goodbye ipad , welcome kindle fire

bpb101

Hi all ,
Didn't see this posted so i though i go ahead.

The kindle fire , which is a tablet by amazon will be only $199
Compared to nearly $500 for an ipad ,
http://www.amazon.com/ref=gno_logo
it will run android
featuring a dual core processor.
8 gb internal
8 hr battey .
main thing for me is the price , over 150% cheaper if my maths is correct :S
this could drop the price of the ipad by over $100
plus this is the starting price . probably will drop like the kindle e-reader

7inch screen

aidan_walsh

this will drop the price of the ipad by over 100%

In the same way the €300 netbook slashed the price of the Macbook range?

bpb101

amazon is trusted !!!

Dades

Not going to consider a tablet that doesn't have at least a 300ppi resolution..
Methinks the iPad 3 is going to be the only one to offer that next year.

Also, 7 inches is a non-size. Too small for long-term net surfing, to big for a portable dedicated music/video device...

It looks boring too. Nothing about it says MUST HAVE except maybe the price.

(And I like Amazon - love my Kindle 3!)

aidan_walsh

I'm struggling to understand Silk. Why the big push to create a new browser type that proxies everything through Amazon (ala Opera Mini) when the device is clearly powerful enough to run a full Webkit browser and there isn't a cellular connection to worry about eating into caps or long download times?

I mean, there is one glaringly obvious reason but I'd be surprised if that wasn't just an "additional benefit".

livEwirE

Am I correct in saying that all web browsing is processed though the amazon 'cloud' using the silk browser so they can track everything you do online, wouldn't be happy with that:eek: Looks like an ingenious way to track customer buying habits though:rolleyes:

stimpson

It runs Plants vs Zombies. I'm sold.

emo72

I'm hoping someone roots it and lets you put a custom rom on it. Would this be likely?

RobertFoster

bpb101 wrote: »

this could drop the price of the ipad by over 100%

Free iPad?

Gadhafi

Does it have flash???

bpb101

RobertFoster wrote: »

Free iPad?

i hit shift 5 instead of 4
forgive me

niallk

It ships on Nov 15. Just checked and no, they do ship to non-American addresses. Anyone know when they plan to release it here?

Inquitus

aidan_walsh wrote: »

I'm struggling to understand Silk. Why the big push to create a new browser type that proxies everything through Amazon (ala Opera Mini) when the device is clearly powerful enough to run a full Webkit browser and there isn't a cellular connection to worry about eating into caps or long download times?

I mean, there is one glaringly obvious reason but I'd be surprised if that wasn't just an "additional benefit".

http://cdespinosa.posterous.com/fire

Biggins

A couple of things.

The first version of this is a basic model. The next version of it – rumored to be announced after Christmas – will have updated and more features.

Like Apple who with each their versions, later added more, as will Amazon. That part alone is not rocket science to understand and already version 2 will be on the scene shortly (and STILL far cheaper than the overpriced Ipad).

I also think it will be a rival to the Ipad but I’m not the only one - read here for example: http://lnw.me/ArIMHm
The reasons are many but short version: Amazon is well placed in price, product, place (be it shop counter or net) and promotion besides already connectivity to millions around the world via their already customer Amazon database.
Every tech review I have read gives this first one an “ok” – its not world class but does the job. The next version like rivals, will be even better – and again, still much cheaper than the Ipad.

It seems there is people just out there (some same people who forked out a fortune for their Ipad) who are just coming across as bitter that their precious Ipad will within a year of release two of Kindle Fire, will be left with still a good table in itself but with holding onto a far more expensive one, in purchase price and with items that can be bought for it.

The Kindle Fire, be it version 1 or 2, will finally introduce the use of tablet use to more people and via the much cheaper price, will make them more common place.
I for one am glad to see it (a) because the price of the product itself is far cheaper (b) there will be less rights restrictions (c) the underlying software on it is far easier to upgrade (d) The number of formats it can use and display as pictures, text, ready made documents, etc, is far greater than the Ipad (e) the number of media services that have joined up with Amazon is far more than with the Ipad ALREADY - and they too are allowing items to be bought from them at much lower prices too than with those that are being allowed to do similar on the Ipad.
...And thats just to begin with.

