Boston Marathon - new registration procedures

loughie

Haven't booked flights yet....waiting it out!

Checked a week or so and Aer Lingus was in the 500's now in 600's. Aer Lingus only direct flight on skyscanner. 1 or 2 stop are a last resort

Peckham

I've no doubt that there'll be a sale in January, so we'll get flights cheaper than currently priced at. Just have the credit card ready and keep an eye out for those emails.

I've accommodation booked from Friday to Friday, so just the flights left to sort.... and the training!

TFBubendorfer

KentuckyPete wrote: »

Meanwhile I was out running with a lad recently who reckons that to break 3:00 in Boston you need to plan to run asplit of 1:27:30/1:33:30.

Jaysus, are the hills in the second half really that bad? I'd be afraid of a serious blowup if I ran 1:27 over the first half.

Not sure about the exact splits, but the second half is definitely a lot harder than the first. The first half has a 400 ft elevation drop. The second half has the Newton hills.

When I ran it, I ran the first half in about 1:29:30 and blew my quads in the process, resulting in a 1:41 second half. Looking back now, even splits aren't the way to do it, so 1:27:30 looks about right.

Having said that, it's not a course I would pick to break 3 hours again.

Peckham

TFB - Are the Newton Hills that much more difficult than the hills around the back of UCD in the Dublin Marathon? I had heard that legacy of Heartbreak Hill etc. was really just hype, especially if you're used to the rolling hills we get round these parts.

TFBubendorfer

Peckham wrote: »

TFB - Are the Newton Hills that much more difficult than the hills around the back of UCD in the Dublin Marathon? I had heard that legacy of Heartbreak Hill etc. was really just hype, especially if you're used to the rolling hills we get round these parts.

Maybe my memory is playing tricks because I really suffered up those hills that day, but yes, I think they are worse than the climb up to Fosters Avenue in Dublin. Each one on its own might be comparable, but in Boston you get 4 of them in quick succession and each one becomes more difficult than the one before.

wideball

I'm waiting for an Aer Lingus sale too.. Have accommodation booked from Sat till Thursday. Are those hills really that bad? Connemarathon (done twice) has more (higher) hills especially the 2nd half.

I'm guessing its the damage to the quads in the 1st half is what that creeps up on you when you hit the Newton hills...

TFBubendorfer

wideball wrote: »

Are those hills really that bad? Connemarathon (done twice) has more (higher) hills especially the 2nd half.

No no, they are definitely nowhere near as bad as Connemara or Dingle. The difference is, I never had any serious aspirations of going sub-3 in either of those races, but I did in Boston and had my backside handed to me.

wideball

Good to know even if all going well sub 3 is my plan at the start line!

At least it puts some perspective on Heartbreak Hill, because it couldn't be any harder than the miles 22-24 in Connemarathon. Newton Hills to be respected but not feared I guess

figs

Didn't have the nerve to hold out until last minute so just bit the bullet and booked my flights for Boston. Looks like the prices are going up, was a few quid more than when I priced it three weeks ago.

Now looking for a place to stay. Any recommendations?

figs

figs wrote: »

Any recommendations?

Scratch that... Looks like i'll be lucky to find anywhere central that doesn't require me to cut my arm off!

RAL3

Hi Figs,

I stayed here in April 2011 and there was a lot of other runners staying there also.

I was there with OH and kids so we were looking for proximity to Boston centre area (10 mins walk)as well as being close to the T.
It was not the cheapest but it was more than worth it for our purposes so I would definitely recommend it from that point of view.

http://www.marriott.com/hotels/travel/bostw-residence-inn-boston-harbor-on-tudor-wharf/

Best of luck with the race, its one you will definitely enjoy.

By the way, I feel a lot better now compared to the last time I saw you on Pearse St on October 31st.

RAL3

TFBubendorfer

figs wrote: »

Scratch that... Looks like i'll be lucky to find anywhere central that doesn't require me to cut my arm off!

If you stay anywhere with reasonable access to one of the T lines, you'll be fine.

KentuckyPete

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Not sure about the exact splits, but the second half is definitely a lot harder than the first. The first half has a 400 ft elevation drop. The second half has the Newton hills.

When I ran it, I ran the first half in about 1:29:30 and blew my quads in the process, resulting in a 1:41 second half. Looking back now, even splits aren't the way to do it, so 1:27:30 looks about right.

Having said that, it's not a course I would pick to break 3 hours again.

Thanks for that Thomas.

The lad I was talking to also said to focus on learning how to run long downhills at pace - in order to avoid your exact quads problem. The guy said that Irish runners can usually climb hills OK but focus their hill training on pushing hard on the climbs - while relaxing on the descents. He reckoned that to maximise performance at Boston you'd need a hard session at least once every 10 days doing the exact opposite - easy climbs and hard downhills.

