Cllr fined for throwing paint at Mary Harney

Twigster

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0225/harneym.html

Ms Minihan refused to make a payment to a charity nominated by Ms Harney and said she would only make a contribution to Cherry Orchard Hospital.
The judge said it was not for her to choose the charity and instead imposed a two-month suspended sentence. Ms Minihan also refused to do community service, so Judge Watkin imposed a fine on the assault charge.

I don't want to start a thread on what was done, whether or not it was right or wrong.
My question is since when do criminals have a choice of what their sentence should be? Does the judge ask the person what they'd prefer to do? I'd think that if the judge passed a sentence if someone refused to carry out they should be held in contempt of court and jailed, not just given a fine.

yoyo

Proper order too. Have no time for Harney either, certainly not the best "minister for health" but no one deserves to be treated like that, and I agree throwing paint at someone is assault in protest or otherwise,

Nick

Chuchoter

And rightly so. I might not like Mary Harney but she didn't deserve paint thrown at her. The whole thing was just childish.

whoopdedoo

fat Cnut!!

should have been blood spilled and not paint!!

Pauleta

I see the guilty female got an ovation from her left wing loony republican mates when she left court. It shows the far left condone violence.

super_furry

Pauleta wrote: »

I see the guilty female got an ovation from her left wing loony republican mates when she left court. It shows the far left condone violence.

No, it shows that fringe Republicans are nutters.

whoopdedoo

Pauleta wrote: »

I see the guilty female got an ovation from her left wing loony republican mates when she left court. It shows the far left condone violence.

will a stop, a bullet would be too good for harney the witch!!! fair played to her and her supporters

landsleaving

Pauleta wrote: »

I see the guilty female got an ovation from her left wing loony republican mates when she left court. It shows the far left condone violence.

We must do what is necessary to create a classless society, da comrade?

Twigster

whoopdedoo wrote: »

will a stop, a bullet would be too good for harney the witch!!! fair played to her and her supporters

Did you not read the post? what i said was, what gives someone convicted of a criminal offense the right to refuse a certain punishment.

Lawrence1895

I wonder, if there would have been the same outcry, if some Nazi sc** would have attacked Gerry Adams or Joe Higgins.

I admit, I'm exaggerating a bit, but in my opinion, Louise's political belief draw some more attention onto the case.

Pauleta

Lars1916 wrote: »

I wonder, if there would have been the same outcry, if some Nazi sc** would have attacked Gerry Adams or Joe Higgins.

I admit, I'm exaggerating a bit, but in my opinion, Louise's political belief draw some more attention onto the case.

There would of been more outrage if it was a far-right group than a far-left group. Far right groups are not tolerated in Ireland and rightly so but for some reason the far left are.

galwayrush

No time for either of those people...

Lawrence1895

Pauleta wrote: »

There would of been more outrage if it was a far-right group than a far-left group. Far right groups are not tolerated in Ireland and rightly so but for some reason the far left are.

The non-existence of far right groups was one reason for me to choose Ireland when I left Germany 6.5 years ago.

But on the other hand, I still think, parties like Sinn Fein are under some kind of severe scrutiny from the Media...sometimes deserved, but sometimes not

biscuiteater

Twigster wrote: »

My question is since when do criminals have a choice of what their sentence should be? Does the judge ask the person what they'd prefer to do? .

i think you'll only get that kind of choice if you've got a good job, bet if she had no job or looked like she was from a poor background it would have been a different story

Bosco boy

whoopdedoo wrote: »

will a stop, a bullet would be too good for harney the witch!!! fair played to her and her supporters

I guess she'll have to resign her seat in the council now that she is a convicted criminal! Tough girl the day it happened, quite girl today!

WindSock

I wonder if she would have prosecuted had the woman thrown a pie in her face instead?

FlutterinBantam

Bint should have been sent to the chokey.

That might soften her cough.

karma_

WindSock wrote: »

I wonder if she would have prosecuted had the woman thrown a pie in her face instead?

The pie would never have made it.

karma_

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Bint should have been sent to the chokey.

That might soften her cough.

You would know all about that.

loobylou

When a pensioner threw eggs (far more dangerous) at AIB chairman Dermot Gleeson he was feted as a national hero.
Whats different here?

mikemac

loobylou wrote: »

When a pensioner threw eggs (far more dangerous) at AIB chairman Dermot Gleeson he was feted as a national hero.
Whats different here?

