Ferrybank Shopping Centre - Again

Green Hornet

fricatus wrote: »

So if M&S or Brown Thomas were in Ferrybank, people in Wexford would travel to it, whereas they wouldn't go (literally) the extra mile to the city centre, where they would also have an array of other shops, plus all the nice cafés and restaurants in town?

Not saying you're wrong, but I would have to ask why? Is parking/traffic that much of a big deal?

Yes, I believe so. The perception in Wexford is that getting across the bridge, parking and the options on offer shopping wise are not worth travelling for.

Bards

Dicky Pride wrote: »

2 wrongs do not make a right.

You say that Ferrybank could well do with an ardkeen style development, so a supermarket...a chemist...a bank...

That could slot nicely into "Ferrybank", along with the library...maybe a citizens information centre...a creche...an internet cafe.... a lot of things that wouldn't be much threat to the city centre...

There is a brand spanking new Small Development called Ross Abbey that never opened because of Ferrybank.

Knock Ferrybank and let Ross Abbey Cetre open - simple.

http://www.halleygrace.com/view.php?pid=683&gid=2

Dicky Pride

I'm aware of Ross abbey but that doesn't really solve the puzzle of Ferrybank shopping centre.

Just confirms that they're all idiots who had too much money and not an ounce of sense

fricatus

Green Hornet wrote: »

Yes, I believe so. The perception in Wexford is that getting across the bridge, parking and the options on offer shopping wise are not worth travelling for.

Not being smart, but I find it genuinely perplexing that you say people would nevertheless drive to Ferrybank from Wexford. It's not that hard to get across the bridge and find parking if you've just driven 30 miles, part of it through New Ross!

Maybe I'm biased, but I find the city centre an attractive place to be these days - certainly better than any shopping centre. By the same token, I was down in Mahon Point and yeah, big swingin' mickey... but Cork city centre is so much more interesting and real - so that's where I would go if I happened to be down around the "real capital".

How about if the Newgate Centre opened say, and contained a nice big M&S, Zara, H&M, etc. Would it be worth travelling then?

comeraghs

Anybody who has been in the city centre the last two weeks would have to be hugely impressed, The whole WINTERVAL festival has really put so much life into it.

Kotek Besar

Slightly off-topic, but can anyone remember the name of the small TV / AV shop that was in town, a couple of doors up from McDonalds? It must have closed in around 2006 I'd say.

Professey Chin

Kotek Besar wrote: »

Slightly off-topic, but can anyone remember the name of the small TV / AV shop that was in town, a couple of doors up from McDonalds? It must have closed in around 2006 I'd say.

RTV

lassykk

Kotek Besar wrote: »

Slightly off-topic, but can anyone remember the name of the small TV / AV shop that was in town, a couple of doors up from McDonalds? It must have closed in around 2006 I'd say.

RTV think they did TV & rental TVs

How did that come to mind?

Kotek Besar

Thanks guys. Was just thinking about shops that used to exist in the city centre.

danjo-xx

A petition to wind up Dunnes Stores over a €21.6m debt has been withdrawn after the Commercial Court heard that the money was paid in full yesterday.
Brian O'Moore SC for Dunnes Stores said that its earlier reasons for non-payment were genuinely held and no discourtesy to the court was intended.
Mr Justice Peter Kelly said that the earlier refusal to settle the judgement could have been viewed as a challenge to the authority of the court even if it was not intended.


Maurice Collins SC for Holtglen ltd said he was not seeking costs but Mr Justice Kelly said he would have granted them if an order was sought.
The summary judgment, granted last March by Mr Justice Peter Kelly, related to the retail group's alleged failure to settle a debt for building works at a shopping centre in Kilkenny.
Holtglen built a shopping centre in Kilkenny in which Dunnes agreed to be the anchor tenant.


