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Cycling/Walking around the city

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    #812
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    1. Are you suggesting that ALL roads are, and were originally, designed for motor traffic?

    2. If roads are designed not to accommodate pedestrians is that (a) smart, (b) fair and (c) sustainable?

    3. Do you think there might be a causal relationship between (a) the secular trend towards designing pedestrians out of the road system and (b) the secular trend towards decreased modal share for walking?




    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ec4ZDW1GB64

    'Secular' trends? What are you ****eing on about now?


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    #813
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    'Secular' trends? What are you ****eing on about now?

    Wow, doing a Google search is such a demanding activity.


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    #814
    joeKel73
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,689 ✭✭✭joeKel73


    Time wrote: »
    Even the poor students with qualifications out qualify us.

    A bit presumptuous of the qualifications of your fellow boardsies?


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    #815
    joeKel73
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,689 ✭✭✭joeKel73


    Of course there were no specific sub-section of pedestrians targeted by the design of the light sequences, that's daft.

    It is strange and frustrating though that pedestrian lights don't automatically go green while the road they're crossing is held on red. It wouldn't lessen the priority of the road traffic either, just aid pedestrians that approach the junctions while traffic is already on red (they don't know if the traffic is just about to go green - a green pedestrian light would go red a few seconds before this).

    There seems to be an inconsistency across the city as they do at some locations but require the button to be pressed before the sequence at other locations.


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    #816
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    galwaycyclist wrote: »
    So we are left with a conclusion they are subordinating pedestrian access and mobility in order to subordinate pedestrian access and mobility.


    It's also hard to avoid the conclusion that they are subordinating cyclist access and mobility as well. And perhaps we should include bus users too.

    Just this morning on the school run I encountered a mother with two children. She had the younger child on the back of her bike, with the older one cycling her own wheels.

    I enquired about her school run, with particular reference to the challenges of navigating nearby junctions with children in tow, including at one spot where Galway City Council has failed to provide a crossing despite Bord Pleanala orders dating back several years.

    There isn't even a "button" to challenge these lazy, apathetic cyclists.
    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    Wow, pressing a button is such a demanding activity.

    From her brief comments I'd say her school run is at least 4 km. Driving is not an option as she doesn't have a car. She said that in her family circumstances the bus would cost her €60 a week (at least that's what I think I heard her say -- the traffic was noisy) which she can't afford.

    So she cycles, and manages the child-hostile junctions as best she can, including at least two roundabouts which she identified as being especially difficult.

    Since she named the school I also know for a fact that when she arrives there will be motorists driving and parking on the footpaths along both sides of the road.


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    #817
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    J o e wrote: »
    There seems to be an inconsistency across the city as they do at some locations but require the button to be pressed before the sequence at other locations.

    Can anyone think of any junction in the city where people on foot get a green light without having to press a button?

    You could argue for the lights at Statoil in Newcastle but that crossing is not really broken down into two stages - it is one continuous crossing.


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    #818
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    The ones at the Town Hall (junction of Francis Street, St. Vincent's Avenue and Courthouse Square) seem to have a mind of their own. The green man is beeping way there as invisible pedestrians cross, even during the wee small hours.


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    #819
    joeKel73
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,689 ✭✭✭joeKel73


    galwaycyclist wrote: »
    Can anyone think of any junction in the city where people on foot get a green light without having to press a button?

    You could argue for the lights at Statoil in Newcastle but that crossing is not really broken down into two stages - it is one continuous crossing.

    I could be wrong. Can't think of a definite example without checking but I'm thinking the junction outside UCHG? And maybe the junction outside the fire station on Father Griffin Rd?


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    #820
    snubbleste
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 31,117 ✭✭✭✭snubbleste


    J o e wrote: »
    I could be wrong....
    You are. :cool:


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    #821
    joeKel73
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,689 ✭✭✭joeKel73


    snubbleste wrote: »
    You are. :cool:

    Ah, I've been wrong before. 1993 I think it was... ;)


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    #822
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    There are three places outside the Fire Station where pedestrians need to cross: Fr Griffin Road (x 2) and Fairhill Road.

