Super Rugby [Super 15] - General Discussion Thread

.ak

Don't know how many around here follow the Super Rugby season, but as it's about to start I thought we could get a thread going if anyone wanted to post anything interesting/thoughts/opinions etc., etc on the upcoming matches or general on-goings south of the border.

I try to keep up with it myself, but the early wake up times can be a killer..

Fishooks12

Seeing as I'm now an hour ahead I'm going to make a genuine effort to follow all the season.

Is Cooper back for the Reds?

Rattlehead_ie

There was one here last yr I believe so if the name be changed to Super 15 2012 might help with confusion if there is any.
Otherwise come on CHIEFS.

I only start getting into this once it starts or a week before and from what I've heard there has been a big clear out at Hurricanes and Crusaders. Chiefs have a lot of new talent mixed with some of the guys moving from other franchises. Hopefully this could be the year.

.ak

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Seeing as I'm now an hour ahead I'm going to make a genuine effort to follow all the season.

Is Cooper back for the Reds?

Still there, but looks like Mike Harris might be the preferred 10 for their opening game.

.ak

Rattlehead_ie wrote: »

There was one here last yr I believe so if the name be changed to Super 15 2012 might help with confusion if there is any.
Otherwise come on CHIEFS.

I only start getting into this once it starts or a week before and from what I've heard there has been a big clear out at Hurricanes and Crusaders. Chiefs have a lot of new talent mixed with some of the guys moving from other franchises. Hopefully this could be the year.

Yeah, wasn't sure if that was the norm or not.

MODS: Feel free to edit the thread title to say 2012 season to avoid confusion.

I tend to follow Crusaders, good work ethic and always entertaining to watch. Haven't really looked into their new team sheet yet. Will start looking at the new team lineups this week.

Rattlehead_ie

Always wondered what a Crusader/Hurricane Vs Leinster/Munster game would be like. I'm not going to start a debate on this as no one really knows in more recent years, but I always thought that the S15 teams get into their stride much quicker and you see great rugby by week 2 or 3 while it could be half way though the season before you see Rabo12/HC teams gelling.

endabob1

Hopefully the Stormers can make the semi's again but with Rassie Erasmus leaving I would be surprised, their pack (front row really) is not up to scratch either imo.
Of the SA sides, I think the Sharks might be the best package, good pack with Smit gone there's less tension around the Hooker slot, I really like the look of McLeod the young 9 & Lambie is developing but possibly not at 10 which might be their issue, I'm not sure if Michalak is staying for the Super 15.
The Bulls have lost Matfield, Steenkaamp, Bakkies Botha, Dannie Rossouw, Du Preez....
They still have a good squad but I think it's too much to expect them to challenge.

The Lions have a good young squad, they won the weakened Currie Cup last year and have an excellent coach, but I still think they're a class behind the front runners, I expect them to be more competitive but they will still be lower half. Watch out for Elton Jantjies at Fly Half, a future Bok 10
The Cheetaahs are not going to be at the races, not sure on the status of Juan Smiths injury but excluding him they have no more than 4 or 5 players who are good enough at this level imo

MungBean

Never followed it much before, only caught the semi final or final. Might make an attempt to follow it to some degree this year.

How early will these early waking times be ?

endabob1

The South African Games are only a couple of hours out

Big Nelly

Are these games on sky sports?

.ak

MungBean wrote: »

Never followed it much before, only caught the semi final or final. Might make an attempt to follow it to some degree this year.

How early will these early waking times be ?

The NZ/Aus games will be about 9am-ish for us.

.ak

Here's a list of all the Union fixtures on Sky Sports, including the SupeRugby fixtures. Eek, some real early ones in there...

ktulu123

Really looking forward to it this year. Love watching great attacking Rugby. The Chiefs were the first team I ever saw in super 14 so I support them. Also enjoy watching The Reds & The Crusaders.

Also I would love them to bring back the Super Rugby Show on sky sports. Was a great highlights show with a few laughs thrown in.

thomond2006

Stormers got a lot of stick for letting Johann Sadie (centre) go to the Bulls, then Jaque Fourie signed a contract in Japan when Stormers believed he would stay.

AFAIK that means that their only two out and out centres are JdV and De Jongh, they've also been playing Habana at 13 in the pre season games.

