Rifle cleaning

pejay

The new rifle should be comming home soon, What do ye think is best for cleaning, a One piece rod or a multi-piece one.

What are the best makes.

Buy a cleaning kit or get products individually

Where is the best place to get good cleaning products.

Many Thanks.

murph226

My experience of cleaning kits in Irish RFD's is that they are usually cheap ****e with a 3 piece rod.

Better off buying the bits individually, get a decent 1 piece rod and boreguide and some quality brushes and patch holders.

When it comes to cleaners and solvents there is thousands out there and different lads like different products and they have different regimes.

Really is a personal thing if you ask me!

Goodluck and safeshooting with the new rifle, what did you go for?

pejay

Thanks murph
I got a Tikka t3 Tac .223

murph226

very nice, looks like I'll be getting to hold onto mine thank god!

what length barrel did you go for?

ormondprop

is there much differance in accuracy and bullet drop between the 24" and 20" barrel on the tikkas

Cass

I have a Bore Tech 56" cleaning rod, 2 jags, 6 mops, i wire brush (never use), and 2 nylon brushes. Also have a Bore Tech bore guide, a must in my book for cleaning. I use these mainly for the new .308 as she has a 32" barrel and the breach with the bore guide adds 12" so my Parker Hale rods don't reach as i would like (well not without smacking my knuckles of the butt stock when i run the rod forward).

As for cleaing chemicals i use one of three. M-Pro7 bore gel, Butch's bore shine and Forrest Foam. I use one depending on the amount i've fired, ie, heavy fouling, medium or light fouling will dictate which one i use.

For breaking it in i usually start with 1 shot and clean. Repeat for 10 rounds. 2 shots and clean for 10 (5x2), 3 shots and clean for 15 (5x3), and lastly 5 shots and clean for 15 (3x5). 45 - 50 rounds is more than enough for breaking in any new rifle. Some may take more, but this does most.

For regular cleaning i usually soak a patch in M-Pro7 bore gel. Run it down the barrel. immediately use a nylon brush and run it up and down a few times to agitate/loosen the fouling. Another soaked patch and run it through the barrel to remove heavy fouling. Then one last (M-Pro7) patch and run it down the barrel ,then leave it to sit for about 3-5 minutes. I then take oiled patches and continuely run wet/oiled patches down the barrel until they run wet and clean. I then run 7-10 dry patches to remove oil, cleaner, everything. Then a mop and run it up and down a few times to "buff" the bore.

If you find fouling on the patches, just repeat the cleaning process again.

As previously mentioned though, its a personal thing and i've changed the way i clean mine over the years. There is no real "right or wrong" way. I will however say that the patches should be wet and clean. This way you are guarunteed there is no dry or drying fouling still in the barrel.

I then wipe the stock with a clean dry cloth (or ever so slightly oiled then dry), wipe the outside of the barrel and breach with a slightly oiled clth and wipe down to remove excess. I also use a tooth brush, oil, and cotton buds to clean the chamber and breach on the inside. When storing the rifle from week to week i leave a clean, rolled up cloth in the chamber/breach so when it is sitting on the butt any "missed" oil will run onto the cloth. Thankfully i've yet to take out a cloth with any oil or at least any "excessive" oil on it.

One shot on kill

the reason why an RDF man would say the army cleaning kit is **** is because they dont know how to use them now im in the PDF since 2000 and ive nerer seen a rod cleaning kit used by the army reason for that is because they use a pull through and flaninet this is for tactical situations where the rifle needs to be cleaned and put back in service before you need to use it so idea is take it out use it and put roll it up and put it back if you were effecient enough you should be able to pull through the barrel in 1 mins for battle situations incase you block barrel with muck dirt or an actions on because of jammed round dirt ect

now my advise would be get what ever is more useable for you but prob more important to get a nilon brush head because the brass can tear the inside of your barrel with excesive use it would take alot but can happen so start as you mean to go on

just use a light oil and make sure to always rag of the excess on if you oil the barrel it is very important to wipe of excess

dos29

One shot on kill wrote: »

the reason why an RDF man would say the army cleaning kit is **** is because they dont know how to use them

I'm guessing your referring to the post that had RFD written in it? ie. Registered Firearm Dealers.... :D:D
Chill lad.

