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will I lose the dole if I get census enumerator job?

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  • 18-01-2011 2:19pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 64 ✭✭


    Me and my spouse have just received a letter inviting us to interviews for the census enumerator job... We are both unemployed (my spouse on benefit and me on allowance).

    My question is if we will lose the dole if we get the jobs?

    The enumerator work is 22 hours a week, but mainly evenings and weekends, hence we are still available to take up other employment and to search for work.

    The enumerator job will last for 10 weeks and only pay approx €2200 in total (not sure if we can life off that taking into account petrol etc!!!)

    Does anyone have experience from a similar situation?


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,758 ✭✭✭eastbono


    Unsure about answer to your question but I can find out and get back to you tomorrow unless someone else has info on this and posts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭Beaucoupfish


    Hi,
    I'm very glad you have asked this question as I am in the same boat as yourself. I received a letter today for an interview on the 27th.


  • Registered Users Posts: 64 ✭✭beatle


    Thanks Eastbono!! Would really appreciate it!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 776 ✭✭✭sellerbarry


    From experience. If you work more than 3 days in a week, you lose all welfare payment. (even though it's just a couple of hours each night.) If you could do all the work in 3 days, you would only lose a certain amount of your welfare for each day worked.(depending on amount earned per day of work).;)
    Ask them to let you only do 19 hours per week and you and spouse would be entitled to FIS (family income supplement).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 951 ✭✭✭tomcollins97


    The enumerator pay is higher than the dole averaged out over the 10 weeks. U also get paid mileage allowance.

    I am confused as if u cannot live on this how are u surviving on the dole?

    Also, as far as I know if you work part time but earn more than the dole in a week u are not entitled to a top up. If that was the case every worker would claim it!!


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 776 ✭✭✭sellerbarry


    ;)They don't want to miss jeremy kyle.
    :)They don't want to lose rent allowance.
    :)They probably claim for a couple of kids.(This would make it a higher payment than job)


    Probably one or two of the above are reasons.


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,518 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    @sellerberry - If you don't have anything useful or helpful to contribute to the thread, then please don't post at all.

    dudara


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Balagan


    beatle wrote: »
    Me and my spouse have just received a letter inviting us to interviews for the census enumerator job... We are both unemployed (my spouse on benefit and me on allowance).

    My question is if we will lose the dole if we get the jobs?

    The enumerator work is 22 hours a week, but mainly evenings and weekends, hence we are still available to take up other employment and to search for work.

    The enumerator job will last for 10 weeks and only pay approx €2200 in total (not sure if we can life off that taking into account petrol etc!!!)

    Does anyone have experience from a similar situation?

    Seems out of the question for many reasons, the main one being that your combined earnings from this work of Euro 440 pw would be in excess of max payment of Euro 312.80 pw allowed to you as a couple on JB & JSA payments. You would be working possibly part of 7 days a week when three days plus Sunday is the limit for casual work. Even if the aforementioned weren't determining factors, there would be no chance that it could be viewed as subsidiary work/secondary work which is allowed for JB claimants as they have to show that they were carrying out both their full time job and subsidiary work simultaneously for a period of 6 months.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Balagan


    beatle wrote: »
    Me and my spouse have just received a letter inviting us to interviews for the census enumerator job... We are both unemployed (my spouse on benefit and me on allowance).

    My question is if we will lose the dole if we get the jobs?

    The enumerator work is 22 hours a week, but mainly evenings and weekends, hence we are still available to take up other employment and to search for work.

    The enumerator job will last for 10 weeks and only pay approx €2200 in total (not sure if we can life off that taking into account petrol etc!!!)

    Does anyone have experience from a similar situation?

    Seems out of the question for many reasons, the main one being that your combined earnings from this work of Euro 440 pw would be in excess of max payment of Euro 312.80 pw allowed to you as a couple on SW payments. You would be working possibly part of 7 days a week when three days plus Sunday is the limit for casual work. Even if the aforementioned weren't determining factors, there would be no chance that it could be viewed as subsidiary work/secondary work which is allowed for JB claimants as they have to show that they were carrying out both their full time job and subsidiary work simultaneously for a period of 6 months.


