Racism - Mod Note on 1st Post - Read before posting.

Chucky the tree

Blatter wrote: »

If used in a derogatory tone, it can be construed as racism...

Anyway, what kind of response would you expect if you went up to a black person and called them a negro? How would you expect the black person to interpret it?

Pro. F wrote: »

It's a word that is of disputed acceptability no? Some black people say it's fine, many say it isn't. That's my understanding anyway.

Anyway context would be everything, especially if they were speaking Spanish. I know you were only talking about the word, not the context btw.

I agree context is important, but it worth noting that negro means black in spainish. So since Suarez was speaking spainish he would have used to word Negro for describing something as black. I'm not sure if Evra understand Spainish but if he doesn't he could have just heard some Spainish then the word "negro" thrown in and just presumed he was being rascist when he might not have been at all.

Blatter

Mr Alan wrote: »

Yea, you can see Suarez lips & it's apparent he's not calling him a word beginning with 'n' at least 10 times (most likely ******, going by Evra's statements). They are also surrounded by witnesses who'd clearly be able to hear what was said.

Is this the gif you are talking about

http://www.101greatgoals.com/video-patrice-evra-accuses-luis-suarez-of-racism-liverpool-manchester-united/110478/

If so, that's very inconclusive as to what was said.

Also, it's ridiculous to assume that the players near by would have definitely heard him.

flahavaj

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I agree context is important, but it worth noting that negro means black in spainish. So since Suarez was speaking spainish he would have used to word Negro for describing something as black. I'm not sure if Evra understand Spainish but if he doesn't he could have just heard some Spainish then the word "negro" thrown in and just presumed he was being rascist when he might not have been at all.

Negro is also a derogatory term for blacks in Spanish. Apparently in Uruguay where black folk aren't as common it means the equivalent of "buddy." AFAIK Evra speaks fluent Spanish, but its doubtful he has any idea of the slang used in Uruguay, so no reasonable person could surely criticise him if he got annoyed at being called "Negro" on the pitch - if that is what happened of course.

Mr Alan

Am I reading this right?!

Flah is claiming Suarez muddied the waters by saying something vague about the incident?!?! Wtf?!

Have a read of Evra's initial interview & slap yourself in the face Flah.

Suarez doesn't have to say what he said-he's simply said he didn't say anything racist & that he along with the Utd players were shocked by Evra's reaction.

Your insistence that what he said was 'some bizarre word', is entirely your own invention.

Chucky the tree

flahavaj wrote: »

Negro is also a derogatory term for blacks in Spanish. Apparently in Uruguay where black folk aren't as common it means the equivalent of "buddy." AFAIK Evra speaks fluent Spanish, but its doubtful he has any idea of the slang used in Uruguay, so no reasonable person could surely criticise him if he got annoyed at being called "Negro" on the pitch - if that is what happened of course.

Well it is in the same way that black can be as degrotatory term for black people as John Terry knows. Obviously it'ss important to know what was said in Spainish to know the context. If he said "Why you dive negro?" Or whatever then I don't think it's rascist on Suarez part, if he said "why you dive you stupid negro ****?" Then obviously that a bit different.

Everyone should have kept their opinion to themslves on this until it all came out, problem is far to many people see it as some kind of neseccsity to make a tit out of themselves in the defense of their club.

flahavaj

Mr Alan wrote: »

Am I reading this right?!

Flah is claiming Suarez muddied the waters by saying something vague about the incident?!?! Wtf?!

Have a read of Evra's initial interview & slap yourself in the face Flah.

Suarez doesn't have to say what he said-he's simply said he didn't say anything racist & that he along with the Utd players were shocked by Evra's reaction.

I am saying he could have cleared this up ages ago surely if its a case of a simple error on his part between languages/cultures.

Nice selective posting btw. Answer the question in the last paragrap of my previous post.

Mr Alan

The rest of your post didn't merit response tbh.

flahavaj

Mr Alan wrote: »

The rest of your post didn't merit response tbh.

Your vehemence is fading fast Al. Suddenly I note the speed, volume and ferocity with which Suarez is being defended has dropped rapidly as the bullsh*t defences that have been peddled here are exposed as just that. Amusing.

Pro. F

Blatter wrote: »

Is this the gif you are talking about

http://www.101greatgoals.com/video-patrice-evra-accuses-luis-suarez-of-racism-liverpool-manchester-united/110478/

If so, that's very inconclusive as to what was said.

Also, it's ridiculous to assume that the players near by would have definitely heard him.

That's the only gif I could find.

It only shows Suarez saying something for about a second and then it cuts off. It doesn't even show the whole word he was saying, let alone everything he said to Evra in the game.

As you say, it's absolutely ridiculous to claim that the other players would have definitely heard what was said.

It's a fúcking gif from the internet. Hardly a reliable source of evidence.