murph226

One shot on kill wrote: »

the reason why an RDF man would say the army cleaning kit is **** is because they dont know how to use them now im in the PDF since 2000 and ive nerer seen a rod cleaning kit used by the army reason for that is because they use a pull through and flaninet this is for tactical situations where the rifle needs to be cleaned and put back in service before you need to use it so idea is take it out use it and put roll it up and put it back if you were effecient enough you should be able to pull through the barrel in 1 mins for battle situations incase you block barrel with muck dirt or an actions on because of jammed round dirt ect

now my advise would be get what ever is more useable for you but prob more important to get a nilon brush head because the brass can tear the inside of your barrel with excesive use it would take alot but can happen so start as you mean to go on

just use a light oil and make sure to always rag of the excess on if you oil the barrel it is very important to wipe of excess

IRISH RFD = REGISTERED FIREARMS DEALER

Don't the PDF use a rod for the GPMG?

Its fine using a pullthrough on an AUG because you won't damage the crown with the muzzle flash hider!

Also light oil won't remove copper fouling, you'll need a solvent for that!

Only ever use nylon brushes on my own guns aswell.

pejay

murph226 wrote: »

very nice, looks like I'll be getting to hold onto mine thank god!

what length barrel did you go for?

24" 1:8

One shot on kill

jesus lads you dont miss a whole lot

just to let you know i dropped back to chill pills there and i read the message again
very stupid mistake forgive me
ive never seen a rod been used on the gpmg maybe on the hmg but you still use the pullthrough

( stupid mistake sorry )

dos29

One shot on kill wrote: »

very stupid mistake forgive me
ive never seen a rod been used on the gpmg maybe on the hmg but you still use the pullthrough

No panic, all good.
(By the way, the gpmg rod is a 3 piece with a t handle kept in the spare parts wallet;))

pejay

ezridax wrote: »

I have a Bore Tech 56" cleaning rod, 2 jags, 6 mops, i wire brush (never use), and 2 nylon brushes. Also have a Bore Tech bore guide, a must in my book for cleaning. I use these mainly for the new .308 as she has a 32" barrel and the breach with the bore guide adds 12" so my Parker Hale rods don't reach as i would like (well not without smacking my knuckles of the butt stock when i run the rod forward).

As for cleaing chemicals i use one of three. M-Pro7 bore gel, Butch's bore shine and Forrest Foam. I use one depending on the amount i've fired, ie, heavy fouling, medium or light fouling will dictate which one i use.

For breaking it in i usually start with 1 shot and clean. Repeat for 10 rounds. 2 shots and clean for 10 (5x2), 3 shots and clean for 15 (5x3), and lastly 5 shots and clean for 15 (3x5). 45 - 50 rounds is more than enough for breaking in any new rifle. Some may take more, but this does most.

For regular cleaning i usually soak a patch in M-Pro7 bore gel. Run it down the barrel. immediately use a nylon brush and run it up and down a few times to agitate/loosen the fouling. Another soaked patch and run it through the barrel to remove heavy fouling. Then one last (M-Pro7) patch and run it down the barrel ,then leave it to sit for about 3-5 minutes. I then take oiled patches and continuely run wet/oiled patches down the barrel until they run wet and clean. I then run 7-10 dry patches to remove oil, cleaner, everything. Then a mop and run it up and down a few times to "buff" the bore.

If you find fouling on the patches, just repeat the cleaning process again.

As previously mentioned though, its a personal thing and i've changed the way i clean mine over the years. There is no real "right or wrong" way. I will however say that the patches should be wet and clean. This way you are guarunteed there is no dry or drying fouling still in the barrel.

I then wipe the stock with a clean dry cloth (or ever so slightly oiled then dry), wipe the outside of the barrel and breach with a slightly oiled clth and wipe down to remove excess. I also use a tooth brush, oil, and cotton buds to clean the chamber and breach on the inside. When storing the rifle from week to week i leave a clean, rolled up cloth in the chamber/breach so when it is sitting on the butt any "missed" oil will run onto the cloth. Thankfully i've yet to take out a cloth with any oil or at least any "excessive" oil on it.

