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Accident in Phoenix Park this morning

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124

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    #92
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    BostonB wrote: »
    Be that as it may enforcement seems to be non existent. For example I see comercials in it almost daily.

    Yes, but it was in reply to a technical point on enforcement.


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    #93
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    What enforcement....;)


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    #94
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    BostonB wrote: »
    What enforcement....;)

    Exactly.

    It was a technical point which could have been made to the park ranger on that lack of enforcement which somehow caused the cyclist here to be unable to signal causing great harm to many park users and deer. :)


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    #95
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Doe


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    #96
    stoneill
    Registered Users Posts: 3,610 ✭✭✭stoneill


    Folks,
    The Phoenix Park is open for recreation for all users.
    The cycle lane is for recreational use- walking, jogging, hopping, skipping, rollerblading, pogo sticking, bicycling, tricycling, what ever means of ambulation you feel like doing.
    If you want to do some training and cycle fast - use common sense and use the road.


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    #97
    Caroline_ie
    Registered Users Posts: 5,400 ✭✭✭Caroline_ie


    They should remove the bike markings, call it a recreational lane and close the park gates to people using it as shortcut to commute to town in they cars.


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    #98
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    What about people who stop for a walk/run on their way to from work?


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    #99
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    BostonB wrote: »
    What about people who stop for a walk/run on their way to from work?

    What about them? How will anything she just suggested affect them?


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    #100
    Bunnyhopper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,414 ✭✭✭Bunnyhopper


    stoneill wrote: »
    The cycle lane is for recreational use- walking, jogging, hopping, skipping, rollerblading, pogo sticking, bicycling, tricycling, what ever means of ambulation you feel like doing.

    Given the confusion over their legal status, you might be right that they can be used for anything, but it does beg the question as to why they have bicycles painted on their surface every fifty metres or so. Also, why are there signs directing cyclists to use them, and surface markings indicating that cycling is prohibited on the other paths along the main road? Why do the OPW's maps of the Park indicate that they are cycle lanes?

    I haven't seen any signs or maps mentioning walking, jogging, hopping, skipping, rollerblading, or pogo sticking on those paths. Have you?


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    #101
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Because it wasn't very well thought out I assume.


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    #102
    Tombo2000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 165 ✭✭Tombo2000


    BostonB wrote: »
    Because it wasn't very well thought out I assume.


    lol "assume"

    I'm racking my brains to think of any other possible reason.....


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    #103
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    monument wrote: »
    What about them? How will anything she just suggested affect them?

    How would you stop commuters as opposed to someone from Castleknock just getting to the Zoo. Or someone from town coming up to go for a walk in the furry glen. Or are you thinking let everyone drive around the park, just not into it. Or through it.

    That main road takes something like the same volume of traffic as one of the lanes of the M50 daily.


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    #104
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Tombo2000 wrote: »
    lol "assume"

    I'm racking my brains to think of any other possible reason.....

    Maybe they thought getting it done legally would be a huge task whereas if they painted a few signs etc, the majority of people would just assume it has some sort of legal status. 90% of the job done with 5% of the effort.

    Maybe...


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    #105
    muckwarrior
    Registered Users Posts: 4,052 ✭✭✭muckwarrior


    BostonB wrote: »
    How would you stop commuters as opposed to someone from Castleknock just getting to the Zoo. Or someone from town coming up to go for a walk in the furry glen. Or are you thinking let everyone drive around the park, just not into it. Or through it.

    That main road takes something like the same volume of traffic as one of the lanes of the M50 daily.

    Set up cameras at each entrance akin to the ones on the M50. If you exit the park within say 30 minutes of entering it then you are deemed to be commuting and therefore must pay a toll. If you're stopping to use the park as a recreational facility then it's free.


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    #106
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    BostonB wrote: »
    How would you stop commuters as opposed to someone from Castleknock just getting to the Zoo. Or someone from town coming up to go for a walk in the furry glen. Or are you thinking let everyone drive around the park, just not into it. Or through it.

    That main road takes something like the same volume of traffic as one of the lanes of the M50 daily.

    Easy, close off routes to stop through traffic.

    The world did not fall apart when it was closed. Far from it.

    What traffic does a single M50 lane take a day and what does the park take?


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    #107
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    People might be happy to pay the toll.


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    #108
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    They might be happy driving around too. :)


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    #109
    Lumen
    Registered Users Posts: 31,017 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    monument wrote: »
    What traffic does a single M50 lane take a day and what does the park take?

    The busy sections of the M50 take about 100k vehicles a day.

    The PP takes about 20k vehicles a day.

    Both figures from cursory Google and include all lanes and both directions.


