im not convinced

braintoxic

I had a great job and d company folded like many others.my work was construction related.i took a few months off n den knuckled down to finding employment.i was prepared to do anything as long as it gave me an honest wage.i applied dor every job i saw from fast food outlets to public service jobs . I was serious about finding a job .e.this is the way i looked at it . I get x amount on the job seekers allowence.any few euros i earn over that amount is worth working for.i got a job easy enough and need not have stressed so much . Sure i work d odd night and every other weekend but im earning a healthy honest wage.my life is great and im so happy.iv an easy job compared to my previous and my life is stress free .
.what promts this thread is a conversation i had with a guy i know.
He WAS a block layer .i asked him if he had any work lately ( a conversation iv had a lot lately) . He said . No nothing out there I HAVE NOT LAYED A BLOCK IN TWO YEARS..i know ww can all talk anout individual cases but iv spoke to a lot of different people and nothing seems to have changed ..i dont understand?? Im not convinced people are trying and r as deaperate as the government n media lead us to believe. I think the work is out there but we as a nation have big ideas avout who we were..am i alone in this view? Wat do u think?

newmug

You're just lucky. Fair play to you getting a job, but the media is more right than wrong in this case.

braintoxic

Im not lucky. I made it happen.i work in the security industry . Its a booming industry n loads of work .i work for a great company and they employ male n female staff. I have friends who moan and bitch about bills .they are noy paying their mortgages and leave bills until they get threatening letters . Iv told them how to get work but it seem people feel its their right not to work or pay their way..am i being harsh?

newmug

braintoxic wrote: »

Im not lucky. I made it happen.i work in the security industry . Its a booming industry n loads of work .i work for a great company and they employ male n female staff. I have friends who moan and bitch about bills .they are noy paying their mortgages and leave bills until they get threatening letters . Iv told them how to get work but it seem people feel its their right not to work or pay their way..am i being harsh?

I'm afraid you are being harsh. And pardon me, but I'm going to be harsh now aswell - you didnt make it happen, you just got lucky. Nothing wrong with that, but when you say you "made it happen", do you not think that thats what everybody else is doing, all the time? 400,000 of us have been trying to make it happen without success. Maybe some of your friends are the exception, and I'm sure there definately are people who think they "deserve" to have a deadly job, but in my experience they are in the minority.

braintoxic

No your wrong . I did my security course . Got a licence and now im working . I sent out my cv and was offered a job pretty much straight away.in fact 4 other major security contacted me asking if i was available.i did not get lucky as you say.

MidlandsM

...but shure who wants to work in Security?

Hence why you got the job.

racso1975

You sound very suited to the job. best of luck

partyatmygaff

braintoxic wrote: »

Im not lucky. I made it happen.i work in the security industry . Its a booming industry n loads of work.

Well there you go. You're one of those who just so happen to work in an industry that hasn't been too badly affected by the recession. Not everyone is in the same position.

braintoxic

@partyatmygaff ...read the post .i worked in construction . Lost my job n now work in security .my point is there is plenty of work out there if u look and ur willing to do it . If any genuine people read this feel free to pm me.

partyatmygaff

braintoxic wrote: »

@partyatmygaff ...read the post .i worked in construction . Lost my job n now work in security .my point is there is plenty of work out there if u look and ur willing to do it . If any genuine people read this feel free to pm me.

I read your entire post but chose to ignore that part to avoid starting an argument.

Not everyone wants (Or is capable) of changing industry that easily.

Jim2007

newmug wrote: »

I'm afraid you are being harsh. And pardon me, but I'm going to be harsh now aswell - you didnt make it happen, you just got lucky.

