Greenways [greenway map of Ireland in post 1]

BarryD2

Was on the Waterford greenway recently between Dungarvan and Kilmac. It was a nice day at end of July and was in continuous use. Young, old, families, teenagers, tourists.

Also see a new greenway all the way along the Suir towpath from Clonmel to Carrick, not as heavily used. Don't think it's promoted much. There will come a time when there are a good number of these and whilst locally used, I don't think we'll see the same numbers flocking to them?

riddlinrussell

BarryD2 wrote: »

Was on the Waterford greenway recently between Dungarvan and Kilmac. It was a nice day at end of July and was in continuous use. Young, old, families, teenagers, tourists.

Also see a new greenway all the way along the Suir towpath from Clonmel to Carrick, not as heavily used. Don't think it's promoted much. There will come a time when there are a good number of these and whilst locally used, I don't think we'll see the same numbers flocking to them?

Really comes down to how well they get promoted, the Waterford one has a great team pushing it. Probably not as much for the Carrick-on-Suir one. I wouldn't even have been aware of it being completed yet if someone in work, and yourself, hadn't said to me.

There will certainly be areas that are a greater tourist draw than others, but the Netherlands manages a fair amount of cycle tourism purely based on the quality of the routes and its flat as a pancake, so theres some chance in the midlands, especially if they can link in plenty of points of interest.

AndrewJRenko

riddlinrussell wrote: »

Really comes down to how well they get promoted, the Waterford one has a great team pushing it. Probably not as much for the Carrick-on-Suir one. I wouldn't even have been aware of it being completed yet if someone in work, and yourself, hadn't said to me.

There will certainly be areas that are a greater tourist draw than others, but the Netherlands manages a fair amount of cycle tourism purely based on the quality of the routes and its flat as a pancake, so theres some chance in the midlands, especially if they can link in plenty of points of interest.

The availability of the shuttle bus was a key factor for us in choosing the Waterford one.

Muahahaha

RikkFlair wrote: »

Saw that, had the usual "this will cut my land in 2" complaint that seems to get trotted out all the time. I'm sure there will be well designed farm crossings included, it's a greenway not the Berlin wall!

Yeah the Kerry farmer that RTE interviewed said he has 180 acres and that the greenway would split his land in two. Which is a bit mad considering farmers themselves split their land into several parcels using fences to keep animals grazing in specific places. Theres also thousands of farmers who had their land properly split in two for the motorways to be built and they just use the overpass bridges and get on with it.

Anyway the IFA are claiming that Kerry CC did not consult landowners. Which is a blatant lie because the public consultation was held in August 2017 and the documents and maps for the greenway are on the KCC website here http://docstore.kerrycoco.ie/KCCWebsite/roads/schemes/skerry/map1.pdf

Muahahaha

nuac wrote: »

The first and most successful Greenway is Westport/Achill. Work on that started 2010.

The County Council appointed a dynamic duo Anna Connor Walking Officer and Padgraig Philbin Senior Executive Engineer. They met and worked with about 170 landowners and local development organisations along the route. They explained the economic and social advantages to the area of a Greenway. They negotiated agreements for permissive access. No mention of a CPO anywhere. Community buy-in instead.

Achill Westport greenway is definitely very successful and the blueprint for other county councils to follow. But I dont think it was as easy to achieve as you are saying- long before construction began in 2010 there was a strong minority of landowners who held it up for years, the bike hire guy was telling me it could have been built 8-10 years sooner if it wasnt for people digging their heels in for a long haul.

whisky_galore

Muahahaha wrote: »

Yeah the Kerry farmer that RTE interviewed said he has 180 acres and that the greenway would split his land in two. Which is a bit mad considering farmers themselves split their land into several parcels using fences to keep animals grazing in specific places. Theres also thousands of farmers who had their land properly split in two for the motorways to be built and they just use the overpass bridges and get on with it.

Anyway the IFA are claiming that Kerry CC did not consult landowners. Which is a blatant lie because the public consultation was held in August 2017 and the documents and maps for the greenway are on the KCC website here http://docstore.kerrycoco.ie/KCCWebsite/roads/schemes/skerry/map1.pdf

Perhaps they would have preferred someone from the council with the balls to call out to them and explain the situation, rather than be summoned to a town hall or library.