    Only one signalised pedestrian crossing has been provided as part of the new "upgrade/enhancement/improvement" scheme, ie the one between that bird sculpture (or whatever it is, on the site of snubbleste's tree :) ) and the footpath outside the Fire Station doors.

    AFAIK neither of the others has a signalised crossing phase (or crossing place) specifically for pedestrians.

    323602.jpg

    323603.jpg


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    #823
    joeKel73
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,689 ✭✭✭joeKel73


    I actually meant the junction opposite the fire station, where Fairhill Road Upper meets Father Griffin Road, I'd thought maybe the pedestrian lights crossing the start/end of Fairhill Road Upper here automatically went green.


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    #824
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    J o e wrote: »
    I actually meant the junction opposite the fire station, where Fairhill Road Upper meets Father Griffin Road, I'd thought maybe the pedestrian lights crossing the start/end of Fairhill Road Upper here automatically went green.

    Yes I think that might be one. Or was before they made that part of Fairhill road two-way - could be gone now.


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    #825
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    J o e wrote: »
    I actually meant the junction opposite the fire station, where Fairhill Road Upper meets Father Griffin Road, I'd thought maybe the pedestrian lights crossing the start/end of Fairhill Road Upper here automatically went green.

    Had a look this evening and the pedestrian lights on the side opposite the fire station appear to be changing automatically.

    That said there are detectors above the crossings pointing down at the waiting area. Not clear what their role is.


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    #826
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    galwaycyclist wrote: »
    There are detectors above the crossings pointing down at the waiting area. Not clear what their role is.


    Waiting for actual pedestrians to arrive so they can mess with their heads... ;)


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    #827
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    Waiting for actual pedestrians to arrive so they can mess with their heads... ;)

    Well yes. In some cases these detectors are used to cancel the request from the button box. So someone presses the button but crosses anyway the the detector cancels the requested green man.

    British (Irish) roads engineers will sometimes bend over backwards to avoid giving people on foot a second more than they deem necessary.


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    #828
    reap-a-rat
    Registered Users Posts: 1,005 ✭✭✭reap-a-rat


    This seems like the most appropriate place to vent. I'm absolutely sick of motorists breaking the red light at the junction of the bridge and Newcastle at the service station in Newcastle.

    It seems that the worst is coming from Dangan direction. Almost every single time I'm waiting to cross, someone breaks the red. I keep an eye on the traffic lights as a means to be prepared for when the pedestrian light goes green. So I see it go Amber. Next car always goes - unsafe to stop, perhaps. I have nothing against that. But then at least one, if not 2 or sometimes even 3 vehicles will go on red. It's so dangerous!

    I've also seen the odd u-turn, and extremely dangerous right turn at that same junction.

    This evening, I was beginning to cross as I had the green man, but something stirred in my peripheral vision and I stopped - a car coming from the roundabout blatantly broke red. What got me most is that it's green from the other direction before the green man, so he had actually been stopped and then decided to go on my green man - I've a feeling he couldn't see properly and thought the pedestrian green was his traffic green.

    I'm coming closer each day to being hit by a motorist or cyclist. It's really difficult to be a pedestrian in Galway - nobody is watching out for us, not even other pedestrians!


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    #829
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    galwaycyclist wrote: »
    Well yes. In some cases these detectors are used to cancel the request from the button box. So someone presses the button but crosses anyway the the detector cancels the requested green man.

    British (Irish) roads engineers will sometimes bend over backwards to avoid giving people on foot a second more than they deem necessary.


    It wouldn't surprise me if said engineers were robotically following a list of tables, or consulting some outmoded warrant system, when setting traffic signals.

    In the UK research has found that older people in particular are not being given enough time to cross at traffic lights, because engineers are ignoring the needs of real people and using obsolete data: http://www.livingstreets.org.uk/older-people-need-3-more-seconds-to-cross-road-says-living-streets


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    #830
    jkforde
    Registered Users Posts: 1,991 ✭✭✭jkforde


    folks, came off the bike recently - watch out for oil tanker spillages, esp now with oil deliveries kicking off! - so looking for a minor service for the bike, esp. wheel straightening, steering alignment... any personal recommendations?

