillah wrote: »

Apparently you're right. I am so glad I didn't notice.

I didn't notice either, thankfully. And while Legions was brilliant as well, i though Mordin was an excellent character from 2, and we'd had more time with him. His death packed more of a punch, and was a perfectly fitting way for him to go out.

Plus...

Zero-Cool

Now it's over and thinking back, there are a few things I wanted to see:

1 - Billy the Serial Killer.
2 - Aria taking back Omega (I have a feeling this will be a DLC pack).
3 - A Human/Quarian baby

Anything else you felt was missing or wanted to see cleared up?

AnCapaillMor

sheehy83 wrote: »

Anything else you felt was missing or wanted to see cleared up?

A better attempt at showing what quarians looks like and krogan females.