BarryD2

Muahahaha wrote: »

Achill Westport greenway is definitely very successful and the blueprint for other county councils to follow.

It is but from what I saw, the Waterford one looked even busier. Closer to large centres of population too, so that makes a difference. I reckon some of these greenways will be attractive and well used whilst others will see occasional use.

AndrewJRenko

BarryD2 wrote: »

It is but from what I saw, the Waterford one looked even busier. Closer to large centres of population too, so that makes a difference. I reckon some of these greenways will be attractive and well used whilst others will see occasional use.

It's not just that Waterford is closer - the access is much better, with much less on-road sections, and fewer road crossings than Mayo.

JohnC.

I live about half way between Waterford and Carrick. Can't move for hearing about the Waterford one. Didn't even know there was one at Carrick.

Corca Baiscinn

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

The availability of the shuttle bus was a key factor for us in choosing the Waterford one.

That's very much a factor especially because of the hopeless bike carriage on offer by irish Rail. It means you can do a longer length of a Greenway rather than doubling back. Mayo offers a return service too afaik but only if you're hiring a bike. Does Waterford offer it even with your own?

We tried to no avail to find bike hire on the Royal Canal Greenway spur from Longford a while ago so had to settle for a drop off and pick up with our own bikes and driver missing the cycle. So many stations on that route, Mullingar, Longford (spur) Maynooth but such limited access by train!

AndrewJRenko

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

That's very much a factor especially because of the hopeless bike carriage on offer by irish Rail. It means you can do a longer length of a Greenway rather than doubling back. Mayo offers a return service too afaik but only if you're hiring a bike. Does Waterford offer it even with your own?

We tried to no avail to find bike hire on the Royal Canal Greenway spur from Longford a while ago so had to settle for a drop off and pick up with our own bikes and driver missing the cycle. So many stations on that route, Mullingar, Longford (spur) Maynooth but such limited access by train!

Shuttle bus was from the bike hire company. There was no obvious sign of any way of transporting bikes, so I doubt if it would be available for your own bike.

whisky_galore

The irony about many greenways is that people will need to bring bikes in their cars to get to them. Very green alright!

AndrewJRenko

whisky_galore wrote: »

The irony about many greenways is that people will need to bring bikes in their cars to get to them. Very green alright!

Not really - many, many people rent bikes, and good rental and shuttle businesses have built up to support these.

Muckyboots

whisky_galore wrote: »

The irony about many greenways is that people will need to bring bikes in their cars to get to them. Very green alright!

The beauty of the Athenry to Claremorris option - Trains arriving and departing at each end of the route. Bikes on trains.

marno21

Muckyboots wrote: »

The beauty of the Athenry to Claremorris option - Trains arriving and departing at each end of the route. Bikes on trains.

Or indeed Claremorris-Collooney and some of the others (Tralee-Fenit, Waterford-New Ross/Rosslare). And indeed some of the future greenway such as Killonan-Ballybrophy and Limerick Junction-Waterford

Zubeneschamali

Muckyboots wrote: »

The beauty of the Athenry to Claremorris option - Trains arriving and departing at each end of the route. Bikes on trains.

Likewise you can go by train from Dublin to Mullingar, cycle 40K to Athlone and catch a train back to Dublin.

AndrewJRenko

The train is a great option to have, though Irish Rail facilities aren't great - is it a limit of three bikes per train? It wouldn't work for many family groups.

whisky_galore

whisky_galore wrote: »

The irony about many greenways is that people will need to bring bikes in their cars to get to them. Very green alright!

As others have mentioned, in most cases this is not an issue. However, where it is, what we are starting to see are ground swells of locals pushing for safer cycling infrastructure even in small country towns and villages to allow safe and easy access

serfboard

Deleted User wrote: »

As others have mentioned, in most cases this is not an issue. However, where it is, what we are starting to see are ground swells of locals pushing for safer cycling infrastructure even in small country towns and villages to allow safe and easy access

I remember visiting Dublin a couple of years after the shared bikes started. What I was surprised about was how much this kick-started an interest in cycling in general, with plenty more people on (their own) bikes then had been the case when I previously worked there.

Corca Baiscinn

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Likewise you can go by train from Dublin to Mullingar, cycle 40K to Athlone and catch a train back to Dublin.