In other words alternate your hills sessions between a hard climbing session and a hard descending session.

Jaysus :eek:

My PB is 3:02:38 so even on a flat course a sub-3 would be a step up. I'll train for Boston for a sub-3 run but will also expect some tough challenges in the second half. Newton hills would probably be OK on a normal course but not if your quads are shot.

Krusty_Clown

KentuckyPete wrote: »

In other words alternate your hills sessions between a hard climbing session and a hard descending session.

Have you seen the elevation profile for Boston? I can't see anything special (precautionary) about the down-hills at all (may be my famous last words). If you set out to do a flat 20 mile training run, you would be covering a similar elevation gains and drops as you would find in Boston marathon. You lose 50m over the first 2.5 miles and another 47m towards the end of the race. I suspect that people's quads may be shot because they are coming to the end of a marathon, rather than being specific to the down-hill. Personally (having not run the course!), I'll be more concerned about TFBubendorfer's Newton hill climbs than the descents, as they'll likely push you over your Vo2max and create a risk of blowing up.

drquirky

I was born and raised less than 10 miles from the Marathon course. The downhill isn't severe but its a nice gentle slope that encourages you to run fast- the issue with it is that people end up running it too quickly and blow up towards the end of the marathon. The Newton Hills are decent enough. I've never run the actual 26.2 but I've been up and down those hills a bunch and if you are tired they are a bit of a pain. The up and down, each hill a little bigger than the last is the issue- also I think people build them up in their minds. TBH a big advantage I would imagine in Boston is the support- a million people line the course and I would think this could be a big help. I'm really jealous of everyone running it - if anyone needs advice on bars/ restaurants etc let me know....

Krusty_Clown

drquirky wrote: »

I was born and raised less than 10 miles from the Marathon course. The downhill isn't severe but its a nice gentle slope that encourages you to run fast- the issue with it is that people end up running it too quickly and blow up towards the end of the marathon. The Newton Hills are decent enough. I've never run the actual 26.2 but I've been up and down those hills a bunch and if you are tired they are a bit of a pain. The up and down, each hill a little bigger than the last is the issue- also I think people build them up in their minds. TBH a big advantage I would imagine in Boston is the support- a million people line the course and I would think this could be a big help. I'm really jealous of everyone running it - if anyone needs advice on bars/ restaurants etc let me know....

You should head back home for the week, and we'll all stay in your gaff. I like oatmeal in the mornings.

Speedy44

Can't wait to start training properly for this now.
I'm hoping the few miles I covered in the past few months will stand to me, and hopefully I'll be a little bit more mentally tough as well for the fun starts on the Newton Hills.
We have a team going over from the club (GCH) so it should be good craic.
Of course its also my second home so I don't have to worry about accomodation. I am also very familier with the course having ran it 3 times previously in the 90's, so I have no excuse there :rolleyes:

Haven't quiet made up my mind on a schedule yet. I'll have to see how I recover from my recent exploits first, but I'm thinking that I may only do 60-70mls/wk with a lot of quality sessions thrown in, and some gym work and maybe a bit of cross training. Will probably do a revised Daniels A program of some sort.

I plan to run a 5ml race in mid Feb and then the Craughwell 10 in March to get an idea of where I'm at.

KentuckyPete

OK, things are much more advanced now on the logistics front

13/04/12 - Dublin-Boston EI 137 Dep 14:55
17/04/12 - Boston-Dublin EI 136 Dep 18:25

Digs booked near Boston common too.

So I'm committed... can't back out... now there's just the small matter of 600+ miles of training to be run

loughie

Just booked the flights with Aer Lingus. 14/04 to 17/04.

Hotel booked some weeks ago.

Now I just need to get some training in!

As a boards newbie maybe I can tap all you 'veterans' for knowledge and info

Peckham

For something that seemed so far in the future, Boston seems quite immediate now that we're into 2012. 102 days to go according to the widget on my phone!

Am kicking off a 13 week schedule the week after next (12 weeks plus one contingency week). Most recent marathon was Berlin 2010 and have been out of the marathon mindset since. Fortunately have found my Berlin 2010 training plan (Daniels-based), so am going to just repeat that (with lots of focus on both the uphills and downhills).

Haven't booked flights yet - am confident of an Aer Lingus sale in a few weeks - however will be travelling out on Fri 13th and back on Fri 20th.