The Ferrybank shopping centre was completed in 2009 but Holtglen later became insolvent and its Bank of Ireland loans were transferred to National Asset Management Ltd (NALM), a company of the National Asset Management Agency.


http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1214/dunnes-stores-winding-up-order-withdrawn.html

Gadgie

People are always banging on about getting a Marks & Sparks here. Maybe the company managing the shopping centre should offer them free rent for a few years to get them in there (that is, assuming Dunnes aren't going to open).

thomasm

Gadgie wrote: »

People are always banging on about getting a Marks & Sparks here. Maybe the company managing the shopping centre should offer them free rent for a few years to get them in there (that is, assuming Dunnes aren't going to open).

Dunnes were offered 5 years free as far as I know

wmpdd3

Usually its 5 years free on a 20 yer lease etc, 5 eyars free on a 7 year lease would be bending over backwards!

thomasm

http://www.waterford-news.ie/2013/02/20/shopping-centre-to-be-sold-at-fraction-of-building-cost/

The 'other' shopping centre in Ferrybank is up for sale. This one is about the size that was needed. Being sold by Nama for 575k.

Bards

thomasm wrote: »

http://www.waterford-news.ie/2013/02/20/shopping-centre-to-be-sold-at-fraction-of-building-cost/

The 'other' shopping centre in Ferrybank is up for sale. This one is about the size that was needed. Being sold by Nama for 575k.

As long as the threat that is ferrybank s.c exists, then this will never be sold, let alone occupied.

Tme to pull down the monstrosity so that the right type of centre can flourish

thomasm

Bards wrote: »

As long as the threat that is ferrybank s.c exists, then this will never be sold, let alone occupied.

Tme to pull down the monstrosity so that the right type of centre can flourish

Most people know that one won't open and would surely factor that into the decesion making process

Dicky Pride

Now that the developers have got some compensation from Dunnes I expect absolutely nothing to happen to Ferrybank SC. in teh next 20 years anyway

wmpdd3

i was in lisduggen the other morning and it was buzzing, even had to circle the carpark for a space.
That seems to be the correct size for a suberban sc. Correct mix of local shops and homeware.

Dicky Pride

wmpdd3 wrote: »

i was in lisduggen the other morning and it was buzzing, even had to circle the carpark for a space.
That seems to be the correct size for a suberban sc. Correct mix of local shops and homeware.

Every time I go into the that place I'm struck by just how "Waterford" it is. I mean you could be in tesco and you wouldn't know what tesco in the country you're in...but up there...we'll let's just say you'd know you're in Waterford.

bilibob

Does Anybody have any update on the centre- I see that they took down some of the railings around the front to allow access to the library and the place looks much better.

Since Dunnes were forced to pay up- Does that mean they wont be going into the centre?

Are any other anchor tenants interested?

Considering that the carpark up at aldi is usually full/ busy and theres a big queue for the checkouts- there must be a decent ammount of demand in the area. Even Molloys butchers seems to be busy all the time.
There seems to be a good deal of footfall around the centre - between people walking into town, at the post office and butchers, and the bus stop-

Are any of the units up for rent? And if they aren't why aren't they? Even if one or two shops were to go in there beside the library it would make a huge difference.

wellboytoo

Dead and Duck spring to mind

wmpdd3

No, no sign of life, I'm down there most days and the security guards dont seem to think anything is going to change. There are 2 carparks open there every day, pity we couldn't have a farmers market or something.

I agree about Aldi, but there's a big difference between a small supermarket doing well and an anchor tenant taking in €600,000 a week. Even if they did, that may not support the communal areas in the center opening.

Max Powers

wmpdd3 wrote: »

No, no sign of life, I'm down there most days and the security guards dont seem to think anything is going to change. There are 2 carparks open there every day, pity we couldn't have a farmers market or something.

I agree about Aldi, but there's a big difference between a small supermarket doing well and an anchor tenant taking in €600,000 a week. Even if they did, that may not support the communal areas in the center opening.

Best thing for it would be a community centre, sport facility.

bilibob

I kind of understand about he communal areas- but Surely they wouldn't have to open the whole thing at once. When I was young I remember only a tiny bit of city square was open, and It took YEARS before it was full of shops. McDonagh Junction in Kilkenny still isn't full- Even though it has come on a lot. These things take time. I think the library opening was the best thing ever- now at least there is something there. they really should be trying to get shops in. Even if they got an anchor in rent free for a few years until it took off. At the moment they aren't even trying to lease units. On daft they are trying to lease units on developments not even built- This shopping centre is built and ready to go!!