I think it is a bit of both really, yes you need a bit of luck, but you also have to make your own luck! The majority of people out there are playing by the rules - send out the CV, get the refusal and so on. But there are another smaller group of people that are far more aggressive about it, they will literal do anything to get their foot in the door:

• Hand deliver the CV, to try and get face time
• Hang out in the pub where the office goes drinking
• Find out where the boss goes for a pint and be there
• Try and get customers of the company to recommend them for the position
• Work for free
• Attending evening courses where they might be able to network
• Make proposals on how they would have done a project the employer is working on

Yes of course there is an element of luck, but the harder you search the better your luck:D

The OP sounds like a very determined individual who would probably make a go of it in any situation.

hdowney

a bit in the op's post that grated on me was when the block layer said they hadn't laid a block in two years - when asked had they any work. this is something that annoys me.

i am very sorry that people lost their jobs/there is no work in a particular industry etc (heck my mother lost her job). but to ONLY look for work in that one thing - i know they guy trained as a block layer, i am not suggesting he try go get a job in accounting if he has no qualification for it, but there are jobs out there to be had. perhaps not in block laying and it might not be as easy as it used to be. but the people who will ONLY work in the thing they used to. it smacks of the celtic tiger days when people wouldn't do menial jobs and are no complaining that 'all the foreigners have took our jobs' - ye didn't want them before ffs. but some of these people come across like they still consider certain jobs beneath them, and they'd rather be on the dole (odd i know) than take a job say cleaning. like it demeans them and the fact that they have a trade or whatnot. they don't consider the food on the table and bills paid aspect of it.

Mrs OBumble

I'm in the "a bit right and a bit wrong" camp: no one has the right to refuse to change industries / roles.

Labour markets change - always have, always will. People need to adapt. Sometimes that means retraining, less money, less status, not so much craic at work, whatever. That's the way it goes. Some people have difficulty with that.

OP, you're lucky in that you have a 10-year checkable work history and a personality type that can "stick" security (it's something I couldn't handle - and in the last two years I've done lots of ****e jobs, just to be in work). So there is some luck, though I give a fair bit of weight to the theory that there's no such thing as luck: what we call luck is usually preparation meeting opportunity.

OTOH, there are definitely not 400,000 jobs out there. If everyone hustled like the OP did, then s/he might not have job the job.

partyatmygaff

JustMary wrote: »

I'm in the "a bit right and a bit wrong" camp: no one has the right to refuse to change industries / roles.

In some cases, changing industry/job type is just impossible. It'd be a bit much to expect people with very specialised qualifications and education to forego everything just so that they can take the first job they find that pays a wage. For example, would it be fair to expect an unemployed doctor to go work in McDonalds?

hdowney

partyatmygaff wrote: »

In some cases, changing industry/job type is just impossible. It'd be a bit much to expect people with very specialised qualifications and education to forego everything just so that they can take the first job they find that pays a wage. For example, would it be fair to expect an unemployed doctor to go work in McDonalds?

why not? that doesn't mean he cannot continue to look for work in his profession, and when he finds it, leave the maccy d's job. but why should he be treated like he is better than someone else, as in let the little person work in maccy d's, i am too important so i shall continue to be funded by the state until such time as a job of the right calibre becomes available. in this day and age hell no. they should suck up their pride, pull up their sleeves and dig in

mikemac1

This bricklayer who hasn't worked in two years, is he holding out for something in construction?

Bricklayers earned some serious money during the boom and maybe he can't adapt

Maybe he still has a "I'm not getting out of bed for less then 1K a week" attitude
Hey, it's out there

Things can't be that bad for tradesmen.
I've dealt with a few this year who were no shows :mad:

Some still want the big jobs on new estates and have no interest in repairs and call out jobs
No shortage of tradesmen crying on Joe Duffy show though

braintoxic

JustMary wrote: »

I'm in the "a bit right and a bit wrong" camp: no one has the right to refuse to change industries / roles.

Labour markets change - always have, always will. People need to adapt. Sometimes that means retraining, less money, less status, not so much craic at work, whatever. That's the way it goes. Some people have difficulty with that.

OP, you're lucky in that you have a 10-year checkable work history and a personality type that can "stick" security (it's something I couldn't handle - and in the last two years I've done lots of ****e jobs, just to be in work). So there is some luck, though I give a fair bit of weight to the theory that there's no such thing as luck: what we call luck is usually preparation meeting opportunity.