Credit goes to Apple for their introduction to the world – but the world has moved on and what Amazon is producing now/later with cheaper prices and a lot more media services (that have already signed up to work with Amazon to bring cheaper items too than with Apples 30% cut demanded + higher prices) will ensure that for once, along comes a product that will REALLY see the heads of Apple worried. Its already stated by some, they are already!

Amazon is taking on Apple and by all accounts of market and strategy analysts, the tide is NOW starting to turn away from Apple.

Wired's Tim Carmody has high hopes that Amazon's low barrier of entry and emphasis on selling services will pay off "The devices aren't free, but they're so much cheaper than comparable products on the market that they will likely sell millions of copies and many more millions of books, television shows, movies, music and apps," Carmody suggests. "The digital divide between haves and have-nots just potentially got a lot smaller."

Amazon Kindle Fire official page: http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-Fire-Color/dp/B0051VVOB2/ref=amb_link_357575542_7?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=gateway-center-column&pf_rd_r=1B6NW1ZJGR35SJ5DR5NC&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=1321408942&pf_rd_i=507846

Biggins

niallk wrote: »

It ships on Nov 15. Just checked and no, they do ship to non-American addresses. Anyone know when they plan to release it here?

No confirmation but sometime around Christmas is being talked about.

stimpson

Biggins wrote: »

Amazon is taking on Apple and by all accounts of market and strategy analysts, the tide is NOW starting to turn away from Apple.

I don't see it Biggins - there have been full size android tablets around for some time now and they have failed to make much of a dent in the iPads market share - I'm not sure a mini tablet is going to do it, even with Plants vs Zombies. At that price I can see it cannibalising the standard Kindle, but not much more.

If the Fire does start to take off I could see Apple dropping the price of the iPad 2 when they ship the iPad 3, like how they kept the iPhone 3GS when they introduced the iPhone4. Likewise, there are rumours of an iPhone 4S next week to take Android on at the lower end of the market with an iPhone 5 at the high end. Apple has been at this game for a while now - they know what they are doing.

Biggins

stimpson wrote: »

I don't see it Biggins - there have been full size android tablets around for some time now and they have failed to make much of a dent in the iPads market share - I'm not sure a mini tablet is going to do it, even with Plants vs Zombies. At that price I can see it cannibalising the standard Kindle, but not much more.

If the Fire does start to take off I could see Apple dropping the price of the iPad 2 when they ship the iPad 3, like how they kept the iPhone 3GS when they introduced the iPhone4. Likewise, there are rumours of an iPhone 4S next week to take Android on at the lower end of the market with an iPhone 5 at the high end. Apple has been at this game for a while now - they know what they are doing.

The initial problem is earlier tablets, be they from Apple or others, was the main price for their tablet.
As the Atlantic Wire put it:

The debate over whether people are willing to pay $1.99 for an app, they won't even make it to the store if they don't have $500 up front.

http://lnw.me/MhjHbJ

Amazon just on the main price alone - has killed that argument. These WILL sell, there is no if's or buts about this and all marketing/sales/I.T. business heads agree.

Apple can drop their price - but they won't do what Amazon has the power to do and has done repeatedly, drop their price below cost of actual manufacture (supposed to be around $50). In other words, Amazon is selling their items at a loss from the very start. Add to that, they are then/now selling cheaper additional items for the Kindle at prices that again under cut Apple and their signed up fewer companies, the table market by all accounts just got brought within the realms of the common person as a more every day item, not just a more expensive, more still rare (for now) tool.

