Agonizing Last Words From Someone Who Couldn't Take Any More Of Life

Dudess

Copper23 wrote: »

people playing the suicide card just for attention.

What the hell does that mean?

amacca

Dudess wrote: »

What the hell does that mean?

The occasional person will threaten suicide with no intention of actually carrying out the act....they do just for attention.

A malingerer of sorts ...makes wild claims, craves attention etc.

presume the poster was referring to these people taking up the time of counselors, referral services


although if they are doing this then they need help too so presumably a good counselor will have some way to help them and they probably should be seen by a professional too

pablomakaveli

amacca wrote: »

The occasional person will threaten suicide with no intention of actually carrying out the act....they do just for attention.

Neil Prendeville did that and was criticised for it.

Dudess

I used always say that too: "Oh a person who's really suicidal wouldn't be going on about it" and Sam34, a member here who is a psychiatrist, advised me and others I was wrong. And she is slightly more knowledgeable. People can assume all they want (and that post by Copper23 is full of assumptions) but you can't claim something is a reality, especially in relation to something as serious as this, just because you "think"/"believe" it is.

Demonique

Dudess wrote: »

What the hell does that mean?

Most people who call suicide help lines are just attention whores?

I wonder how the poster came to that conclusion?

amacca

Dudess wrote: »

I used always say that too: "Oh a person who's really suicidal wouldn't be going on about it" and Sam34, a member here who is a psychiatrist, advised me and others I was wrong. And she is slightly more knowledgeable. People can assume all they want (and that post by Copper23 is full of assumptions) but you can't claim something is a reality, especially in relation to something as serious as this, just because you "think"/"believe" it is.

That doesnt however discount the fact that a small percentage (very small) of people do cry wolf for attention seeking reasons etc. I'm in no way trying to say its not a very serious thing even for those crying wolf but to ignore the fact that you cant always take everyone who claims to be suicidal at face value would be silly too - for one thing you might never get to the real bottom of what was making them say this. Their motivation might not be anything to do with depression.


You've heard of people who swallow medical implements so they will be treated or claim they have diseases/sickness so they will be admitted into hospital - and become the center of attention as they see it...you wouldnt just take their word for it if the symptoms did not match what they said they were suffering from?

jill_valentine

I've been persistently suicidally depressed since I was in my young teens. I finally started attending counselling a few years ago as a last resort and I wish I'd done it years before.

Of course it's not a catch all solution, but it does lay the groundwork for you to start sorting yourself out, rather than just pretending there's no problem until it becomes insurmountable.

What f*cking nerve anybody has to tell people it makes no difference. Ye've no idea. It was the stupid pigheaded Irish mindset that kept me away, and it's shamefully irresponsible to throw it around in ignorance.

Dudess

yoshytoshy wrote: »

I commented without reading the whole thing ,can't say I think suicide is something thats justified though.

Even with the man's eloquent reasonings? I agree with him in a way - it's also selfish of people to expect someone else to endure pain and suffering they cannot begin to imagine. That said, I'm not "in favour" of suicide - I'd prefer a world without suicide, where the suicidal person actually gets better and chooses life of their own accord (not for those around them) but if people are driven to such depths of despair that they cannot go on living, it's inexcusable to call them selfish, and displays a serious lack of empathy and understanding. If a person was in horrendous physical pain, there would be plenty of understanding if they signed up to be euthanised, but just because people who are suicidal aren't confined to bed all day (although some are) and generally have full use of their physical faculties, it's considered a different thing - I really don't see how it is though...

dan_d

It's a very sad read....someone who thought he was such an awful human being that there was no point trying to make himself better because he felt he was such a waste of space the world was better off without him.Someone who trusted nobody and felt that he could never be 'normal'.He might have had some hope of help if he had told someone about his childhood experiences, but he never did...
He never gave himself a chance.

I think what they say about people who talk about committing suicide is that they tend to be the ones that want to be stopped.It's those that say nothing about it, that are most likely to do it (which is a paradox in itself).It's not really what you'd call attention seeking.

Either way, people should always know that no matter how badly you think of yourself, no matter how dark the darkness is, try and get help...suicide is not the solution.

Jesus Wept

Talking for the sake of talking or talking to everyone and anyone is usually a bad idea.
Talking to the right people is a very good idea.

hacked

That was a tough read.

The thing people need to realise is that this problem (And by that I mean the child sexual abuse, which is the real problem that LED to the depression) is such a huge huge issue in this country.

