SBS on stand by...

elius

Just seen it on sky news the sbs are on stand buy to rescue stranded Britons in Libya.. Wonder how true it is?

Fratton Fred

elius wrote: »

Just seen it on sky news the sbs are on stand buy to rescue stranded Britons in Libya.. Wonder how true it is?

Radio four mentioned the SAS and the para special forces support group. HMS Cumberland is awaiting permission to dock and HMS York is en route.

I would imagine this is pretty normal and other countries have done the same. Reports this morning suggest Tripoli airport is descending into chaos so the UNSC may look to put a force in to secure it.

There was a Professor from Dublin interviewed on BBC radio four who had made it to Gatwick. Her accounts were pretty scary.

who the fug

Am I the only one who turn off the news at the mention of SBS / SAS as you know what follows is bollicks

elius

who the fug wrote: »

Am I the only one who turn off the news at the mention of SBS / SAS as you know what follows is bollicks

Most time's i would agree but given the political uncertain i wouldn't be so shore. The Middle east is awfully un-staple at the mo.

Fratton Fred

who the fug wrote: »

Am I the only one who turn off the news at the mention of SBS / SAS as you know what follows is bollicks

Extracting British citizens from situations like this, at short notice, is a fundamental role for both, so I doubt very much that it is crap.

There is also the added factor of sending a clear message that the UK isnt sitting on its hands.

RMD

who the fug wrote: »

Am I the only one who turn off the news at the mention of SBS / SAS as you know what follows is bollicks

I wouldn't be surprised at all, what's going on there is a lot more serious than what's being reported here. As said, there's no group better prepared for a rapid extraction at the BA's disposal than the SAS / SBS.

BrianD

The SBS/SAS are probably best placed to extract people from the remote areas of Libya. These areas will probably have an airstrip of some sort but ground security may be uncertain.

You send in your SAS helicopter and the troops can provide local security for the extraction in the event it's needed. It just so happens that the SAS are best trained to this.

I doubt of the Brits want to send a message to anybody. They are just extracting their nationals. I trust they'll send them or their employers a bill for services rendered.

PatsytheNazi

who the fug wrote: »

Am I the only one who turn off the news at the mention of SBS / SAS as you know what follows is bollicks

My own thoughts, Bravo Two Zero fiasco in the making.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Extracting British citizens from situations like this, at short notice, is a fundamental role for both, so I doubt very much that it is crap.

There is also the added factor of sending a clear message that the UK isnt sitting on its hands.

I think they would make the situation vastly worse for the British citizen's there. Britain because of Iraq and it's history in the middle east etc, Britain is not too populiar over there at the best of times. I could see an awful bloodbath of British civilians or anyone else in the vicinity, if the trigger happy supporters of Gidaffi go at it with the trigger happy SBS and Parachute regiment etc

RMD

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

My own thoughts, Bravo Two Zero fiasco in the making.


I think they would make the situation vastly worse for the British citizen's there. Britain because of Iraq and it's history in the middle east etc, Britain is not too populiar over there at the best of times. I could see an awful bloodbath of British civilians or anyone else in the vicinity, if the trigger happy supporters of Gidaffi go at it with the trigger happy SBS and Parachute regiment etc

The way Gaddafi is acting right if he hears the SAS / SBS / Para 1 (SFSG) are on the way in,I wouldn't be surprised if he'll take that very seriously and considering he basically sees a lot of his soldiers of "expendable" I wouldn't rule out a full scale shootout. Thing is though, in a firefight between some standard Libyan soldiers and a group of special forces there's only going to be one winner unless the Brits are drastically out numbered.

danbohan

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Extracting British citizens from situations like this, at short notice, is a fundamental role for both, so I doubt very much that it is crap.

There is also the added factor of sending a clear message that the UK isnt sitting on its hands.

wonder if they are sending in the carriers , ogh i forgot they dont have any , better ask the Indians

Fratton Fred

RMD wrote: »

The way Gaddafi is acting right if he hears the SAS / SBS / Para 1 (SFSG) are on the way in,I wouldn't be surprised if he'll take that very seriously and considering he basically sees a lot of his soldiers of "expendable" I wouldn't rule out a full scale shootout. Thing is though, in a firefight between some standard Libyan soldiers and a group of special forces there's only going to be one winner unless the Brits are drastically out numbered.

