Have I lost it all.

2much2take

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Hi all. I'm really hoping for some help with this and would love to read a reply from someone who has experinced this or has reconciled with their partner. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]For reasons I won't go into too much, my partner of 12yrs and I broke up about 6wks ago. She gave me a number of reasons and if I understand them correctly, she was basically fed up. She was exhausted and burned out from the relationship. She believed, correctly, that she was giving more than she was receiving. The relationship became a mechanical and tiresome routine, repeated day after day. I work nights and work a lot to raise the money and we didn't spend a lot of time together because of this. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]You're probably thinking..........ok, fair enough, she had enough! [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I guess the two major reasons for her feeling this way are[/FONT]

1. [FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]We had to move back to our family homes (not good for a pair of 30 somethings) after I suffered a huge set back in work and had to leave the appartment we rented. I had used the money I had been saving for a wedding, (she didn't know I was going to propose) to pay the rent for an extra few months in the hope that the work situration would change.[/FONT]

[LIST=2]
[*][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]In the last 6mths the work situration had changed, and I was again in a postition to propose and either rent or buy a property. I had planned on doing this after her returned from a family break in November.[/FONT]
[/LIST]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]There were two minor things, that happened which I believe promted her dicision to break up. The first was, I didn't want to take time off work to go on a weekend in the country she had planned. I didn't want to do this because the overtime would have boosted the amount of money I could save and I didn't want to tell her why, because that would have ruined the proposal plans I had planned. The second was a wedding, which she didn't get a +1 for and still wanted me to go, but I didn't feel comfortable going.[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Since the break up I have made all the usual misakes and have wrote and spoke to her asking her to take me back. I have even spoken to her friend, who told me there was no chance of getting back together. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]The last time we spoke, I even had the ring in my pocket but didn't go throught with the proposal because I wanted to ask her parents first. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Now I often sit, staring at the ring and wondering have my attempts to give the girl I love, the romantic proposal I think she wanted and deserved. [/FONT]

rebel10

I'm sorry you are going through this.:(
Deep down, was the proposal an attempt to keep the relationship going? Did you hope it would just make things more exciting with wedding planning and all that? In truth, was it an attempt to avoid the fact that you knew the relationship was going down hill?
I'm really sorry, but from what you have said, especially the part where you said you spoke to her friend, it looks like it is over.:( 12 years is a long time. she would have obviously been thinking about whether she really wanted to spend her life with you. She hasn't taken this decision lightly, you can be sure of that, and probably has been on her mind for a long, long time, even before you moved home.
The weekend away thing was probably the final nail. She probably weighed up her options and decided, well, if this is what it is like before we even get married...
Obviously this is completely my interpretation of things. After 12 years, you don't want to lose someone but at the same time you don't want to feel like you are the only one putting in the effort.
Did you tell her you were going to propose? If not, don't. Don't ask her family. Just see how things play out over the next few weeks.
Hope you are ok.

2much2take

rebel10 wrote: »

I'm sorry you are going through this.:(
Deep down, was the proposal an attempt to keep the relationship going? Did you hope it would just make things more exciting with wedding planning and all that? In truth, was it an attempt to avoid the fact that you knew the relationship was going down hill?.

Thanks for the reply. No, the first time I was in a position to propose, we were really happy. Had a great place to live, a broad and varied social life and had both talked about it for a while.

rebel10 wrote: »

I'm really sorry, but from what you have said, especially the part where you said you spoke to her friend, it looks like it is over.:( 12 years is a long time. she would have obviously been thinking about whether she really wanted to spend her life with you. She hasn't taken this decision lightly, you can be sure of that, and probably has been on her mind for a long, long time, even before you moved home. .

I'm sure this sounds as week as I think it does, but the move home was only for a year.... tops and my plan to ask her to marry me would have happened well within that time. My ex, also said what you have. That she has been thinking about it for a while and its a decision she didn't take lightly.

rebel10 wrote: »

The weekend away thing was probably the final nail. She probably weighed up her options and decided, well, if this is what it is like before we even get married...
Obviously this is completely my interpretation of things. After 12 years, you don't want to lose someone but at the same time you don't want to feel like you are the only one putting in the effort.
Did you tell her you were going to propose? If not, don't. Don't ask her family. Just see how things play out over the next few weeks.
Hope you are ok.

I sort of guessed the same time about the weekend. I have tried to explain my reasons for not wanting to go away, but alast any thing I said would just sound like an excuse.

2much2take

Just to add. We did have a small period were I thought, if I put a lot of work into the relationship it might be saved. As we agreed to keep contact, but I messed that up by sending a joke by text, which she then said was to much contact :mad:

littlefriend

I really think you should tell her all of this. You have nothing to lose and maybe it is just what she wanted to hear to stop her leaving.

2much2take

littlefriend wrote: »

I really think you should tell her all of this. You have nothing to lose and maybe it is just what she wanted to hear to stop her leaving.

Thanks. I have thought of that. But cannot think of a way to do it, were it won't appear to be a last grasp at holding onto her.

The big problem is, she is very insecure. She believes I will say whatever it takes to get her into bed, as she told me she thinks I really didn't want to commit to her and the relationship and was only interested in sex

fungun

Its difficult to understand everything from your post but Im not sure you have gleaned the correct reasons for the split - both those reasons sound fairly temporary that someone who was happy with all other things in a relationship would work through.