  • Registered Users Posts: 317 ✭✭Ki ki


    Did you apply for the jobs or did they contact you simply because you are on benefits?

    Either way, I think you are very lucky and lots of people would love the chance to get work and off welfare.

    And plus, seeing as it's mainly evening duty, it shouldn't affect you applying/interviewing for other work :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,758 ✭✭✭eastbono


    beatle wrote: »
    Me and my spouse have just received a letter inviting us to interviews for the census enumerator job... We are both unemployed (my spouse on benefit and me on allowance).

    My question is if we will lose the dole if we get the jobs?

    The enumerator work is 22 hours a week, but mainly evenings and weekends, hence we are still available to take up other employment and to search for work.

    The enumerator job will last for 10 weeks and only pay approx €2200 in total (not sure if we can life off that taking into account petrol etc!!!)

    Does anyone have experience from a similar situation?

    UPDATE

    No guidelines as yet have been issued with relation to people on JA/JB working as enumerator for the census. As soon as guidelines issue I will post.


  • Registered Users Posts: 64 ✭✭beatle


    I had to apply for the job, and everyone applying is being interviewed, so not sure if I should count my self as luckier than anyone else...

    I have been unemployed for a while and am desperate to work again! If I am offered a job I will take it, but I still need to know some practical details...
    The last time I signed on it took well over three months before I was paid. If I have to sign off, work for a little more than I am getting now, then get nothing for three months from signing on, Im not sure who will cover my rent. I am simply trying to take some responsibility.

    Also, I have heard from a few people that they ended up paying for a lot of the petrol themselves as the census only pay for what they assume you'll use.. It might not cover the cost if you need to revisit houses that do not answer the door etc.

    Hope we get some clarity on this soon...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,339 ✭✭✭tenchi-fan


    eastbono wrote: »
    UPDATE

    No guidelines as yet have been issued with relation to people on JA/JB working as enumerator for the census. As soon as guidelines issue I will post.

    Given the huge number of unemployed people, hopefully a few of them will be selected for these jobs rather than give them to people in full-time employment.

    However, there is no reason this should be turned into a cushy number by letting people work and claim.

    Perhaps people claiming a low rate of JA due to means testing or age should get first refusal on these jobs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 593 ✭✭✭V480


    beatle wrote: »
    Me and my spouse have just received a letter inviting us to interviews for the census enumerator job... We are both unemployed (my spouse on benefit and me on allowance).

    My question is if we will lose the dole if we get the jobs?

    The enumerator work is 22 hours a week, but mainly evenings and weekends, hence we are still available to take up other employment and to search for work.

    The enumerator job will last for 10 weeks and only pay approx €2200 in total (not sure if we can life off that taking into account petrol etc!!!)

    Does anyone have experience from a similar situation?


    It's a totally legitimate question and a bit unfair the way some people responded to you.

    I'd be in a similar enough situation though I'm fortunate in that my spouse is working. I don't think I would be earning anymore than what I'm getting on the dole, possibly less, taking into account travel costs. I'm just dying to get out working again - though I have heard it can be a tough enough job!


  • Registered Users Posts: 135 ✭✭midgej


    beatle wrote: »
    Me and my spouse have just received a letter inviting us to interviews for the census enumerator job... We are both unemployed (my spouse on benefit and me on allowance).

    My question is if we will lose the dole if we get the jobs?

    The enumerator work is 22 hours a week, but mainly evenings and weekends, hence we are still available to take up other employment and to search for work.

    The enumerator job will last for 10 weeks and only pay approx €2200 in total (not sure if we can life off that taking into account petrol etc!!!)

    Does anyone have experience from a similar situation?