BBM77

For god sake the Ferrybank shopping centre is not financially viable. What has to happen before people get this? It is a BS Celtic tiger development built in a small suburb under a very dodgy planning decision. Aldi and Molloy’s is absolutely no evidence that the Ferrybank shopping centre is viable you are talking about completely different scales.

bilibob

I really don't agree! If you look at the Dunmore road area- There is the area all around the Uluru, lidl and the ardkeen 'shopping centre' there is Where Tesco, homebase and a huge next are located, and up the road again there is ballinakill centre. I know Ferrybank doesn't have as big a population but there are tens of thousands of people living in within 20 minutes of it- from Slievrue, Mullinavat, Kilmacow, Mooncoin, and Ferrybank itself has lots of houses, Entire estates that were like ghost estates for years are now full. The centre is built and has good facilities, parking and is actually surrounded by houses. Why is it ok for people to drive all the way out to ardkeen to next and not ok for people to drive out to Ferrybank for shopping?

BBM77

bilibob wrote: »

I really don't agree! If you look at the Dunmore road area- There is the area all around the Uluru, lidl and the ardkeen 'shopping centre' there is Where Tesco, homebase and a huge next are located, and up the road again there is ballinakill centre. I know Ferrybank doesn't have as big a population but there are tens of thousands of people living in within 20 minutes of it- from Slievrue, Mullinavat, Kilmacow, Mooncoin, and Ferrybank itself has lots of houses, Entire estates that were like ghost estates for years are now full. The centre is built and has good facilities, parking and is actually surrounded by houses. Why is it ok for people to drive all the way out to ardkeen to next and not ok for people to drive out to Ferrybank for shopping?

The Ferrybank shopping centre is more than what you described in Ardkeen. The shops in Ardkeen are sustained by the Dunmore Road suburb. As you pointed out yourself the Ferrybank shopping centre would need to bring people in from as far away as Mullinavat to keep it going. The Ferrybank shopping centre is a regional centre built as I said on the dodgy pretence that it is a suburban shopping centre. I have nothing against a Tesco’s or whoever opening in Ferrybank like there is in Ardkeen or Lisduggan with some other shops around it but don’t try and tell me that is what the Ferrybank shopping centre is.

Max Powers

bilibob wrote: »

I really don't agree! If you look at the Dunmore road area- There is the area all around the Uluru, lidl and the ardkeen 'shopping centre' there is Where Tesco, homebase and a huge next are located, and up the road again there is ballinakill centre. I know Ferrybank doesn't have as big a population but there are tens of thousands of people living in within 20 minutes of it- from Slievrue, Mullinavat, Kilmacow, Mooncoin, and Ferrybank itself has lots of houses, Entire estates that were like ghost estates for years are now full. The centre is built and has good facilities, parking and is actually surrounded by houses. Why is it ok for people to drive all the way out to ardkeen to next and not ok for people to drive out to Ferrybank for shopping?

i dont know, couldnt be bothered looking up the figures but i doubt its 10s of thousands.

Bards

bilibob wrote: »

I really don't agree! If you look at the Dunmore road area- There is the area all around the Uluru, lidl and the ardkeen 'shopping centre' there is Where Tesco, homebase and a huge next are located, and up the road again there is ballinakill centre. I know Ferrybank doesn't have as big a population but there are tens of thousands of people living in within 20 minutes of it- from Slievrue, Mullinavat, Kilmacow, Mooncoin, and Ferrybank itself has lots of houses, Entire estates that were like ghost estates for years are now full. The centre is built and has good facilities, parking and is actually surrounded by houses. Why is it ok for people to drive all the way out to ardkeen to next and not ok for people to drive out to Ferrybank for shopping?

Population of the are you describe is 5,000 approx .inhabitants.