No he wasn't.
And he wasn't some poor pensioner struggling to survive, just a disgruntled shareholder

He invested his money in bank shares and lost a lot of it.
Never heard of spreading the risk it seems

Shelga

She should have been given a month in prison and made to pay all court costs. What an utter idiot.

loobylou

feelingstressed wrote: »

No he wasn't.
And he wasn't some poor pensioner struggling to survive, just a disgruntled shareholder

OK then, an elderly disgruntled shareholder assaulted a banker. He was interviewed (sympathetically) by any number of radio stations, appeared on RTE news, pictured in newspapers, etc.
He wasn't charged with anything and many people seemed to admire his behaviour.
How is what he did different to what this Minihan person did?

major bill

Twigster wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0225/harneym.html



I don't want to start a thread on what was done, whether or not it was right or wrong.
My question is since when do criminals have a choice of what their sentence should be? Does the judge ask the person what they'd prefer to do? I'd think that if the judge passed a sentence if someone refused to carry out they should be held in contempt of court and jailed, not just given a fine.

first off she is not a criminal....thrown paint at someone is hardly a criminal offence..to think that she got a two year suspended sentence just shows how laughable the justice system is in this country. How many people have died in this country from inadequate government health ministers??

:rolleyes: jesus wept

panda100

I've been working in the disability sector for the last few years,on the front line of the HSE, and I for one was delighted when I heared about the paint attack on Harney. She completely and utterly deserved that 5 seconds of discomfort for what she has inflicted on the people of Ireland.

The councilwomen was dead right to refuse to give the money to a charity of Harney's choice. I can't believe people are supporting she of the €410 haircut who earned more in her once off retirement bonus then a disability support worker does in €15 years working with the HSE.

Bosco boy

loobylou wrote: »

OK then, an elderly disgruntled shareholder assaulted a banker. He was interviewed (sympathetically) by any number of radio stations, appeared on RTE news, pictured in newspapers, etc.
He wasn't charged with anything and many people seemed to admire his behaviour.
How is what he did different to what this Minihan person did?

The difference is the banker didn't make a complaint!

FlutterinBantam

major bill wrote: »

first off she is not a criminal....thrown paint at someone is hardly a criminal offence..to think that she got a two year suspended sentence just shows how laughable the justice system is in this country. How many people have died in this country from inadequate government health ministers??

:rolleyes: jesus wept

Saw her coming out of court, with a boneheaded gimp,with a dodgy haircut, trying to rise applause by her side.

God help us all if people like that ever get near power.

Idiots who have no idea where responsibility or democracy even begins.

epgc3fyqirnbsx

major bill wrote: »

first off she is not a criminal....thrown paint at someone is hardly a criminal offence..to think that she got a two year suspended sentence just shows how laughable the justice system is in this country. How many people have died in this country from inadequate government health ministers??

:rolleyes: jesus wept

Of course it's a criminal offence, it's the definition of assualt, you can't change that just ti appease some people who feel aggrieved.
Should someone throw paint, or any object or liquid, at you then it is assault. It is the exact same for Harney.

This lady chose to assault someone as a form of protest. She went in with her eyes open and as such deserves a punishment. This is common sense, justice should be blind

major bill

Raiden Cuddly Ink wrote: »

Of course it's a criminal offence, it's the definition of assualt, you can't change that just ti appease some people who feel aggrieved.
Should someone throw paint, or any object or liquid, at you then it is assault. It is the exact same for Harney.

This lady chose to assault someone as a form of protest. She went in with her eyes open and as such deserves a punishment. This is common sense, justice should be blind

If I threw paint at a person on the street i wouldnt be fined over 1500 and giving a two year suspended sentence..justice in this case wasnt blind!!!

Sonnenblumen

panda100 wrote: »

I've been working in the disability sector for the last few years,on the front line of the HSE, and I for one was delighted when I heared about the paint attack on Harney. She completely and utterly deserved that 5 seconds of discomfort for what she has inflicted on the people of Ireland.

The councilwomen was dead right to refuse to give the money to a charity of Harney's choice. I can't believe people are supporting she of the €410 haircut who earned more in her once off retirement bonus then a disability support worker does in €15 years working with the HSE.

If reports are anything to go by, HSE workers are hardly in any position to complain. Afterall, more of them earn more money than more people throughout Ireland and work less for the privilege.

HSE should be before a court!:mad:

Dudess

Viewing Mary Harney as solely responsible for the problems in the health service is ridiculous. The HSE is overcrowded with administrators in permanent jobs - she couldn't just fire them; consultants refused to take pay cuts; the service was in an awful state before she was appointed. She has her role to play but "She's minister for health, therefore everything's her fault" is plain lazy.

