Not In My Name

Wibbs

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

Less of the condescending crap please. Don't fall off that high horse.

Dont worry I won't. After all it's not hard to look down on a mindset like yours. It's also true you'll get greyer in thinking with the years. Being utterly convinced of ones cause is a symptom of the young. As is thinking dying for it, or worse killing for it is worthwhile.

Talk about naivety.

You do realise that there is exists a large chunk of the population of the north who don't want to be part of this UI of yours. And what happens then? They leave? And you call me naive? Build a bridge, get off all your soapboxes and build a fúcking bridge.

hondasam wrote:

Not this again ! How many times do we need to keep seeing this debate.

+10000. With the exception of a small group of people whose historical pause button is stuck on 1973, the vast majority of people in this republic of ours don't give a crap and are sorely tired of the chuckies and orange madness up north. As are a majority of the Northerners.

Hookah

Wibbs wrote: »

Build a bridge, get off all your soapboxes and build a fúcking bridge.

One bridge for crossing, and one bridge for fucking.

Very practical.

MadsL

Not in Our Name - the pledge to resist...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ_o660d0oc

If enough people stand up against the silence, things change.

Thanks for posting DeV

m@cc@

Wibbs wrote: »

With the exception of a small group of people whose historical pause button is stuck on 1973, the vast majority of people in this republic of ours don't give a crap and are sorely tired of the chuckies and orange madness up north. As are a majority of the Northerners.

Correct. Efforts should be concentrated on making NI a more prosperous place and then maybe in 50 years time when we've shown we can run the place, then the UI question can be seriously looked at. The Republic has enough problems of it's own without that s****.

Wolfe Tone

lugha wrote: »

Out of curiosity, does it follow, and would you advise nationalists who may have information on the activities of the dissident republicans, not to cooperate with the police?

I think people need to look at physical force republicans very closely...

Many people disagree with the GFA, nothing wrong with that. All the so called "dissidents" are doing is enabling all objections to it to be buried under the label of "dissident". Just look at how éirigí are branded "dissidents" while in fact they are not pro armed campaign. Its clear that the armed groups are not advancing the goal of a UI. I think they should be stopped.

If people want to inform then they can. I would never do it, I have no desire to end up dead or worse, have family members hurt.

Forest Master

I don't get it - not in my name what?

realies wrote: »

people are expressing there view that it was not done in there name as they are not representing them.

All these people were accused of the murder?

Wolfe Tone

Wibbs wrote: »

Dont worry I won't. After all it's not hard to look down on a mindset like yours. It's also true you'll get greyer in thinking with the years. Being utterly convinced of ones cause is a symptom of the young. As is thinking dying for it, or worse killing for it is worthwhile.

I wouldn't die for it, or kill for it. Bad form Wibbs belittling peoples views. Age has nothing to do with it, and I'm disappointed that you would attempt to explain away my views as simply being the product of youth. I must have imagined all those people, who would be of a similar age to yourself, who share my views.

For someone who usually makes good points and who is one of my favorite posters, you have let yourself down here by bringing my age, something irrelevant, into it.

You do realise that there is exists a large chunk of the population of the north who don't want to be part of this UI of yours. And what happens then? They leave? And you call me naive? Build a bridge, get off all your soapboxes and build a fúcking bridge.

I'm calling you naive for thinking that police work will stop whats going on.

Wolfe Tone

Forest Master wrote: »

I don't get it - not in my name what?



All these people were accused of the murder?

Various IRA groups, saying that any killing they do is not in their name.

ScumLord

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

The only time these "terrorists" will be part of history is when the illegal partition of this island is brought to an end.

As long as those "terrorists" use violence over the democratic system they have sitting right in front of them they'll never become part of this republic. The stepping stones are, no more violence, learn to get along like good boys and girls, and then maybe we'll let you join our republic.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Whilst this video won't do anything to stop the attacks it may help with community relations.

Like historically there was fear and suspicion that Catholics mostly supported the IRA and would shelter them as well as the belief the Irish government supported and sheltered the IRA.

The large "not in my name" themed protests show it is a minority aiding and abetting these groups

TheZohanS

MadsL wrote: »

If enough people stand up against the silence, things change.

Thanks for posting DeV

Yeah, that YouTube video is going to change the world...gawd maybe they'll make a Facebook page next....ohhhh the outrage!

