The Eagles Return

E39MSport

Birdnuts wrote: »

My impression was that rural Kerry has more then its fair share of Gombeens:( - the farmers I meet in these parts seem alot more clued in and knowledgeable about conservation issues though of course you can get bad apples anywhere that can do a totally disproportionate amount of damage in any area. Personally i thought Kerry was the wrong choice for this once those ridiculous protests started which highlighted the deep-rooted ignorance of the issues among some in the farming community there. Somewhere like the upper Shannon Lakelands may have been more suiteable!!

Good point. One of the birds has been tracked circumnavigating the island however which means one bad apple can ultimately ruin the entire project.
What a downer.

LostCovey

E39MSport wrote: »

Good point. One of the birds has been tracked circumnavigating the island however which means one bad apple can ultimately ruin the entire project.
What a downer.

This is really a key point. These birds are released into Irish skies, they do not stay in the same parish all their life.

A Red Kite released in Wicklow was poisoned in Dromahair, Co Leitrim. A Golden Eagle hatched in north Donegal was poisoned on the back of Ben Bulben, Co Sligo. A White-tailed Eagle released in Co. Kerry was shot dead on Lough Neagh, in Co Armagh.

And fair play to Crossing The Line Films, what a fantastic documentary series. So proud to see an Irish film company making something of this quality. More power to them.

LostCovey

LostCovey

sables2

E39MSport wrote: »

Good point. One of the birds has been tracked circumnavigating the island however which means one bad apple can ultimately ruin the entire project.
What a downer.

Well said. One bad apple...ehhh!! seems we CAN'T afford that 'bad apple' - unlike a tree which produces 100,000's!
Long live this re-introduction

Feargal as Luimneach

A good review of the golden eagle re-introduction in Donegal:
I

http://www.snh.org.uk/pdfs/scottish/IrishGoldenEagleProject.pdf

Review of Irish Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project:

donation of Scottish birds under licence issued by SNH

The Review Group notes that the indicator of successful establishment was
based on a minimum 40% pre-breeding survival figure, which Whitfield et al
(2006; see Annex 2) specified as the lower limit for a population to achieve
favourable conservation status. The actual number of pairs established (7 pairs
in 2007, and 6 pairs in 2008) closely matches the predicted number based on
40% pre-breeding survival estimate (6 pairs in 2007, and 8 pairs in 2008),
suggesting that the reintroduction is on track to meet its aims.
To date five released birds are known to have died (one poisoned, the others
dying naturally) and the Project team considers that a minimum of 15-20 birds
are still alive (see Annex 3). TheGroup Review concludes that the project

appears to be on track to meet its aims for population re-establishment.


Edit: This report from april 2009 not from 2010

sables2

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

A good review of the golden eagle re-introduction in Donegal:
I

http://www.snh.org.uk/pdfs/scottish/IrishGoldenEagleProject.pdf

Review of Irish Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project:

donation of Scottish birds under licence issued by SNH

The Review Group notes that the indicator of successful establishment was
based on a minimum 40% pre-breeding survival figure, which Whitfield et al
(2006; see Annex 2) specified as the lower limit for a population to achieve
favourable conservation status. The actual number of pairs established (7 pairs
in 2007, and 6 pairs in 2008) closely matches the predicted number based on
40% pre-breeding survival estimate (6 pairs in 2007, and 8 pairs in 2008),
suggesting that the reintroduction is on track to meet its aims.
To date five released birds are known to have died (one poisoned, the others
dying naturally) and the Project team considers that a minimum of 15-20 birds
are still alive (see Annex 3).

TheGroup Review concludes that the project

appears to be on track to meet its aims for population re-establishment.


Edit: This report from april 2009 not from 2010

Hi Feargal. Look like a very detailed 'Review of the golden eagle re-introduction project'. Can't wait to read it. Thanks

bogtreader

The Norwegian ambassador was on Mooney goes wild on Friday
He said they were still going continue to supply White tailed sea eagles to
that project the interview is available as a podcast
www.rte.ie/radio1/podcast/podcast_mooney.xml
Hopefully the link will work sorry if not just go to www.rte.ie/mooney
podcasts is on the left
Is it true that John Gormley has put the banning of poisoning on the statue books?

