do you ask landowner can you hunt ?

whelan1

over from the farming and forestry forum, i am a landowner and am a bit annoyed that people think they have a right to shoot on my land with out asking me, i think i am right to be annoyed, so do ye ask the landowners permisson?

One shot on kill

well if that person falls or hurts them self or someone else whos insurance pays out

i would say your entitled to be annoyed

landkeeper

there seems t be a fundamental we can go anywhere till asked not to in this country i grew up asking for permission to shoot not assuming i can until told otherwise even on here lads will post why don't you put up signs , it's easy to get lost and not know whoose land yer on etc etc
yes you have a right to be annoyed just ring the guards next time

Cass

Absolutely they have to ask permission. Otherwaie they are into trespassing, and maybe even poaching territory.

Its a requirement for a person to get a license to be a member of a gun club or have their own permissions to shoot on lands. Granted the lands they use to get the permission may not necessarily be all of them, but its "taken for granted" that they have permissions for all the lands they do shoot on.

1. Are they known to you?
2. Are they from a gun club?
3. Where they there before with someone that has permission from you?
4. Are they new to the area?
5. Do they have shooting rights on adjoining land?

If yes to any of the above then i would say its an honest mistake. They could have ben turned around, new membes of a gunclub and don;t fully know the boundaries, been brought out before by someone and assumed it was okay to shoot alone, etc.

My advice would be to talk to them. No need for a confrontation as the all decent hunters would ackowledge they made a mistake, apologise, and leave without incident/cross word. If they insist or refuse to talk i would then make it kow to them tha you do not want them (or anyone depending on your situatio) shooting on your land. Make it known to any local gun clubs, and then if they persist i would take the matter up with An Gardai.

However please try and do as much as you can to prevent there being any mistake. I appreciate its your land and you have every right to say who can and cannot shoot there, but if you do any of the above then there can be no room for the "i didn't know defense".

whelan1

thanks i am going to put up signs tomorrow

Sparks

landkeeper wrote: »

otherwise even on here lads will post why don't you put up signs , it's easy to get lost and not know whoose land yer on etc etc

That's not quite the gist of what got posted up here that time though, is it?
The signs were to guard against accidental encroachment from lands where the shooter had permission to lands where they didn't; not to stop some halfwit who thought he owned the whole country and could shoot wherever he or she pleased, property rights be damned!

Cass

fodda wrote:

It is your land and you have who you want on it.

You do not have to put up signs by anybodies law or opinion....it is simply your property end of story!.

Call the cops and report the tresspassers and go out and film them.

Not this again.

I fail to see how putting up a few signs can hurt. Yes its his land and yes he has the right to allow anyone on the land he chooses, and in an ideal world people would respect it - no questions asked.

As i've said above 100% of decent hunters will obey a sign, and not trespass either puposely or by accident if they see a sign. All that remains is the minority that ignores all the rules irrespective of a sign.

However given the choice of eliminating 95% of people on your land by placing a simple sign rather than having to deal with 100% of them because of the attitude "its my land, i don't have to put up signs" is silly. I'm not disagreeing its a pain, but seriously, that attitude is as bad as the people that would ignore a sign. Why create conflict?

Spunk84

whelan1 wrote: »

thanks i am going to put up signs tomorrow

Sorry to here about this whelan, I myself have been on someone elses land without permission but it was my understanding it belonged to our gun club and a club member telling I could shoot it :mad:I shot over it for years until a farm quad came flying up the field towards me. The farmer was very angry and after explaining who I was and that it was a genuine mistake me being there he calmed down. He explained there had been alot of trespassing and that cattle were getting out with open gates and things like that. I offered my apologies and ask where his land ended and the gunclub stopped, by then he was happy that I wasn't some undesirable from the local area.

You will have people say they didn't know it was your land but in some instances it maybe true, not condoning trespass but sometimes there is a genuine reason.

Also if you want shooting off your land put up "Poision" signs, no sane person with a dog will venture onto poisoned land;)

landkeeper

Sparks wrote: »

That's not quite the gist of what got posted up here that time though, is it?
The signs were to guard against accidental encroachment from lands where the shooter had permission to lands where they didn't; not to stop some halfwit who thought he owned the whole country and could shoot wherever he or she pleased, property rights be damned!

maybe,! sparks i know you don't shoot out in the woods and fields but as i pointed out at the time there are subtle clues to land boundaries like gates and fences that should be just as big a clue to individual farms as a sign.!! the truth remains is a lot of lads don't give a flute and will wander where they will and use those old cherry excuses when challenged

fodda

Hey all i am saying if it isnt a law then why should someone be obliged with their time and expense to do it?
If it's genuine gun club members honest mistake then surely the gun club could go to their expense and trouble of giving out maps and putting up signs on where they can shoot. Why have other landowners got to oblige a hunting club?

