"Maynooth Students' Union Snubs Hanafin Visit"

banquo

We're dressing up as professions. Dunno what I should go as. Might just look like I'm emigrating by wearing a suit and have a suitcase with a "Bangor, Wales" sticker on it.

Ian Beale

banquo wrote: »

We're dressing up as professions. Dunno what I should go as. Might just look like I'm emigrating by wearing a suit and have a suitcase with a "Bangor, Wales" sticker on it.

I see what you did there :cool:

TouchingVirus

banquo wrote: »

We're dressing up as professions. Dunno what I should go as. Might just look like I'm emigrating by wearing a suit and have a suitcase with a "Bangor, Wales" sticker on it.

ZING! Take that Prof. John Hughes

@funky penguin: LOL! Iontas is already well broken in. It's hosted easily 10 receptions at this stage, from the IASIL conference to the Anthropology conference and a few other bits and pieces

freeze4real

J.D.R wrote: »

I don't mean to get personal, but just because you may think 2500 is a pittance definitely does not mean others do. I can personally say if it wasn't for the grant scheme I would not have any chance of being able to afford college, and that's at the current €1500 level.

If it was raised to a further €2500 it would put too much strain on the committee and would therefore seriously restrict the amount of aid they could issue those who need it to gain a third level education.

Tbh guys 1500 - 2500 is t alot compared to what non eu international students will pay.
They're paying up to 14000 depending on their courses.

Although I agree with the point that it a waste of talent.

mickstupp

It may be true to say that the cost is not much compared to that in other countries, or paid by any other students, but I completely fail to see how that's even remotely relevant to anyone having the slightest difficulty in paying the fees.

freeze4real

mickstupp wrote: »

It may be true to say that the cost is not much compared to that in other countries, or paid by any other students, but I completely fail to see how that's even remotely relevant to anyone having the slightest difficulty in paying the fees.

what I'm saying is 1500 is not much.
For me its not knowing that I could be paying worse.
some other guy here said something about others making it to college even though they couldn't afford it.
Or i think that was what he said.

there are credit unions AFAIK the banks do loans that you can pay when you've graduated and you have a job,
please correct me if i'm wrong.

And speaking of grants 80 percent of all Irish might be able to get it or more correct me again if i'm wrong because the criteria's are straight forward.

J.D.R

freeze4real wrote: »

there are credit unions AFAIK the banks do loans that you can pay when you've graduated and you have a job,
please correct me if i'm wrong.

These loans are based on your credit history and your parents income status, which for many, rules them out of getting a loan.

I completely agree with what Irish_Goat said, about it being high time that there was a government backed state system of low interest student loans, where the policy of handing out loans is not based on your parents.

mickstupp

^I'd sign up for one in a second if I could pay it back after getting me qualification. Whether that be in the form of extra tax, or just when my earnings reach a particular level. I'd be there in a heartbeat.

freeze4real wrote: »

what I'm saying is 1500 is not much.
For me its not knowing that I could be paying worse.
some other guy here said something about others making it to college even though they couldn't afford it.
Or i think that was what he said.

there are credit unions AFAIK the banks do loans that you can pay when you've graduated and you have a job,
please correct me if i'm wrong.

And speaking of grants 80 percent of all Irish might be able to get it or more correct me again if i'm wrong because the criteria's are straight forward.

1500 is also not much compared to the military budget of Mongolia, especially when you throw in 17 Mini Coopers and an elephant. And neither that nor the cost of fees in literally anywhere else in the universe, or for anyone else, has the slightest relevance to someone who can't afford fees here and now. You may just as well say why are you complaining about 1500, sure would you look at those bananas over there!

I don't know if the banks do loans that you can pay when you've graduated or have a job. It's the first I've heard of it in this country. I wish I'd heard of it a month ago. Of course, maybe those loans exist if you're lucky enough to have a guarantor, or a job, or a decent amount of savings, or etc. Again, I don't know. I'll take your word for it. But just because banks exist and loan money to people in general, doesn't necessarily mean they're going to give a person a loan. People get refused loans all the time, even people with perfect credit ratings.

I don't know the exact number, but I'll take your word for the 80% on grants. I'd just point out that the 20% who don't get grants are not made up entirely of people who can afford it and therefore don't pass through the means testing system. There may be relatively few people who fall through the cracks, and the criteria may be straightforward, but the means testing system in this country is broken. If a person doesn't get a grant, you cannot assume it's because they can afford it. And the same if a person does get a grant, that doesn't mean everything's peachy. The point being everyone's situation is different. Generally comparing the cost to literally anything else is irrelevant to the particular person having problems coming up with the money.