That protestor behaved like a petulant child - and I am FAR from a leftie basher, and while I'm not a fan of SF, I'm not on the "Let's slate everything vaguely republican" bandwagon either.

wyndhurst

major bill wrote: »

first off she is not a criminal....thrown paint at someone is hardly a criminal offence..to think that she got a two year suspended sentence just shows how laughable the justice system is in this country. How many people have died in this country from inadequate government health ministers??

:rolleyes: jesus wept

She is a convicted criminal and rightly so.

The judge let himself down very badly.

Topper Harley01

panda100 wrote: »

I've been working in the disability sector for the last few years,on the front line of the HSE, and I for one was delighted when I heared about the paint attack on Harney. She completely and utterly deserved that 5 seconds of discomfort for what she has inflicted on the people of Ireland.

The councilwomen was dead right to refuse to give the money to a charity of Harney's choice. I can't believe people are supporting she of the €410 haircut who earned more in her once off retirement bonus then a disability support worker does in €15 years working with the HSE.

It might be worth pointing out that Minehan insisted on pleading not guilty, thus wasting thousands in taxpayers money. With that contempt for public funds, she would give Harney a run for her money.

So the moral of the story is.....two thick knackers don't make a right.

major bill

wyndhurst wrote: »

She is a convicted criminal and rightly so.

The judge let himself down very badly.

maybe you should take a stroll up to the tallaght courts some day and sit in on the cases......the judge in her case was very harsh!!

wyndhurst

major bill wrote: »

maybe you should take a stroll up to the tallaght courts some day and sit in on the cases......the judge in her case was very harsh!!

Not talking about the sentence. Referring to the fact that he allowed the court to be dictated to by the criminal. (The actual thread topic...)

orourkeda

does she qualify for a darwin award

epgc3fyqirnbsx

major bill wrote: »

If I threw paint at a person on the street i wouldnt be fined over 1500 and giving a two year suspended sentence..justice in this case wasnt blind!!!

Well that may be a good point, I'd like to look at similar cases and read the judgements though.
My point was that she was rightly guillty of an assault

shaneybaby

major bill wrote: »

If I threw paint at a person on the street i wouldnt be fined over 1500 and giving a two year suspended sentence..justice in this case wasnt blind!!!

True, if it was just a random aassault like that on a street it would most definitely have been a custodial sentence, the fact she linked it to a political process probably saved her bacon.

She actually got off lightly with a community service order and a donation to charity. Not the judge's fault she refused them both.

People are referring to the judge as a "he", in fact it's a she. (Judge Ann Watkins)

major bill

shaneybaby wrote: »

True, if it was just a random aassault like that on a street it would most definitely have been a custodial sentence, the fact she linked it to a political process probably saved her bacon.

She actually got off lightly with a community service order and a donation to charity. Not the judge's fault she refused them both.

People are referring to the judge as a "he", in fact it's a she. (Judge Ann Watkins)

id doubt it would have been a custodial if it happened on the street!!.

id hate to see you as a judge:pac:

gonedrinking

shaneybaby wrote: »

People are referring to the judge as a "he", in fact it's a she. (Judge Ann Watkins)

Theres the problem right there then. If the defendant had of been a male and he refused to do community service, he would of been charged with contempt of court and ordered to spend a night in the cells.

Judge Ann Watkins should be investigated over this, there are just too many corrupt and incompetent judges in Ireland today to just let another one slide by.

Daegerty

I don't condone throwing paint at the likes of Mary Harney at all. If you are going to put yourself through the trouble of throwing something at her why not let it be a bucket of good strong dark yellow piss?

Dangerous Man

Christ almighty - people need to wake the fuck up - and quick. We all know the cllr in question was technically wrong but all this hand-wringing about 'violence' is ludicrous. Mary Harney and her government have wrought immense economic violence on this country. They have ruined, and continue to ruin lives through their insane policies. Jesus Christ, it's not wonder we're getting fucked the way we are when people are actually sympathizing with someone like Harney.

Remember your sympathy when your grandmother is lying on a trolley in some hospital ward for two days.

Remember your sympathy when people who can afford to can walk into one of our wonderful new private hospitals and get treatment because they can afford it - but you can't.

Remember your sympathy when someone really close has lost their job as direct result of this government's incompetence.

Remember your sympathy when a relative hugs you at the airport because they have to leave the country to get a job.

They deserve more than fucking paint.

heyjude

Its interesting to compare the severity of the punishment(2 year suspended prison sentence and €1500 fine) in this case for throwing paint on someone, with the lack of prosecution and punishment of a senior politician alleged to have committed perjury. Indeed, inaccuracies/lies in the testimony of several politicians to the tribunals doesn't seem to have resulted in any action either.