For instance, it seems odd to me that if you have a job (and maybe she does?) that in the current climate you couldnt afford to rent a place together (even if it wasnt ideal location etc) rather than move back to the family home if this one thing really was a deal breaker. Perhaps they were just symptoms of the deeper issues?

Because what comes across in your post is that you worked hard for what you thought was important. But perhaps what she thought important was you and you didnt give her that. And this has probably been going on for a while....have you been working hard/long hours for a long time?

At this point I would tell her all, explain you were doing it for her etc etc, what have you go to lose?

2much2take

fungun wrote: »

Its difficult to understand everything from your post but Im not sure you have gleaned the correct reasons for the split - both those reasons sound fairly temporary that someone who was happy with all other things in a relationship would work through. [\QUOTE]

Those were the reasons I came up with after some serious thought. I'm sure there are others such as privacy while living in the family homes, all her sisters have married / families etc.

fungun wrote: »

For instance, it seems odd to me that if you have a job (and maybe she does?) that in the current climate you couldnt afford to rent a place together (even if it wasnt ideal location etc) rather than move back to the family home if this one thing really was a deal breaker. Perhaps they were just symptoms of the deeper issues?

Yes, with hindsight we should have done that. But my intention was to try and save the maxinium amount of money within a year.

fungun wrote: »

Because what comes across in your post is that you worked hard for what you thought was important. But perhaps what she thought important was you and you didnt give her that. And this has probably been going on for a while....have you been working hard/long hours for a long time?

At this point I would tell her all, explain you were doing it for her etc etc, what have you go to lose?

I work really unsocial hours, which are all night shifts. The pattern of night on and night off, means I sleep during the day before I go to work and then all day the next day. Which doesn't leave much time to be a proper boyfriend.

I'm also confused about the invite to the wedding I metioned earlier. When we spoke after the breakup, I told my ex, that if she wanted me to go to the wedding I would. She told me she would like that. But haven't mentioned it to her since then..

2much2take

Folks, thanks for your replies so far. I do genuinely believe I can patch things up with my ex. I'm not a big believer in the whole 'if it was meant to be' lark or that people can just turn thier feelings and emotions on and off as they please. I understand she is feeling jaded as she feels she carried the relationship for the last while, and I just need a way to show her how much it was appreciated and now its my turn to work really hard to show her how much she means to me

I have apologised to her in the letter I wrote, but how good it was or how well it was recieved....... I'm not to sure.

qwertytlk

Hi, im sorry for how things have turned out for you... I have read all your posts here about this and apart from the reasons you have already mentioned, would you say your workin hours were a big thing? I mean working all night, sleeping all day. That meant you never got to spend any time togethher really... Or sleep in the same bed at night, or sit down to a meal. Im sure this was very hard for you,and for your girlfriend. Id imagine she would have felt she was almost living alone! And id say she was quite lonely too.
I understand the reasons why you were working so hard-saving for a marriage nd house, but the fact that she didnt know about either may have made her feel you were just working all the hours for the sake of it. She did not know there was a purpose, a goal in sight. Perhaps she got really fed up of living like that? If this was part of he problem, which i suspect it was, then i feel had she known there was a purpose to it, iit would have given her something to work toward and to look forward to.

If there is a chance for you to get back together, then in my opinion you shoud give her some breathing space. Some time to think, to re evaluate things for herself. As you said, you have made it clear you want to give it another go and have written letters etc, so she knows how you feel in that regard.
In my opinion u should contact her once more and if possible meet up. Explain everything to her and tell her you love her and want to spend the rest of your life with her (or whatever you feel, in your own words) and tell her that you would like to give her some space, some time to think, really think about what she wants, and ask her to come to you when she is ready and let you know what she wants to do once and for all.
I feel this would be a good way to go about it as you are laying your cards on the table, telling her how you feel and offering her some time to sort out her own feelings. This way she will not feel pressured. Whereas if you keep bombarding her with texts, calls , emails and talking to her friends about the breakup, then she will feel pressured and smothered and this is likely to annoy her and therefore cause her to push you away completley, or make a rash decision. I feel this is the best chance you have to smooth things over. Offer to do whatever it takes to change the things that were causing problems in the relationship. But make sure you folow through on these promises as if you dont she will just see nothings changed and you will end up back where you are now.
If you do get back together then you probably have alot of work to do to make the changes that are needed to make it work. You love though,so its all worth it!
My opinion anyway.
Best of luck and i hope things work out for the best.

IrishEyes19

Would you consider showing her the exact message you wrote on boards.

I honestly think its heart warming and really honest.

Curry Addict

i think you fail to see the deeper reasons behind her wanting to split.

it sounds like there is a distinct lack of emotional connection. its very possible to work shift nights etc and maintain a great relationship. you just have put thought and effort into it.
when you are a solid couple, you face stuff together and make adjustments. its important for a woman to feel safe and secure and looked after by her man and protected with a roof over her head. you dont go running home to mammies in order to save money.
you need to work towards common goals together, sharing the experience.
you seem consumed by your own goals and blind to hers.
relationships need to be maintained daily, not in blocks of time where you are focusing on other seemingly important stuff.
you need to understand what makes your partner happy day to day and make sure you are satisfying those needs.