Thanks ezridax for all that, my next question was on barrel break in.
Great help:):)
I have been looking into ammo, what do you think of the molly stuf should I start with it and keep using or just go with non molly add stay away from it

murph226

ezridax wrote: »

my Parker Hale rods don't reach as i would like (well not without smacking my knuckles of the butt stock when i run the rod forward)

If you want to sell that rod let me know!

doyle61

i use an OTIS tactical cleaning kit. great piece of kit;) has everything from shotgun to pistol atachments and does callibers from .17 to .5, and it all fits into a nice pocket size case. i bought the attachments and the lens kit aswell; great value for money:D

Tackleberrywho

doyle61 wrote: »

i use an OTIS tactical cleaning kit. great piece of kit;) has everything from shotgun to pistol atachments and does callibers from .17 to .5, and it all fits into a nice pocket size case. i bought the attachments and the lens kit aswell; great value for money:D

http://www.otisgun.com/pc_product_detail.asp?key=459AF3413F7A421DB4462B2E01C4F568

$179 I think I'll pass. I was going to get one for my Leatherman MUT, however I think I'll stick with my Parker hale Rods.

Only shi* thing is I need a different rod for the .308 and the .223 as the attachments are not interchangeable

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=18390/Product/CLEANING_RODS

FISMA

PeJay,
Here's all you need:
(1) a good rod
(2) bronze brush
(3) cotton swabs
(4) rod loop for swab
(5) solvent

Get a good rod that is plastic coated. Those Aluminum rods can cause a bit of rub off themselves inside the bore.

Get a bronze brush.

Get a pack of patches and a loop for the patches

Use some solvent like Hoppe's #9 to clean the bore

After cleaning, a bit of oil on the bore and metal using

Also good for the exterior metal

and

murph226

Some say the carbon and copper fouling sticks to the plastic rods and causes an abrassive effect!

Not a fan of any kind of metal brush.

Cass

pejay wrote: »

I have been looking into ammo, what do you think of the molly stuf should I start with it and keep using or just go with non molly add stay away from it

Personally i wouldn't bother my a**e with the moly stiff. No doubt its a bit more accurate, but i like cleaning my gun. It gives me piece of mind to know i've it spotless, and ready to shoot again. The moly bullets, to get the true effect from them, should be used in comjunction with a moy paste of some make to properly line the bore and get top results. It will work without this, but again its a bit of grief.

Also there are far more bullet types/makes availble in NON moly varieyt than with so you could end up short or even out of ammo and if you want to shoot non moly coated rounds after treting the, and using moly previously it means cleaning the guts out of the rifle to remove the coating. Then when going back to the moly having to retreat/coat the barrel again.

as said i'm sure there is a benefit to moly bullets, but thats alot of work when the rifle you have is perfectly capable of performing very well without them.

Just my choice.

One shot on kill

tech your prob right but there is also suppose to be 1 spare parts wallet for every gpmg but if you were lucky enough to get a wallet all your birth days have came at once

but why do you have to use the pulltrough in toet's

Tackleberrywho

One shot on kill wrote: »

tech your prob right but there is also suppose to be 1 spare parts wallet for every gpmg but if you were lucky enough to get a wallet all your birth days have came at once

but why do you have to use the pulltrough in toet's

I had to rescue many a recruit who got a AUG jammed with flannelette
I bring my Parker Hale along and save the day!

One shot on kill

oh ye that happens and happens alot tryin to rush things

but sure we all make mistakes and unfortunitly some one will always do that not just recruits

pejay

ezridax wrote: »

Personally i wouldn't bother my a**e with the moly stiff. No doubt its a bit more accurate, but i like cleaning my gun. It gives me piece of mind to know i've it spotless, and ready to shoot again. The moly bullets, to get the true effect from them, should be used in comjunction with a moy paste of some make to properly line the bore and get top results. It will work without this, but again its a bit of grief.

Also there are far more bullet types/makes availble in NON moly varieyt than with so you could end up short or even out of ammo and if you want to shoot non moly coated rounds after treting the, and using moly previously it means cleaning the guts out of the rifle to remove the coating. Then when going back to the moly having to retreat/coat the barrel again.

as said i'm sure there is a benefit to moly bullets, but thats alot of work when the rifle you have is perfectly capable of performing very well without them.

Just my choice.

