Need a large saloon car with a diesel engine

Kashkai

I have to get a bigger car to cope with the mountain of stuff my kids like to bring with them. A huge boot, reliability and good fuel economy are my prerequisites.

I'm currently looking at the VW Passat 1.9 and the Mondeo 1.9. Any opinions on either?

Any other alternatives I should consider?

Finally, can you recommend a good dealer in Dublin/Kildare that would provide good aftersales service.

Thanks

boredatwork82

I drive an 03 Skoda Superb. I would definitely recommend the Superb over a Passat.
It is probably the perfect choice for you, only problem is that they are hard to pick up second hand.

Are you buying new or used?

Bought mine from Pat Keogh in Ballybrittas (just outside portlaoise and very accessible from Dublin/Kildare), aftersales with 2 issues was excellent, although they can be really hard to get in touch with - they always seem to be really really busy.

ottostreet

Mitsubishi Galant!

BMW 320d.

Saab 9-3 TID

Volvo V40.

Lex Luthor

ottostreet wrote: »

Mitsubishi Galant!

BMW 320d.

Saab 9-3 TID

Volvo V40.

Cant say the 320d, V40 or 9-3 would have a huge boot in comparison to others.

ki

I drive a A4 Avant and find it great. There is nothing I've failed to fit in the boot when travelling around.

Whats your budget?

SpannerMonkey

I always owned bmw's but boot in 320d is small as is audi A4 best option maybe an estate or if you want to stick with saloon the Ford Mondeo boot is enormous as is the interior or maybe a Mazda 6 or skoda Superb all good options with big spacious interiors and boots

Axe Rake

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

A huge boot, reliability and good fuel economy are my prerequisites.

Skoda Octavia TDI

Max Power1

Axe Rake wrote: »

Skoda Octavia TDI

Spot on

Kashkai

Thanks for the replies.

The next car will be second hand as the depreciation on these cars is crushing, e.g. a local garage close to me has a 2008 1.6 petrol Mondeo with just 30,000 miles for €14,000 asking price. I'd consider it but I think the diesel will be a better bet fuel wise and resale value.

My budget is approx €8,000 (might stretch a little) plus my trade in (2005 Megane Hatch, fsh, NCT until 6/2011 and 40,000 miles on the clock)

I thought about the Superb but they're as rare as hen's teeth.

While I wouldn't disregard estate cars, I have concerns about having the contents of the boot on show to passers by with just a flimsy cover over the contents. Thats why I was looking at saloons as I feel (perhaps wrongly?) that they are more secure.

I'll look further afield than Dublin/Kildare if I can get a good deal and more importantly, good aftersales service.

d2ww

Got an A6 estate myself and the cover works just fine. An estate will give you a lot more flexibility to haul stuff, including kids than a saloon ever will.

cadaliac

Be prepared for repair bills to run well into the hundereds if you have to repair the Dual Mass Flywheel (DMF) on any new diesel.
Likewise the Diesel Particulate Filter. Combine both and you could be looking at near €2k in repairs. This all seems to be happening in or around 100k miles or so. Avoid the VAG 2.0 TDI (140) like the plague.
Now consider the petrol and the option might not seem so bad. A lot of petrol can be bought for €2k.

Kashkai

I've never owned a diesel before but with the better economy/lower fuel pump price/new tax regime, I thought it was the way to go. IMO you won't be able to give away a large petrol powered car in the coming years as they will have annual road tax of €700 upwards whereas a 2 litre diesel would be €156. Saying that, I hadn't thought about ongoing maintenance problems as I thought diesel cars were "tougher" than their petrol equivalents.

Still waiting for tips re. good dealers within a 50 mile radius of north Kildare.

Finally, my preference is still with the Mondeo, Passat, possibly Superb if I could find one. Any experience with these cars???

Cass

Just gonna throw out the Opel Vectra.

My Father currently dirves a 2005 Vectra. Its a 1.9 diesel, however she is the CD(red)ti / SRI model. She is hatchback, but plenty of room and boot space. Has 150bhp as standard although he had a tuning kit installed and now has 189bhp. She is currently doing 53.3 mpg ( 85+ kpg). Has 6 speed box and no end of extras. A full tank of fuel costs €75 - €80 and will get about 900 miles (1500 km).