I myself was abused as a child. It really does damage you so deeply and create problems in just about every aspect of life.

Although I have been in psych services for 10 years or so I am only about to start trauma therapy for the abuse this next week. It's very tough, but it really does help. For any of you who are considering it...there really is hope out there. Sometimes it takes a while, not every counselor will be a good fit, and it can take time. Sometimes it takes a while for you to figure out what your problems really are and what you need to work on, but when you reach that stage, it's all worth it.

jill_valentine

One thing that is worth noting is that I only availed of help when it was available to me for free and in confidence by my college.

Otherwise, the provisions for depression in Ireland are absolutely farcical. I dread to think what would have happened if I'd been dependent on public services alone.

midlandsmissus

hacked wrote: »

That was a tough read.

The thing people need to realise is that this problem (And by that I mean the child sexual abuse, which is the real problem that LED to the depression) is such a huge huge issue in this country.

I myself was abused as a child. It really does damage you so deeply and create problems in just about every aspect of life.

Although I have been in psych services for 10 years or so I am only about to start trauma therapy for the abuse this next week. It's very tough, but it really does help. For any of you who are considering it...there really is hope out there. Sometimes it takes a while, not every counselor will be a good fit, and it can take time. Sometimes it takes a while for you to figure out what your problems really are and what you need to work on, but when you reach that stage, it's all worth it.

Maybe we could start a support group? Seriously I don't know anywhere you can go where you can talk to survivors.

I do find talking to the few people I have told, that you can see them kind of go "ughh" and they can't really comprehend it, Not their fault but I would like to talk to peop who have gone through the same thing.

Loopy

A very tough read that.
It's very sad to think he felt he had no other way out. He wanted to die badly, I commend him for going ahead instead of living with all that pain.
IMO it's not a cowards way out, I believe it takes great strength to take your own life.

foxinsox

That was a sad read..

RIP

The saddest I thing I think is that there have probably been thousands of suicides (many in Ireland) that we never know why.

I think it is a good thing that this letter is available for many to read, I'm sure many have felt exactly like him (not necessarily as a result of abuse) and maybe have committed suicide just didn't have the ability to write such a letter.

If it makes people more aware/understanding of depression and how it can affect peoples thoughts then this is a good thing.

Please always remember there are people who can help.

hacked

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Maybe we could start a support group? Seriously I don't know anywhere you can go where you can talk to survivors.

I do find talking to the few people I have told, that you can see them kind of go "ughh" and they can't really comprehend it, Not their fault but I would like to talk to peop who have gone through the same thing.

Yes, I understand what you mean! I'm a single mother living on my own and putting myself through uni at the moment. I've been trying to be honest with sme friends about the therapy as I know I could get a bit messed up, but they don't seem to understand and it can just make things worse!

For the record, I'm happy to talk to anyone. There does seem to be very little in the way of support for CSA survivors.

galwayrush

I don't want to read it because things like that pull on my strings, too sad.

KERSPLAT!

Sad read, has really opened my eyes and changed my opinion somewhat on suicide, R.I.P

Robby91

Quite a sad tale to read - RIP

I hope that someone who is on the edge stumbles across this and, despite the man's lack of success in his search for professional help, tries to speak to someone they can trust. I can't say that my situation has been the same, but having someone to talk to helps immeasurably in lightening the burden (IMO)

J2D2

It is very sad, I know someone who tried, and when they told me about how they went about it I knew from what I'd studied about pharmaceuticals in college that what they had done actually had unknowingly saved them in the end. Only because of this failed attempt were they able to receive the care they desperately needed.

That person wouldn't be here today if they hadn't been able to get this treatment and I'm eternally grateful to the counseling services for helping them deal with some very serious personal issues and allowing them to get their life back on track with a lot of hard work.

thebigleap

http://1000memories.com/billzeller

Pics, bio, tributes.

Apparently his closest friends, including those who lived with him, didn't know 80% of what he wrote in the letter and are shocked by his suicide. They say he was a good friend and a mentor to young kids.

For all he went through he did a lot in his short life....

dr.bollocko

Folks please take that stuff to PM. Please post on topic from here on out or not at all.
PM for clarification. No more thread derailment from here on out.
Fair warning.
A number of posts will be removed.
PM with questions about that also if needed.

I think we can safely say that this thread will not be open for much longer.

Copper23

Dudess wrote: »

I used always say that too: "Oh a person who's really suicidal wouldn't be going on about it" and Sam34, a member here who is a psychiatrist, advised me and others I was wrong. And she is slightly more knowledgeable. People can assume all they want (and that post by Copper23 is full of assumptions) but you can't claim something is a reality, especially in relation to something as serious as this, just because you "think"/"believe" it is.