From what I heard this morning, the big concern seems to be the desert compounds where a lot of Brits are working for oil companies. I would imagine the sas would be used to secure these rather than a full scale punch up in Tripoli.

I would guess Tripoli airport would be a much bigger international thing. But I would agree, this could get messy.

Fratton Fred

danbohan wrote: »

wonder if they are sending in the carriers , ogh i forgot they dont have any , better ask the Indians

You're a bit late Dan, its already been done

But yeah, it does call that decision into question. Still, I guess if air cover was needed, it won't take ling to get a few typhoons to Akrotiri or Malta.

RMD

Fratton Fred wrote: »

From what I heard this morning, the big concern seems to be the desert compounds where a lot of Brits are working for oil companies. I would imagine the sas would be used to secure these rather than a full scale punch up in Tripoli.

I would guess Tripoli airport would be a much bigger international thing. But I would agree, this could get messy.

Ye I saw that, there was a group of British oil workers trapped in the desert countryside, the army barracks beside them had been bombed and looters with machetes had already tried to break into their compound. Problem is, I don't see how the SAS can get them without it escalating into full scale war, I doubt Gaddafi would be to keen on British special forces going through the country considering his history of supporting the PIRA. Anyone know if HMS Cumberland / York has helicopter launch capabilities, the only way I can see them rescuing those trapped in the compounds is a heli extraction.

PatsytheNazi

RMD wrote: »

Ye I saw that, there was a group of British oil workers trapped in the desert countryside, the army barracks beside them had been bombed and looters with machetes had already tried to break into their compound. Problem is, I don't see how the SAS can get them without it escalating into full scale war, I doubt Gaddafi would be to keen on British special forces going through the country considering his history of supporting the PIRA. Anyone know if HMS Cumberland / York has helicopter launch capabilities, the only way I can see them rescuing those trapped in the compounds is a heli extraction.

I agree with you, unless the British civilians are in some very empty area near the Eygptian border or something, he or his cronyies are not going to take kindly to what they would see as a " British invasion".

Anyway, Britain and Gaddafi have been military friends for a while now. Sky News had a discussion that much of the military hardware been used by his forces/supporters were sold to him by you know who
Britain to help rebuild Gaddafi's military

http://news.scotsman.com/world/Britain-to-help-rebuild-Gaddafis.2514427.jp

Fratton Fred

RMD wrote: »

Ye I saw that, there was a group of British oil workers trapped in the desert countryside, the army barracks beside them had been bombed and looters with machetes had already tried to break into their compound. Problem is, I don't see how the SAS can get them without it escalating into full scale war, I doubt Gaddafi would be to keen on British special forces going through the country considering his history of supporting the PIRA. Anyone know if HMS Cumberland / York has helicopter launch capabilities, the only way I can see them rescuing those trapped in the compounds is a heli extraction.

I would guess they both carry a lynx helicopter.

who the fug

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I would guess they both carry a lynx helicopter.

According to Wiki x 2 per vessel

LondonIrish90

danbohan wrote: »

wonder if they are sending in the carriers , ogh i forgot they dont have any , better ask the Indians

Not really a problem in this situation. If it became that serious, then no European military power would hesitate to let British Typhoons use their air bases. After all, who would want to have an aggressive and unpredictable military just across the mediterranean should they become hostile to us?

who the fug

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

Not really a problem in this situation. If it became that serious, then no European military power would hesitate to let British Typhoons use their air bases. After all, who would want to have an aggressive and unpredictable military just across the mediterranean should they become hostile to us?

Off the Top of my head

France Spain Italy , and any number of countries who reckon they could steal arms contracts off the UK

LondonIrish90

who the fug wrote: »

Off the Top of my head

France Spain Italy , and any number of countries who reckon they could steal arms contracts off the UK

No, not with Gaddafi in charge. Its even more in their interests to remove him should his forces threaten warfare on a larger, possibly regional scare due to the unpredictable nature of the man and their proximity to his country.