Kevin Duffy

If the reasons you've given here are the sum of her reasons for the split, I'm not sure why you'd want her back. If I read you right, working some unsociable hours, not wanting to go to a wedding you weren't invited to and deciding to go to work to earn money you obviously needed instead of heading away for a weekend seems to have been enough for her to end it.

Perhaps there's more to it, maybe more than you're aware of, but if what you've said so far is all there is to it then she doesn't seem to have valued you or the relationship.

As for the contact after the breakup, if I read it right you agreed to be in contact, then she said a joke by text was too much contact. This says to me there's a bit more to her reasons. It seems a small thing, but after 12 years together it's certainly not too much contact.

After 12 years together, how does she think she's justified in saying you were only interested in sex? I'm sure she wanted a more solid commitment such as a ring, as she saw it, but nothing about staying with someone for 12 years says you're only looking for a ride.

All in all, I don't think you're the one with ground to make up or anything to prove. If she's told you the truth, she seems to have very little commitment, if she hasn't told you the truth, I think she owes you that after 12 years.

2much2take

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@ qwertytlk I have always works nights, But when a new company took over my hours were cut serverly and the shifts I got were realy hard to work around, because of how they were set up – night on / night off meant I would gave either just come off I needed to sleep to go to work. Often this new employer wouldn't even pay wages on time. So it was very hard to make plans and maintain a healty relationship. Before this, I used to work week on / week off and we ould both make plans and look forward to doing things as a couple on this week off. My new employer, would often not pay on time or change the roster at the last moment so it was very differcult to make plans or pay the rent. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I didn't tell her about my plans, as I wanted it to be a surprize for her. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I agree with your suggestion of allowing her time and space to think about things. We had limited contact for four weeks after the break up, but have had no contact since the last text ( which was a joke I sent to everyone in my contact list). I have no spoken to her friend in about four weeks and that was only because I needed to try and understand her reasons. I would like to contact her and meet her someplace, but I'm not sure if I would get a reply or even if she would agree. I'm afraid all she would hear would be bah bah bah bah....... [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@ Irisheyes19 I would, but I think she has lost her trust in me to deliever. I have already made mention of my intentions to her friend and her reply was.... why didn't you do it before??? [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@ Curry Addict I agree with you. Running home to mammies do seem like a good idea at the time, but in hindsight it wasn't. As I said, I've always worked nights and had no problems before. I can understand why my ex didn't feel safe and secure, because I wasn't even sure if I would get paid from this new employer and therefore couldn't make any soild plans for anything. And yes, I did become all consumed by my plans and forgot about the little, day to day things. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@ Kevin Duffy While I was not intitally invited to her friends wedding, she and another four friends who didn't get a +1 told the bride to be, that unless they all got +1's none of them would be going. The invite was then changed to invite partners. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Eventhough she could have gone to the wedding with her friends and had a good time, she was willing to fall out with her friend to ensure I went with her. But even after this, I appeared to be still unwilling to go and she felt I didn't have much interest in her or the relationship. My refusal to go on the weekend away only confirmed this. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Yeah, I thought claiming a joke sent to many was to much contact was strange aswel. But thinking about it, maybe she seen it as being too pushy and an attempt to maintain normal contact went all she wants is to be left alone and given time to think. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I believe her claim of only been interested in sex, is because we stopped doing the usual things like dating and other stuff people do in relationships and whenever we met up just had sex instead. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I do agree with your last point. Sometimes I feel short changed by the whole thing. We have always been able to talk to each other about anything and if she was feeling this way why didn't she say anything. If I thought my actions were in anyway hurting the relationship I would have told her my plans. But she has alreay told me, if she wasn't committed, she wouldn't have stayed with me for so long. [/FONT]

Chinafoot

2much2take wrote: »

]I believe her claim of only been interested in sex, is because we stopped doing the usual things like dating and other stuff people do in relationships and whenever we met up just had sex instead.



I do agree with your last point. Sometimes I feel short changed by the whole thing. We have always been able to talk to each other about anything and if she was feeling this way why didn't she say anything. If I thought my actions were in anyway hurting the relationship I would have told her my plans. But she has alreay told me, if she wasn't committed, she wouldn't have stayed with me for so long.

Ah come on now OP. She tried to organise a weekend away for you both, something that was probably a rarity for you given the hours you work, and you refused to get the time off because it would take away from your wedding savings that she knew absolutely nothing about. How is she supposed to react? She's obviously been unhappy for a while and it sounds like she hung in there for as long as she could and I think it's extrememly naiive to think that this is down to just the weekend and the wedding.

I'm always suspicious of people that claim that their lenghty relationships ended suddenly, or "out of the blue". More often than not, the partner who leaves has made numerous attempts to highlight the problems. Even the weekend, something you have referred to as minor, was an attempt from her to actually spend some time together. You were so focused on your attempt to get money together for the wedding that you completely missed it. Your working hours mean you don't spend time together like people in a normal relationship so extra effort needs to be made.

Also, if money has been an issue for you in the past, surely paying for the wedding is something you should have been doing as a couple. How long were you planning to spend trying to get enough money together before you actually proposed to her? Surely it would have made more sense to propose, let her know that you want to marry her, and then you could both work together to pay for your wedding. As it stood for her, you weren't there. You might think your intentions were good but in being so focused you missed the bigger picture. Even when you had the opportunity to propose to her you didn't do it because you wanted to ask her parents?! OP, you are so blind to where this relationship was at and its a bit rich for you to feel "short changed".