Birdnuts

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

A good review of the golden eagle re-introduction in Donegal:
I

http://www.snh.org.uk/pdfs/scottish/IrishGoldenEagleProject.pdf

Review of Irish Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project:

donation of Scottish birds under licence issued by SNH

The Review Group notes that the indicator of successful establishment was
based on a minimum 40% pre-breeding survival figure, which Whitfield et al
(2006; see Annex 2) specified as the lower limit for a population to achieve
favourable conservation status. The actual number of pairs established (7 pairs
in 2007, and 6 pairs in 2008) closely matches the predicted number based on
40% pre-breeding survival estimate (6 pairs in 2007, and 8 pairs in 2008),
suggesting that the reintroduction is on track to meet its aims.
To date five released birds are known to have died (one poisoned, the others
dying naturally) and the Project team considers that a minimum of 15-20 birds
are still alive (see Annex 3). TheGroup Review concludes that the project

appears to be on track to meet its aims for population re-establishment.


Edit: This report from april 2009 not from 2010

It can't be judged a total success though for at least another 10-15 years

E39MSport

Birdnuts wrote: »

It can't be judged a total success though for at least another 10-15 years

With you there.

sables2

bogtreader wrote: »

The Norwegian ambassador was on Mooney goes wild on Friday
He said they were still going continue to supply White tailed sea eagles to
that project the interview is available as a podcast
www.rte.ie/radio1/podcast/podcast_mooney.xml
Hopefully the link will work sorry if not just go to www.rte.ie/mooney
podcasts is on the left
Is it true that John Gormley has put the banning of poisoning on the statue books?

Hi bogtreader. I was birding when The Mooney show was on!....(how ironic- as he was talking birds too!) It's SO exciting to hear that the Norwegian ambassador said: White tailed sea eagles are 'still' going to be supplied.Your correct about the:banning of poisoning by John Gormley. I think it will still happen mind you. Let's NOT kid ourselves. I hate been pessimistic. I think we can ALL be hopeful for our birds of prey. Our young people...(25 up) can instil this message on again to their children/friends also. (God Bless The Eagle Trust)

Feargal as Luimneach

Birdnuts wrote: »

It can't be judged a total success though for at least another 10-15 years

You're probably correct, maybe I'm being too optimistic.

bogtreader

It will take a while to change the mind set Fingers crossed not to many birds of prey fall victim to poisoning.

sables2

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

You're probably correct, maybe I'm being too optimistic.

Hi Feargal. Your not too optimistic...your been 'positive': we need it. I think We need to produce a sizeable eagle population/or pair's...(and other raptors too) year on year to sustain and have a relative growth, so there's enough hens. I believe the birds/cocks have better all round life spans...(correct me..) God forbid, if one hen dies..for what ever reason, there will be another round the corner, so to speak, to lay, and hopefully her eggs will hatch and chick's will grow. It's a 'probable' fairy tale.

recedite

What a lot of people fail to realise is that in the spring lambing season of 2010 it was legal to leave out poisoned carcasses, on open hillsides, where the raptors would naturally find them. From now on this practice is illegal. We are one of the last euro countries to ban it, but better late than never.

The new law can be found here;
http://www.environ.ie/en/Heritage/NationalParksandWildlife/RHLegislation/FileDownLoad,24240,en.pdf

Relevant bit is on page 5;

"Prohibition of use of certain poisoned bait
4. (1) A person shall not place, cause to be placed or permit to be placed or
have with him or her any poisoned or anaesthetic bait that is animal or contains animal substance or other animal derivative in any place to capture, kill, poison, stupefy, anaesthetise, harm or injure or where it is likely to capture, kill, poison, stupefy, anaesthetise, harm or injure:
(i) any species referred to in Article 1 of the Birds Directive, or

(ii) any species of wild fauna listed in Annexes IV

Habitats Directive, except in accordance with a licence."