    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️



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    #831
    Micilin Muc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Micilin Muc


    jkforde wrote: »
    folks, came off the bike recently - watch out for oil tanker spillages, esp now with oil deliveries living off! - so looking for a minor service for the bike, esp. wheel straightening, steering alignment... any personal recommendations?

    Moycullen Bike Works have a great mechanic, very sound in there.


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    #832
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    It wouldn't surprise me if said engineers were robotically following a list of tables, or consulting some outmoded warrant system, when setting traffic signals.

    In the UK research has found that older people in particular are not being given enough time to cross at traffic lights, because engineers are ignoring the needs of real people and using obsolete data: http://www.livingstreets.org.uk/older-people-need-3-more-seconds-to-cross-road-says-living-streets

    Yes historically Irish roads engineers used a system of what were termed "warrants" to determine the types of crossing to be provided. Under the warrant system as used in practice, walking routes or "desire lines" were not planned into, or taken into account of, in the design and construction of roads.

    Instead roads infrastructure were built to match projected demand for car trips. After this infrastructure had been put in place to cater for cars regardless of other considerations, steps would then be taken to deal with places where pedestrians were still crossing the road.

    So surveys or accident analysis would be carried out to find places where people were still crossing roads. Locations would be prioritised based on this and the types of crossing used would be based on what treatment would result in the least delays for motor traffic.

    So rather than being based on the needs of people on foot, the "Irish" system was based on trying to "manage" people who walk for the benefit of those who drive.

    This has been the underlying philosophy of several generations of "Irish" road engineers.


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    #833
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    This has been the underlying philosophy of several generations of "Irish" road engineers.

    So we have a situation in this country where several generations of "Irish" roads engineers have been training several generations of Irish pedestrians to ignore pedestrian controls.


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    #834
    Micilin Muc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Micilin Muc


    jkforde wrote: »
    folks, came off the bike recently - watch out for oil tanker spillages, esp now with oil deliveries kicking off!

    Where was the oil? Hope you're not injured.

    There was a good bit of oil this morning on the N59 inbound from Moycullen, the narrow section beside Ballycuirke Lough. It's already dodgy enough on that section for a cyclist.


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    #835
    jkforde
    Registered Users Posts: 1,991 ✭✭✭jkforde


    Micilin Muc wrote: »
    Where was the oil? Hope you're not injured.

    There was a good bit of oil this morning on the N59 inbound from Moycullen, the narrow section beside Ballycuirke Lough. It's already dodgy enough on that section for a cyclist.
    at inbound WDR junction at Deane RAB, it was only a small spillage but enough to make me loose traction... wasn't going fast but gave me and bike a bruise! yesterday, there was a large spillage on Costello Rd. just off Newcastle Rd.... be safe folks!

    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️



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    #836
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    The hazards of fossil fuels, eh? ;)


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    #837
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    jkforde wrote: »
    at inbound WDR junction at Deane RAB, it was only a small spillage but enough to make me loose traction... wasn't going fast but gave me and bike a bruise! yesterday, there was a large spillage on Costello Rd. just off Newcastle Rd.... be safe folks!

    Streaks of it this morning on Seamus Quirke road - the section between the hospital roundabout and the Newcastle road.


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    #838
    snubbleste
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 31,117 ✭✭✭✭snubbleste


    galwaycyclist wrote: »
    Streaks of it this morning on Seamus Quirke road - the section between the hospital roundabout and the Newcastle road.
    Fabulous surface :cool:


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    #839
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    snubbleste wrote: »
    Fabulous surface :cool:

    Yes big thumbs up. Council gets it right. Also the resurfaced section of the Monivea Rd up at Thermo King. Long overdue and very welcome.


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    #840
    Iwannahurl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭Iwannahurl


    What is this surface of which you speak?


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    #841
    galwaycyclist
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    Iwannahurl wrote: »
    What is this surface of which you speak?

    Flat thing made of compressed asphalt and chippings. Ideal for cycling especially if you have Mr. Dunlops new patent pneumatic cycling tyres.

    So as a result back in the 19th Century, when cycling was a mass movement and cars a largely theoretical concept, the cyclists got together to campaign for all main roads to be surfaced to the new standard.

    http://www.roadswerenotbuiltforcars.com/

    Nowadays some people in cars seem to conveniently forget who the roads were built for.


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