Sparks

landkeeper wrote: »

maybe,! sparks i know you don't shoot out in the woods and fields but as i pointed out at the time there are subtle clues to land boundaries like gates and fences that should be just as big a clue to individual farms as a sign.!!

Funny thing landkeeper, I don't shoot out in the woods and fields, but that doesn't mean I'm barred from ever going there, and most farms I've been on tended to have more than one field and thus more than one ditch or gate. So crossing a ditch didn't mean you'd left the farm, if you follow me.

the truth remains is a lot of lads don't give a flute and will wander where they will and use those old cherry excuses when challenged

Nobody's defending eejits who do that, and they deserve what's coming to them; but you've just heard from Spunk above - sometimes it does happen quite innocently, and in those cases a sign or two is a good dose of prevention.

Sparks

fodda wrote: »

Hey all i am saying if it isnt a law then why should someone be obliged with their time and expense to do it?
If it's genuine gun club members honest mistake then surely the gun club could go to their expense and trouble of giving out maps and putting up signs on where they can shoot. Why have other landowners got to oblige a hunting club?

They're not.
You're also not obliged to always agree with your wife when she's wrong.
But some of us like a quiet life...

whelan1

i have never been asked by agun club could they use my land, they have signs up but have never asked me... i am farming this farm 10 years in my own right... i think this year will be the year i tell them to get lost...

landkeeper

Sparks wrote: »

Funny thing landkeeper, I don't shoot out in the woods and fields, but that doesn't mean I'm barred from ever going there, and most farms I've been on tended to have more than one field and thus more than one ditch or gate. So crossing a ditch didn't mean you'd left the farm, if you follow me.

Nobody's defending eejits who do that, and they deserve what's coming to them; but you've just heard from Spunk above - sometimes it does happen quite innocently, and in those cases a sign or two is a good dose of prevention.

your missing the point sparks or ignoring it deliberately
yes farms have ditches and fences BUT usually when you come to a ditch , hedge or fence that DOESN'T have a gate then it usually means it's the boundary of that particular farm not always but usually

Spunk84

Would it not be the same as having Beware of Bull on gates or a home owner with guard dog sign, they don't have to have it but just in the 1% of the population venturing on to their property, they have at least a warning for all to see

Cass

You're missing the point completely.

You are focused on who's responsibility it is to put up any signs rather than the placing of the signs at all. In your view the landowner/farmer has no obligation to do this, and you're quite right. S/he is under no obligation to do so. However i'll ask again, and please try keep your answer to this question only.

Why not do it?

Why run the "risk" of confrontation, tresspass, etc. Why seek conflict? An occassional sign when out and about would solve some problems. Its not like they have to go out and spend days putting up signs everywhere. My gun club puts up their own signs, but we also gave a bundle to each of the landowners, and asked them o throw up one occassionally if they see one missing or somewhere they think its needed. Not one of them has a problem doing it. As we are surrounded by 7 other clubs its important we mark our boundaries, and the farmers are also very strict as to who is on their land, restricting it to our club only. So everyone benfits by EVERYONE chipping in.

I mean from your attitude i get the impression that if you seen a fire, you'd stand there watching it burn because you're not a fireman, and its not your job?

Spunk84 wrote:

Would it not be the same as having Beware of Bull on gates or a home owner with guard dog sign

Ezactly. Prevention better than cure.

whelan1 wrote:

... i am farming this farm 10 years in my own right... ...

I'm not 100 familiar with the laws aurrounding this, but is it your own land. As in you own it, and has the sporting rights to it? I only ask because if you are renting the land, then the sprting rights could have been granted by the land owner(s). I think one the lads here might know the ins and outs of this better than i.

Spunk84

whelan1 wrote: »

i have never been asked by agun club could they use my land, they have signs up but have never asked me... i am farming this farm 10 years in my own right... i think this year will be the year i tell them to get lost...