    I absolutely agree with V480, that it was unfair the way some people responded to this question. It is completely legitimate and I am sure there are hundreds of people in the same situation who would like to know the answer to this. I am one of them. I have been unemployed since the start of July, and am dying to get back working. In fact I am starting a 12 week unpaid work placement next week, in the hope that it may develop into a full time job, or if not at least I will be in a workplace meeting people, and possibly developing contacts that may lead to work.
    If I get the Census job I will be working it evenings & weekends, along with my full time work placement.
    Like the OP, if I have to sign off completely & then wait a couple of months while my Jobseekers claim is processed again the bills simply won't get paid. I would be willing to work for nothing simply to get extra experience on my CV if I knew my Jobseekers claim would be processed immediately following the end of the Census work.
    If common sense prevailed in this country the enumerators jobs would only be offered to those on Jobseekers Benefit / Allowance, letting the Social Welfare benefits continue without break and just paying a little additional to cover fuel etc. I would go as far as to say that if anyone on Jobseekers refused the position they should no longer be entitled to benefits.
    It is wrong that people already working are allocated these jobs allowing them to fatten up their wallets when unemployed are perfectly willing and able to do the job just as well.
    Sorry! Rant over - if anyone has any further info please share.
    Oh and for the record sellerbarry - I have never watched Jeremy Kyle!!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,168 ✭✭✭Balagan


    It seems some may not be aware that those waiting for Jobseekers claims to kick in (or repeat claims be processed if they've been working for a period) are able to get payments to tide them over through the Community Welfare Officer at their local HSE Health Office? Those funds are deducted when the Jobseekers payments come through. It is therefore very possible (and quite common practice ) to take on short term contract work without suffering long waits without funds before welfare payments recommence.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5 csographer


    Fact is that nobody should be able to work and claim benefits (unless they are adequately means tested and are deemed to be in great need of assistance)

    I'm a fully qualified teacher and cannot for love nor money get a job in a primary school despite having a masters in Special education, coming first in my class in college and speaking fluent Irish, I after two years of on off subbing have given up trying to find full time work and am working as an SNA in a school.

    I'm still sending out job applications which cost on average €5 each; in the last 18 months I've sent 200 applications covering jobs in 4 counties and gotten 20 interviews.

    My point is in all this time I have never claimed benefits and never will (children's allowance goes to the children's bank accounts) despite my current earnings being considerably below the current dole payment.

    My partner is working full time €12.50 phr (not claiming FIS or anything else) and is in education four nights a week which we are paying for it ourselves. We've two children and never live beyond our means. We don't have a boom time mortgage we socialize but never over spend, we save for everything and are incredibly happy.

    I've applied for a position as an enumerator and if successful a friend will babysit. I am happy to say we will be using the money to pay for a small summer vacation and adding the remaining funds to our savings for car tax, health and car Insurance for 2012.

    People who are desperate for work should be willing to do whatever job that may come their way regardless of their skills. In our current economic climate pride has no place in career choice.

    Midgej I may have taken you up wrong but are you saying that you are on the dole, If so is this work placement you are going on one of those state sponsored or Fas initiatives and if not will you be giving up your dole during this time (since you'll not be available to look for work) as you won't be entitled. If your benefits remain in place is it not fair to say that you are indeed even if below the minimum wage getting paid (in benefit) for the work you do. I do apologize if I've misinterpreted your earlier post.

    Best of luck to all who are going to interview.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,811 ✭✭✭✭billy the squid


    This really isn't the thread to be judgeing people for the questions they ask. If you have nothing to contribute, then don't post. Thank you.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2 unalien


    Well done. Are you glad you got that out of your system? Your relentless onslaught on some 450,000 people signing on was very inspirational. If 450,000 people all signed off to work for 7.65 an hour do you think there would be enough jobs to go around. Everyone's circumstances are different and nobody asked about yours.

    Now, does anyone actually know how to work as an Enumerator while claiming Job Seekers Benefit, which I need to pay ESB, mortgage, management company fees, college course, car tax, insurance, fuel, prtb fee's, loan, credit card, food, oil, toll charges, tv licence, bin tags, petrol, nappies for two children, mechanic and a kitchen sink.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,614 ✭✭✭The Sparrow


    Csographer you are failing to grasp the basic idea of social welfare/ insurance. Everybody pays some money into a big pot so that you are insured against losing your job and are able to claim some of that money when you are unemployed or sick or whatever. So not claiming is not some sort of noble pursuit, it is just plain stupid.

    As a teacher, I would hope that you would have more empathy than coming on here and attempting to belittle people because they are asking a question about claiming money that the majority are fully entitled to.

