Garda cars driving with fog lights on

highdef

And due to the angling of the light beam and also the physical location of the bulbs so close to the road surface, the glare reflected off a wet road can be extremely hazardous. And that's a best case scenario when the direct beam from the fog light alone does not excessive glare.

Jomcc

I've often seen this discussion/argument with regards to having fog lamps on when not foggy and I genuinely don't get what problem is. Can anyone please explain how it annoys people so much. I could fully understand the fact that rear fog lights being left on annoys people but am lost as to how people have problem with front ones being left on.

Now, people driving with only one headlight (either dipped, or full beam) is what drives me mad, but that's for another day.........

highdef

As has been explained several times already, first of all it is illegal to have them on. That on its own is a pretty good reason why they should not be on.
Then there is the fact that they can cause excessive glare when they are on when they should not be on. Some cars are not bad, some cars are horrendous. It would be impossible to draw up a list of cars that can and cannot have fog lights on when the visibility is not poor. In any case, if a car has it's fog lights on in wet conditions, the glare is generally quite severe. I don't differentiate between front and rear fog lights, although there are times when rear fog lights may be needed and front may not be needed, such as driving on a dual carriageway/motorway when there is a lot of spray. Some cars (older Micras and Fiestas in particular) have fog lights that are literally like full beams. Lots of other cars are almost as bad. My current car does not have front fogs so if I insist that I want more illumination in front as some people seem is ok to do with fog lights (although has been explained does not really work), the I should drive with my full beams on all the time. The light output from them would not be very dissimilar to that of an older Micra of Fiesta yet I would be flashed by every oncoming car for having them on yet it seems ok to be blinded by foglights. Now THAT I do not understand! Again, it all comes down to driver education and lack of enforcement.....some penalty points and fines would bring down the amount of habitual fog light users down pretty quickly, I would imagine!

But in a nutshell, Jomcc, the actual problem is literally that it is ILLEGAL to have them on when they should not be on....end of story.

savagecabbages

Again you are arguing one thing, everyone else another...
You are saying they are illegal. I am saying they aren't dangerous.

Comparing fog lights to main beams is unfair. Headlight main beams are designed to illuminate the road ahead and to the left for several hundred meters. The beams are focused specifically to do this. Fog lights are less accurately focused and aimed to the ground and verge of the road.
Also I dont understand the wet roads issue. Surely the larger an area a light is spread out the less the glare? a smaller area (the light itself) pointed forwards will cause more glare than the light pointed down, loosing intensity and ten reflecting back up over a large area.

Jomcc

Thanks Highdef for your explanation.
I understand that it is illegal for them to be turned on, and for that reason, my question did not refer to that side of things. I simply was wondering how it is of such annoyance to some people and not as to why they should be on or off. As you put it, the story ends there........but that was not what I asked.
It now makes sense that if they are incorrectly alligned, they will cause danger to oncoming traffic............as of course do incorrectly alligned dipped beams.
My understanding of fog lamps was that they should give a wide low beam of light which prevent the driver from being dazzled by the fog or snow. I was of the opinion that fog lamps should be used instead of full or dipped beam. If weather is good enough for dipped beam, foglamps are not required. This is the reason for my confusion as to how they should not dazzle oncoming drivers. Someone mentioned earlier about gardai being told that fog lamps were not on........it was spotlights. Surely these would be much worse to have on meeting oncoming traffic.

highdef

The fact that fog lights are angled less accurately can often be a main reason for the problems they cause. If they are are angled to high, they will cause excessive glare straight into the oncoming driver's eyes, like full beams....that would be cars of the older Micra and Fiesta type, as mentioned before. If they are angled lower, as they are supposed to be, they can very often cause excessive glare when the roads are wet and it's dark. With the lights themselves being so close to ground, the amount of light which is reflected is much greater than that of a dipped headlights. And because it it reflected off uneven and wet ground, the light is more scattered.
The intensity of light radiating from a point source (in this case fog lights) is inversely proportional to the square of the distance from the source; so an object (the road) twice as far away, receives only one-quarter the energy (in the same time period). So therefore the amount of light reflected off a wet road from fog lights is usually much greater than those of dipped headlights due to the distance the light has to travel from the light source to the point of reflection.

pah

highdef wrote: »

But in a nutshell, Jomcc, the actual problem is literally that it is ILLEGAL to have them on when they should not be on....end of story.

well....not exactly

Prosecutions are taken under section 51(a) of the road traffic act

“Driving without reasonable consideration".

51A. (1) A person shall not drive a vehicle in a public place without reasonable consideration for other persons using the place.


There is no specific offence for driving while using fog lights when there is no fog, so it is not illegal in itself.

Eru

Jomcc wrote: »

Can anyone please explain how it annoys people so much. I could fully understand the fact that rear fog lights being left on annoys people but am lost as to how people have problem with front ones being left on.

Back ones while mildly annoying don't actually effect me as do some of the milder fog lights however the bright bright front fogs bother me for one simple reason:

Bright lights beaming straight into my eyes causes a migraine attack. Bright lights like that are one of my triggers. Its my cross to bear but there it is. Its especially bad when a car behind me has them on.

Zambia

We have a law against them being used incorrectly here for the reasons stated below

Note the below is not Irish legislation

Using fog lights
Front fog lights are designed to better illuminate the road in fog, snowfall, rainstorms or dust clouds. They can be recognised by the narrow pattern of light emitted.
Road Rule 217 states that drivers must not use front or rear fog lights unless driving in fog or other hazardous weather conditions that cause reduced visibility.
Fog lights cannot be accidentally switched on. They must be switched on separate from the main and dipped beam head lights.

bofh666ie

Eru wrote: »

Bright lights beaming straight into my eyes causes a migraine attack. Bright lights like that are one of my triggers. Its my cross to bear but there it is. Its especially bad when a car behind me has them on.

Ugh, you don't want to be driving in West Cork at night then, where the drivers like to give you a good few seconds of full-beam before they remember that there was something they forgot to do... And, yes, some 'tards follow with high-beams, too.
Gives me a headache the odd night.