It will be interesting to see how the Rebels do, they have some serious class out wide with O'Connor and Beale but the fear is their pack is powderpuff and they won't see the ball.

Gonna be able to see almost all Friday games. What team should I follow? Who plays most of their games on a Friday that are much craic?

I wan't a back dominated team with a useless scrum so that I can experience the highs and lows of rugby please and thanks.

.ak

PlanetRugby are currently posting Team Previews on their Super Rugby page here.

Good way to catch up on who's in and who's out.

irishbucsfan

Lived in Perth so I'm stuck supporting the Force...

Looking forward to another season of slick passing and feeble defending though.

CatFromHue

.ak wrote: »

Here's a list of all the Union fixtures on Sky Sports, including the SupeRugby fixtures. Eek, some real early ones in there...

It's strange that they're not showing the Blues v the Crusaders which is the first fixture of the season.

Big Nelly

Have never watched Super 15 before, I hear it is good??? wonder is it worth recording all the match's on plus?

GerM

Big Nelly wrote: »

Have never watched Super 15 before, I hear it is good??? wonder is it worth recording all the match's on plus?

It's massively entertaining but, in terms of intensity, it's nowhere near the big games of the HEC. It's so open at times that it can resemble a 15 man version of 7-a-side. Tackling is half hearted, line breaks frequent, front five play an afterthought for some sides. It's a perfect tournament for the current crop of Australian backs. Hammer in the tries, don't take the points, tackling optional. Score lines can verge on the ridiculous e.g record score is 72-65.

The top few sides are capable of reaching an intensity the others cannot come business end of the season. The Reds were only the 5th winner since 1996. Before that, the last 6 titles were shared by the Crusaders and the Bulls. With only 15 teams, it's generally quite predictable.

Untouchable in terms of handling and running though to watch when it's on form.

Big Nelly

GerM wrote: »

It's massively entertaining but, in terms of intensity, it's nowhere near the big games of the HEC. It's so open at times that it can resemble a 15 man version of 7-a-side. Tackling is half hearted, line breaks frequent, front five play an afterthought for some sides. It's a perfect tournament for the current crop of Australian backs. Hammer in the tries, don't take the points, tackling optional. Score lines can verge on the ridiculous e.g record score is 72-65.

The top few sides are capable of reaching an intensity the others cannot come business end of the season. The Reds were only the 5th winner since 1996. Before that, the last 6 titles were shared by the Crusaders and the Sharks. With only 15 teams, it's generally quite predictable.

Untouchable in terms of handling and running though to watch when it's on form.

Sky + so

razorblunt

Another casual Chiefs fan here. Love this time of year, stumble out of the leaba, cup of tea and toast and get to watch something other than Soccer Am!

Will be interesting to see Haskell as well. Rebels caught my eye last year with a big number of NH players, always interesting to see how they fare down there.

Kiwi_knock

Looking forward to Super Rugby starting up again. Will be supporting the Rebels. We have an exciting back line with Phipps, Cipriani, O'Connor and Beale but are lacking a tight 5. Not expecting too much from this year, definitely not expecting to challenge for the Championship. Hopefully the rugby will be exciting, and Cipriani and Vuna actually learn to tackle this year.

I think either the Crusaders or the Blues will win it this year. It is definitely exciting to watch, some magnificent tries in it.

sock puppet

Deleted User wrote: »

Gonna be able to see almost all Friday games. What team should I follow? Who plays most of their games on a Friday that are much craic?

I wan't a back dominated team with a useless scrum so that I can experience the highs and lows of rugby please and thanks.

The New Zealand teams seem to play more Friday games. Can't remember the Australians as well but the South Africans definitely play more weekend games. The Highlanders are good to watch imo. Less of the headless throwing the ball around that you see with some of the other NZ teams.

Xavi6

Another year of mediocrity beckons for the Force

boynesider

Seems a bit strange that O'Connor is with the Rebels?

Judgement Day

Crusaders for me as usual. Can't wait to see how Dan Carter's comeback goes and I'm looking forward to retribution for last years' disappointment in the Final.

Crusaders squad here: http://www.crusaders.co.nz/net/team/player-profiles.aspx - read it and weep!

endabob1

Deleted User wrote: »

Gonna be able to see almost all Friday games. What team should I follow? Who plays most of their games on a Friday that are much craic?