Forest Master

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

The large "not in my name" themed protests show it is a minority aiding and abetting these groups

But how does it work if they never specified who they are or which side they represent? They didn't say if they were catholic or protestant. For all I know, watching that video, they could all be protestants saying the Queen isn't visiting Ireland next week in their name.
If you're going to make a vague political video, you need to be specific to get the point across. A lot of people ITT had no idea what that video was about, and the OP wasn't even bothered giving a clue either. It's too boring to watch all the way through - it's just the same thing over & over, with no description whatsoever re what it's about.

Nodin

My name is URL wrote: »

It's funny how a video championing unity can cause such petty arguments.

People bring in their own jibes at certain parties and the whole thing goes to shite, I find. As a result even though I'm against the dissidents, I rarely get involved in them. We were lucky to get to post 29 with just cynicism and smartarsery.

m@cc@

TheZohan wrote: »

Yeah, that YouTube video is going to change the world...gawd maybe they'll make a Facebook page next....ohhhh the outrage!

Yeah, much better to bitch behind a keyboard while your government consigns your grandkids to a debt-ridden existence. We must be world leaders in apathy and non-action.

arybvtcw0eolkf

realies wrote: »

Its a video about the murder of ronan kerr who was murdered by the ;republicans: and people are expressing there view that it was not done in there name as they are not representing them.

Thank you, because it was completely lost on me too.

If you want power anti-terror ad's (the internet wasn't around when this was broadcast) then here's the most powerful..

The original posted in this thread is terribly lame IMO.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Forest Master wrote: »

But how does it work if they never specified who they are or which side they represent? They didn't say if they were catholic or protestant. For all I know, watching that video, they could all be protestants saying the Queen isn't visiting Ireland next week in their name.
If you're going to make a vague political video, you need to be specific to get the point across. A lot of people ITT had no idea what that video was about, and the OP wasn't even bothered giving a clue either. It's too boring to watch all the way through - it's just the same thing over & over, with no description whatsoever re what it's about.

It is part of a broader campaign. There was mass protest in Omagh(predominantly nationalist town) where everyone carried a poster of Ronan Kerr with a "not in my name" text alongside it. If you were from the north or read northern papers you'd immediately know what it was about

TheZohanS

m@cc@ wrote: »

Yeah, much better to bitch behind a keyboard while your government consigns your grandkids to a debt-ridden existence. We must be world leaders in apathy and non-action.

The time for Facebook and YouTube protests is long over, we need real action as in massive, massive public demonstrations.

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

It is part of a broader campaign. There was mass protest in Omagh(predominantly nationalist town) where everyone carried a poster of Ronan Kerr with a "not in my name" text alongside it. If you were from the north or read northern papers you'd immediately know what it was about

That's more like it.

DeVore

The reason I posted this was to be clear that people claiming to represent Irish people and who do violence to others do not represent me. I make no argument for or against, though I certainly could, I just wanted to convey that single piece of information.

I was prompted to do so because friends of mine in Malta presumed the majority of people here supported violence. I can't speak about majorities but I can speak for myself.

I submit that the mass posting of this simple, uncontentious phrase is a powerful counter to the presumption that Irish people support violence and that these people represent us. I'm making it clear they don't represent me and thousands of others are doing the same.

To say this achieves nothing is disingenuous and/or stupid. It puts the lie to the propganda and removes their pretense of support.


But all of that is simply emergent consequence of a single simple undeniable statement... That this violence is not done in my name.

Tom Murphy.

Blobby George

DeVore wrote: »

The reason I posted this was to be clear that people claiming to represent Irish people and who do violence to others do not represent me. I make no argument for or against, though I certainly could, I just wanted to convey that single piece of information.

I was prompted to do so because friends of mine in Malta presumed the majority of people here supported violence. I can't speak about majorities but I can speak for myself.

I submit that the mass posting of this simple, uncontentious phrase is a powerful counter to the presumption that Irish people support violence and that these people represent us. I'm making it clear they don't represent me and thousands of others are doing the same.

To say this achieves nothing is disingenuous and/or stupid. It puts the lie to the propganda and removes their pretense of support.


But all of that is simply emergent consequence of a single simple undeniable statement... That this violence is not done in my name.