Aaaaaaa there's your kicker whelan! Has the said gun club been around longer 10years, having the signs on your land it's your fault, as your advertising your land to be a GC land. I know you said you didn't have anyone ask you but if you don't want anyone shooting why did you not take the GC signs down On my first point, if the said GC has been around longer than u have owned the farm they may have always had permission from previous owners. If I was you call them up and go have a chat. I would rather have a GC on my land than not, at least you will who is who. You will always get help of GC members as well if your short handed

fodda

So you have signs up on your land saying it's gun club land? Is that correct?

landkeeper

why should a landowner have to ????why should there be conflict???? ,your putting the onus on the land owner to tell folk to stay out ,by your reasoning every piece of property in the state from house to farm to garden should have sign-age every jack soap in the country knows full well they have to have permission on the land they are shooting on, it's written there in black and white on your fac application form .
If you have no permission to be on that land you are in breach of your licence and run the risk of having it revoked

whelan1

i own the land and my dad owned it before me, tbh i think its damn right cheeky that the gun club have never ever asked me could they shoot my land, my dad says its along time since he was asked either.... would you go putting up signs on lands you have not askedthe owner their permission

whelan1

landkeeper wrote: »

why should a landowner have to ????why should there be conflict???? ,your putting the onus on the land owner to tell folk to stay out ,by your reasoning every piece of property in the state from house to farm to garden should have sign-age every jack soap in the country knows full well they have to have permission on the land they are shooting on, it's written there in black and white on your fac application form .
If you have no permission to be on that land you are in breach of your licence and run the risk of having it revoked

that is very interesting , thank you, am i supposed to have signed a form giving permission?

Cass

fodda wrote: »

So you have signs up on your land saying it's gun club land? Is that correct?

There are signs around all lands pointing out the club has the rights to shoot on it.

landkeeper wrote: »

why should a landowner have to ????why should there be conflict???? ,your putting the onus on the land owner to tell folk to stay out

No i'm not. We had this debate a while ago, but allow me to refresh your memory. I have no problem whether a landowner puts up signs or the gunclub do it. i don't even care whether its done or not. What i am saying is if the landowner places a few signs up it will eliminate some of the confsion and conflict that comes with people GENUINELY crossiinginto lands they do not have permission to be on.

I have already said the landowner is under no obligation to so anything, but i fail to se the problem with them doing it other than the attitude of "i shouldn't have to, so i won't".

,by your reasoning every piece of property in the state from house to farm to garden should have sign-age every jack soap in the country knows full well they have to have permission on the land they are shooting on, it's written there in black and white on your fac application form .

No thats your inference of what i said. You are once again blowing it out of proportion as you done in the last thread. Where a boundary is clearly defined or know there is no issue. A house/dwelling 99% of the time has a clearly marked boundary, and cannot be mistakeningly taken as shooting lands. However where one field adjoins to another for miles, sometimes there are innocent mistakes whereby people cross into lands they do not have permission to be on. If there is a gun club they should have signs up, if not or f they are missing i fail to see why a landowner would not put up one or at the very least contact the local gunclub and ask that they define it more clearly.Where is the problem there?

whelan1 wrote:

my dad says its along time since he was asked either....

That might be the problem so. If your father gave permission previously then they had sproting rights to the land, and have continued to shoot it. If the land is now in your name then i would suggest contacting the gunclub and informing them that you now own the land and do not wish for anyone to shoot on it.

would you go putting up signs on lands you have not asked the owner their permission

Absolutely not. However as above there would seem to be a previous permission that has simply been continued.

Spunk84

whelan1 wrote: »

that is very interesting , thank you, am i supposed to have signed a form giving permission?

For GC they want a signed permission to say that they have the shooting rights over the land, my club has a oral permission of land owners. Whelan just call the club you may find they are unaware that they can't shoot the land. It's just a matter of telling them you want no shooting there, or if you want to be formal email them and write a letter. As you said above that your father did at one time give permission but they haven't asked since, again they could be still under the illusion they still have permission and with their GC signs still on your land you pretty much are giving them permission.

fodda

If there are signs up then you cant blame the lads going shooting but i think you should may be thrash it out with the gun club to see what has happened with the signs etc being in the wrong place. I wouldnt have thought that the club would put signs up knowing they didnt have permission.

landkeeper

landkeeper wrote: »

why should a landowner have to ????why should there be conflict???? ,your putting the onus on the land owner to tell folk to stay out ,by your reasoning every piece of property in the state from house to farm to garden should have sign-age risk of having it revoked

meaning that by your reasoning no-one is capable of making a decision whether they can or cannot set foot anywhere unless there is a sign telling them they cannot and if one is not present they can assume they can .not that they can go shoot in your garden !!

landkeeper

anyway to the op ask around and who the chairman/committee of the gun club are ask them to meet with you and explain your concerns and ask them to inform their members they do not have you permission to shoot on your land you could also ask them to remove the signs

Cass

No. Again you have mistakeningly infered something i have not said.