OTOH, there are definitely not 400,000 jobs out there. If everyone hustled like the OP did, then s/he might not have job the job.

Thanks for the constructive reply .but is it lucky to have a ten year checkable history?? Explain! Im not talking about 400,000 jobs but i can point a person. In the right direction and i know work is available .also il stick any job that feeds my family n pays d bills because im a realist n not a bandwagon jumper .

braintoxic

partyatmygaff wrote: »

JustMary wrote: »

I'm in the "a bit right and a bit wrong" camp: no one has the right to refuse to change industries / roles.

In some cases, changing industry/job type is just impossible. It'd be a bit much to expect people with very specialised qualifications and education to forego everything just so that they can take the first job they find that pays a wage. For example, would it be fair to expect an unemployed doctor to go work in McDonalds?

And you my friend are an idiot .i bet u live with mammy and daddy . Run along this is sa post for grown ups . Look look a santa grotto .off u go little man

Jim2007

partyatmygaff wrote: »

In some cases, changing industry/job type is just impossible. It'd be a bit much to expect people with very specialised qualifications and education to forego everything just so that they can take the first job they find that pays a wage. For example, would it be fair to expect an unemployed doctor to go work in McDonalds?

As someone else said why not... in most other European countries unemployment benefits are limited to a specific period and after that you become what is commonly called a "social case" meaning that to get any further financial assistance you have to show that you have exhausted all other financial resources - savings, sold the BMW, moved to cheaper housing and so on. You still qualify for training courses etc... but no cash!

This does mean that some people will have to accept jobs that might be below their qualifications or even retrain. But it also means that only really deserving cases remain a drain on the state.

As far as I can see Ireland & UK are among the few where you can continue to receive benefits indefinitely!

mikemac1

partyatmygaff wrote: »

For example, would it be fair to expect an unemployed doctor to go work in McDonalds?

Would keep you going for a few months. Sure didn't most of us work minimum wage and low paid jobs in college and for a while afterwards. Any job is better for your mental health then staying at home and having your confidence sap away. Would get you out and meeting people

And McDonalds are a good employer. It's all done by the book. McDonalds have a great reputation as an employer

They treat their staff better then many hotels in Ireland where overtime, rest periods and breaks do not exist and bullying is common

partyatmygaff

hdowney wrote: »

why not? that doesn't mean he cannot continue to look for work in his profession, and when he finds it, leave the maccy d's job. but why should he be treated like he is better than someone else, as in let the little person work in maccy d's, i am too important so i shall continue to be funded by the state until such time as a job of the right calibre becomes available. in this day and age hell no. they should suck up their pride, pull up their sleeves and dig in

Well for one, the chances of McDonalds actually accepting an application from a doctor or similar are almost nonexistant. The employer will know full well that they're just looking for a stopgap job and that they'll leave at the first opportunity that they get. No one wants staff like that.

Another thing, the highly skilled and educated shouldn't work in unskilled or menial jobs. Not because they're above it but because their skills and talents could be put to much better use doing something else. Take for example someone who has a degree in Biochemistry. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to say take part in an unpaid research project (While still on the dole) than to go take any old job? They'd actually be bettering themselves and returning something to the society who helped fund their degree.

braintoxic

partyatmygaff wrote: »

hdowney wrote: »

why not? that doesn't mean he cannot continue to look for work in his profession, and when he finds it, leave the maccy d's job. but why should he be treated like he is better than someone else, as in let the little person work in maccy d's, i am too important so i shall continue to be funded by the state until such time as a job of the right calibre becomes available. in this day and age hell no. they should suck up their pride, pull up their sleeves and dig in

Well for one, the chances of McDonalds actually accepting an application from a doctor or similar are almost nonexistant. The employer will know full well that they're just looking for a stopgap job and that they'll leave at the first opportunity that they get. No one wants staff like that.