It will also be interesting to note whether the prosecuting authorities show the same zeal for criminal convictions and tough punishments, if they ever discover wrongdoing in any of the banks. Hopefully they'll use the punishment in this case as a yardstick, in which case, any fraud involving millions would hopefully attract very lengthy prison sentences and huge fines.

Daegerty

heyjude wrote: »

It will also be interesting to note whether the prosecuting authorities show the same zeal for criminal convictions and tough punishments, if they ever discover wrongdoing in any of the banks. Hopefully they'll use the punishment in this case as a yardstick, in which case, any fraud involving millions would hopefully attract very lengthy prison sentences and huge fines.

One rule for them, one rule for us. Unfortunately

as for the Bond holders, they don't need to concern themselves with such silly things as rules.

AskMyChocolate

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Saw her coming out of court, with a boneheaded gimp,with a dodgy haircut, trying to rise applause by her side.

God help us all if people like that ever get near power.

Idiots who have no idea where responsibility or democracy even begins.

No doubt, you feel the same way about the two Gardai that jointly physically assaulted, far more seriously, the elderly peaceful protestor outside the Dail and knocked him to the ground when he was protesting the IMF bailout. How long do you think they should spend in the "chokey" on a pro-rata basis?

AskMyChocolate

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Bint should have been sent to the chokey.

That might soften her cough.

It would be interesting to know how long you think the FG TD who threatened and intimidated a junior Garda, for trying to take his keys off him when he attempted to drive drunk, should be sent to chokey for ? or the FF TD who broke a nurse's leg in four places while driving drunk and then attempted to flee the scene?

Dudess

Dangerous Man wrote: »

Christ almighty - people need to wake the fuck up - and quick. We all know the cllr in question was technically wrong but all this hand-wringing about 'violence' is ludicrous. Mary Harney and her government have wrought immense economic violence on this country. They have ruined, and continue to ruin lives through their insane policies. Jesus Christ, it's not wonder we're getting fucked the way we are when people are actually sympathizing with someone like Harney.

Not so much sympathy for her as seeing the protestor as a childish twat. No way is Harney the most corrupt of the politicians either, and I still think the "evil bitch" sh1te directed at her is idiotic - as if her approach was "Muhahahahahah! I shall keeeeell all the sick people!" The odds were stacked against her from day one when she took the poisoned chalice of health minister portfolio.
I never voted FF/PDs in my life by the way...

colly10

major bill wrote: »

If I threw paint at a person on the street i wouldnt be fined over 1500 and giving a two year suspended sentence..justice in this case wasnt blind!!!

If I walked down the street tomorrow and threw a bucket of paint over a passer by I would be shocked if I didn't get a fine like that, driving without insurance is a fine of about 1000 last time I checked (unless your out of work) and i'd see assault (and it is assault) as much worse.

I you were standing there and some random gob****e decided to throw a bucket of paint over ye should ye just be expected to get over it?

colly10

Dangerous Man wrote: »

Christ almighty - people need to wake the fuck up - and quick. We all know the cllr in question was technically wrong but all this hand-wringing about 'violence' is ludicrous. Mary Harney and her government have wrought immense economic violence on this country. They have ruined, and continue to ruin lives through their insane policies. Jesus Christ, it's not wonder we're getting fucked the way we are when people are actually sympathizing with someone like Harney.

Remember your sympathy when your grandmother is lying on a trolley in some hospital ward for two days.

Remember your sympathy when people who can afford to can walk into one of our wonderful new private hospitals and get treatment because they can afford it - but you can't.

Remember your sympathy when someone really close has lost their job as direct result of this government's incompetence.

Remember your sympathy when a relative hugs you at the airport because they have to leave the country to get a job.

They deserve more than fucking paint.

So she didn't do a good job, should we stone her to death or show a bit of mercy and call in the firing squad for a quick ending.

Fools being let away with doing what they like is not good for the country, it was the correct judgement. It was nothing but a publicity stunt and i'm sure it won her a few votes from some. I heard her on the radio when she was interviewed about the incident and she didn't do herself any favours, pleading not guilty then refusing to give to the chosen charity says all ye need to know about her really, serious attitude problem

Jesus Wept

major bill wrote: »

first off she is not a criminal....thrown paint at someone is hardly a criminal offence

I hope you are just trolling and that you're post isn't actually this stupid.

mikemac

By fighting the case she cost the State a lot of money.
Nothing wrong with fighting cases of course but she was clearly guilty, she was crowing on Joe Duffy about it after it happened.

Pure publicity stunt to raise her profile.
She's right up with there with Joan Collins from PBP for publicity stunts