2much2take

Chinafoot wrote: »

Ah come on now OP. She tried to organise a weekend away for you both, something that was probably a rarity for you given the hours you work, and you refused to get the time off because it would take away from your wedding savings that she knew absolutely nothing about. How is she supposed to react? She's obviously been unhappy for a while and it sounds like she hung in there for as long as she could and I think it's extrememly naiive to think that this is down to just the weekend and the wedding.

Yeah, sure sounds dumb now.......doesn't it . I'm not saying its entirely down to the two things you say. But I'm sure they didn't help

Chinafoot wrote: »

I'm always suspicious of people that claim that their lenghty relationships ended suddenly, or "out of the blue". More often than not, the partner who leaves has made numerous attempts to highlight the problems. Even the weekend, something you have referred to as minor, was an attempt from her to actually spend some time together. You were so focused on your attempt to get money together for the wedding that you completely missed it. Your working hours mean you don't spend time together like people in a normal relationship so extra effort needs to be made.

Thats true. We had a big heart 2 heart a few weeks before the break up and we agreed that we would wait untill I had settled in with my new employer and would move in together in the new year.

I only described the weekend away as minor, compared to the other issues.

Chinafoot wrote: »

Also, if money has been an issue for you in the past, surely paying for the wedding is something you should have been doing as a couple. How long were you planning to spend trying to get enough money together before you actually proposed to her? Surely it would have made more sense to propose, let her know that you want to marry her, and then you could both work together to pay for your wedding. As it stood for her, you weren't there. You might think your intentions were good but in being so focused you missed the bigger picture. Even when you had the opportunity to propose to her you didn't do it because you wanted to ask her parents?! OP, you are so blind to where this relationship was at and its a bit rich for you to feel "short changed".

I was only saving for my end of the wedding. My ex was a much better saver than me and when my hours were cut, it put a big dent in my savings. I spent the last year saving, I could have proposed anytime in the last 3mths, but she was really looking forward to this family break and I knew if I asked her to marry me, she would use the savings she had for the break on the wedding.

I only wanted to 'get permission from the parents' as all her family had done the same and it seemed like a nice thing to do.

And yes...... I did miss the big picture. :mad:

I am greatful for the answers, but I'm fully aware of the misakes I've made and even though I had good intentions they were still huge **** ups.

What I'm really trying to do is show my ex that I know how much I messed up and that her goals for the relationship and mine are the same

Chinafoot

2much2take wrote: »

I only described the weekend away as minor, compared to the other issues.

But the thing is OP, after 12 years together, not living together and you working the way you are, by refusing to go away with her and not telling her why, it is anything but minor. Its actually pretty disrespectful and no doubt made her think that you simply weren't bothered. Similarly with you only having sex when you meet up. It sounds like any semblence of romance has left your relationship and you made no effort to change that.

2much2take wrote: »

I was only saving for my end of the wedding. My ex was a much better saver than me and when my hours were cut, it put a big dent in my savings. I spent the last year saving, I could have proposed anytime in the last 3mths, but she was really looking forward to this family break and I knew if I asked her to marry me, she would use the savings she had for the break on the wedding.

The fact that you were only saving for your end makes even less sense to me! Why couldn't you propose and therefore show her that you are committed to her and you do want your future together, and then save. You don't need to get married as soon as you put the engagement ring on her finger. You're assuming she would have sacraficed the family break in order to keep the money for the wedding, but you really don't know that. The fact that your relationship floundered while you were doing this saving and even now you haven't spoken to her properly about it, it's just baffling. While asking her parents permission might have been "nice", you really should have been more concerned with the fact that you were losing her because of your inaction. You're now, in a way, trying to put it on her. You couldn't propose because she would have avoided her family break. You couldn't propose because it'd be "nice" to ask her parents first because thats what her family has done in the past. The minute she broke up with you you should have told her everything and explained exactly what you were at.

2much2take wrote: »

What I'm really trying to do is show my ex that I know how much I messed up and that her goals for the relationship and mine are the same

Tell her then.

2much2take

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@ Chinafoot. Thanks, I do get what what your saying. Its not that I wasn't bothered, but after the heart2heart I just wanted to keep to the goals we made then and got a little target fixated. Sound really stupid now, doesn't it. As I said, she was always a much better saver than me so I had to work a bit harder to sort of 'catch up'. I understand I wouldn't have to get her straight to the altar, but I know she wouldn't want a long engagement. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I am not assuming anything about the break. I know she would. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I have spoken to her. I have told her everything. The first time, she told me she would think about what I am promising. The second time I even had the ring in my pocket. But I believe she thinks I'm just giving excuses and trying to make her feel guilty about the break up and am just trying anything to get back with her. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Seems like I only take one foot out to replace it with the other. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]A friend of mine told me to pawn or get a refund on the ring and use the money to go on holiday and then get my own place went I return. Then meet her after work and invite her up to my new place for a coffee, because my actions would speak louder then any words could. [/FONT]

Chinafoot

2much2take wrote: »

A friend of mine told me to pawn or get a refund on the ring and use the money to go on holiday and then get my own place went I return. Then meet her after work and invite her up to my new place for a coffee, because my actions would speak louder then any words could.