Another thing, the highly skilled and educated shouldn't work in unskilled or menial jobs. Not because they're above it but because their skills and talents could be put to much better use doing something else. Take for example someone who has a degree in Biochemistry. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to say take part in an unpaid research project (While still on the dole) than to go take any old job?

..im sure a. Lock layer considers himself highly skilled. So what your saying is only some people are too good for some jobs ..Leave that kind of job to less intellegent people. The state can pay me until i find a job that suits me ! The social welfare would love u

partyatmygaff

braintoxic wrote: »

And you my friend are an idiot .i bet u live with mammy and daddy . Run along this is sa post for grown ups . Look look a santa grotto .off u go little man

There's only one person who's throwing their toys out of the pram in this little exchange and it's not me.

mikemac1 wrote: »

Would keep you going for a few months. Sure didn't most of us work minimum wage and low paid jobs in college and for a while afterwards. Any job is better for your mental health then staying at home and having your confidence sap away. Would get you out and meeting people

And McDonalds are a good employer. It's all done by the book. McDonalds have a great reputation as an employer

They treat their staff better then many hotels in Ireland where overtime, rest periods and breaks do not exist and bullying is common

Oh yeah I know. McDonalds are one of the better employers out there. I just used them as an example.

eastbono

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Well for one, the chances of McDonalds actually accepting an application from a doctor or similar are almost nonexistant. The employer will know full well that they're just looking for a stopgap job and that they'll leave at the first opportunity that they get. No one wants staff like that.

Another thing, the highly skilled and educated shouldn't work in unskilled or menial jobs. Not because they're above it but because their skills and talents could be put to much better use doing something else. Take for example someone who has a degree in Biochemistry. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to say take part in an unpaid research project (While still on the dole) than to go take any old job? They'd actually be bettering themselves and returning something to the society who helped fund their degree.

I agree with what you say. But the jobs arent there. If they want to get jobs in their field or take part in a research project which is mostly at Phd level(or post doc level) they need to broaden their horizons and look abroad. This has always been the case with research projects even in Celtic Tigers years.
I dont speak from ignorance... I speak as a parent who has someone working abroad and once my other child(adult) finishes their Phd they will be heading abroad for post doc as it is actively encouraged for career progression. BTW both my children were lucky and worked their way through Uni. Unfortunately that is the main problem now that jobs are few and far between for people putting themselves through Uni.

Jim2007

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Well for one, the chances of McDonalds actually accepting an application from a doctor or similar are almost nonexistant. The employer will know full well that they're just looking for a stopgap job and that they'll leave at the first opportunity that they get. No one wants staff like that.

Well you were the one that suggested McDonalds...

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Another thing, the highly skilled and educated shouldn't work in unskilled or menial jobs. Not because they're above it but because their skills and talents could be put to much better use doing something else. Take for example someone who has a degree in Biochemistry. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to say take part in an unpaid research project (While still on the dole) than to go take any old job?

Not when the state has no funds no! The fact that the person has failed to find a job within a reasonable time frame - lets say 18 months or so, means that their skills are not required right now...

Look here in Switzerland we have PhDs in chemistry and related subjects coming out our ears, because there are a lot of chemical companies head quartered here and everyone expected to get a job, the did not! So instead they have had to take other jobs or be penniless, you'll find them working in all kinds of jobs from kindergarten teachers, to ticket checkers on the trains, to gardeners and what not. That is life, deal with it - nobody owes you a living.

braintoxic

I had a number of polish people working for me . Doctors mechanics dentists etc .but they all came over here to work on d buildings no problem . A lot of my friends are gone to austrilia n germany to work construction and again many have been to college and have had higher end jobs .i meet a lot of people here still scrounging off the dole who refuse to accept the state does not owe you the job you trained or are qualified for .my family is my number one priority and my pride comes when i pay my own way and im not owing to the rest of the country ..

eastbono

braintoxic wrote: »

I had a number of polish people working for me . Doctors mechanics dentists etc .but they all came over here to work on d buildings no problem . A lot of my friends are gone to austrilia n germany to work construction and again many have been to college and have had higher end jobs .i meet a lot of people here still scrounging off the dole who refuse to accept the state does not owe you the job you trained or are qualified for .my family is my number one priority and my pride comes when i pay my own way and im not owing to the rest of the country ..