True but that would be a lot more pleasant if the Liffey Cycle Route,North Strand, Sandymount, Fitzwlliam etc routes were built! If not biking to/from station you're into no bikes on Dart at rush hour, none or Luas or bus at all at all, much easier to get to a Greenway in Germany but hopefully we'll make progress.

PS not implying the Dub routes should be built to get people to leisure cycling routes, that would just be a bonus!

serfboard

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

much easier to get to a Greenway in Germany but hopefully we'll make progress.

We will definitely - Bord Failte, the HSE and the government in general can see the benefits of Greenways, and are now going full steam ahead in planning and building Greenways all over the country.

Well full steam ahead that is, in a country with a ponderous legal system and obstreperous farmers that can hold up anything for years at a time.

I'm well impressed though, with the progress we have made in just a few short years. Late starters, but still ...

Corca Baiscinn

serfboard wrote: »

We will definitely - Bord Failte, the HSE and the government in general can see the benefits of Greenways, and are now going full steam ahead in planning and building Greenways all over the country.

Well full steam ahead that is, in a country with a ponderous legal system and obstreperous farmers that can hold up anything for years at a time.

I'm well impressed though, with the progress we have made in just a few short years. Late starters, but still ...

In fairness farmers don't have a monopoly on obstreperousness and some projects have gone smoothly when communication was well managed, whereas many badly needed urban routes are also being held up by obstreperous car-centric individuals.

BarryD2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

The train is a great option to have, though Irish Rail facilities aren't great - is it a limit of three bikes per train? It wouldn't work for many family groups.

And you can pay a small fortune to travel by Irish Rail too.

Carawaystick

There's No Fare Information I can see on Bus Éireann's site to say if and how much it is to bring a bike, which would be nice to know.

Qrt

Carawaystick wrote: »

There's No Fare Information I can see on Bus Éireann's site to say if and how much it is to bring a bike, which would be nice to know.

The Bus Éireann website refuses to give you fare information on most journeys tbh

RHJ

This post has been deleted.

The official stance is

Folding bicycles which are packed and wrapped in a suitable carrier bag/protective covering will be treated as passengers’ accompanied luggage and carried free of charge in the luggage storage area. Folding bicycles which are NOT packed or wrapped as described above will be charged at the full cycle rate.

Bicycles, prams and non-folding childrens' pushchairs will be carried only if sufficient accommodation is available; they must be placed in the luggage compartment or other designated area of the vehicle and are subject to a charge as determined by Bus Éireann from time to time.

Source: http://www.buseireann.ie/inner.php?id=376#luggage

Info for other transport operators here http://irishcycle.com/how-to/how-to-bring-bicycles-on-public-transport/

Now that's sorted, back to the greenways....

The construction of a €2.5m pedestrian and cycling route between Baldoyle and Portmarnock has been given the go ahead by An Bord Pleanala.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/25m-greenway-project-to-begin-37167495.html

Carawaystick

Northern Irish Railways serve both ends of the Lagan canal from Lisburn to Belfast; and the Newry canal from Newry up to Portadown

Bikes are free.

It's a pity BÉ are unable to publish "The Full Cycle Rate" on their website...

Muahahaha

Deleted User wrote: »

The construction of a €2.5m pedestrian and cycling route between Baldoyle and Portmarnock has been given the go ahead by An Bord Pleanala.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/25m-greenway-project-to-begin-37167495.html

Is it just me or does 2.5m seem ridiculously expensive to construct 1.8km of greenway? Is there going to be lots of bridges in this 1.8km or something? The article says Fingal CC have 88km of coastline and intend for a greenway to be built along all of it so this cost of 2.5m for 1.8km works out at 138,000 per 100 metres. Extrapolating that would mean the full 88km would come in at 122 million

Well for starters this would be along a main road so would require a certain outlay for traffic management. This would not be the case for most of the greenways so far

In addition, I'm guessing there will be some modifications to existing bridges of the addition of new ones. Bridges are never cheap

Lastly, from what I gather, the route will be on the sea side of the coast road for much of it, but then crosses over to the Racecourse Park in Baldoyle. Depending on the method of crossing the road, you could see a large chunk of the budget spent there, especially if they choose to do something fully segregated like an extended gently sloping bridge

I havent seen plans yet so everything above could be wildly inaccurate