Thanks ezridax I that clears things up grand

BigDuffman

One shot on kill wrote: »

ive never seen a rod been used on the gpmg maybe on the hmg but you still use the pullthrough

( stupid mistake sorry )

Never seen a cleaning rod used on the GPMG?? Odd considering they are in every cleaning kit...?

Now if you have all the right parts of the rod in the kit is a different story:D, but still the majority of the time rods are swapped, scavenged and used.

I had a recruit block up a barrel by using a full baby wipe on a pull through. Tried to jam barrel against a bar and brute force it out, resulting in snapping of pull through that then catapulted itself into the gut and cutting me open. Ended up having to get a load of cleaning rods and battering the thing out!

I've found bore snakes fantastic. But as they get older can get a bit manky. Got a fantastic kit off ebay with everything from shot gun mops all the way down to pistol brushes. All top end stuff only around €20. Only had to buy some solvent and "borrow" a load of gun oil + flannelette for the little oil bottle and s/gun + rifle sorted.

gunhappy_ie

BigDuffman wrote: »

Never seen a cleaning rod used on the GPMG?? Odd considering they are in every cleaning kit...?

Now if you have all the right parts of the rod in the kit is a different story:D, but still the majority of the time rods are swapped, scavenged and used.

I had a recruit block up a barrel by using a full baby wipe on a pull through. Tried to jam barrel against a bar and brute force it out, resulting in snapping of pull through that then catapulted itself into the gut and cutting me open. Ended up having to get a load of cleaning rods and battering the thing out!

I've found bore snakes fantastic. But as they get older can get a bit manky. Got a fantastic kit off ebay with everything from shot gun mops all the way down to pistol brushes. All top end stuff only around €20. Only had to buy some solvent and "borrow" a load of gun oil + flannelette for the little oil bottle and s/gun + rifle sorted.

+1 on the snake bores ... although they are washable.

But the "borrowed" army oil..... I wouldnt put it near my guns.... Its shocking sh!te !

I will have to say though .... if you wanna get ripped off.... but them in ireland, I see them retail for 25-30 euro. Get them in brownells for alot less than that.....

if saes to but a few things in brownells at a time... but try keep around the $100 mark to save on import tax. So for me id reccommend....


http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=23267/Product/M_PRO_7_trade__TACTICAL_GUN_CLEANING_KIT $50

brilliant bit of kit !! Its an excellent kit that will work fantastic on its own or as a starter kit that you can add more and more to. I personally use this and have to say that Mpro 7 is great stuff !

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=9687/Product/BORE_SNAKE $16

A .22 cal snake bore will do pistols and rifles. I have 1 snake bore 10 years now ... started off using it on my .22...... now using same 1 on my .223 and as i said there washable so they last ages.

Thats $66 and lets say $30 shipping.... for $96 which is €73 euro... might seem like alot ... but your getting alot for your money !

dCorbus

Just realised something: the OP doesn't specify whether it's a rimfire or centrefire he's getting. This info would help as the cleaning regime for these is quite different. Not least, being you don't need to worry about copper fouling in a .22 shooting subs (unless of course you're shooting copper jackets, which TBH i won't).

Also, the make and "type" of rifle will make quite a difference to the cleaning regime carried out:

e.g.

F/TR .308 - "Whoosh" out after every session - Semi-clean after about 100 rounds - Major Clean with foam, boreshine, etc etc after about 200 rounds (That's just my cleaning regime for this particular rifle - as I've found that's how she likes it!)
CZ452 .22lr - Major clean with carbon remover etc about every 500 - 1000 rounds (she likes it dirty!)
Anschutz Match54 - Still experimenting with the regime on this one - Will probably go back to cleaning thoroughly after every 50-100 rounds or per training session (whichever is the greater). Rifle is new to me so still not sure what is best for this one.

That's just three very different rifles and three very different cleaning regimes.

murph226

Any oil I've seen in the ordnance stores these days is breakfree clp, think they started getting it when the USP arrived.

gunhappy_ie

murph226 wrote: »

Any oil I've seen in the ordnance stores these days is breakfree clp, think they started getting it when the USP arrived.