Taking that ring out of your pocket when you had the chance would have been a far better idea. Of course she thought it was all just words to get her back. You haven't shown her that you're serious. You could have easily proposed and the fact that you had the ring should have shown her that you had been considering it for a long time. Your lack of action really isn't derserving of sympathy.

If you've told her everything and she's having none of it then you need to leave her be and move on with your life. You had 12 years OP. Learn from your mistakes.

2much2take

Chinafoot wrote: »

If you've told her everything and she's having none of it then you need to leave her be and move on with your life. You had 12 years OP. Learn from your mistakes.

That might be all thats left!

littlefriend

I really don't get the rationale behind not telling her what you had planned and not showing her the ring to prove that you have been saving etc. Seriously? It makes no sense. If she is thinks you are just saying anything to get back with her then show her that she is wrong. The ring is proof that she is wrong.

Also your friends idea of selling the ring and going on holiday is utterly ludicrous. I'm sure she'd be over the moon to hear you did that to show actions speak louder than words. WTF?????

Starokan

its always horrible going through a break up particularly when you have been together for such a long time.

Don't be sorry that you wrote to her, at the very least she has that letter and knows how you feel. The fact that she has not acted upon it speaks volumes and for the moment i think you need to accept the relationship is over.

Im not saying it cant re-ignite but i do think that right now the best thing you can do is focus on yourself and give her some space. Concentrate on getting your own life together , work wise and personal wise. Funnily enough that is likely to impress your ex more than any letter or gesture. Break contact with her, you have let her know how you feel, leave it up to her to contact you, a prolonged period of no contact will help you. Also stop contacting her friend, regardless of what her friend says anything you say will be going back to your ex and it doesn't make you look good.

Lose the guilt, you were together for 12 years , she obviously thought a lot of you to stay with you for that length of time. Don't focus to much on the weekend away and the wedding, these are only minor things, yes they may have tipped her into making a decision but i can assure you the decision was already pretty much made.

Sometimes relationships are just not lifetime ones, you can get through this and you will.

LegacyUser

There is something really fishy about this break up. I really don't understand why you haven't shown her the ring and asked her to marry you OP. Twelve years is a long time to be with someone, and it seems odd that you never had the opportunity to ask her to marry you in those twelve years. You really need to understand that women don't have that much time to be faffing about when it comes to starting a family.
Can you be honest? Can you honestly say that you never led her up the garden path, with promises of getting married etc 'when things get better'. Your ex has taken a huge gamble to break it off with you, so the break up isn't something she's done on a whim. She's spent her best years with you and now needs to start all over again with someone new, and might feel pressurised to meet someone so she can start a family. This isn't the sort of thing any woman would do without a lot of soul searching. That's why I think the break up and your response to it sounds really, really bizarre!

2much2take

littlefriend wrote: »

I really don't get the rationale behind not telling her what you had planned and not showing her the ring to prove that you have been saving etc. Seriously? It makes no sense. If she is thinks you are just saying anything to get back with her then show her that she is wrong. The ring is proof that she is wrong.

Also your friends idea of selling the ring and going on holiday is utterly ludicrous. I'm sure she'd be over the moon to hear you did that to show actions speak louder than words. WTF?????

I didn't pull the ring out because it didn't feel the right thing to do. We were very upset while talking and I thought asking her to married me would just be more needy then I already appeared.

I think his suggestion was more about showing her I hadn't become so settled in mammies and what I said about moving forward was what I wanted - with or without her.

2much2take

unregter wrote: »

There is something really fishy about this break up. I really don't understand why you haven't shown her the ring and asked her to marry you OP. Twelve years is a long time to be with someone, and it seems odd that you never had the opportunity to ask her to marry you in those twelve years. You really need to understand that women don't have that much time to be faffing about when it comes to starting a family.
Can you be honest? Can you honestly say that you never led her up the garden path, with promises of getting married etc 'when things get better'. Your ex has taken a huge gamble to break it off with you, so the break up isn't something she's done on a whim. She's spent her best years with you and now needs to start all over again with someone new, and might feel pressurised to meet someone so she can start a family. This isn't the sort of thing any woman would do without a lot of soul searching. That's why I think the break up and your response to it sounds really, really bizarre!

Thats very unfair. If you had read my posts you would have seen I was going to propose to her before, but instead I used the money I had saved to pay the rent of our appartment.

Yes, I know she gave me her 'best years' and that she didn't take the dicision lightly but she did make the desision without having all the facts.

2much2take

Starokan wrote: »

Don't be sorry that you wrote to her, at the very least she has that letter and knows how you feel. The fact that she has not acted upon it speaks volumes and for the moment i think you need to accept the relationship is over.

I don't think she will, even if she wanted too. Like most people, when she puts her mind to something she see's it through to the end...

Starokan wrote: »

Im not saying it cant re-ignite but i do think that right now the best thing you can do is focus on yourself and give her some space. Concentrate on getting your own life together , work wise and personal wise. Funnily enough that is likely to impress your ex more than any letter or gesture. Break contact with her, you have let her know how you feel, leave it up to her to contact you, a prolonged period of no contact will help you. Also stop contacting her friend, regardless of what her friend says anything you say will be going back to your ex and it doesn't make you look good.