Now after saying all that he changes the oil himself every 6 weeks and full service every 4 months. He is a qualified mechanic so does these things himself. Seems to be the life of the car.


Anyhow, just another option. No guarantee another Vectra would give the same performance.

Max Power1

ezridax wrote: »

Just gonna throw out the Opel Vectra.

.

Thats the best place for it imo

Cass

Each to their own i suppose.

It has never given him a days trouble and at the end of the day isn't that what you want in a car.

kildare.17hmr

Id have a look at the mondeo before i ruled out petrol. crackin lookin car altho id imagine with your trade in and 8k you would need to come up with a wee bit more €€€. Think i know that local garage if its in your screenname and beside a petrol station.

Cass

Okay getting the impression you all don't like Vectras.

Why?

shawnee

Have a Mondeo tdci, love it and love the space all round

alias no.9

ezridax wrote: »

Okay getting the impression you all don't like Vectras.

Why?

The Vectra was a dreadful buy new because it was so far behind the class leaders in almost every way, bar the 1.9 cdti lump brought in from Fiat, yet it cost just as much. Depreciation is a great remedy for inadequacy so keenly priced second hand models start to make sense against higher priced competitors.

Greenman

Max Power1 wrote: »

Thats the best place for it imo

Everyone to their own but I love my 20 year old 1.7D Vectra, Great car, lots of boot space, trouble free with 5 liters to the 100km.:)

Lex Luthor

yip the Vectra Estate is one big boot..

alias no.9

Greenman wrote: »

Everyone to their own but I love my 20 year old 1.7D Vectra, Great car, lots of boot space, trouble free with 5 liters to the 100km.:)

The Vectra was one of the class leaders 20 years ago, it was the benchmark for the first generation primera and mondeo. Subsequent models didn't maintain that cutting edge over their contemporary rivals.

peckerhead

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

A huge boot, reliability and good fuel economy are my prerequisites.

Axe Rake wrote: »

Skoda Octavia TDI

Max Power1 wrote: »

Spot on

+1

Cass

I owned 2 Vectras years ago. One was a 1.8 petrol and the other a 1.6 petrol. Both were nice cars, roomy, cheap to run and quicker than most cars in their class, as per my impressions (i was young, speed was important-ish). That was 10 - 12 years ago. I have changed style since and have had jeeps for the last 5 years (due to work commitments).

To be honest i have no personal stake in whether the OP goes for a Vectra or not. I only suggested them as Mondeo, Scoda, VW were already mentioned. My Father was thinking of selling his recently and i talked him out of it as for the money he would get for it, he would not find another car of similar performance, style, etc for the same money.

I know people that wouldn't have a Vectra, Mondeo, VW even though others swear by them. Car recommendation is based on the persons personal experiences of them, while others give suggestions without ever having owned one and base their decision on what they've read in a magazine or heard from Jeremy Clarkson.

OP, you are probably best of getting out anf trying a few. Take some test drives, etc. If you have cash and a trade in you are in a good position to get the best posible deal.

pateen

What about the 99-03 model 2.0 D4D Avensis? Maybe:o

bladespin

cadaliac wrote: »

Be prepared for repair bills to run well into the hundereds if you have to repair the Dual Mass Flywheel (DMF) on any new diesel.
Likewise the Diesel Particulate Filter. Combine both and you could be looking at near €2k in repairs. This all seems to be happening in or around 100k miles or so. Avoid the VAG 2.0 TDI (140) like the plague.
Now consider the petrol and the option might not seem so bad. A lot of petrol can be bought for €2k.

That's a big generalisation, not unlike saying petrol cars do less than 10mpg.:eek:

DMF failure isn't as common as you think, some do suffer from it , the mondeo does tend to need a new one aroung the 100k mark as you mention, but many don't. I've coverer well over 400k in 5 diesel cars in the past 10 years and never encountered etither problem you describe as being common.