I'm saying that if there is some dispute, confusion over the boundaries of a gunclubs lands then signs would help clarify it.

If someone shoots lands near a residential housing estate would every home owner need a sign saying "No Shooting". No. Why? Because people have more savvy than you are crediting them with. I am saying that signs WHERE APPROPRIATE are a good thing.

The details of this thread have become more complicated by the fact that there was previous or possibly existing permission. However if there was no previous permission it still does not take from the fact that a sign would sort most problems out.

You seem to be of the same opinion as fodda that you shouldn't have to put up signage. And you're right. In an ideal world you wouldn't. In an ideal world i wouldn't need thousands of Euro of security for my firearms. I would't need alarms for my house, car. We don't live in an ideal world or even close to it. So my attitude to signage is the same as all things. If i can prevent it with a a little effort then i'll take that route rather than sitting back and complaining about what i should or shouldn't have to do.

landkeeper

yes i am of the same opinion as fodda because you aren't looking at it from a landowners point of view , our farm is over 200 acres there are 5 neighbours who we share boundaries with us there are dozens of fields that come up to the boundary there is one hunt gate from us to one of the neighbours .
however there are hundreds of places where lads can /could /might cross from one farm to the next, they all with the one exception involve either climbing through a hedge over a ditch or through/over a fence
even if i could put up signs at all these places it is still arguable that a transgressor might not see one of the signs
your property is your property whether its a farm or a garden, what you are suggesting is as i say putting the onus on the landowner to say keep out. whereas my thoughts would be that anyone who is out and about with a gun should know where they are at all times after all if you have no permission to be there i'm sure your insurance wouldn't cover you if there were to be an accident

Spunk84

landkeeper wrote: »

yes i am of the same opinion as fodda because you aren't looking at it from a landowners point of view , our farm is over 200 acres there are 5 neighbours who we share boundaries with us there are dozens of fields that come up to the boundary there is one hunt gate from us to one of the neighbours .
however there are hundreds of places where lads can /could /might cross from one farm to the next, they all with the one exception involve either climbing through a hedge over a ditch or through/over a fence
even if i could put up signs at all these places it is still arguable that a transgressor might not see one of the signs
your property is your property whether its a farm or a garden, what you are suggesting is as i say putting the onus on the landowner to say keep out. whereas my thoughts would be that anyone who is out and about with a gun should know where they are at all times after all if you have no permission to be there i'm sure your insurance wouldn't cover you if there were to be an accident

It's not that my insurance wouldn't cover me is that "Your" insurance would be screwed if someone hurt themselves on your land. It's stupid that a person who trespasses onto your property without permission can sue the living hell out of you if something happens to them there. With signs up you can argue that your property was adequately signed to tell people to stay off. The same way most businesses now have the sign saying they wouldn't cover your loss or damage whilst your parked in their car park, even if u work there or your a member of the public.

Cass

landkeeper wrote: »

even if i could put up signs at all these places it is still arguable that a transgressor might not see one of the signs

True. No argument. I wouldn't expect the landowner to place everywhere at every little crossing, etc, but perhaps where APPROPRIATE.

your property is your property whether its a farm or a garden, what you are suggesting is as i say putting the onus on the landowner to say keep out.

I've said this above, and i'll say it one more time as you seem intent on telling me what i'm saying. I am NOT putting the onus on the landowner. I'm asking what is your aversion to a landowner putting up some signs himself other than you shouldn't have to argument?

whereas my thoughts would be that anyone who is out and about with a gun should know where they are at all times ..............

I agree, they should. However its the ideal world scenario again.