I am sorting my life out. I'm enjoying my new job and the time off it allows me.

I have broke contact with her, and have only spoke to the friend once (I had accepted her friends on facebook, now they have all dropped me, which I can understand)

Starokan wrote: »

Lose the guilt, you were together for 12 years , she obviously thought a lot of you to stay with you for that length of time. Don't focus to much on the weekend away and the wedding, these are only minor things, yes they may have tipped her into making a decision but i can assure you the decision was already pretty much made.

Guilt??? I don't feel guitly for what I did. I had good intentions and never set out to hurt her. Yes, the weekend & the wedding were the small things that tipped the balance, but as you said 12yrs does mean she though a lot of me and us as a couple thats why I think if I can show her rather than tell her, it would improve our chances of getting back together

Chinafoot

2much2take wrote: »

Yes, I know she gave me her 'best years' and that she didn't take the dicision lightly but she did make the desision without having all the facts.

She didn't have all the facts because you didn't provide them.

Let her go OP. You clearly haven't learned much from this at all.

2much2take

Chinafoot wrote: »

Let her go OP. You clearly haven't learned much from this at all.

I've learned a lot....

Its clearly better to be a selfish bastard then to think of others...........

LegacyUser

2much2take wrote: »

Thats very unfair. If you had read my posts you would have seen I was going to propose to her before, but instead I used the money I had saved to pay the rent of our appartment.

Yes, I know she gave me her 'best years' and that she didn't take the dicision lightly but she did make the desision without having all the facts.

Why don't you tell her the facts so? It really sounds like your ex broke it off with you because she thought you wouldn't commit to her. I can't see any other reason why she would end a twelve year relationship.

2much2take

unregter wrote: »

Why don't you tell her the facts so? It really sounds like your ex broke it off with you because she thought you wouldn't commit to her. I can't see any other reason why she would end a twelve year relationship.

Yeah... she thought that, but it wasn't true. If she had told me that what she was thinking, instead of going back on what we spoke about only a few weeks before I would have proposed and gone house hunting.

I only wanted to do what I felt was the right thing by waiting until her came back from New York with her family.

So I left it a bit late. But its not like I was abusive, violent or anything. I just wanted to give her a romatic proposal... whats wrong with that????

Chinafoot

2much2take wrote: »

I've learned a lot....

Its clearly better to be a selfish bastard then to think of others...........

A selfish bastard? You want to talk selfish...alright then. Selfish is not considering your partner of 12 years. Selfish is only focusing on you and your plans. Selfish is making your partner of 12 years feel that the only reason you meet up with her is for sex. Selfish is blaming the end of your relationship on her when she knew nothing about your plans because you didn't open your mouth to tell her. Instead you let her think that you quite simply didn't give a shít. Stop feeling sorry for yourself. You have nobody to blame here but yourself.

2much2take wrote: »

So I left it a bit late. But its not like I was abusive, violent or anything. I just wanted to give her a romatic proposal... whats wrong with that????

Yep, you really haven't learned a thing. You really can't see why she has ended it? Really? So she should just accept that sure you're not a woman beating alcoholic and be happy with a relationship where you don't spend time with her apart from meeting to have sex? You actually think that she's in the wrong when you never told her of your plans and even when you had the opportunity to show her the ring you had bought to prove how much you love her and are committed to her, you didn't do it. Firstly in this thread it was 'cause of some family tradition of asking her parents, but that has since changed to it not being the right time. The fact that she had ended things because of your sole focus on this end goal should have made you realise that the romanitc proposal wasn't necessary. Her parents permission wasn't necessary. What was necessary was you showing her exactly how much you care and want to be with her. Talk is cheap. You fúcked up but seem to think you haven't done a whole lot wrong. Stunning.

2much2take

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@ Chinafoot. I'm on here looking for advice. I know how much I messed things up and when I said selfish, I was refering to wanting to give the girl I love the romatic proposal I really believed she wanted. To be selfish, what I should have done is, leave the job which didn't allow me time with her, go on the dole, sponge of her and just give her the ring in Burger King. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I don't blame her for ending it. I fully understand her reasons. We didn't just meet up for sex, we would also do the usual things that couples do. But not that often. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]But you are right, I did allow her to think I wasn't ever going to commit and didn't give a ****. [/FONT]



[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]There is a family tradition of asking the parents in her family and I wanted to keep to that. When I said it 'wasn't the right time', I meant it wouldn't be right to propose marrage when we had spilt up and I felt it would have appeared to be a last grasp at holding onto her. If I thought for one moment that a proposal would have shown her I was committed I would have skipped the whole permission bit and got on with it[/FONT]

I am a friend

You are doing an awful lot of thinking but not enough action to back it up...

If you want her, go get her and quit sitting at home licking your wounds... You are trying to justify your inaction here and all that's happening is that you are wasting time typing responses to strangers on the Internet. If I were you I would be in the car on the way over to her to lay my cards on the table. Quit thinking cos it's obviously not working for you - move your ass and try to get her back.

2much2take

I am a friend wrote: »

I would be in the car on the way over to her to lay my cards on the table. Quit thinking cos it's obviously not working for you - move your ass and try to get her back.

Your reply actualy made me LoL... your right!