Peckham

Timely article about preparing for downhills in Boston

askcoachjenny.runnersworld.com/2012/01/four-effective-ways-to-conquer-the-downhills-of-the-boston-marathon.html?cm_mmc=Twitter-_-RunnersWorld-_-Content-Blog-_-CoachJennyDownhills

carthaigh

Sorry for butting in if this has been asked before. So are the hills that bad? Looking at the course profile it looks mostly downhill and the hills aren't so bad. I guess it's their location that might cause an issue. Maybe some of the vets of the course can comment?

TFBubendorfer

carthaigh wrote: »

Sorry for butting in if this has been asked before. So are the hills that bad? Looking at the course profile it looks mostly downhill and the hills aren't so bad. I guess it's their location that might cause an issue. Maybe some of the vets of the course can comment?

Why don't you just read the previous page of this very thread?

christeb

Very jealous of everyone going over this year. Does anyone know what times ended up being accepted, and which were rejected based on the new registration procedure?

wideball

All set qualifying times less 1min 44secs. So if age group time BQ time was 3.30, all those who ran 3.28.45 or less qualified

Pardon my Maths... meant to say 1:14 not 1:44...

shels4ever

christeb wrote: »

Very jealous of everyone going over this year. Does anyone know what times ended up being accepted, and which were rejected based on the new registration procedure?

http://www.runtri.com/2008/07/race-boston-boston-marathon-qualifying.html

To meet size constraints, it came down to this: if you ran a qualifying time, you needed to beat that time by one minute and 14 seconds to enter the race. The new Entrant Time = qualifying time minus 0:01:14. For example, in the M40-44 division:

•Old Qualifying Time = Standard Eligible to Submit an Application' = 3:20:00
•New Qualifying Time = Entrant Time = 3:18:46

KentuckyPete

Peckham wrote: »

Timely article about preparing for downhills in Boston

askcoachjenny.runnersworld.com/2012/01/four-effective-ways-to-conquer-the-downhills-of-the-boston-marathon.html?cm_mmc=Twitter-_-RunnersWorld-_-Content-Blog-_-CoachJennyDownhills

Thanks Peckham.



That's a good solid workout she lists there in the second option - I might give it a go for a few weeks:

• Step 1: Run 2-3 miles at an easy pace and no incline.
• Step 2: Cycle (or Stair Climb) 2 minutes at a hard resistance and quick cadence (not slow turn over) or climbing out of the saddle (very hard--don't try this first).
• Step 3: Perform one strengthening exercise for one minute to fatigue. Include lunges, squats, single-leg step-ups on a bench, kettlebell exercises, up-and-overs on a step bench, burpees...)
• Step 4: Repeat the cycling and strength intervals 4-6 times.
• Step 5: Finish by running 2-3 miles. The first 2 minutes are at an easy to moderate effort, and the remainder is done at a race effort (not pace). You want to be at an effort where you're out of your comfort zone but not sprinting--a strong, controlled effort or an 8 out of a 1 to 10 effort scale. You can also add a random hill course for the final running leg as well (hard).
• Note: This workout will take a lot out of you and is best mixed with truly easy workouts before and after. A good way to start is to weave it into your training every other week. As you gain strength, try it once per week.

I like the way it works all all levels of fitness and abilities since you're pushing against your own personal notional limits

At this stage I'm in two minds. Krusty is right when saying to look at the course profile and not to panic over this downhills/quads burnout buisiness. But then so many runners say that Boston is definitely not a PB course - and that's gotta be because of the hills... Reckon I'll increase the hills training compared to DCM 2011, not worry about it too much and just go for it on the day

Peckham

I'm only going to do two things:

1) Most importantly, I'm going to make sure my long runs and particularly many PMP/tempo segments within them are done over rolling hills (alternatively I might combine two bits of her advice and do all my speedwork over hills whilst running backwards!)

2) I'm going to do 2 or 3 sessions of squats/lunges each week


Not a PB course? The first two men across the line in 2011 were the fastest marathon times ever recorded!

carthaigh

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Why don't you just read the previous page of this very thread?

Sorry, should have done just that.

KentuckyPete

Peckham wrote: »

I'm only going to do two things:

1) Most importantly, I'm going to make sure my long runs and particularly many PMP/tempo segments within them are done over rolling hills (alternatively I might combine two bits of her advice and do all my speedwork over hills whilst running backwards!)

2) I'm going to do 2 or 3 sessions of squats/lunges each week


Not a PB course? The first two men across the line in 2011 were the fastest marathon times ever recorded!

The other thing I'm hoping to lean on is the fact that of the four marathons I've run, the last three have been negative splits - by an average of two minutes. If I can carry that form into Boston then I should hopefully have something in the locker when arriving at the Newton Hills.