Dudess, I actually wrote a long reply to this but it's quite personal and I ended up really not wanting to post it in public.

When I said "using the suicide card" I meant people pretending they are going to do it and using it to manipulate you to do as they like, things like saying it will be your fault when they are dead if you do not do X. Doing this repeatedly to get your attention or to manipulate you.

What I said what not an assumption. I was talking about my own life experience and some real events which were just absolutely horrifying, heaving dealt with being the subject of this behaviour for a long time. I really didnt want to post personal details so I just kept my reply short here.

stupidusername

thebigleap wrote: »

http://1000memories.com/billzeller

Pics, bio, tributes.

Apparently his closest friends, including those who lived with him, didn't know 80% of what he wrote in the letter and are shocked by his suicide. They say he was a good friend and a mentor to young kids.

For all he went through he did a lot in his short life....

Just goes to show that you can't know a person is doing ok, even if they seem it.

Guill

I liked Lego as a kid.

Darlughda

I first experienced suicidal idealation in 2001. Actually, truth be told, it was as early as 1993 I really felt it.

I tried to take my life in a way that is not necessary to discuss on a social media, and ever since I have struggled with suicidal thoughts.

When all is well, and I am functioning 'normally' it is as inconceivable to me, like it is to others, how a person can be overwhelmed to die by suicide.

I worked with Samaritans and other suicide prevention groups, so I could help others who were about to take their lives.

I had to withdraw from such work, when my own overwhelm overtook me.

Thankfully, I have learnt to know the signs. Through the help of counsellors, and others. Nonetheless, there are times when these feelings hit and overwhelm me. But they do pass.

The urge to self harm and suicide during these times is a force so hard that it is impossible to describe in written terms.

Kimono-Girl

stupidusername wrote: »

Just goes to show that you can't know a person is doing ok, even if they seem it.

that is completely true, you can never know whats going on inside a person's head, i know from my personal experience i said and did some awful unthinkable things, but yet i tried to make everyone else believe i was ok, i was insistent i was ok when inside i was falling apart in more ways then one, people eventually saw through that, but it has shown me people only see what they want to see, nobody saw what i did coming, except me.

eventually the pressure got to me and i wanted out i wasn't thinking about my family, or my friends, or those who loved me, i have to say i felt weak, i felt i wanted to take the painless way out, i overdosed on every prescription medicine i had stored in the two years previous.

people outside your head, they don't see who you are, what you are going through, they will never understand what you've been through, they judge you, tell you to "get on with it", "get over yourself", they haven't felt the hellish feeling of simply not caring enough to live.

I have,

and its changed who i am, i may seem like the same person, but from deep down inside of me, i swore to never be there again, i promised to myself that i needed to do everything i could to make my life livable, i put the past behind me and i am here today living proof,

with the right kind of help others will hopefully be able to restore some kind of happiness and not end up having to take their lives for escape from the pain.

Gunsfortoys

A very sad state of affairs.

He used the route of counselling and it didn't work which is a shame. It goes to show that the longer you leave it the more it manifests and takes over every aspect of your life.

RIP

cian1500ww

Such a shame that a man who has achieved so much in such a short time has to die like this. As a CS student myself, I can only hope to achieve a small fraction of what he has done, he was truly a incredibly intelligent man and who knows how much more he could have achieved.

Rest In Peace Bill, you've earned it...

Millicent

Naikon wrote: »

Who knows. People in general are unpredictable. Best confide in your family members or someone you trust. Not some "health professional". Sorry, I am just skeptical of the general
concept of counselling. It's a great system for compiling statistics, but what about actual help? If the problem is serious enough, I am not so certain of counselling. "Yes but I didn't
mean to drive over the guy 14 times":pac:

Naikon, not trying to pick a fight but have you ever been in the situation where you needed counselling? Nothing in the world feels worse than knowing you are slowly falling apart but then, when you work up the courage to talk to a family member or close friend, they make you feel as if you are wrong, mental, overly dramatic, irritating, whining, deluded, unimportant, a burden, a source of shame, a victim, a drama-queen or worse, they simply ignore you, ridicule you or don't believe you.

Nothing compounds the loneliness and frustration of being that depressed more than the complete apathy of the people who are supposed to care about you. Counsellors, in that instance, are literally lifesaving and not to be made light of.