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    #110
    Doctor Bob
    Registered Users Posts: 1,141 ✭✭✭Doctor Bob


    muckwarrior wrote: »
    Set up cameras at each entrance akin to the ones on the M50. If you exit the park within say 30 minutes of entering it then you are deemed to be commuting and therefore must pay a toll. If you're stopping to use the park as a recreational facility then it's free.
    This!^^

    You could have one exception to the above suggestion: if someone leaves through the gate they entered by, then the toll doesn't apply.

    Another possibility is allowing easy access but very limited egress, which would be achievable by simple re-jigging of the traffic light sequences.


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    #111
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    A far easier option is to physically close through routes to motorised transport.

    This is what the OPW says it is going to do outside rush hours, at least.


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    #112
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    monument wrote: »
    They might be happy driving around too. :)

    Those roads suck.

    I couldn't think of a better way of saying it.


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    #113
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    BostonB wrote: »
    Those roads suck.

    I couldn't think of a better way of saying it.

    Clearly not as much as many on boards tried to make out before the main avenue was closed. The sky was due to have fallen in after the closure of the main avenue, but it somehow did not.


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    #114
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    I think its because most of the traffic took a route much further out. Which is why its been quieter all around the park but other areas are much busier. I don't really travel at peak, so not really effected by it. Other than I can't avoid ramps now, when I could before. When I've gone near peak its seems a lot worse than usual.

    When I'm on the bike it seems like there's a lot less people walking and running in the park too. Especially in the evenings and mornings. I guess because less people are passing through to stop en route.


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    #115
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    BostonB wrote: »
    I think its because most of the traffic took a route much further out. Which is why its been quieter all around the park but other areas are much busier. I don't really travel at peak, so not really effected by it. Other than I can't avoid ramps now, when I could before. When I've gone near peak its seems a lot worse than usual.

    When I'm on the bike it seems like there's a lot less people walking and running in the park too. Especially in the evenings and mornings. I guess because less people are passing through to stop en route.

    But at the end of the day, everybody survived. The sky still has not fallen in.


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    #116
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    My suspension wouldn't agree with you.


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    #117
    Seve OB
    Registered Users Posts: 15,846 ✭✭✭✭Seve OB


    wow, this thread has gone from an accident in a cycle lane to are they really cycle lanes at all to whether or not it is legal to leave your dog off a lead to giving out about people using the phoenix park to commute in their cars.....

    Now lets go back to where we started, I'm quite glad that the pedestrian in the cycle lane got a clatter, they absolutely deserve it. After all, I bet the same pedestrians who feel it is ok to walk in cycle lanes, would never go Jay walking in the middle of the road... it pretty much equates to the same thing!

    I am sorry for the poor lad on his Bike who crashed into her. I hope you are ok mate!

    I had a rant about the phoenix park cycle lane only last week

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76432649&postcount=23

    I don't care if they are legal cycle lanes or not, they are cycle lanes so that should be the end of it really. I have lost count of the number of times over the last few months where I have seen cars go against the new one way system, or out entry only gates at Chapelizod and Ashtown, and even rangers driving up and down the cycle lane because the road was dug up!!


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    #118
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    You'll never keep pedestrians off that path. its pointless getting worked up about it.


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    #119
    Lumen
    Registered Users Posts: 31,017 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    stevieob wrote: »
    I don't care if they are legal cycle lanes or not, they are cycle lanes so that should be the end of it really.

    Just because you state something as fact doesn't make it true.

    The lanes are not exclusively for the use of cyclists, whether you like it or not.


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    #120
    Consey
    Registered Users Posts: 410 ✭✭Consey


    It makes sense to keep the eyes wide open on the lanes on Chesterfield Avenue, paricularly near the zoo entrance and sports fields. The amount of families who carry their buggies onto the cycle lane to open them is unbelievable on the average weekend day, with the kids wandering blindly along behind them. having young children myself, I understand why they would do so, as they are sheperding them away from the busy road. Also, unless you're a regular park user, you probably won't realise it's a bike lane, especially if up from the country to go to the zoo etc.

    In that context it makes sense to avoid that part of the cycle lane/road at weekends.

    Early in the morning the lane is usually pretty clear - apart from the odd walker/jogger who are usually considerate of cycle users.

    In these dark evenings, the lane is taken up by a combo of dark clothed joggers and hi vis ones. Fair play to the high vis ones I say, I have no prob using my bell and slowing down for them as they show consideration - so do I. Usually though the dark clothed walkers are happy to hog the cycle lane, and in my view that is just plain rude.

    In summary then, when going for a cycle in the Park at weekends, I tend to keep to the perimeter roads inside the Park - it's a grand circuit of just under 10km.

    Finally - regarding my altercation with the Park Ranger - I don't tend to hand signal at anytime if there's no-one I need to signal to !!!


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    #121
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    stevieob wrote: »
    Now lets go back to where we started, I'm quite glad that the pedestrian in the cycle lane got a clatter, they absolutely deserve it.

    :rolleyes:


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