    Plus as a side note, how can every job application possibly cost €5? And I love how you start your post with the word 'fact'... :rolleyes:

    Anyway, I asked about this today at the social welfare office and I was told they didn't know. :confused: So hopefully somebody else will have more luck and can clarify the situation.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 277 ✭✭ciaramc


    Hi, Im in the same boat. Im on JSB and would love to have a job. I did the interview for the Census on monday.

    Let me know if what the outcome if you get the job. Thanks.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7 reliable4eddie


    I attended interview for Census Enumerator on Tuesday. I explained to them that I would love to do the job, I would do it for 50 euro a week, my only worry is because I am operating on such a tight weekly budget I simply cannot afford to lose any social welfare entitlements. (They are unable to comment on this matter, only advise to take it up with SW.) I am over 15 months claiming so I am entitled to fuel allowance of 20 euro per week from September to May. If I sign off for ten weeks to take up the CE job then start a fresh claim do I have to wait another 15 months to become entitled to fuel allowance. There are some other worries also that are too complicated to cover here.
    I would just love if the powers that be could simplify things, maybe tell people on the dole they can do the job for fifty quid a week without upsetting their claim, something like the community employment scheme.
    Oh! btw I was taught in school to never say never.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,339 ✭✭✭tenchi-fan


    (They are unable to comment on this matter, only advise to take it up with SW.)
    SNIP
    I would just love if the powers that be could simplify things, maybe tell people on the dole they can do the job for fifty quid a week without upsetting their claim, something like the community employment scheme.

    I think everyone looking for this job but wants to keep their benefits is barking up the wrong tree.

    Why is everyone complaining that they can't get an answer? The fact is, this job will be treated as any other employment.

    There are a lot of people in Ireland who are on reduced payments for age (€100), because they are means tested on their partner's income (and possibly get between €0 and €20), and some don't qualify for welfare at all such as people who worked abroad for a few years. There are also many students, including mature students, who would be only to happy to take the job.

    I think people in this country need to ween themselves off the notion of community employment and sweet deals where they can have income of more than a full-time employee by working and claiming benefits at the same time.

    Minimum wage is only $7 something. And min wage workers get taxed. Their takehome pay can be as low as €250. But people here are actually suggesting in addition to claiming €196 dole, heat allowance, medical card, possible rent allowance and whatever else, they also want a few hours a week to bring their income well over what a minimum wage worker would earn for an entire week, but without affecting their benefits? Sorry if I'm not more sympathetic.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,614 ✭✭✭The Sparrow


    tenchi-fan wrote: »
    I think everyone looking for this job but wants to keep their benefits is barking up the wrong tree.

    Why is everyone complaining that they can't get an answer? The fact is, this job will be treated as any other employment.

    There are a lot of people in Ireland who are on reduced payments for age (€100), because they are means tested on their partner's income (and possibly get between €0 and €20), and some don't qualify for welfare at all such as people who worked abroad for a few years. There are also many students, including mature students, who would be only to happy to take the job.

    I think people in this country need to ween themselves off the notion of community employment and sweet deals where they can have income of more than a full-time employee by working and claiming benefits at the same time.

    Minimum wage is only $7 something. And min wage workers get taxed. Their takehome pay can be as low as €250. But people here are actually suggesting in addition to claiming €196 dole, heat allowance, medical card, possible rent allowance and whatever else, they also want a few hours a week to bring their income well over what a minimum wage worker would earn for an entire week, but without affecting their benefits? Sorry if I'm not more sympathetic.


    Where to start? :confused:

    1. People are complaining that they cannot get an answer because they cannot get an answer! I asked at the social welfare office and was told they do not know what the situation is in this regard. Nobody that I can see is complaining (bar you), they are just asking a question that has yet to be definitively answered.

    2. Nobody is looking for a 'sweet deal' as you term it, they are simply enquiring about their entitlements. There are back to work schemes and payments for a reason and it is a legitimate question to ask whether this falls under that category.

    3. Also, those schemes and payments are available to everyone including minnimum wage employees and people who claim other benefits.

    4. The majority of people asking this question have probably worked for years before the current economic slump and contributed far more than they have taken out to the social insurance pot so the last thing they need is a pompous lecture from you about 'sweet deals'.