Its been in longer than the USP, but like i said..... its SH!TE

pejay

dCorbus wrote: »

Just realised something: the OP doesn't specify whether it's a rimfire or centrefire he's getting. This info would help as the cleaning regime for these is quite different. Not least, being you don't need to worry about copper fouling in a .22 shooting subs (unless of course you're shooting copper jackets, which TBH i won't).

Also, the make and "type" of rifle will make quite a difference to the cleaning regime carried out:

e.g.

F/TR .308 - "Whoosh" out after every session - Semi-clean after about 100 rounds - Major Clean with foam, boreshine, etc etc after about 200 rounds (That's just my cleaning regime for this particular rifle - as I've found that's how she likes it!)
CZ452 .22lr - Major clean with carbon remover etc about every 500 - 1000 rounds (she likes it dirty!)
Anschutz Match54 - Still experimenting with the regime on this one - Will probably go back to cleaning thoroughly after every 50-100 rounds or per training session (whichever is the greater). Rifle is new to me so still not sure what is best for this one.

That's just three very different rifles and three very different cleaning regimes.

Thanks dCorbus for reply, It is a tikka t3 tac .223 24" 1:8
Any input or advice woukd be great I love to learn!!!

pejay

FISMA wrote: »

PeJay,
Here's all you need:
(1) a good rod
(2) bronze brush
(3) cotton swabs
(4) rod loop for swab
(5) solvent

Get a good rod that is plastic coated. Those Aluminum rods can cause a bit of rub off themselves inside the bore.

Get a bronze brush.

Get a pack of patches and a loop for the patches

Use some solvent like Hoppe's #9 to clean the bore

After cleaning, a bit of oil on the bore and metal using

Also good for the exterior metal

and

Where do you get the products from

Tackleberrywho

pejay wrote: »

Where do you get the products from

Any good RFD.
You'll have to invest around €100 total but you'll get years out of them.

I have several variations of them all.
You'll be able to start out with A general gun oil, however for long term maintenance you'll get all the above

dCorbus

Obviously every single shooter is going to have a different opinion on cleaning regimes, so for every shooter you'll probably get different opinions and advice on this whole cleaning question.:o

Collective nouns again: A Disagreement of Shooters:rolleyes::D

For a really good read on the subject of bore-brushing, have a look at this article from 6mmBR.com, with opinions from some of the most experienced and knowledgeable high-level competitive shooters and custom-barrel manufacturers: 6mmBR.com The Great Bore-brushing Debate You may end up more confused than enlightened having read the article, but the opinions and advice in it are all sound and you should take what you will from the info given.

My own few bits of humble advice (for what they're worth), now that you've clarified it's a centrefire rifle in .223 with a decent factory barrel, are:

1. Don't bother with Moly-coating IMO: Haven't tried it myself TBH but I cannot see the benefit, other than costing you more money on moly-coated ammo and the hassle of always ensuring you have a supply of only moly-coated ammo. Keep your barrel good and clean is my advice and stick with the tried and tested ways of doing this. From my research, reading, and asking around about moly pro's and con's, it seems that this is only for dedicated followers of fashion - the rest of us mere mortals should stick with the bore brush, patches, and solvents. Again, that's only my opinion - and others will no doubt disagree.
2. If at all possible, get a couple of good quality nylon bore-brushes. Worldwide opinions varying on whether a bronze brush can or will damage/scratch your bore. Some say they will, some say they won't, and some sit on the fence!;) All i can say, is that having got some nylon bore-brushes recently, I feel a lot more comfortable giving the bore a good hard scrub than when I used the bronze brushes. Also, you are far less likely to scratch or nick the crown with a nylon brush.
3. Invest in some Forrest Foam ForrestFoam at the Sportsmans Gun Centre or WipeOut (some more info available here on HPS's website: WipeOut at HPS-TR) for when you are giving the barrel a really good clean and want to make sure the copper fouling is well taken care of. I haven't found these in too many gun shops around the place, so I usually stock up when over in the UK or up the North.

A bore-guide is an absolute must. Get one before you attempt to clean.

Also, IMO a chamber and bolt locking-lug cleaning kit would also be a good investment in the medium term (it's not absolutely necessary - but is very handy and you'll at least know that there's no crud building up in those unseen crevices). The Sinclair ACT11 comes recommended from a few shooters Sinclair ACT2 Action Cleaning Kit and it's one of the bits of kit on my own shopping list.