RMD

who the fug wrote: »

Off the Top of my head

France Spain Italy , and any number of countries who reckon they could steal arms contracts off the UK

No country in their right mind would want to arm Gaddafi if he started acting as an aggressor towards Europe.

Savage93

elius wrote: »

Just seen it on sky news the sbs are on stand buy to rescue stranded Britons in Libya.. Wonder how true it is?

Are they going to rescue all British citizens or just the SAS boys who are over there training Gadaffi's people since just after the Lockerbie bomber was released????????:D:D:D

Steyr

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

were sold to him by you know who

What equipment does he have thats of UK Origins??

Fratton Fred

Steyr wrote: »

What equipment does he have thats of UK Origins??

His Bentley?

who the fug

Fratton Fred wrote: »

His Bentley?

Is it a proper Bentley or a rebadged Volkswagen

BlaasForRafa

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

I agree with you, unless the British civilians are in some very empty area near the Eygptian border or something, he or his cronyies are not going to take kindly to what they would see as a " British invasion".

Anyway, Britain and Gaddafi have been military friends for a while now. Sky News had a discussion that much of the military hardware been used by his forces/supporters were sold to him by you know who
Britain to help rebuild Gaddafi's military

http://news.scotsman.com/world/Britain-to-help-rebuild-Gaddafis.2514427.jp

If you've got any ACTUAL proof that britain supplied arms to Libya then please supply it, otherwise all you have is idle speculation. From what I've seen of the Libyan forces its been mostly Soviet/Chinese equipment thats been used.

elius

Savage93 wrote: »

Are they going to rescue all British citizens or just the SAS boys who are over there training Gadaffi's people since just after the Lockerbie bomber was released????????:D:D:D

Source?

Fratton Fred

who the fug wrote: »

Is it a proper Bentley or a rebadged Volkswagen

Whatever it is, I'm sure its better than my Rolls Canardly.:)

PatsytheNazi

Steyr wrote: »

What equipment does he have thats of UK Origins??

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

If you've got any ACTUAL proof that britain supplied arms to Libya then please supply it, otherwise all you have is idle speculation. From what I've seen of the Libyan forces its been mostly Soviet/Chinese equipment thats been used.

:rolleyes: ' Yawn '.......As per the link supplied -

• Blair to offer Libya military aid in return for declaring WMDs
• Deal may include training Libyan cadets and MOD expert advice
• Offer puts UK firms in pole position to sell arms to Libya

PatsytheNazi

elius wrote: »

Source?

SAS trains Libyan troops - The SAS has been ordered by the Government to train Libyan special forces
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/onthefrontline/6176808/SAS-trains-Libyan-troops.html

Ping Chow Chi

To be fair, offering military training in exchange for them to giving up their WMD program is a bit of a bargin.

RMD

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

:rolleyes: ' Yawn '.......As per the link supplied -

• Blair to offer Libya military aid in return for declaring WMDs
• Deal may include training Libyan cadets and MOD expert advice
• Offer puts UK firms in pole position to sell arms to Libya

The link you supplied though any stated what will happen if the deal is agreed, it doesn't state that it did happen. When I looked for a source of the Brits arming Libyan forces I couldn't find anything, the only European equipment I could find which the Libyans had was a couple of Belgium small arms and 2 French missile systems, one AT and one AA. The rest of the equipment was all of Russian and Brazilian origin, except for a 105mm American Howitzer.

BlaasForRafa

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

:rolleyes: ' Yawn '.......As per the link supplied -

• Blair to offer Libya military aid in return for declaring WMDs
• Deal may include training Libyan cadets and MOD expert advice
• Offer puts UK firms in pole position to sell arms to Libya

"to offer"
"may"
"in pole position"

So NO in other words. No actual arms have been supplied, I asked for confirmation as your link was useless speculation and thats the best you can do? Pathetic.

If your going to use "rolleyes" you might want to make sure you have a basis to when you quite clearly don't.

BigDuffman

I wonder why the are SBS getting the Nod over SAS for this one?

PatsytheNazi

RMD wrote: »

The link you supplied though any stated what will happen if the deal is agreed, it doesn't state that it did happen. When I looked for a source of the Brits arming Libyan forces I couldn't find anything, the only European equipment I could find which the Libyans had was a couple of Belgium small arms and 2 French missile systems, one AT and one AA. The rest of the equipment was all of Russian and Brazilian origin, except for a 105mm American Howitzer.