DPF failure is only common on city diesels, most cars won't have a problem with it, I've never heard of it being common around the 100k mark It's got to do with how the car's driven, they need to be driven over 1500rpm for more than 10 mins per day to clear the filter, if you do this then the chances of a failure are very slight, same reasoning they can go on a car with less than 30k if it's not used correctly.

johnos1984

boredatwork82 wrote: »

Bought mine from Pat Keogh in Ballybrittas

I bought the Golf from hell from form them, after 8 trips back they returned my money and said they couldn't fix the car an apologies-ed

I have to say all things being equal the fact they gave me my money back without argument means I would buy form them again. Very honest and never argued the car wasn't faulty. Lots of people have good things to say about them also.

Personally I'd recommend a Passat but then again I've just purchased one. 2006 TDI SE with 110k miles, total cost €8300 with a full NCT and service

geespot

mondeo chews up and spits out the passat in every way and repairs will be cheaper

Cass

Pat Waters - Kildare (Think he is still open - Anyone?) - Dealt with him

Finlays Ford - Newbridge - Dealth with him

That new car outlet in Kildare - Never dealt with them

bazz26

OP, did you take a look at the Renault Laguna III 1.5 dci, decent size boot and hatchback makes it more practical than a saloon:

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201041199829378
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201021198196543

Kashkai

Plenty of food for thought there lads, thanks.

My brother just bought a diesel Vectra saloon, '06 I think. I was in it last week and was impressed with the space. Perhaps another one to add to the list.

I'm getting rid of my Megane because I've had nothing but bother with it so I wouldn't be in a hurry to buy Renault again. I had a mate who had teh last model Laguna and he hated it as it was so unreliable.

The earlier comment about filter failure had me going but as my daily commute involves about 20 miles of motorway driving with 5 miles of city driving, I don't think that should be a problem.

I'll head out to check out a few dealers at the weekend with the Mondeo still top of the list. However, if I see a Superb and a Vectra in good nick with low mileage, I'll give them a lookover. I don't think my budget will stretch to an Audi estate - pity:(

Leonard Hofstadter

The current generation Passat is best avoided, it will be every bit as unreliable as your Renault.

Don't be fooled by the VW badge!

The Vectra isn't a bad car but it's not a terribly good one either. It is reliable(once you avoid the weedy 1.6 petrol which is prone to HG failure because a little NA petrol engine is completely insufficient for a car that size), but the petrol engines have a reputation for being very underpowered, even the 1.8 is meant to be sluggish.

I'd be looking at the 1.9 CDTI, but the 120 PS version as the 150 is more complicated and has things like swirl flaps(which if they fall off will write off the engine, only 150s have these, 120s don't) and can give timing belt trouble too.

Most Vectras in the country are poverty spec as well.

bladespin

Might be worthwhile looking to the UK (do homework first), plenty of repmobiles for sale, all well looked after, motorway work etc, they're exceptioonal compared to the Irish cars and usually have high level of spec too.

Mr Benevolent

Avoid the Passat, go for the Mondeo.

lukester

Accord? Or an Avensis, much maligned, but fits your bill.

Fey!

A couple of 5 series BMWs here. 2004+, 2.0-2.5 diesel.

galwaytt

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

........While I wouldn't disregard estate cars, I have concerns about having the contents of the boot on show to passers by with just a flimsy cover over the contents. Thats why I was looking at saloons as I feel (perhaps wrongly?) that they are more secure.

...I'm afraid you are a bit misguided in that. The cover is visual, certainly, but the security is physically identical to a saloon. Break the driver's door in either, and it's gone.

I have Saab 9-3 1.9Tid which I rate highly, and it's the estate. I wouldn't say the boot is bigger, than the saloon, but it's infinately easier to access to get stuff in/out of. For this reason any estate, or the Octavia, is, imho, a good choice if it's priority for you. Now, and Octavia estate......now that would the icing on the cake !

Two of my friend's have Octavia estate's. Makes mine look small !

galwaytt

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

Plenty of food for thought there lads, thanks.