    5. And as a point of fact, unemployment benefit is now less than €196 since the budget and many claimants (myself included) are not entitled to "heat allowance, medical card, possible rent allowance and whatever else".


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,758 ✭✭✭eastbono


    Still no guidelines but I have asked about previous treatment of people on jsa/jsb taking up enumerator jobs and the consensus is that people still received a certain amount of the jsb/jsa money some days were docked but I cannot stand over saying this will the same this year. As soon as guidelines are posted I will get back.

    My advice would be if you are offered one of these jobs to accept, you dont have to take up the job. They will have people to fall back on as they are interviewing 16,000 approx for 5,000 jobs. Unfortunately this is all the help I can give at the moment.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,117 ✭✭✭AnnyHallsal


    eastbono wrote: »
    Still no guidelines but I have asked about previous treatment of people on jsa/jsb taking up enumerator jobs and the consensus is that people still received a certain amount of the jsb/jsa money some days were docked but I cannot stand over saying this will the same this year. As soon as guidelines are posted I will get back.

    My advice would be if you are offered one of these jobs to accept, you dont have to take up the job. They will have people to fall back on as they are interviewing 16,000 approx for 5,000 jobs. Unfortunately this is all the help I can give at the moment.

    This makes sense. I imagine it will be treated as casual work. I see no reason why it wouldn't.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,758 ✭✭✭eastbono


    exactly anny i think what will happen is that they will say that ok people are working 5 nights a week and maybe allow them to keep 2 days of their jsa/jsb but that is just a personal opinion. I will post as soon as guidelines are issued.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,876 ✭✭✭deelite


    midgej wrote: »
    I am starting a 12 week unpaid work placement next week, in the hope that it may develop into a full time job, or if not at least I will be in a workplace meeting people, and possibly developing contacts that may lead to work.


    If I get the Census job I will be working it evenings & weekends, along with my full time work placement.

    I have never watched Jeremy Kyle!!!!


    Congratulations on starting a 12 week unpaid work placement - well done and I do hope that it leads to something bigger and better. You seem to have a fantastic attitude to the current climate - more of us should take a leaf out of your book. Well done. Also fair play for trying to get an evening / weekend work on top of it congratulations on taking control of your life instead of looking for others to do it for you! :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,700 ✭✭✭tricky D


    Csographer you are failing to grasp the basic idea of social welfare/ insurance. Everybody pays some money into a big pot so that you are insured against losing your job and are able to claim some of that money when you are unemployed or sick or whatever. So not claiming is not some sort of noble pursuit, it is just plain stupid.

    It's even worse given the fact that by not signing on you don't get your weekly PRSI stamp which is not clever at all even if you opt not to take the money.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7 reliable4eddie


    Thanks Eastbono,
    I've pasted below a clip from from John Curran speaking in the Dail on 5th Oct 2010, also a link to same.

    http://www.kildarestreet.com/debates/?id=2010-10-05.4.0

    On the question about enumerators and those in receipt of social welfare, first and foremost the positions are open to anybody who meets the qualifications and are deemed suitable, regardless of whether they are in employment, unemployed or whatever may be their circumstances. They must be suitably qualified to deliver the task.
    "Regarding those in receipt of social welfare, it should be noted that each enumerator is required to deliver census forms to approximately 400 households and most of that work is carried out in the evening and at weekends. I am advised by the Central Statistics Office that because of the necessity to make personal contact with all householders, it is a requirement of the job that enumerators typically work five or six evenings a week and perhaps one day at the weekend. If that is the case, under social welfare rules they would not have an entitlement to claim jobseeker’s allowance because effectively they would not be available for work.The experience of the staff and the advice I am getting from the CSO is that, typically, the enumerators must work four or five days a week because there is a need to make personal contact and some householders may not be at home on a Monday evening. The work required tends to be for most evenings of the week as well as one of the days of the weekend."

    One of my problems is if I took the job and signed off the dole how long would I be waiting for family income supplement to come through, as a family of four would find it impossible to survive on 100 euro per week paid in arrears for the ten weeks and then the remaining 1200 in a lump at the end.
    Thats why I feel they could simplify it, at the moment it seems impossible.


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