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

"to offer"
"may"
"in pole position"

So NO in other words. No actual arms have been supplied, I asked for confirmation as your link was useless speculation and thats the best you can do? Pathetic.

If your going to use "rolleyes" you might want to make sure you have a basis to when you quite clearly don't.

The children have to be spoon fed :rolleyes:

The British government has approved the sale to Libya of a wide range of equipment for use against civilians. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/20/british-crowd-control-equipment-libya

UK firm defends Libya military sales http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/21/uk-firm-defends-libya-military-sales

OS119

BigDuffman wrote: »

I wonder why the are SBS getting the Nod over SAS for this one?

normal makey-uppy press crap. they don't know so they say 'SAS' to make themselves sound informed and 'in the loop'. most journalists - even the 'defence' corresponents, couldn't tell the difference between the SBS and the Air Cadets.

both units come under Director Special Forces and he will alot whatever sub-units are available and to hand - either would be as capable as the other, i suppose its more likely that it'll be SAS purely because they're a bigger unit than SBS, and therefore more (statisticly) likely to be the high readiness unit than SBS.

RMD

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

The children have to be spoon fed :rolleyes:

Patsy I'm not treating you or your argument with any condescending bull**** so I'd appreciate is you showed me the same respect I'm showing you. If you can't be part of a debate without acting like a wanker there's no point in arguing.

BlaasForRafa

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

The children have to be spoon fed :rolleyes:

The British government has approved the sale to Libya of a wide range of equipment for use against civilians. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/20/british-crowd-control-equipment-libya

UK firm defends Libya military sales http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/21/uk-firm-defends-libya-military-sales

the operative word in the first link being "APPROVED".

the second is about a bunch of poxy police vans, not "arms".

As usual, specious non-information.

PatsytheNazi

RMD wrote: »

Patsy I'm not treating you or your argument with any condescending bull**** so I'd appreciate is you showed me the same respect I'm showing you. If you can't be part of a debate without acting like a wanker there's no point in arguing.

Apologies RMD, the replies were mainly intended for Blaas, I shouldn't have included you, who is been his usual self.

elius

Surely the reason the sbs would go in is the close protection of britons stranded there. Its getting worse out there by the minute.. There are still some 200+ stranded.

Dogwatch

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

SAS trains Libyan troops - The SAS has been ordered by the Government to train Libyan special forces
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/onthefrontline/6176808/SAS-trains-Libyan-troops.html

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

The children have to be spoon fed :rolleyes:

The British government has approved the sale to Libya of a wide range of equipment for use against civilians. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/20/british-crowd-control-equipment-libya

UK firm defends Libya military sales http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/21/uk-firm-defends-libya-military-sales

OH come on patsy. Since when is the Guardian such a reliable source. It is as much use as Wiki.

I expected better from you.

Utrinque Paratus

elius wrote: »

Surely the reason the sbs would go in is the close protection of britons stranded there. Its getting worse out there by the minute.. There are still some 200+ stranded.

Its a complex situation, if they send a rescue party to the oil workers Gaddafi will claim Libya is under attack from the west and it could get him sympathy from those who are on the fence and pogroms against westeners still out there by his forces.

Its best to wait and see how the situation plays out.


This is potentially the start of a tribal civil war out there.

Utrinque Paratus

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

The children have to be spoon fed :rolleyes:

The British government has approved the sale to Libya of a wide range of equipment for use against civilians. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/20/british-crowd-control-equipment-libya

UK firm defends Libya military sales http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/21/uk-firm-defends-libya-military-sales

Many countries have sold arms to Libya, not just the UK.Gaddafi is better then Libya falling to Islamic extremists in a civil war.

http://www.expatica.com/es/news/spanish-news/ngos-urge-spain-to-halt-arms-sales-to-libya_132473.html


Spain sold arms to Libya, including planes and equipment, worth 7.0 million euros ($9.6 million) in the first half of 2010, according to figures quoted by the group of NGOs, which also includes Oxfam and Greenpeace.