The last time we spoke it didn't go so good. I was really hurt when we broke up and if went bad it would hurt me even more. I have told her how I feel, but stopped short of asking her to marry me.

I just don't think popping the question at this time would be the right move.....

I am a friend

Stop thinking and go talk to her!! Tell her everything and then let HER think and make a decision. What have you to lose??

2much2take

I am a friend wrote: »

Stop thinking and go talk to her!! Tell her everything and then let HER think and make a decision. What have you to lose??

I have.... I told her everything, except that I had the ring in my pocket. That was two weeks ago, and haven't heard from her since. So I think I've gotten my answer

Thanks everybody

IrishEyes19

Im amazed at how everyone is going off on a feminist rant on this guy. He's admitted he made a mistake. But his job is clearly night shifts, therefore obviously it is more difficult to make time for such relationships. Plus I dont think its a time to have a go at him, when really advice is the best option.

OP, you have a lot to consider here, your job interferes with your relationship and I guess the bad timing with the weekend away and your saving money to propose just really hit the fan with your ex but as others did say, she must have underlying reasons to just up and leave, as after 12 years, it would be extreme to do that without reason.
If you do get a chance to reconsider the relationship, another job and spending time together will have to be your focus as, the only lesson you can gather from this experience is change. if nothing changes, there wont be a third chance I feel. Your option now is to talk to her directly. You will have to listen entirely,and hear her out as excuses I feel wont cut it this time. best of luck

IrishEyes19

2much2take wrote: »

I have.... I told her everything, except that I had the ring in my pocket. That was two weeks ago, and haven't heard from her since. So I think I've gotten my answer

Thanks everybody

why didnt you tell her about the ring. according to your posts, saving for the wedding and the proposal was the main cause of so much strife?

2much2take

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]@Irisheyes. Thanks for your support. I feel that I know her reasons and while I do understand them, I cannot just give up. The main basis for the break up was the precieved lack of commitment. I told her I was fully committed to her and the relationship, but when things in the job went bad, it just drew me into a situration were I just got into a pattern of not having any time to spend with her and any extra money I had would go towards the big plan leaving little or nothing to socialise etc. And I just sort of got a bit lazy. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I have another job now, its still night work, but not the 14hrs night on / night off like I used to do. The last time we spoke, I told her I wasn't looking for a full on second chance. That I am willing to work to rebuild our relationship, perhaps dating or the odd weekend away. Ironicy, the new job pays more, better hours and I have much more decent time off. But as I have already said. Everything I say to her appears to be excuses and empty promises. (I know this, because she told me that all she is hearing is 'excuses')[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I should point out... other people would often comment on us. Even after been with each other for so long, how we still acted like we were on our honeymoon period as we would still hold hands, cuddle and behave like loved up teenagers everywhere. [/FONT]

Irisheyes. Just seen your last post there. The proposal wasn't the only thing she said would have shown committment. When I sarcastically asked if she would be happy if we were still in the appartment eating bread & water, would she be happy and she said yes. Which sort of threw me a bit as it was not what I was expecting

Chinafoot

IrishEyes19 wrote: »

Im amazed at how everyone is going off on a feminist rant on this guy. He's admitted he made a mistake. But his job is clearly night shifts, therefore obviously it is more difficult to make time for such relationships. Plus I dont think its a time to have a go at him, when really advice is the best option.

Feminist? Get a grip ffs.

As for advice. He was given advice. If he's not prepared to tell her everthing (including that he had bought the ring) then he should leave this woman alone and move on with his life. Blaming her for his actions is hardly going to help his situation. He's playing the poor me card, claims he wants her back but is absolutely refusing to show her the one thing that could possibly change her mind. The engagement ring.

2much2take

Chinafoot wrote: »

He's playing the poor me card, claims he wants her back but is absolutely refusing to show her the one thing that could possibly change her mind. The engagement ring.

Yeah, because I want it to be because she wants to.... not because she feels compelled too. :mad:

I am a friend

Op you are not listening to any of the advice you are getting here. You have turned this into a blog where you can type out your thoughts And bat back your reasons for doing nothing to the posters.

Take it from people who have relationship experience - you need to tell her all. Doing nothing is not working.

Maple

Ok folks, back off the OP. He knows he has made a mistake. Please keep your advice constructive, berating the guy serves no purpose.

OP, people are taking time to give you advice, I suggest you read it and try apply it to your situation rather than coming up with reasons/excuses as to why you can't.

Maple

LegacyUser

I find your behaviour interesting OP. You protest that you feel one thing but your actions show another script running in your subconscious that either you are not aware of or you are not admitting!

You have choice but you claim you do not. Therefore I wonder if you in your heart of hearts really don't want to be married as much as you say. There is nothing wrong with that but I do feel if that is the case then you need to simply be at one with that decision and live with it.

As it is you are mourning for the loss of your relationship but you are also quite passive in your efforts to get it back. You are going out with each other 12 years and have not lived together. That is very unusual. I think your ex may have found you inflexible and exasperating.

You seem to want the relationship but only on your terms. You insist that everything you do/propose to do has to be done in a particular way and are adament that this is all for your ex's benefit. But you seem very reluctant to allow her share any control about events.

You almost act competatively with her. Trying to catch up with her savings and wanting to prove to her and her family that YOU can give her the perfect proposal (you believe) she/they will be impressed by. Why is this? What is your motivation here?