The population of the Dunmore Road Suburbs, which takes in Ardkeen Ballygunner etc is 20,000 approx - thats 4 x times the population

To put Ferrybank S.C in perspective. Think how big City Square + Hypermarket + Lisduggan combined are? and we are still not at the same scale - it belongs more in Dublin or Cork than it does in Ferrybank, let alone Galway, Limerick, or Waterford City Centre.

Nypd

I wish they would just level the place, sack whoever rubber stamped it and move on.

padraig.od

Bards wrote: »

Population of the are you describe is 5,000 approx .inhabitants.

The population of the Dunmore Road Suburbs, which takes in Ardkeen Ballygunner etc is 20,000 approx - thats 4 x times the population

To put Ferrybank S.C in perspective. Think how big City Square + Hypermarket + Lisduggan combined are? and we are still not at the same scale - it belongs more in Dublin or Cork than it does in Ferrybank, let alone Galway, Limerick, or Waterford City Centre.

Incorrect. There are about 14k people on the KK side of the border within 10 miles of the shopping centre.

You can get population statistics from 2011 via the census.

These are broken down by electoral districts for the parishes of Mooncoin, Kilmacow, Mullinavat, Slieverue and Ferrybank. I've excluded Glenmore (close to Ross) Fiddown & Piltown (close to Carrick), and some ED's near Mullinavat as I'm not too familiar with the area. So if anything I'm being conservative.

Kilculliheen 4811
Rathpatrick 1140
Kilcolumb 579
Ballincrea 310
Dunkitt 1058
Aglish 871
Portnascully 1128
Pollrone 1406
Ullid 1014
Rossinan 776
Farnoge 297
Killahy 708
14098

Not that I'm saying that it should ever be built, but it's better to debate based on facts, not on guess work.

Bards

padraig.od wrote: »

Incorrect. There are about 14k people on the KK side of the border within 10 miles of the shopping centre.

You can get population statistics from 2011 via the census.

These are broken down by electoral districts for the parishes of Mooncoin, Kilmacow, Mullinavat, Slieverue and Ferrybank. I've excluded Glenmore (close to Ross) Fiddown & Piltown (close to Carrick), and some ED's near Mullinavat as I'm not too familiar with the area. So if anything I'm being conservative.

Kilculliheen 4811
Rathpatrick 1140
Kilcolumb 579
Ballincrea 310
Dunkitt 1058
Aglish 871
Portnascully 1128
Pollrone 1406
Ullid 1014
Rossinan 776
Farnoge 297
Killahy 708
14098

10 mins by. What, Jet., just loomat some of thise places, how in gods name can you get from ferrybank to some of those outlying places within the speed limit.

.. And if we want to deal in facts there are about 100k people within 30 mins of the centre of Waterford. We do not need Ferrybank - Period.

Dempsey

He said 10 miles, not minutes

Sully

I actually don't think that the center is doomed, it was just badly timed as its hard to fill out these units in this time. It had and still has potential but it doesn't even seemed to have been marketed very well. I remember calling several times to find out about renting one of the units and nobody could tell me anything, and despite me told I would get a call back, it never came.

I think people would come from Kilkenny & Waterford if it had decent shops.

Nypd

Sully wrote: »

I actually don't think that the center is doomed, it was just badly timed as its hard to fill out these units in this time. It had and still has potential but it doesn't even seemed to have been marketed very well. I remember calling several times to find out about renting one of the units and nobody could tell me anything, and despite me told I would get a call back, it never came.

I think people would come from Kilkenny & Waterford if it had decent shops.

If Waterford city centre is suffering why would any retailer set up in Ferrybank ?

Green Hornet

In fairness though, I'd imagine people from as far as New Ross would go to Ferrybank but wouldn't be as inclined to go into the town itself with the bridge, traffic etc.

wellboytoo

The numbers being mentioned here are paltry in the extreme , this is a humongous building way too big for Waterford City never mind a small suburb, it will never work as is ,

decies

I think you got that the wrong way round unless it had some mind blowing attractive units would Waterford People be bothered crossing the bridge to it , I have my doubts .

Deise67

I for one will never spend a penny of my hard earned in project purely designed to take footfall from Waterford and pay rates to kk !