Tom Murphy.

Empty soundbites is all I see from this post. The real name sign off in an attempt to convey sincerity makes me feel like puking my guts out.

Wibbs

DeVore wrote: »

TTo say this achieves nothing is disingenuous and/or stupid.

OK so those who happen to disagree with you are now disingenuous and/or stupid? Riiiight. Though where you get disingenuous from is a bit of a puzzle. I'm being perfectly sincere when I say I think it's more about patting oneself on the back than actually changing anything.

It puts the lie to the propganda and removes their pretense of support.

You do realise how much support these guys need don't you? A couple of hundred people is pretty much all they require. Do you think you'll reach them? I doubt you're that naive. If all you do is reach the rest, whom we already know don't go along with the goons on both sides, what is it but an empty gesture.

However I do agree with you about foreign perceptions. That can be changed by us all standing up more vocally, but a thread on a "local" forum isn't going to do it, neither is a "local" facebook page. A cursory perusal of Boards would show the vast majority thinks these tools are daft, but how many say Spaniards or French read Boards.ie? You're preaching to the e choir basically. The interweb may save us, but not just yet.

A worldwide site could be set up. My contention is it's fúck all use if it's not global. I had this notion myself a while back(hough Notinmyname.com is already gone). A hub/portal for individual people of all nations to assert their opposition to using violence to political ends. That I could see being actually useful. A one stop shop to say to terrorists of all hues, fúck off you primitives. Throw in an iphone and android app and get it worldwide in english/french/chinese/spanish etc and bobs your mothers brother. No politics attached to the site itself. Just a blank canvas. (c) me

Blobby George wrote:

The real name sign off in an attempt to convey sincerity makes me feel like puking my guts out.

While I think he's naive as a drunk arts student, he at least put his name to his opinion. Would you?

Apologies if you were christened Blobby. Or indeed George. If the latter, apologies for referring to your ongoing fight with weightloss.

UglyBolloxFace

So...what's all this bollocks about?

Blobby George

Wibbs wrote: »

While I think he's naive as a drunk arts student, he at least put his name to his opinion. Would you?

Apologies if you were christened Blobby. Or indeed George. If the latter, apologies for referring to your ongoing fight with weightloss.

Your insensitivity has cut me deep, Wibbs. I might have to nip out for a steak and kidney to cushion the blow. That alone won't make up for the crushing torture I endure on a daily basis as a result of being christened Blobby, however.

Gordon

Great idea, hope the message reaches everyone.

Wibbs

Gordon wrote: »

Great idea, hope the message reaches everyone.

And right there G you've summed up the problem. Great idea, but how do you get this message out to the actual world and not just locally?

The Left Hand Of God

DeVore wrote: »

The reason I posted this was to be clear that people claiming to represent Irish people and who do violence to others do not represent me. I make no argument for or against, though I certainly could, I just wanted to convey that single piece of information.

I was prompted to do so because friends of mine in Malta presumed the majority of people here supported violence. I can't speak about majorities but I can speak for myself.

I submit that the mass posting of this simple, uncontentious phrase is a powerful counter to the presumption that Irish people support violence and that these people represent us. I'm making it clear they don't represent me and thousands of others are doing the same.

To say this achieves nothing is disingenuous and/or stupid. It puts the lie to the propganda and removes their pretense of support.


But all of that is simply emergent consequence of a single simple undeniable statement... That this violence is not done in my name.

Tom Murphy.

Out of interest can you provide a link where these new people claim to represent the Irish people as you stated? I couldn't find one from my searching.

Thanks.

Also you need to find more intelligent friends in Malta! Sure I have a few English friends who aren't even that stupid as to think something like that.

Wolfe Tone

A worldwide site could be set up. My contention is it's fúck all use if it's not global. I had this notion myself a while back(hough Notinmyname.com is already gone). A hub/portal for individual people of all nations to assert their opposition to using violence to political ends. That I could see being actually useful. A one stop shop to say to terrorists of all hues, fúck off you primitives. Throw in an iphone and android app and get it worldwide in english/french/chinese/spanish etc and bobs your mothers brother. No politics attached to the site itself. Just a blank canvas. (c) me

Thats an interesting idea Wibbs, but not everyone agrees on a definition of terrorist. Are the Libyan rebels terrorists? What about the Israeli army? Hamas? etc etc etc... Could people come on and say the war in Afghanistan/Iraq is not in my name? Are they then calling the US terrorists?

