Dublin Catholics could face church levy

Knasher

Saw this on the journal:

THE CATHOLIC CHURCH in Dublin is on the brink of ‘financial collapse’ – and may be forced to place a parish-based levy on Catholic families in order to stay alive, according to leaked internal documents published today.

A consultation document from the Archdiocese of Dublin’s Council of Priests, given to the Irish Catholic newspaper and published today, says that many of the Archdiocese’s parishes are close to collapse.

The substantial cash reserves built up by the parishes over the last number of decades have all been diminished by declining Massgoing attendances, and other factors relating to the economic downturn.

RTÉ News, reporting the Irish Catholic’s story, said that compensation settlements reached by by the church had also caused a significant worsening in its financial standing.

Priests have been asked to consider the document and to respond to it at a meeting next month.

The Irish Catholic’s website was offline at the time of publication.

http://www.thejournal.ie/dublin-catholics-could-face-church-levy-as-archdiocese-faces-financial-collapse-203902-Aug2011/

If it comes to pass it will be interesting to see how many remain a la carte catholics.

mikemac

As I understand it used to be the parish collections stayed in the parish
But then you have large/small and rich/poor parishes.
So the money goes to diocese who split it out fairly

I can't see a levy.
But will we see the rural areas supporting the parishes of Dublin?

Guess the Dubs can't complain they are constantly subsidizing rural Ireland anymore

MagicMarker

Not that it would ever happen, but how on earth would they go about setting up a parish based levy?

catbear

In states of Germany your tithe can come out of your pay packet if you tick that you are a member of the RCC. The tax office collects it for the RCC and other churches. If you don't tick the box then you don't get to get married/baptised etc.....

It would be interesting how many would tick the box if it were so here.

magicbastarder

one interesting outcome of this is that (speculation on my part) you may not be allowed have your child baptised without paying this levy - which would be an interesting turn of affairs for people who want to get their kids into a catholic school.
maybe they'd even rule that if you haven't paid this levy, they won't consider your child a practicing catholic?

Knasher

MagicMarker wrote: »

Not that it would ever happen, but how on earth would they go about setting up a parish based levy?

I was just wondering the same thing actually. When I read the article, my initial thought was that it was the German church tax, but obviously they don't have the power to mandate something like that. And if it was just another collection in church, then they would just call it that, plus that wouldn't really solve their problem as people would probably just split the same amount over all the collections.

Maybe they could make the parishes subscription based and refuse weddings and stuff for people who haven't subscribed. :P

Dades

Knasher wrote: »

Maybe they could make the parishes subscription based and refuse weddings and stuff for people who haven't subscribed. :P

Or charge for weddings etc, which is was what was suggested on Newstalk earlier.

I think it's brilliant. Let them try and pay their own way by charging the people they failed, and see what happens.

heebusjeebus

Why cant the church just ask for a big wad of cash for any baptisms, communions, weddings, funerals etc. "Proper" Catholics wont mind paying and us normal folk wont have to bother. It will become more socially acceptable not to get married in a church or get your kids baptized.
Let the real Catholics celebrate their faith and let the rest of us live in peace without the lectures.

Penn

"I know our institution has failed you, and I know that church income has fallen because of these failings, the recession, and many people losing their faith... But if you donate more money to the church, we promise not to change a damn thing"

Dont be at yourself

Got any spare change?

papu

Redic , the Church is such a vastly Rich empire.

amacachi

Would be wonderful to see just how many Catholics there actually are in this country once they have to pay even a nominal charge.

seamus

Fingers crossed that they introduce this. *please* *please* *please* *please* *please* *please*

Penn

coffee_cake

heebusjeebus wrote: »

Why cant the church just ask for a big wad of cash for any baptisms, communions, weddings, funerals etc. "Proper" Catholics wont mind paying and us normal folk wont have to bother. It will become more socially acceptable not to get married in a church or get your kids baptized.
Let the real Catholics celebrate their faith and let the rest of us live in peace without the lectures.