I can see and understand where you are coming from... but there are not enough jobs for everyone who now find themselves unemployed to be employed.And not everyone is in a position where they can move for job prospects e.g. family, mortgage. My major bugbear and soapbox was when we had "total employment" we still had 140,000 long term unemployed and had to look abroad to fill our job vacancies.

hdowney

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Well for one, the chances of McDonalds actually accepting an application from a doctor or similar are almost nonexistant. The employer will know full well that they're just looking for a stopgap job and that they'll leave at the first opportunity that they get. No one wants staff like that.

Another thing, the highly skilled and educated shouldn't work in unskilled or menial jobs. Not because they're above it but because their skills and talents could be put to much better use doing something else. Take for example someone who has a degree in Biochemistry. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to say take part in an unpaid research project (While still on the dole) than to go take any old job? They'd actually be bettering themselves and returning something to the society who helped fund their degree.

i do completely agree that some skilled people find it difficult to get an employer (such as, but i don't know about them personally, maccy d's) to take them seriously when they apply for a job. employers should be more open to people who have qualifications and look for a job. i don't think a qualification in one field should prevent you from being offered a job somewhere else. so yes that is a problem many skilled people face. however just because it happens some places doesn't mean it will in all, and they should apply.

yes i am sure research is a worthwhile use of their time. but firstly as a poster said, there isn't the money to fund them and their research (and clearly the don't have the money to fund themselves). if they went and got a job then the money the government was paying them in dole could in theory be used to fund other things, such as research grants.

what bothers me is the fact that a lot of skilled graduates (not all granted) don't want to be seen doing certain jobs. they went through college and got the qualification so as not to have to work those jobs, so coming out the end of it seems wrong to them. whereas being on the dole, if anyone says anything, they can say there are no jobs in the sector at the moment but as soon as there are they'll be gone from the dole like a shot. it is a disgrace

theg81der

Braintoxic - did you target the market and spot a gap? Was security an informed choice? I`ve recently finished a degree in Accounting and there are no accouting jobs. I am 100% willing to retrain but as I have a level 8 now I`m not eligable for any training. I can`t afford to pay for education right now. My husbands not working and has done 7 courses fas recommended and has a huge pile of rejection letters from anywhere and everywhere. He feels so bad about not being able to support me and the baby we have on the way but not everyone has you confidence and I think this is his issue.

Its very simplistic and incorrect to say everyone who doesn`t have a job doesn`t want one really.

hdowney

theg81der wrote: »

Braintoxic - did you target the market and spot a gap? Was security an informed choice? I`ve recently finished a degree in Accounting and there are no accouting jobs. I am 100% willing to retrain but as I have a level 8 now I`m not eligable for any training. I can`t afford to pay for education right now. My husbands not working and has done 7 courses fas recommended and has a huge pile of rejection letters from anywhere and everywhere. He feels so bad about not being able to support me and the baby we have on the way but not everyone has you confidence and I think this is his issue.

Its very simplistic and incorrect to say everyone who doesn`t have a job doesn`t want one really.

i don't think that everyone who doesn't have a job doesn't want one. i just do come across a fair number of two groups, the had a good job and doesn't want to work at anything less group, and the doesn't want to work a day dole scrounger group. after a while dealing with these two you can become a bit jaded and judgemental of people in general and possibly jump to conclusions based on the most megar of information

krd

I smell a troll.


I dont understand wy anybodee is unemployed. Deres millions of jobs out dere. It was easee for me.

Peeple are just lazee or cracked in de head if dey cant get a job.

Just roll ur sleeves up