---

Another thing, if people are serious about trying to prevent and stop physical force republicans the only way this can be done is by engaging in dialog with them or more importantly their supporters.

Just the other day I was talking to a man, who while not an activist, passively supported "dissident" republicans. By the time I was finished talking he had conceded that violence only strengthened all island support for the GFA and branded all those who opposed it , peacefully or otherwise, as violent dissidents, pretty much negating any vald points they have and removing any chance of popular support. Violence, even from an anti gfa viewpoint is counter productive. Offer people a choice between SFs vague promise of an agreed Ireland sometime in the future and what physical force republicans offer they will choose SF every time.

Now maybe that man will be spouting stuff about the RIRA next time I see him, but there is a chance, a significant chance, that he wont. But you can be sure if I told him it wasn't in my name and berated him he would go on the defensive and close his mind completely. He knows deep down violence is not bringing anyone closer to a UI. If he, and others like him, really believe that the GFA is a great betrayal and the end of any chance of a UI they must realize, as it is fact, that any form of violence simply increases popular support for the GFA. Nigh on universally their justification for violence, as they inevitably concede that it brings us no closer to a UI, is that British rule must be opposed, the point must be made that the British should not have a say in Irish affairs. They do this with a bomb, they could do this peacefully. éirigí, despite their unpopular status on boards, cop this. They go about things in the right way.

Now none of the above may work at at all, maybe its naive to think that a reasoned debate could work, but it sure as hell has a better chance of working than the well intentioned video. You may say is impossible, but Gerry Adams brought the vast majority of the IRA to his way of thinking. Talking does work, isolating an angry group doesn't. Berating them doesn't. Engaging them in a manner which they can understand, in a respectful way, will at the least give them something to think about, and like that man I talked to, may change their minds. Calling them murdering scumbags, terrorists, etc etc only further isolates and entrenches them.

If people are serious about peace there should be no avenue they refuse to go down to achieve it.

Now how should these people be "brought to the table"? I have a half baked idea which involves various reps from various groups engaging in a type of round-table debate on boards, one which can only be beneficial and is at least worth an attempt. Dev, if you would like to hear more about this fire us a PM, AH isnt really the place.

Wibbs

The Left Hand Of God wrote: »

Also you need to find more intelligent friends in Malta! Sure I have a few English friends who aren't even that stupid as to think something like that.

Without running to Google name the main town of Malta. Name one historical figure of Maltese extraction. Name one historical event in Malta. Outline a thumbnail sketch of Maltese history. Explain their connection to Britain. Without running to Google Then get back to me on the stupidity of his friends in Malta. It's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not.

Wolfe Tone

Wibbs wrote: »

Without running to Google name the main town of Malta. Name one historical figure of Maltese extraction. Name one historical event in Malta. Outline a thumbnail sketch of Maltese history. Explain their connection to Britain. Without running to Google Then get back to me on the stupidity of his friends in Malta. It's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not.

Malta was the most bombed place in WW2 wasnt it? I remember reading about how a huge convoy was sent to run the gauntlet of the Med to bring them supplies.

The Left Hand Of God

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

<snip>Talking does work, isolating an angry group doesn't. Berating them doesn't. Engaging them in a manner which they can understand, in a respectful way, will at the least give them something to think about, and like that man I talked to, may change their minds. Calling them murdering scumbags, terrorists, etc etc only further isolates and entrenches them.

If people are serious about peace there should be no avenue they refuse to go down to achieve it.

Now how should these people be "brought to the table"? I have a half baked idea which involves various reps from various groups engaging in a type of round-table debate on boards, one which can only be beneficial and is at least worth an attempt. Dev, if you would like to hear more about this fire us a PM, AH isnt really the place.

These people will never be brought to the table. Offer them about 5 million STG each and you might get somewhere.

They are like the people here when you ask what would you do to someone if you find out they raped your child. Most are Kill, Kill, Kill. And there is no talking to them

Sanity goes out the window.