I wan't a back dominated team with a useless scrum so that I can experience the highs and lows of rugby please and thanks.

You should back the Stormers, Cape Town is the closest to Ireland(ish) so support your local team and stop looking at those fancy Kiwi sides

This opinion is in no way influenced by me living in Cape Town and supporting the Stormers

KenSwee

Hi,

I love the Super 15 since I first saw it over 10 years ago. It's great that there are more Northern Hemisphere played down there now too.

Never followed a franchises directly but I do like the Sharks.

Does anybody know if there has been much movement on the proposal to have the Super 15 winners play the Heineken Cup winners?

castie

Im in and out of Sydney sooooo

Go Tahs!

chupacabra

This year will be the Sharks year. I can feel it in my bones.

matthew8

Go on the Lions! The Currie cup win gives us hope but I'm not expecting anything big (big for the Lions being mid-table)

thomond2006

chupacabra wrote: »

This year will be the Sharks year. I can feel it in my bones.

Bismarck starting every week will be huge.

basillarkin

I think the Highlanders have an outside chance in the NZ conference this season. That is said more with the heart then the head.

Some good sites for info are:

http://www.superxv.com/
http://www.planetrugby.com/

The Super 15 Rugby Draw and Fixtures for 2012

http://www.superxv.com/fixtures/

Betting for round 1 and overall winners here:

http://www.oddschecker.com/rugby-union/club-rugby/super-15

Brian

Growing up in Manawatu, I'm obliged to support the Hurricanes... but back then Andrew Mehrtens was my rugby idol so I'll always cheer for the Crusaders too.

Leinster7

Rattlehead_ie wrote: »

Always wondered what a Crusader/Hurricane Vs Leinster/Munster game would be like. I'm not going to start a debate on this as no one really knows in more recent years, but I always thought that the S15 teams get into their stride much quicker and you see great rugby by week 2 or 3 while it could be half way though the season before you see Rabo12/HC teams gelling.

It would look like NZ vs Ireland pretty much. SH team keeping the ball in hand and playing heads up off-loading game (like Leinster) but Ireland, certainly under current conservative management playing in fear and punting it to their back 3 and defending 70% of the time and losing. All in all a good game to watch if your a kiwi.


Leinster vs Crusaders/Reds however.....that I'd like to see. There should be a winner of the Heineken vs winner of the S15 imo.

These would've been the matchups of recent years:

1996 - Blues vs. Toulouse
1997 - Blues vs. Brive
1998 - Crusaders vs. Bath
1999 - Crusaders vs. Ulster
2000 - Crusaders vs. Northampton Saints
2001 - Brumbies vs. Leicester Tigers
2002 - Crusaders vs. Leicester Tigers
2003 - Blues vs. Toulouse
2004 - Brumbies vs. London Wasps
2005 - Crusaders vs. Toulouse
2006 - Crusaders vs. Munster
2007 - Bulls vs. London Wasps
2008 - Crusaders vs. Munster
2009 - Bulls vs. Leinster
2010 - Bulls vs. Toulouse
2011 - Reds vs. Leinster

GerM

Looking at those match ups, the one or two that stand out for me as potential wins for the NH are the 2003, 2004 and 2011 games and that's in large part because of the opposition. Those were absolutely brilliant Toulouse and Wasps sides. Wasps are often overlooked but they were backboned by some absolutely class players. Lewsey, Dallaglio, Howley, Worsley, Shaw. They were such a well drilled side that put their bodies on the line more than any side I recall. That final in 2004 was the only final that can sit alongside last year's in my memory in terms of quality. The Stade Leicester final was a great game but ended up being a kicking dual more than anything.