Utrinque Paratus

Seems British, US and French military advisors are supporting the rebels.

US, British and French military advisers have arrived in Cyrenaica, Libya's eastern breakaway province, debkafile's military sources report exclusively. This is the first time America and Europe have intervened militarily in any of the popular upheavals rolling through the Middle East since Tunisia's Jasmine Revolution in early January. The advisers, including intelligence officers, were dropped from warships and missile boats at the coastal towns of Benghazi and Tobruk Thursday Feb. 24, for a threefold mission:


1. To help the revolutionary committees controlling eastern Libyan establish government frameworks for supplying two million inhabitants with basic services and commodities;

2. To organize them into paramilitary units, teach them how to use the weapons they captured from Libyan army facilities, help them restore law and order on the streets and train them to fight Muammar Qaddafi's combat units coming to retake Cyrenaica.
3. The prepare infrastructure for the intake of additional foreign troops. Egyptian units are among those under consideration.


http://www.debka.com/article/20708/


I did find it odd that Libyas special forces were defeated according to reports by members of the public who had got hold of weapons.

The warship landing would also tie in with claims of potential SBS deployment.

Utrinque Paratus

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/5/20110224/tuk-libya-sbs-on-stand-by-for-rescue-mis-45dbed5.html


Security sources have told Sky that the Special Boat Service (SBS) had already forward mounted liaison officers to a Mediterranean location, which Sky will not reveal, as part of the preparations to rescue an estimated 170 people unable to reach Tripoli where RAF

Savage93

Have you not been following news, Accuracy International were over there trying to flog sniper rifles, bull**** cover up story about them being "non firing demonstrators" HA HA

Savage93

elius wrote: »

Source?

Guardian, Telegraph around sept/oct 2010:D:D

Savage93

BigDuffman wrote: »

I wonder why the are SBS getting the Nod over SAS for this one?

cos the SAS need rescuing, HA HA:D:D:D:D:D

Dogwatch

Savage93 wrote: »

Guardian, Telegraph around sept/oct 2010:D:D

Yet another poster who believes newspapers print the truth.

Wise up gentlemen. Research and quote from reliable sources or dont contribute to the noise ratio of the thread.

If Special Forces were being used, you may be assured that the world and his dog would not know until after the event, if at all!!

RMD

Dogwatch wrote: »

Yet another poster who believes newspapers print the truth.

Wise up gentlemen. Research and quote from reliable sources or dont contribute to the noise ratio of the thread.

If Special Forces were being used, you may be assured that the world and his dog would not know until after the event, if at all!!

The vast majority of SF operations let alone locations wont receive a mention in newspapers / tabloids till after the operation has been completed or it has been drastically ****ed up, reason being they wont know of it obviously enough. The only reason the media has found out about these is the UK government is 1) Sending a clear message to Gaddafi they're serious 2) To assure the public they're taking the situation seriously. And no savage they're not going in to save the SAS boys, safe to say that since they were helping train Libyan soldiers Gaddafi will look after them, if not they'll now be on the rebels side since the Brits have sent in advisers to assist the rebels.

Utrinque Paratus

RMD wrote: »

The vast majority of SF operations let alone locations wont receive a mention in newspapers / tabloids till after the operation has been completed or it has been drastically ****ed up, reason being they wont know of it obviously enough. The only reason the media has found out about these is the UK government is 1) Sending a clear message to Gaddafi they're serious 2) To assure the public they're taking the situation seriously. And no savage they're not going in to save the SAS boys, safe to say that since they were helping train Libyan soldiers Gaddafi will look after them, if not they'll now be on the rebels side since the Brits have sent in advisers to assist the rebels.

The Libyans were being trained in the UK. Mainly in anti terrorism techniques.

To counter potential Islamic extremism, Gaddafi was the lesser evil.

RMD

Utrinque Paratus wrote: »

The Libyans were being trained in the UK. Mainly in anti terrorism techniques.

To counter potential Islamic extremism, Gaddafi was the lesser evil.

Forgot that, initially thought it was the SAS in Libya, don't know how I mixed it up there. Ye I'll certainly agree to that, as much as a bastard that Gaddafi is, I'd still prefer him to Islamic fundamentalists.