Look i'm not saying a sign will cure all the problems, and in some cases they are useless. All i;m saying, and have been saying, is why not have a few up. No doubt people will miss them, ignore them, etc, but in some situations they can be an aid irrespective of who puts them up.

after all if you have no permission to be there i'm sure your insurance wouldn't cover you if there were to be an accident

Don't know about that.

landkeeper

surely shouldn't have to is as good a reason as any other, but if we are not careful society will adopt an attitude ;if it doesn't say you can't then it means you can '
i stand by my statement if somebody is out for a shot they should know whose land they are on and have permission we as a sport are supposed to be responsible law abiding members of society
perhaps it's time the nargc started a fund to provide landowners with no shooting signs

cavan shooter

whelan1 wrote: »

over from the farming and forestry forum, i am a landowner and am a bit annoyed that people think they have a right to shoot on my land with out asking me, i think i am right to be annoyed, so do ye ask the landowners permisson?

I only shoot where I have or our Gun club has permission.. I go further to always have a chat with the farmer at some time in the year and the Batchelor farmers around me always get a visit especially when the weather turns bad. God bless Teachers....:D
If a Farmer doesnt want someone to shoot on the land thats fine. I have offered in the past to put up sanctuary and no shooting signs and this goes down well. Its about compromise as I see it. Some farmers dont mind shooting others do...some will let you shoot some fields some dont want you in other fields.

whelan1

Spunk84 wrote: »

For GC they want a signed permission to say that they have the shooting rights over the land, my club has a oral permission of land owners. Whelan just call the club you may find they are unaware that they can't shoot the land. It's just a matter of telling them you want no shooting there, or if you want to be formal email them and write a letter. As you said above that your father did at one time give permission but they haven't asked since, again they could be still under the illusion they still have permission and with their GC signs still on your land you pretty much are giving them permission.

asked my dad again , he said the people he gave permission to are all dead

Cass

landkeeper wrote: »

surely shouldn't have to is as good a reason as any other, but if we are not careful society will adopt an attitude ;if it doesn't say you can't then it means you can '

At the risk of going off theme/topic by going from a shooting perspective to a social one we already have that society. When you are driving how many times have you have you had to react to something that someone else has done. You shouldn;t have to do it, but unfortunately the same people that would walk lands they have no permission for are the same people that will drive recklessly, ignorantly because their attitude is "I'll do as i please, and if you hit me i'll sue".

Thats somewhat simplistic explanation, but its apt. We already exist in a society where some people are responsible and others are not, and those that are responsible must act accordingly to counter the ignorant ones.

Its annoying, frustrating, and most times shouldn't happen, but it does. So there is a difference between should not have to in theory and should not have to in reality.

i stand by my statement if somebody is out for a shot they should know whose land they are on and have permission we as a sport are supposed to be responsible law abiding members of society

I agree, they should.

perhaps it's time the nargc started a fund to provide landowners with no shooting signs

Perhaps.

cavan shooter

whelan1 wrote: »

asked my dad again , he said the people he gave permission to are all dead

Did he give permission to the individuals or the club, we have this every couple of years when we resign club boundaries. Its important for a club to go around every few years and have a chat:)

Some Farmers say work away others may have passed away and their Daughters and Sons say the dont want shooting on the Land, its their prerogative but I will stand by what I said earlier I prefer to try keep them on board and offer to put up Sanctuary signs. Only recently a member of the Club inherited 60 acres of land and then wrote to us telling us he didnt want shooting on it......Its his choice...Lucky for me and our club there are plenty of Farmers that allow us to have a shot and are quite supportive.

fodda

I was at the understanding that you had to have written permission from landowners to shoot on there land......is this still true?

I was on the understanding that it is trespass if you enter land without permission........is this true?

If a cop did me for speeding and there weren't any signs up (were he stopped me) which i pointed out to him.........what do you think he would do?

cavan shooter

fodda wrote: »

I was at the understanding that you had to have written permission from landowners to shoot on there land......is this still true?

I was on the understanding that it is trespass if you enter land without permission........is this true?

If a cop did me for speeding and there weren't any signs up (were he stopped me) which i pointed out to him.........what do you think he would do?

I have original signed permissions going back to the 1960's after that it was work away very few people want to sign anything.

Spunk84

fodda wrote: »

I was at the understanding that you had to have written permission from landowners to shoot on there land......is this still true?

I was on the understanding that it is trespass if you enter land without permission........is this true?

If a cop did me for speeding and there weren't any signs up (were he stopped me) which i pointed out to him.........what do you think he would do?