What methods suit you, your shooting, your rifle, and your time availability, will dictate what cleaning regime you choose for yourself and your rifle. Trial and error will tell you what will or will not affect the rifles accuracy. Keeping a rifle clean can only stand you in good stead if you ever go to sell it on and a well-cared for rifle should keep you shooting for many years!

Either way, they're just a couple of pointers based on my limited experience and, by experimenting with various regimes, you'll find what suits you and the rifle. Best of luck with it and have fun.

Tackleberrywho

I use Moly and Non Moly.

The .308 has copper in the barrel, the .223 that uses Moly Doesn't

I've been using Moly for the SAME price as Non Moly rounds for around 3 or 4 years now. (I'm not sure when I started using them first)

I've heard nobody complain about Hornady 55Grain Moly Rounds.

I buy in 100's so I try and avoid availability issues, However I have the same issues with availability of .308 NON Moly rounds.

OP, Welcome to teh world of Varminting, massive "Fun"
Yes I did say fun!

dCorbus

Fairy nuff, tac, on the moly front. That's what I meant when I said it's a matter of great debate.

Personally, I won't advise moly - and you, like many others no doubt, will.

The .308 has copper in the barrel

Have you tried cleaning the .308 barrel perhaps?:p
And how do you know that your .223 has no copper fouling in the barrel, if you don't clean it?

I buy in 100's

That's a decent weekend's shooting in my book!:D:rolleyes::D

I have the same issues with availability of .308 NON Moly rounds

Eh?

Availability of certain brands, weights, and types of .308 may or may not be available at all times from all dealers, but I'd be pretty sure I would never be unable to purchase a .308 round at any given time anywhere in the country. Can you say the same about moly's? If so, fair enough. I just believed them to be less readily available in all the weights, types, and brands that non-moly rounds are.

Either way, as I said, to each their own and it's whatever suits the individual shooter and their rifle. There's no right or wrong way of doing any of this (well TBH there is a wrong way - but there are many right ways).

Tackleberrywho

I can't get Hornady, my Brand of choice in .308 in Superperformance

Savage Hunting round.
I'm a major fan of ballistic tipped over softnose, and I'll I can find most times is soft nose.

Currently running HPS which was €179 for 100, I could not afford to be firing 100 of those every weekend (not made of money)

If I can't get ammo I still have Hornady Softnose which is quite accurate in my set up, but not as accurate as TAP or Hopefully Superperformance

In regards cleaning I have Hoppes Benchrest, Forrests Foam and Hoppes No.9 amongst a few.
As copper migrates as a metal is is almost impossible to get it all out.
In a match grade barrel it may be easier remove as the bore is polished finer.

If I could get Moly for the .308 I would!

zaitsev

Anyone know where I can get KG cleaning products here ?
Specifically looking for Kg 1 Carbon Cleaner...

gunhappy_ie

zaitsev wrote: »

Anyone know where I can get KG cleaning products here ?
Specifically looking for Kg 1 Carbon Cleaner...

Gim Griffin supplies all the KG stuff. I cant remember the name of the shop but its in Rathan (spelling ???) in offally.

alternativly ring midlands and ask for him.

Cass

The Tackle Shop, Rahan, Tullamore. 057 93 55979.

dev110

What does people think of the KG cleaning products?

gunhappy_ie

dev110 wrote: »

What does people think of the KG cleaning products?

There cleaning products I havent had experience with but I have used there KG gunkote and wasnt that Impressed.

Ive used MPRO7 (for cleaning) for years now along with Militec-1 (as a lubricant/protector) and have been more than happy

johngalway

Tried KG, won't be buying that stuff again.

Hoppes Benchrest and Shooters Choice now, they seem to work well.

zeissman

I tried KG as well. I thought the carbon cleaner worked well but didnt think much of the copper cleaner

doyle61

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

http://www.otisgun.com/pc_product_detail.asp?key=459AF3413F7A421DB4462B2E01C4F568

$179 I think I'll pass. I was going to get one for my Leatherman MUT, however I think I'll stick with my Parker hale Rods.