The trick for any company is to get their foot in the door.
Apple did it with the launch of their expensive but unique (then) Ipad.
Now comes along a table that gets the foot in the door not only in price big time but by doing so with additional cheaper services, will keep customers returning to Amazon.
With product familiarity alone (a regognised sales tactic) Amazon with additional versions later - still cheaper - will continue to grow in numbers, and that will be on top of new customers that are already familiar with previous Kindle applications.

horgan_p

With this new fire tablet I think Amazon could be on a winner.
The big thing as I see it is that Apple have a closed environment. its one place for your music , books , apps etc.
Yes android have a market place , but most people dont link the word android with their phone (they'd say "I have an HTC" as opposed to Android 2.3 for example)
Whether IT heads like me like it or not the simpler the thing is to both use and put apps onto the more popular it'll be.
Familiarity will win out , and Apple/ Itunes is a familiar brand and so too is Amazon.

stimpson

Biggins wrote: »

Amazon just on the main price alone - has killed that argument. These WILL sell, there is no if's or buts about this and all marketing/sales/I.T. business heads agree.

All of them? Surely not

Apple can drop their price - but they won't do what Amazon has the power to do and has done repeatedly, drop their price below cost of actual manufacture

They wouldn't have to. A 299 full size iPad would be enough to attract the masses. The talk of the iPhone 4S costing sub 250 makes me think a 299 iPad is not beyond the realms of probability.

Biggins

stimpson wrote: »

All of them? Surely not

All.
Find me one website (be it marketing/I.T./whatever) that states these will not sell.
I have yet to find one.
Anyone that has commented on them as regards sales, has all said the same thing.

stimpson wrote: »

They wouldn't have to. A 299 full size iPad would be enough to attract the masses. The talk of the iPhone 4S costing sub 250 makes me think a 299 iPad is not beyond the realms of probability.

A cheaper Ipad at a supposed 299 price tag is STILL more expensive than the Amazon tablet - and with STILL more expensive additional items that can be purchased for it.

If you were going to buy a tablet tomorrow - seriously - would you pay more for a product you know is more expensive, has fewer media services signed up to it (with their more expensive prices to boot), or would you buy a cheaper tablet within the better realms of weekly shopping prices, with cheaper addon's too - to boot?
...And thats now whats facing new customers - besides already possible millions of previous Kindle users.

niallk

horgan_p wrote: »

With this new fire tablet I think Amazon could be on a winner.
The big thing as I see it is that Apple have a closed environment. its one place for your music , books , apps etc.
Yes android have a market place , but most people dont link the word android with their phone (they'd say "I have an HTC" as opposed to Android 2.3 for example)
Whether IT heads like me like it or not the simpler the thing is to both use and put apps onto the more popular it'll be.
Familiarity will win out , and Apple/ Itunes is a familiar brand and so too is Amazon.

I have no doubt Apple will eventually lose their grip on the smartphone/tablet market simply because too many people hate Apple's business model/iTunes etc. They want more freedom. All that needs to happen is for a good/cheap enough competitor to come along with a more open PC like model. I think Amazon Fire may very well be it.

horgan_p

niallk wrote: »

I have no doubt Apple will eventually lose their grip on the smartphone/tablet market simply because too many people hate Apple's business model/iTunes etc. They want more freedom. All that needs to happen is for a good/cheap enough competitor to come along with a more open PC like model. I think Amazon Fire may very well be it.

you see here's the thing, once you stop thinking like an IT head you'll realise people basically couldnt give 2 figs about apples business practices.
People want to get their email , books and other media as simply as possible.
Amazon app store or Apple app store , people like my dad couldnt care less.
All they want is one place , easy to navigate and a device thats equally as easy to use.
Which is why , worse case scenario the Amazon Fire will easily slip into 2nd place , and if they price the media aggressively (which I think they will), then they'll pip Apple to the top spot.
Availibility at christmas will also be key.

Biggins

niallk wrote: »

I have no doubt Apple will eventually lose their grip on the smartphone/tablet market simply because too many people hate Apple's business model/iTunes etc. They want more freedom. All that needs to happen is for a good/cheap enough competitor to come along with a more open PC like model. I think Amazon Fire may very well be it.

horgan_p wrote: »

you see here's the thing, once you stop thinking like an IT head you'll realise people basically couldnt give 2 figs about apples business practices.
People want to get their email , books and other media as simply as possible.
Amazon app store or Apple app store , people like my dad couldnt care less.
All they want is one place , easy to navigate and a device thats equally as easy to use.