If this is what you were talking about Al then you are taking the piss.

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

Your vehemence is fading fast Al. Suddenly I note the speed, volume and ferocity with which Suarez is being defended has dropped rapidly as the bullsh*t defences that have been peddled here are exposed as just that. Amusing.

In fairness Flah i've yet to see any evidence which proves his guilt so i think you are clutching at straws

flahavaj

amiable wrote: »

In fairness Flah i've yet to see any evidence which proves his guilt so i think you are clutching at straws

I haven't said once any such evidence exists.

However several Liverpool fans have stated outright that they think Evra is lying.

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

I haven't said once any such evidence exists.

You seem to be sensing blood

I still think you are clutching at straws.

Why is it race rows seem to follow Evra around for a few years now?

flahavaj

amiable wrote: »

You seem to be sensing blood

I still think you are clutching at straws.

Why is it race rows seem to follow Evra around for a few years now?

This has been done a million times, over the vast majority of the 50 pages of the thread.

Mr Alan

Ok, I thought GeGea was directly at the pair when it happened. Apologies.

However, as I said Suarez said the pair exchanged words & there is proof. See how easy it was?!

Thankfully that establishes we definitely had a camera on the pair during the altercation. Unless a power cut out just prior to Suarez unleashing a racial slur upon Evra more than 10 times!? Or the camera men who were catching the action got distracted by something?!

flahavaj

amiable wrote: »

I'll play your game here.

Re read my post

What?

Why are you replying to the same post twice with two different replies?

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

This has been done a million times, over the vast majority of the 50 pages of the thread.

I'll play your game here.

Re read my post

flahavaj

Either I'm seeing double here or there was more whiskey that I thought in that fruit cake I ate a minute ago......

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

What?

Why are you replying to the same post twice with two different replies?

Replied to the wrong post.

Pro. F

amiable wrote: »

Why is it race rows seem to follow Evra around for a few years now?

You want to have the row about that out again, why don't you just present your case now instead of trying to draw people in with that line? Are you saying there is a pattern of Evra crying wolf? Lets see your evidence.

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

Either I'm seeing double here or there was more whiskey that I thought in that fruit cake I ate a minute ago......

Ok still playing your game, show me where i said Evra has made accusations before.

I've read most of these pages you referred to too.

I asked a specific question

amiable

Pro. F wrote: »

You want to have the row about that out again, why don't you just present your case now instead of trying to draw people in with that line? Are you saying there is a pattern of Evra crying wolf? Lets see your evidence.

Maybe you should re read my post too

flahavaj

amiable wrote: »

Ok still playing your game, show me where i said Evra has made accusations before.

I've read most of these pages you referred to too.

I asked a specific question

See Pro F's answer.

Good to see you reverting to that old chestnut though. Struggling.

If you have a point to make, make it. Race rows "following Evra" is no different to you saying he has called people racists before. He hasn't. You're just slightly changing the language to suit your self, but the basic point remains the same as the dozens of times ye have tried this lame defence before.

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

See Pro F's answer.

Good to see you reverting to that old chestnut though. Struggling.

Good to see you avoid the question i asked

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

See Pro F's answer.

Good to see you reverting to that old chestnut though. Struggling.

If you have a point to make, make it. Race rows "following Evra" is no different to you saying he has called people racists before. He hasn't. You're just slightly changing the language to suit your self, but the basic point remains the same as the dozens of times ye have tried this lame defence before.

Absolute bull

flahavaj

amiable wrote: »

Good to see you avoid the question i asked

This is so f*cking lame its laughable.

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

This is so f*cking lame its laughable.

Ditto

flahavaj

amiable wrote: »

Absolute bull

How is it bull? he hasn't accused people of being racist before as your fellow Liverpool fans grasped after having it explained many times.

Again, what is your point? If the best defence you have for him is "race rows have followed him around even though I know and admit he has not accused others of racism before" then you're just making yourself look stupid.

Le King

It's quite sad. If Wayne Rooney had of said the same thing to a black Liverpool player the same posters playing it off now would be jumping the gun.

Mr Alan

Flah, just out of curiousity, if/when the FA dismiss this case, will you then say, 'yep, Suarez didn't racially abuse Evra. Fair enough.'

amiable

flahavaj wrote: »

How is it bull? he hasn't accused people of being racist before as your fellow Liverpool fans grasped after having it explained many times.

Again, what is your point? If the best defence you have for him is "race rows have followed him around even though I know and admit he has not accused others of racism before" then you're just making yourself look stupid.

It's been proved before that he has accused someone of racism before.

It was done in detail in ''50 pages'' in fact

It was claimed by an independant FA council that his evidence was exaggerated and dangerous in the past.( Telling Lies)

I'm honoured you think i'm making myself look stupid( that old chesnut to win an argument)

Carry on Flah