Is it to make you look good? Is it that YOU need the grand gesture? I believe so.

You've come on here and stated one thing but it seems you are unwilling to actually do anything about it so I'm not really sure what you want us to say?

Firetrap

When did you get the ring? Before ye broke up? I'd assume you have a receipt...
Honestly, the only thing you can do is try to talk to her somehow or even show her this thread. Is there anyone who could talk to her on your behalf? One of her parents? A sibling? A friend?

Big Bag of Chips

Exactly what advice are you looking for? Much like everyone else I'm baffled by the situation.

I get that you wanted the surprise, romantic proposal but surely after 12 years together, could you not sense something was up? Could you not talk about things? My husband never proposed to me, we just agreed to get married and went shopping for a ring. And I was the happiest girl in the world!

She has ended the relationship because she thinks you weren't all that bothered. And you just let her go believing that.

When you said you talked about everything.. did that include everything about your plans to propose and your various reasons for not doing so up to that point? Or did you talk about everything else except what was really going on?

Loads of people have given you much the same advice ie... TELL HER.

And yet you are coming up with excuses and procrastinating, much the same as you seem to have done with her all this time.

Your only way back here is explaining everything, and being totally honest with her. If you are holding the proposal plan thing back from her, then you are not being honest... and she thinks you don't care.

Neyite

I dont think you do want to propose, and never did, to be honest. When a man wants to propose, they find a way to do it - ring or no ring. It is a simple question. No more, no less. You dressed it up to make it a massive deal talking about formality and tradition but your actions spoke louder than words.

You should stop kidding yourself - first it was lack of money, then it was her trip, then it was asking her parents first. I'm betting that if she came back from her trip in November you would want to wait until Christmas because it's more romantic, then New Year, and after that you would wait until the festive season had died down, then choose her birthday... and on... and on...

Now you are saying that she will only think you got the ring purely to get her back, and you know what - I cant blame her a bit, I would think the exact same thing. You did buy the ring after she broke up with you, didnt you?

Let her go. You have been given an awful long time to prove you want her as your wife, and yet while your relationshipp is lying in tatters around your feet you are still sitting on the fence.

2much2take

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Ok folks, to try and save this turning into more of a bog then it already is, I'm going to try and answer all the last few posts. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]When we lived together I told her I would marry her. When the work problems came up, I told her our plans to marry would have to wait. Now, I have finally saved up enough to buy a nice ring, which I got at the end of july. I wanted to follow the tradition of getting the parents premission because it seemed to be the done thing in her family and I thought it would be nice to hold onto some old fashioned values. My disision to wait until after she returned from New York was based on the fact that I knew she would put her off her plans for the trip or somehow curtail her plans. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Yes, the idea to try and put a little romance into the proposal was my idea, and maybe a little selfish, but instead of just throwing her the ring while drunk or something, I wanted it to be something that was remembered. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I was not in competition with her regarding saving etc. But I didn't want to look like I wasn't making the effort either.[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]My problem is.... this girl told me her reasons for breaking up were basicaly the lack of commitment – no ring, not living together and not doing much as a couple anymore. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I have wrote to her, spoke with her twice but I cannot get my level of commitment to her across. Even to me, it just feels like I'm grabbing at anything that might bring us back together, and if I can't convince myself... what hope have I of convinceing her. I didn't pull out the ring when I had it in my pocket, because I was already coming across quite badly and producing the ring would have at best, appeared to be the last gasp of a deparate man and at worst appeared to be forcing her into doing something out of guilt rather then wanting to. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I think, she has made up she mind, she just doesn't want to believe my reasons for leading her to believe I was no longer interested / bothered any more as she is feeling hurt and if she believes me, then I will only hurt her more. And giving my actions over the last few months, I don't blame her. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]The small window of hope I mentioned earlier, was when she hadn't told her family for two weeks after the break up. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I have spoken to her friend. I told her friend how committed I was to the relationship and how much I love her. I told her I wanted to do something special and wanted something really romantic when I proposed. Her friend told me, and her told me that that last few months have just burned her out, as she feels she was making all the effort in the relationship and my ex just feel things were podding along, that nothing would ever change and my ex was just fed up!!! The hardest thing to hear was, she still loves me, that I broke her heart, but she had to make a differcult choice, to either carry on in what she thought (given the information she had) was a done relationship and live in the hope that things would change or cut her loss's and run. Unfortunilty, she decided to cut and run. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I was going to talk to her mother, but though that wouldn't be such a good idea. I was going to speak to another friend of hers, but my ex wasn't very happy when I spoke to her friend before. [/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Yes, I did wait a long time to take action. But that was because our goals before were based around travel, and enjoying ourselves. It is only in the last few years, when we lived together that our focus changed. Yes, I should have done it when I first wanted to (before the job stuff) but what could I offer her?????? An ever ending or long engagement? or a parnter on the dole, trying to get a job? Increased money problems? [/FONT]

I am a friend

Will ya ask the girl to Marry you ffs!!!

2much2take

I am a friend wrote: »

Will ya ask the girl to Marry you ffs!!!

How??? When she doesn't want to talk to me

I am a friend

You know where she lives don't ya....This is ridiculous - what's the point posting if you are going to ignore the advice.