Ye both have good points.

We are to some degree looking at this and other products from a better I.T. knowledgeable background.
Take your average person on the street - maybe not so may of them will know the tech in's and outs.
All they will possibly see/think is "Hello! Here is a much cheaper item that does what the other more expensive one does that I've heard a lot talking about."
...And if it does the same basic stuff as others more expensive - well happy days!

The foot will be put in the open door and then with Amazons MASSIVE ability to sell everything via its own site alone (besides others which it allows - Apple don't, everything has to be approved by Apple alone before they then allow access), as regards users using the table, their purchasing will be far, far easier.

We are thinking from I.T. head backgrounds - the average customer on the street won't be.
They will see cheaper price, same basic functions, easy buying via one button - less hassle, etc...

niallk

horgan_p wrote: »

you see here's the thing, once you stop thinking like an IT head you'll realise people basically couldnt give 2 figs about apples business practices.
People want to get their email , books and other media as simply as possible.
Amazon app store or Apple app store , people like my dad couldnt care less.
All they want is one place , easy to navigate and a device thats equally as easy to use.
Which is why , worse case scenario the Amazon Fire will easily slip into 2nd place , and if they price the media aggressively (which I think they will), then they'll pip Apple to the top spot.
Availibility at christmas will also be key.

Freedom trumps simplicity. Apple will always have its loyalists, but Windows was always more popular than Mac OS. Most people are smart enough to navigate email, books and media without Apple's help, they want to have the ability to do anything, which Apple doesn't offer.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

rofl
a hundred thousand linux users just slit their own wrists

windows offers freedom cute

horgan_p

niallk wrote: »

Freedom trumps simplicity. Apple will always have its loyalists, but Windows was always more popular than Mac OS. Most people are smart enough to navigate email, books and media without Apple's help, they want to have the ability to do anything, which Apple doesn't offer.

I'm going to agree to disagree with you.

Biggins

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

...Windows offers freedom cute

Maybe I missed something - but no one has said that!

I read Niallk's words "Freedom trumps simplicity" as related to the operating system the tablet from Amazon (or even other rival makers besides Apple), but I'm open to be wrong.

I would also say that if you get a product that offers more freedom plus simplicity - you have an immediate sales bonus over others out there that don't.

the whole year inn

At the end of the day im buying this for my parents over the ipad.Why because its alot cheaper.

Biggins

gob_smacked wrote: »

At the end of the day im buying this for my parents over the ipad.Why because its alot cheaper.

...And thats what it boils down to.
Far cheaper price.
When available over here this side of the Atlantic, I've no doubts it will sell and become a common sight eventually.
I already see previous Kindles for reading being used regularly on buses and trains between my home town and Dublin alone.

horgan_p

gob_smacked wrote: »

At the end of the day im buying this for my parents over the ipad.Why because its alot cheaper.

ditto , my ould lad needs email access and I dont have nearly enough patience to train him into using a pc. Nor enough money to get him an Ipad.
He uses sms on his phone - this makes it close enough to a "phone like " experience.
He can look up stuff on google and do a bit of web surfing.
Winner as I'm sure a lot of other people will be thinking the same way.

the whole year inn

horgan_p wrote: »

ditto , my ould lad needs email access and I dont have nearly enough patience to train him into using a pc. Nor enough money to get him an Ipad.
He uses sms on his phone - this makes it close enough to a "phone like " experience.
He can look up stuff on google and do a bit of web surfing.
Winner as I'm sure a lot of other people will be thinking the same way.

Pretty much in the same boat,id prob get one for my self to be honest as they be great for watching movies on trains,surfing net etc.The ipad is too expensive and have to be carefull with it because of it,what was it apple said a "higher resulation that the eye cant see" does anybody else thought this was aload of bollix?

If you can put your own roms on it,im getting one.

I still love the apple mac computer tho