My brother just bought a diesel Vectra saloon, '06 I think. I was in it last week and was impressed with the space. Perhaps another one to add to the list.(

...that's the same as the 9-3 actually, including the engine. The Saab would have a few more toys, usually.

Ferocious

What are the major problems with VAG 2.0 140bph?
Was planning on buying a Passat in the next few weeks.

Drove an Accord but it just felt cheaper, noisy, and not very responsive for a 140? The new Mondeo is outside the budget becase its a bit too new.
Have a 320cd. Powerful and good to drive but it's been troublesome and expensive each time, and its not very economical versus the models above. Plus the boot is small.

antomorro-sei

Honda Accord, 2.2 diesel?

Mr Benevolent

Ferocious wrote: »

What are the major problems with VAG 2.0 140bph?
Was planning on buying a Passat in the next few weeks.

DPF, DMF, oil pump & turbo problems, electric issues, rattles, glovebox creaking, the list goes on. The first two apply to all new CR diesels.

lukester

I have the 2.0 VAG TDI PD engine, i.e. no DPF, and have had no issue with it so far. I hang out on some of the VAG forums too, appears anecdotally there are more issues with the newer CR engines. I have had mine maintained religiously, which may be a factor. My local independent mechanic sees a lot of them and says they're generally reliable, but need to be 'minded', i.e. serviced regularly.

@ the OP, the 2003 onwards Accords are excellent imo, very refined diesel engine.

galwaytt

Confab wrote: »

DPF, DMF, oil pump & turbo problems, electric issues, rattles, glovebox creaking, the list goes on. The first two apply to all new CR diesels.

...the 2.0CR Passat.......let me put it this way: the one that's outside my window has the towing eye left permanently in place..........I wouldn't trust it to cross the road.

Waterford26

Mondeo estate 2.0TDCi would suit u ..just ask the seller about service history..specialy INJECTORS!!! ..perfect car otherwise. reliable,very easy on diesel and powerful enough.

geespot

have a 2002 mondeo tdci ex taxi with 200k and it drives perfect and having driven a 2004 passat tdi the mondeo leaves it sitting with regard to power road holding and noise

Green Hornet

The Accord is a good motor. Reliable and reasonably cheap to run. The only downside is that I find it a little bit soul-less but thats not really a big issue compared to having a car that has a lot of breakdowns!

Lex Luthor

i work with a guy who has driven passat diesels for yeaes, swears by them and has recently been driving a mondeo for work and says it beats passats in every dept

kildare.17hmr

geespot wrote: »

have a 2002 mondeo tdci ex taxi with 200k and it drives perfect and having driven a 2004 passat tdi the mondeo leaves it sitting with regard to power road holding and noise

I reckon that was bottom of the pile basic passat. The diesel mondeo of 2002 does not compare to the passat tdi 2004 model, the passat is a far superier car and with the higher BHP engine it will leave your mondeo standing in every way

cadaliac

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

I reckon that was bottom of the pile basic passat. The diesel mondeo of 2002 does not compare to the passat tdi 2004 model, the passat is a far superier car and with the higher BHP engine it will leave your mondeo standing in every way

You are all wrong there I'm afraid. If it was a basic passat or a 130 bhp passat - they all handle like pigs, nose heavy, understeer and don't stop as well as you might think. Push a Passat through a corner and your palms will sweat from fear.
Older Mondeo was (and is) a dinger on the road. No comparison.

kildare.17hmr

cadaliac wrote: »

You are all wrong there I'm afraid. If it was a basic passat or a 130 bhp passat - they all handle like pigs, nose heavy, understeer and don't stop as well as you might think. Push a Passat through a corner and your palms will sweat from fear.
Older Mondeo was (and is) a dinger on the road. No comparison.

Well i disagree, i would consider the passat a much better car than the mondeo. I have had many of both and absolutely hate the diesel mondeo and id switch my opinion with regards to the new models of both

Waterford26

passat?? bleeee.. dont pay just for VW mark. Mondeo cant be beaten in handling..one of the best suspension ever. Avoid hundred's years old TDI engines from VW.