Digifriendly

Waratahs beat Tonga 52-0 in a warm up. Interesting that second half had 3
20 minute periods.
http://www.superxv.com/news/super15_rugby_news.asp?id=33870

sock puppet

Looks like the old boards fantasy league is still up if anyone wants to join. Not sure how it works now that handsomecake seems to be gone.

http://superrugbyfantasy.foxsports.com.au/

irishbucsfan

sock puppet wrote: »

Looks like the old boards fantasy league is still up if anyone wants to join. Not sure how it works now that handsomecake seems to be gone.

http://superrugbyfantasy.foxsports.com.au/

Southern hemispherers are playing so I'd guess he'll be back soon

sock puppet

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Southern hemispherers are playing so I'd guess he'll be back soon

True. He's probably hibernating for these cold, northern winters

Flincher

Leinster7 wrote: »

These would've been the matchups of recent years:


2001 - Brumbies vs. Leicester Tigers
2003 - Blues vs. Toulouse
2005 - Crusaders vs. Toulouse
2008 - Crusaders vs. Munster
2010 - Bulls vs. Toulouse
2011 - Reds vs. Leinster

I'd go back in time to see those games if I could. That Brumbies team with Gregan and Larkham was just quality, and Leicester were such a dogged team back then.

I'll be shouting for the Rebels and the Highlanders I think. The Force and the Hurricanes are really going to struggle without their star players.

There was a channel on youtube which showed 10 min highlights of most of the games, I hope that will be operational this year.

By the way, the Crusaders backline of Dagg, Maitland, Frueun, Crotty, Guildford, Carter and Ellis is almost arousing. Insane talent there.

CatFromHue

The Chiefs is looking pretty good too

Leonard, Cruden, Mesaga, Sonny Bill, Kahui, Declan O'Donnell, Robbie Robinson.

Morf

Flincher wrote: »

By the way, the Crusaders backline of Dagg, Maitland, Frueun, Crotty, Guildford, Carter and Ellis is almost arousing. Insane talent there.

Maitland isn't that great of a footballer from what I've seen, Guildford hasn't decided if he still wants to drink his career away or not and Frueun is pretty hyped up for a player that hasn't delivered a huge amount yet. Ellis isn't a standout scrum half either.

Flincher

Morf wrote: »

Maitland isn't that great of a footballer from what I've seen, Guildford hasn't decided if he still wants to drink his career away or not and Frueun is pretty hyped up for a player that hasn't delivered a huge amount yet. Ellis isn't a standout scrum half either.

Maitland isn't a great footballer, but he's a great finisher. His work off Dagg and Frueun was class last year. He's seriously quick and exactly what they need on the wing.

No disputing Guildford's class, aside from his issues in keeping the bottlecap screwed on.

I think you're harsh on Frueun. He has an excellent 12 in Crotty inside him, and he has the power and pace to exploit any hint of a gap. He worked well with Sonny Bill, and if he does the same with Crotty this year I reckon he'll compete with Conrad Smith for the 13 jersey.

Ya Ellis isn't great, but he's competent at that level. Scored one of the coolest tries ever

csm

Anyone know how this new white card system they're trialling will work? Apparently it's when the ref suspects foul play but can't identify the culprit. He holds up a white card and the citing commissioner will look at it.

Will it mean that punishment will be handed down during the game itself? Or afterwards like the usual citing commissioner system? If afterwards, what's the point of having a white card?

kmart6

Because it draws attention to it straight away and it will definately be looked at after the game!

Punishment will be after the game, hardly expect the citing commissioner to be ringing someone in the middle of a game to hand down the punishment!

csm

But that happens anyway with the referee's report doesn't it? He can draw the citing commissioner's attention to something after the game can't he?

Why the need to notify everyone during a game? He can talk to the captains so it's not to inform the players, he can inform the citing commissioner after the match, which logically means that it's only to inform the crowd. What's the point?

kmart6

Well instead of a split second decision from the ref who may be unsure it allows for more clarity, shows he has acknowledged there was some form of an incident and it will be looked at just couldn't act on it there and then! Also could lead to more severe bans if the incident was dangerous!

Judgement Day

Morf wrote: »

Maitland isn't that great of a footballer from what I've seen, Guildford hasn't decided if he still wants to drink his career away or not and Frueun is pretty hyped up for a player that hasn't delivered a huge amount yet. Ellis isn't a standout scrum half either.

You obviously haven't watched much Super 15 then, Ellis aside, the others you mention are some of the classiest players in New Zealand at the moment. You forgot to mention Dan Carter - rubbish as well I suppose?

.ak

Judgement Day wrote: »

You obviously haven't watched much Super 15 then, Ellis aside, the others you mention are some of the classiest players in New Zealand at the moment. You forgot to mention Dan Carter - rubbish as well I suppose?

Worst of a bad bunch.