Only shi* thing is I need a different rod for the .308 and the .223 as the attachments are not interchangeable

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=18390/Product/CLEANING_RODS

looks like they have gone up in price:eek:. i got my kit for $50 (overseas) and with the attachment and optic kit included it came to less than $100. the price on the web site is a bit steep alright but say someone has a shotgun, a .17hmr, a .223 and say a .308 in their gun safe...........well at that stage $179 doesnt look too bad as the one kit does everything:cool:

Tackleberrywho

doyle61 wrote: »

looks like they have gone up in price:eek:. i got my kit for $50 (overseas) and with the attachment and optic kit included it came to less than $100. the price on the web site is a bit steep alright but say someone has a shotgun, a .17hmr, a .223 and say a .308 in their gun safe...........well at that stage $179 doesnt look too bad as the one kit does everything:cool:

I've a .223 Shotgun and .308, however I have cleaning equip for all of them.

If I could get the kit for less than $100 then I would consider it, as they attach to a leatherman MUT.

Maybe next Christmas

FISMA

Not sure what the concern about bronze brushes is. My concern with the plastic or tornado brushes is whether they will do the job properly, especially in the grooves.

I have cleaned many barrels many times and never had a problem with my bronze brushes.

The main component of bronze is copper, correct? Then, probably tin or something else.

I find it difficult to believe a bronze brush would cause more damage than a bullet, traveling supersonic speeds.

I doubt very much if the metallurgy of today's barrels would allow bronze to scratch it. If it did destroy or harm barrels, I am sure manufacturers would be quick to void lifetime warranties.

Also, I have worn a lot of brushes out. That tells me the brushes are wearing, not the bore. I cannot imagine the brush companies leaving themselves open to the lawsuits that would fly if their brushes were demonstrated to wear barrels.

Unfortunately, I have no studies to back up my theory. If anyone has a study, from either perspective, please advise.

Maybe, I'll do one this summer.:)

gunhappy_ie

FISMA wrote: »

Not sure what the concern about bronze brushes is. My concern with the plastic or tornado brushes is whether they will do the job properly, especially in the grooves.

I have cleaned many barrels many times and never had a problem with my bronze brushes.

The main component of bronze is copper, correct? Then, probably tin or something else.

I find it difficult to believe a bronze brush would cause more damage than a bullet, traveling supersonic speeds.

I doubt very much if the metallurgy of today's barrels would allow bronze to scratch it. If it did destroy or harm barrels, I am sure manufacturers would be quick to void lifetime warranties.

Also, I have worn a lot of brushes out. That tells me the brushes are wearing, not the bore. I cannot imagine the brush companies leaving themselves open to the lawsuits that would fly if their brushes were demonstrated to wear barrels.

Unfortunately, I have no studies to back up my theory. If anyone has a study, from either perspective, please advise.

Maybe, I'll do one this summer.:)

Agreed on the bronze brushes !

In my job Ive seen many many barrels using issued bronze and nylon brushes and Ive never once seen rifle a barrel fail a wear gauge. (failing CHS though is different)

I once had a guy try to tell me that using a Snake bore would damage the crown of my rifle by applying uneven pressure to any side as I pull it out. I swear... i couldnt contain my laughter as i said.... "its made of cotton with a tiny bit of bronze embedded in it". I cant possibly see how, (and after using them myself for years) the bronze in the snakebore could damage barrel steel.

I also think that bore guides while having limited use are 99% complete gimmic !

murph226

could you explain "chs" for me in laymans terms

Cass

I'm assuming Gunhappy is refering to Chamber Head Spacing. This is the "gap" between the bolt face and the chamber face.


The "gap" is illustrated in the diagram below as point A to B.
D = Bolt.
E = Case
C = Receiver.

murph226

Ah headspacing, cheers Ezridax!

Cass

I can only assume that is what he refers to. Cannot think of anything else with that lettering.

gunhappy_ie

Ezridax wrote: »

I'm assuming Gunhappy is refering to Chamber Head Spacing. This is the "gap" between the bolt face and the chamber face.


The "gap" is illustrated in the diagram below as point A to B.
D = Bolt.
E = Case
C = Receiver.

Sorry, Yes, wasnt thinking when I abbreviated that but its Cartridge Head Space.


Actually while not the true defintion, to avoid confusion its best to leave that diagram/description as the definition because in different actions and different calibres have different points to reference head spacing from.