Wibbs

Good post WT. And some pretty bloody valid arguments too IMHO. I defo agree you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

The Left Hand Of God

Wibbs wrote: »

Without running to Google name the main town of Malta. Name one historical figure of Maltese extraction. Name one historical event in Malta. Outline a thumbnail sketch of Maltese history. Explain their connection to Britain. Without running to Google Then get back to me on the stupidity of his friends in Malta. It's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not.

I don't get what you are saying. Thinking all Irish people support violence is OK if you are from Malta? Is that what you are saying?

Note I didn't go to google to ask that?

Wibbs

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

Malta was the most bombed place in WW2 wasnt it? I remember reading about how a huge convoy was sent to run the gauntlet of the Med to bring them supplies.

Yea one of my rellies flew in defence of the place. Barely outa nappies and off he went. Mad.

Wolfe Tone

The Left Hand Of God wrote: »

I don't get what you are saying. Thinking all Irish people support violence is OK if you are from Malta? Is that what you are saying?

Note I didn't go to google to ask that?

How the hell are you supposed to understand Irish politics if you are some randomer from a small island in the Med? Chances are they only know about Ireland cause of the troubles.

MagicMarker

The clip in the OP serves no purpose if people turn it off after 30 seconds, like I did.

The Left Hand Of God

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

How the hell are you supposed to understand Irish politics if you are some randomer from a small island in the Med? Chances are they only know about Ireland cause of the troubles.

Well as far as I can tell they seem to think we are all into violence and murder, for OUR cause or so I gather from Wibbs.

Have you read the thread?

lugha

The Left Hand Of God wrote: »

Also you need to find more intelligent friends in Malta! Sure I have a few English friends who aren't even that stupid as to think something like that.

I don’t think it is at all stupid for an outsider to think that. Gerry Adams in the past, endorsed men who used violence despite being clearly told, “not in our name” and he now has an electoral mandate bettered only by the Taoiseach, though he is entirely unapologetic about his past stance. How exactly do you think an outsider looking in should interpret this?

Gordon

Wibbs wrote: »

And right there G you've summed up the problem. Great idea, but how do you get this message out to the actual world and not just locally?

Firstly, that's not my problem but I'm happy to help if I can

Secondly, Youtube is a start..

The Left Hand Of God

lugha wrote: »

I don’t think it is at all stupid for an outsider to think that. Gerry Adams in the past, endorsed men who used violence despite being clearly told, “not in our name” and he now has an electoral mandate bettered only by the Taoiseach, though he is entirely unapologetic about his past stance. How exactly do you think an outsider looking in should interpret this?

I'm not saying anything I just don't understand Wibbs and this post?

"Without running to Google name the main town of Malta. Name one historical figure of Maltese extraction. Name one historical event in Malta. Outline a thumbnail sketch of Maltese history. Explain their connection to Britain. Without running to Google Then get back to me on the stupidity of his friends in Malta. It's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not. "

Can you explain it to me?

Wibbs

Gordon wrote: »

Firstly, that's not my problem but I'm happy to help if I can

Secondly, Youtube is a start..

I was with you up until youtube G. Discussion wise, it's the anti Boards, where "being a dick" is a prerequisite. Great for nostalgia porn and copyright infringement? Reasoned debate? Eh no. Other sites? I dunno. One of the biggest reasons I like this site is I can suggest that DeVore, a founder of the place, the main vein, the Mr Ben of Boards.ie is talking out of an orifice not normally associated with speech and he may require a glass navel so that he can see out, but so long as I don't "pull a youtube"(c) I won't get banned for or censored for it. And that is pretty damned rare on the interweb. For all the fight the powah pundits in feedback etc(and I often agree with them), that rarity makes it valuable. That's the kind of reasoned worldwide platform that this kind of issue needs.

lugha

The Left Hand Of God wrote: »

I'm not saying anything I just don't understand Wibbs and this post?

"Without running to Google name the main town of Malta. Name one historical figure of Maltese extraction. Name one historical event in Malta. Outline a thumbnail sketch of Maltese history. Explain their connection to Britain. Without running to Google Then get back to me on the stupidity of his friends in Malta. It's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not. "

Can you explain it to me?

I’d guess he is making the point, via shoe on the other foot thinking, that a person having a shaky knowledge of the minute of an emerald isle off the West coast of Europe does not a stupid person make.

Anyway, our exact attitude to gunmen who represent us, in our name or not, is far from simple.