My own interpretation of the above is that the poisoners will still put bait out for foxes, but they will have to cover it or hide it, and this will make all the difference to the survival of the raptors.

sables2

recedite wrote: »

What a lot of people fail to realise is that in the spring lambing season of 2010 it was legal to leave out poisoned carcasses, on open hillsides, where the raptors would naturally find them. From now on this practice is illegal. We are one of the last euro countries to ban it, but better late than never.

The new law can be found here;
http://www.environ.ie/en/Heritage/NationalParksandWildlife/RHLegislation/FileDownLoad,24240,en.pdf

Relevant bit is on page 5;

"Prohibition of use of certain poisoned bait
4. (1) A person shall not place, cause to be placed or permit to be placed or
have with him or her any poisoned or anaesthetic bait that is animal or contains animal substance or other animal derivative in any place to capture, kill, poison, stupefy, anaesthetise, harm or injure or where it is likely to capture, kill, poison, stupefy, anaesthetise, harm or injure:
(i) any species referred to in Article 1 of the Birds Directive, or

(ii) any species of wild fauna listed in Annexes IV

Habitats Directive, except in accordance with a licence."

My own interpretation of the above is that the poisoners will still put bait out for foxes, but they will have to cover it or hide it, and this will make all the difference to the survival of the raptors.

Hi recedite,
That's interesting: the only country in the Euro zone to introduce the laws ONLY NOW! Emmm...isn't that saying a lot of Ireland and it's policies?? We are a joke..PERIOD! I'm sure the Norwegians are have a right 'ole laugh at us - seriously. The new banning law is very informative and thoughtful, but, now ENFORCING it stringently is an other ball game entirely! God Bless the Eagle Trust.

fryup

did any of you watch yesterday's progamme...they were hand feeding a poisoned eagle at the start but they didn't update on his condition...did he survive?

Hells Belle

fryup wrote: »

did any of you watch yesterday's progamme...they were hand feeding a poisoned eagle at the start but they didn't update on his condition...did he survive?

He did, the little guy was let go a few days (4?) later, they put him down on the grass and he took a few steps and flew off, twas lovely

The little golden eagle chick that was taken out of the nest didn't survive though.

Feargal as Luimneach

fryup wrote: »

did any of you watch yesterday's progamme...they were hand feeding a poisoned eagle at the start but they didn't update on his condition...did he survive?

You can see the whole programm on rté player. Here's the link:
http://www.rte.ie/player/#v=1083931

Was heartbreaking to see Conall lying dead (murdered) on the side of the hill. The bastard who did that to him should be poisoned with the same stuff he/she used on Conall. What's makes it worse was that Conall was Irish, he wasn't a Scottish Bird.:(

Still there was alot of hope in the Programm. 12 Irish Red kites now in Wicklow and 3 more Irish Golden Eagles in Donegal. Sea Eagles reaching maturity and the chance of Irish Sea Eagle chicks next year.:)

Rainbowsend

It was a good series, but I would have liked to have seen it in one programme with all the repeated bits cut out, the first half of each episode was taken up with repeating what had happened the week before, but I did enjoy it.

sables2

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

You can see the whole programm on rté player. Here's the link:
http://www.rte.ie/player/#v=1083931

Was heartbreaking to see Conall lying dead (murdered) on the side of the hill. The bastard who did that to him should be poisoned with the same stuff he/she used on Conall. What's makes it worse was that Conall was Irish, he wasn't a Scottish Bird.:(

Still there was alot of hope in the Programm. 12 Irish Red kites now in Wicklow and 3 more Irish Golden Eagles in Donegal. Sea Eagles reaching maturity and the chance of Irish Sea Eagle chicks next year.:)