Sully

Nypd wrote: »

If Waterford city centre is suffering why would any retailer set up in Ferrybank ?

Well part of that problem seems to be lack of 'decent' shops. That's what people seem to be saying. Having a decent shopping center with a range of big brand shops should pull people from the South East. Its not going to work if its just going to average run of the mill shops.

Deise67

yeah pull what's left out of the center of waterford and line big Phils kk pockets with rates, extend the boundary then waterford people could embrace it , otherwise its just another parasite leeching off Waterford !

padraig.od

Bards wrote: »

padraig.od wrote: »

Incorrect. There are about 14k people on the KK side of the border within 10 miles of the shopping centre.

You can get population statistics from 2011 via the census.

These are broken down by electoral districts for the parishes of Mooncoin, Kilmacow, Mullinavat, Slieverue and Ferrybank. I've excluded Glenmore (close to Ross) Fiddown & Piltown (close to Carrick), and some ED's near Mullinavat as I'm not too familiar with the area. So if anything I'm being conservative.

Kilculliheen 4811
Rathpatrick 1140
Kilcolumb 579
Ballincrea 310
Dunkitt 1058
Aglish 871
Portnascully 1128
Pollrone 1406
Ullid 1014
Rossinan 776
Farnoge 297
Killahy 708
14098

10 mins by. What, Jet., just loomat some of thise places, how in gods name can you get from ferrybank to some of those outlying places within the speed limit.

.. And if we want to deal in facts there are about 100k people within 30 mins of the centre of Waterford. We do not need Ferrybank - Period.

1. I said miles, not minutes.
2. "if we want to deal in facts there are about 100k" - good job dealing with facts!

Anyway, I wasn't passing judgement on the shopping centre, just correcting the 5K remark.

Nypd

Deise67 wrote: »

yeah pull what's left out of the center of waterford and line big Phils kk pockets with rates, extend the boundary then waterford people could embrace it , otherwise its just another parasite leeching off Waterford !

I have no doubt that's what the original thought process was, leeching describes it perfectly.

padraig.od

Sully wrote: »

Well part of that problem seems to be lack of 'decent' shops. That's what people seem to be saying. Having a decent shopping center with a range of big brand shops should pull people from the South East. Its not going to work if its just going to average run of the mill shops.

Is that what people really want? I'm pretty sick of the identikit UK highstreets/shopping centres full of the same boring UK chains.

padraig.od

Nypd wrote: »

I have no doubt that's what the original thought process was, leeching describes it perfectly.

Who's thought process? Did the property developer have it in for Waterford?

Nypd

padraig.od wrote: »

Who's thought process? Did the property developer have it in for Waterford?

Did I say that ?
KK County Council if you need it spelt out for you.

wmpdd3

What's the square footage of the Dove Hill Irish Design Centre, Carrick On Suir?

I remember thinking 'who in their right mind?' when I saw the plans for that, but its doing fine.

Find a niche.

How does anyone ever start a business with that kinda cant do attitude?

7upfree

wmpdd3 wrote: »

What's the square footage of the Dove Hill Irish Design Centre, Carrick On Suir?

I remember thinking 'who in their right mind?' when I saw the plans for that, but its doing fine.

Find a niche.

How does anyone ever start a business with that kinda cant do attitude?

KK CoCo should be ashamed of the roundabout adjacent to that white elephant. An absolute disgrace, along with the one at Newrath and the one at "Belmount".
I never saw anything as petty as those "Belmount" signs TBH.

padraig.od

Nypd wrote: »

Did I say that ?
KK County Council if you need it spelt out for you.

So KK CC put up the cash to build the shopping centre to "leech" from Waterford? No, some private investors did. All KK CC did was approve the thing.

Was approval ever appealed to An Board Pleanala or a body like that? What did the local residents think of the plan?

padraig.od

7upfree wrote: »

KK CoCo should be ashamed of the roundabout adjacent to that white elephant. An absolute disgrace, along with the one at Newrath and the one at "Belmount".
I never saw anything as petty as those "Belmount" signs TBH.

What signs are those? I drive through Newrath pretty regularly and can't say I have noticed anything special about the roundabout