Wolfe Tone

Wibbs wrote: »

Good post WT. And some pretty bloody valid arguments too IMHO. I defo agree you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

See Wibbs, I'm not totally full of sh!te

The Left Hand Of God

lugha wrote: »

I’d guess he is making the point, via shoe on the other foot thinking, that a person having a shaky knowledge of the minute of an emerald isle off the West coast of Europe does not a stupid person make.

Anyway, our exact attitude to gunmen who represent us, in our name or not, is far from simple.

But he is not? Sure he thanked your post but hasn't explained how knowing about Maltas history makes sense? People in Malta think we support violence because they know little about our history? is that it?

Wibbs

The Left Hand Of God wrote: »

But he is not? Sure he thanked your post but hasn't explained how knowing about Maltas history makes sense? People in Malta think we support violence because they know little about our history? is that it?

Are you serious? :eek: Yes that's most of it. Like I said it's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not.

Gordon

Wibbs wrote: »

I was with you up until youtube G. Discussion wise, it's the anti Boards, where "being a dick" is a prerequisite.

Lol @ Wibbs. If sh*t like 'Friday' can make Rebecca Black famous, then Youtube is obviously a great tool to get the word out. Sure there are more, but one step at a time.

I have a question for you Wibbs: is putting that video up on Youtube detrimental to that cause, in your opinion?

Degsy

On the roof of Fort St Elmo in Valetta,Malta there's a depression a couple of centimetres deep where the Lufwaffe scored a DIRECT hit on the bugle-boy who was annoying everybody by playing "Reveille" at daybreak.

I rember thinking "good shot Fritz"

Wibbs

Gordon wrote: »

Lol @ Wibbs. If sh*t like 'Friday' can make Rebecca Black famous, then Youtube is obviously a great tool to get the word out. Sure there are more, but one step at a time.

I have a question for you Wibbs: is putting that video up on Youtube detrimental to that cause, in your opinion?

Yep. Why? "friday" and Rebecca Black is frivolous bollocks. Another empty internet meme for the saddos out in youtube land. IMHO putting serious stuff on Youtube is akin to having a serious political debate on Britains got special needs talent.

Gordon

Wibbs wrote: »

Yep. Why? "friday" and Rebecca Black is frivolous bollocks. Another empty internet meme for the saddos out in youtube land. IMHO putting serious stuff on Youtube is akin to having a serious political debate on Britains got special needs talent.

Haha

Youtube can spread an idea to millions of people, but you mustn't use it because there are saddos on Youtube. Hilarious

The Left Hand Of God

Wibbs wrote: »

Are you serious? :eek: Yes that's most of it. Like I said it's easy to be a subjective "expert" when it's close to home, not so easy to be an objective one when it's not.

You have explained nothing. I don't understand what you mean. Educate me.

Mouthing off on the internetz +1

Wibbs

Gordon wrote: »

Youtube can spread an idea to millions of people, but you mustn't use it because there are saddos on Youtube. Hilarious

Nope. Fire away and use it, but don't be shocked if saddos hijack it or prove so irritating that non saddos lose interest. Otherwise why would you and me and the rest of the community here have bothered our arses on this very site for more years than we care to remember, trying to save the place from the disruptive, the trolls, the dicks and the saddos? And a good thing too. Youtube is useful for hosting a video and linking elsewhere. As a site in of itself? Waaay to much noise over signal. Hell there are millions watching Jersey shore. Do you wanna have a serious discussion carried out on same?

Gordon

Wibbs wrote: »

Nope. Fire away and use it, but don't be shocked if saddos hijack it

More advertising.

or prove so irritating that non saddos lose interest.

While firstly being made aware of the message, which is the point.

Otherwise why would you and me and the rest of the community here have bothered our arses on this very site for more years than we care to remember, trying to save the place from the disruptive, the trolls, the dicks and the saddos? And a good thing too. Youtube is useful for hosting a video and linking elsewhere. As a site in of itself? Waaay to much noise over signal. Hell there are millions watching Jersey shore. Do you wanna have a serious discussion carried out on same?

Nope, and that just proves that you haven't been reading my words.

But that's cool, I'm not the one spreading the message. Good to see the topic generate discussion on boards too now though. Yet another platform the message is spreading onto.