I fully empathise with you Feargal: The bird (conall) was found at the hillside. He HAD to have been poisoned deliberately as farmers used poison indiscriminately around that area - no doubt. I've a feeling conall died a slow agonising death on that frozen wasteland. That farmer KNOWS who he/(she?) is: NO QUESTION! I was 'gutted' when i saw Lorcan holding conall, I'm sure he shed a tear or two after the filming. These fu****s should be hung out to dry...i'm not the better for watching it. Mind you - after seeing the poisoned eagle recover and fly off was breath taking. the vet in question is a 'genius'. Also, when the lads found the Red Kite chicks high up in the nest was a sight for sore eyes, it made you feel: it was all worth it. Pity the programme is finished. God Bless the Eagle Trust.

littlebug

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

You can see the whole programm on rté player. Here's the link:
http://www.rte.ie/player/#v=1083931

I've been working when these were on so missed them so thanks for the link. I just watched the last one. Fantastic programme. I'll watch the others through the week. I'm glad I watched the last one first as there is a real sense of optimism at the end.

rog1985

T'was a great programme. I hope it raises interest levels and there will be more demand for productions in that ilk!

Alun

I agree with Rainbowsend, a great series, but what with all the "Previously on .." and "In next weeks program ...", the identical quite lengthy preamble for each episode, and other duplicated footage, they could probably have squeezed the entire 4 part series into one 1 hour program and it would have been more enjoyable much less irritating. That's 'modern' program making for you though, I guess, designed for people with the memory and attention span of a fly .

magicbastarder

if it was an independent production, it might have been a way for them to get more money from RTE.

sables2

littlebug wrote: »

I've been working when these were on so missed them so thanks for the link. I just watched the last one. Fantastic programme. I'll watch the others through the week. I'm glad I watched the last one first as there is a real sense of optimism at the end.

Hi littlebug. Great programme indeed. One thing about it: Someone mentioned in a thread here that it should have been played all together - i agree. Blink and you'd miss it. Your right about: 'real sense of optimism at the end', and there is. look at the Red Kite re-introduction, it seems to be going to plan. As one guy on here says: he saw one in Co. Carlow today or yesterday. they ARE spreading and hopefully getting more confident in their relatively new landscape. God Bless the Eagle Trust.

magicbastarder

on autumnwatch last night, they talked about the sea eagle reintroduction in scotland; which started in 1969 and it was 1985 (i think) before they had their first successful breeding. but they had a steeper learning curve as they had no real precedent.

sables2

magicbastarder wrote: »

on autumnwatch last night, they talked about the sea eagle reintroduction in scotland; which started in 1969 and it was 1985 (i think) before they had their first successful breeding. but they had a steeper learning curve as they had no real precedent.

Hi magicbastarder,
Saw the programme. Very good too. The sea eagle was a 'sight for sore eyes'. Their HUGE raptors with real presence of power over the sky's. I didn't think the re-introduction went back as far as 1969 though. Now there is an abundance of wildlife there. Otters, eagles, hawks, hobby's, seals, deer,..you name it. I envied the guys working on that beautiful Island: Orkney.

Birdnuts

sables2 wrote: »

Hi magicbastarder,
. I didn't think the re-introduction went back as far as 1969 though. .

Correct - it was 1975:)

snowstreams

I saw a program a 2 years ago about the reintroduction to scotland.
It did say that 4 sea eagles were released on the remote island Fair isle between shetland and orkney in 1968. Those 4 eagles disappeared shortly after release. probably dieing at sea because it was such a remote island.
They even released 3 sea eagles back in 1959 according to this link.
http://www.roydennis.org/sea-eagle/
So the reintroduction didnt start properly untill 1975 on Rum, which was far more suited to them.

Those 1959 & 1968 attempts were probably not real attempts, like Charley Haugheys attempt with 2 sea eagles on Inishvickillane, Kerry in 93.

Mothman

The last 11 posts in this thread were moved to another recent thread.

From now on most if not all discussion with regard to poisoning of raptors etc in this forum will be moved to thread linked above titled Penalties for poisoning birds of prey introduced.

1squidge

I thought this was an excellant documentary and gave a great insight into the workings of the reintroduction programme. Hopefully it will turn out to be a success and a follow up programme will be made on the progress of this scheme. Ger.