I thought they did that already

smokingman

This would be fantastic but I wish they brought it in before the census.

Another good idea is charge those who checked "catholic" in the census to cover the popes upcoming visit.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

bluewolf wrote: »

I thought they did that already

they do.. a bit anyway

i was googling the church of a friends upcoming wedding to see where i was, and it costs 300 euro to have the wedding there

also for some reason wedding party has to supply the flowers and are then asked to leave them behind inthe church

something shady going on there

seamus

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

i was googling the church of a friends upcoming wedding to see where i was, and it costs 300 euro to have the wedding there

This is often typical where the church is popular or prestigious, like Gouganbarra or Trinity chapel. Pays for the higher maintenance cost when there are two weddings every weekend.

also for some reason wedding party has to supply the flowers and are then asked to leave them behind inthe church

"A gift for the virgin Mary". I'm deadly serious. In reality the priest likely brings them home to his Mammy.

stimpson

seamus wrote: »

Fingers crossed that they introduce this. *please* *please* *please* *please* *please* *please*

That sounds suspiciously like a prayer.

seamus

I'll get in the sack...

Spacedog

Maybe they should charge all of us to cover their child sexual abuse limited financial liability insurance agreement with the Irish Government...

...oh wait.

alan85

So the church that, due to its own negligence, is liable to pay compensation to its abuse victims and that has lost money investing in Irish banking shares now expects parishioners to carry the burden through a levy. Did the parishioners carry out the abuse or decide to invest money in banks? How about looking to the top brass in the Vatican (who invariably set the trend for such actions) for help instead? Who do they think they are - a pseudo-government that can tax spirituality? Expect to see raised wedding and funeral 'donations' next...

W*nkers!

Kila

I think that what I find most annoying about this is that the church won't let me be not Catholic. When hundreds of people started defecting, using sites like CountMeOut.ie, they rewrote canon law to remove the ability to defect. Since I was baptised at birth (when I was, obviously, not in a position to object), I'm basically stuck with Catholicism like a blood stain that won't wash out. So, in summary, if you're not going to let me leave your church, then you can get stuffed if you think I'm paying for it too.

magicbastarder

Kila wrote: »

I'm basically stuck with Catholicism
...
then you can get stuffed if you think I'm paying for it too.

no you're not.
and they can't make you pay.

Sarky

Reinstate indulgences, that'll sort it out. Nothing more profitable than the pope saying you can buy your way into heaven.

Robert ninja

God needs your money.

Zillah

Haha their religion is dying.

Wonderful. I hope it hurts. So long fellas, you die as you lived; stuck up your own arses.

Solair

How can they even call it a "levy"!?
Does it still think it has tax raising power?
All they can do is very humbly ask its parishioners to contribute.
This will go down like a lead balloon. In the current climate, they'll be laughed out of town.

The Rook

I'm Catholic, but I wouldn't pay this levy and think it's an insult that I might be asked to pay it.

"Ooops, sorry, we messed around with kids and have to pay compensation and then we messed up our financial investments, will you fix it up for us by paying a levy?"...... Eh no, no I won't, no more than the Catholic Church (the Institution) would give me lots of free money if I was in negative equity on my house and I had to pay compensation to someone for whatever reason.....

eyescreamcone

Of course Catholics should pay for the day to day expenses of their church.
I see nothing wrong with this.
If I was a member of a golf club I would only see it as fair to pay my way as a member.
Of course I could always refuse to pay and decide to leave the club.
What's the problem??

MagicMarker

eyescreamcone wrote: »

Of course Catholics should pay for the day to day expenses of their church.
I see nothing wrong with this.
If I was a member of a golf club I would only see it as fair to pay my way as a member.
Of course I could always refuse to pay and decide to leave the club.
What's the problem??

There's no problem if people want to pay it, but it's when people don't want to pay it it becomes a problem.

Now imagine that you didn't play golf, you just liked it, believed in it and watched it on tv now and again, would you still pay your membership?

In fact, this is all rather pointless as they can't make anyone pay it anyway!