No written permission is needed, farmer joe says you can shoot my land and ur set

Yes trespass is as you said

If you say a to a cop there's no signs you will get an earful or a ticket. If your caught trespassing you will get an earful or a Gard called-:D either way it's how you speak to a farmer or Gard which determines the outcome. Always treat people how you would like to be treated and you will 99% of the time be okay, it's when u get thick with lads it becomes a problem

Cass

fodda wrote: »

I was at the understanding that you had to have written permission from landowners to shoot on there land......is this still true?

To get your firearms license you need written permission, but for shooting rights no. I have some of mine on word of mouth. The rest are written, as i feel better knowing i have it in wrting. however i'm not sure if there is a law regarding all permissions MUST be written.

I was on the understanding that it is trespass if you enter land without permission........is this true?

Yes in most cases. There are right of way issues on some land for walkers, etc, but not for shooting. How its dealt with depends on the landowner and details surrounding the tresspass (on purpose or accidental).

If a cop did me for speeding and there weren't any signs up (were he stopped me) which i pointed out to him.........what do you think he would do?

Depends on the situation. There is a national speed limit set for all roads unless otherwise indicated by signage.

On another point........
I didnt know as Spunk says that you could tresspass and sue the owner if you got hurt if there is no signs up.......is this true?

I've heard of such cases, but cannot comment as i've no experience with personal injury claims, etc.

whelan1

i want to get this sorted before november 1st, will i put up no hunting signs or signs that no one is to enter the lands with out my permission?

landkeeper

yes if you can but your best bet is to inform the committee and make sure they pass on the information then there are no grey areas

whelan1

tbh i dont actually know who is on the gun club committee, will have to ask tomorrow, that will tell you how little contact we have ever had

landkeeper

Ezridax wrote: »

Thats somewhat simplistic explanation, but its apt. We already exist in a society where some people are responsible and others are not, and those that are responsible must act accordingly to counter the ignorant ones



Perhaps.

the problem i have with that statement ezri is that as i said we as shooters are supposed to be above reproach , if you got lifted for being drunk and disorderly you quite easily have your fac revoked the same if you got into a fight and were arrested
because we apply and are granted a fac means we should behave responsibly and correctly and behave better than the average oike

Spunk84

whelan1 wrote: »

tbh i dont actually know who is on the gun club committee, will have to ask tomorrow, that will tell you how little contact we have ever had

Just ask in your local or Gard station they will know.

Cass

landkeeper wrote: »

.............. are supposed to be above reproach ,................... means we should behave responsibly and correctly and behave better than the average oike

I agree completely and would like to think that the majority think the same way. Problem is, even in the highlighted bits above from your own post, that doesn't happen. As is evident from stories/reports about shooting recklessly, poaching, tresspassing, etc.

Birdnuts

Large Tresspassers will be Prosecuted next to No Hunting signage I would have thought makes clear a landowners feelings if they don't want hunting on their land. The problem here is a few Jackasses who fup things up for everybody, both farmer and law abiding hunter alike. The type who wilfully tresspass without permission don't give a toss about the law anyway and then things proceed into the criminal sphere which makes this issue more or less the same as crimes like breaking and entering etc.

MOSSAD

Great sign in Arizonza:
"Trespassers will be shot. Survivors will be shot again".

homerhop

As a club we ask each farmer every year can we post their lands as gunclub lands. We also give the farmers a list of who is in the club. I recall a few years ago where a lad took it for granted he could shoot one of the farms and was told by said farmer if it is not worth asking for it is not worth shooting on.

There are a lot of things we shouldnt have to do but end up doing to save further hassle down the road. To the OP send a letter to the local gun club when you find out who they are, you can put up signs and also like a lot of farmers do put an add in the local paper stating all permission revoked on your lands.

garv123

MOSSAD wrote: »

Great sign in Arizonza:
"Trespassers will be shot. Survivors will be shot again".

Ive that on my bedroom door:D:D The Garda had a laugh at it when he was inspecting the safe:cool:

Dusty87

MOSSAD wrote: »

Great sign in Arizonza:
"Trespassers will be shot. Survivors will be shot again".

Or Grand Theft Auto 3.

doctor evil

cavan shooter wrote: »

Only recently a member of the Club inherited 60 acres of land and then wrote to us telling us he didnt want shooting on it......Its his choice...Lucky for me and our club there are plenty of Farmers that allow us to have a shot and are quite supportive.

Did he have a good reason why or is it shmucky behaviour.