Based on recent evidence from elsewhere, I'd like to apologise if I offended you in this post. I appear to do that quite a lot because I'm not careful enough with my words or tone. So just in case... I'm not intending to offend you or to be a prick.

ChristopherUno

I would just like to congratulate the SU for its stance on the Hanaffin visit. The letter they drafted really captured the feelings of myself and everyone I know in my own situation. Anyone I know who graduated last year is either on the dole or emigrating, I don't know anyone who has managed to secure any decent full- or even part-time work here in Ireland. If the government think they can have a day off this close to a make or break budget it shows how seriously they take the country's situation to be.

On the subject of grants, I come from a single parent family and am going into my final year of college in Maynooth. My brother graduated from the same institution last year and is unemployed. We were on 1/2 grant last year but now as he's finished his degree we've both been cut off. My mam checked it out and turns out her wages are €50 over the limit for getting a maintenance grant. Without the grant and at present without any sort of job (not for want of trying) I'll struggle to make ends meet this year. €1,500 is a pittance compared to other countries, this is true. But Ireland also has a pathetic system in place for helping students through college. It's all based on a Celtic Tiger mindset of "ah sure their parents have loads of disposable income *pause for pat on back* let them pay for it". But now with many families in debt and incomes severely reduced (my mam works in the public sector, thank God she's still got a job though) this system is no longer feasible. But don't worry, I'm sure the government have a plan to help us out...

banquo

The grant system,designed in theory to bring equality, is a joke.

Anyone else out for the protest on Thursday?

CFC1905_NK

Kiwi_knock wrote: »

If they are looking at famous alumni to open the building they may as well have opted for Craig Doyle.

Or Sean Munsanje(the male presenter off Xposé)

ILBondo

hypersquirrel wrote: »

2500 is a pittance compared to other countries. Honestly I don't see that we have anything to complain about here.

Il have to pull you up on that one. of the other fee charging countries in Europe, Austria, Luxembourg, Germany, Portugal, France charge much less than our €1500 and in the UK they have a students loan system. Here most institutions wont let you get a student card until you've paid the full amount, and banks aren't exactly forthcoming with lending these days.

hypersquirrel

ILBondo wrote: »

Il have to pull you up on that one. of the other fee charging countries in Europe, Austria, Luxembourg, Germany, Portugal, France charge much less than our €1500 and in the UK they have a students loan system. Here most institutions wont let you get a student card until you've paid the full amount, and banks aren't exactly forthcoming with lending these days.

I'll accept that point but it still stands that we have it better then many others.

There has been a huge amount of discussion regarding removing fee exemption in Germany over the last few years.

Italy is pretty much on a par with us.
The Dutch €5000 plus.
Uk £3000 plus
US $5000 plus
Canada $9000 plus

It seems to me that the main issue for most people is that their isn't a proper student loan system. I would agree with that but I suggested that to some of the people I know and they weren't willing to make that compromise.

I finished my undergraduate degree with no debt whatsoever. Any of my family in the UK have left with a minimum of £8000 debt while some of them are as much as £16000 in debt.

I for one am grateful we have it as easy as we do. I worked all throughout my degree and had no difficulty in paying despite having no grant assistance. It simply meant I couldn't afford to go out and get hammered every weekend and or go on a two week holiday during the summer.

ILBondo

I also had to work part time during college and TWO jobs during the summer just to pay the registration fee which was then just over €800. These days the registration fee is double that figure and jobs are much scarcer than they were when i was doing my undergrad. What was a problem back then, is an even bigger problem now. The reg fee at its current level is even more unfair than a deferred loan system or a graduate tax, but i support neither of those options.

hypersquirrel

ILBondo wrote: »

I also had to work part time during college and TWO jobs during the summer just to pay the registration fee which was then just over €800. These days the registration fee is double that figure and jobs are much scarcer than they were when i was doing my undergrad. What was a problem back then, is an even bigger problem now. The reg fee at its current level is even more unfair than a deferred loan system or a graduate tax, but i support neither of those options.

That is exactly my point. The people that complain about fees are the same ones that don't want a deferred loan system or graduate tax etc etc. The fact of the matter is that a compromise is needed.

Speaking as a postgrad who pays fees I can say now that it is possible.

Anyway this is getting way off topic so I'm going to leave this to another thread.

ILBondo

I think a compromise would be to increase Ireland's Education spending to the OECD average, even under the boom years it lagged a precentage point beneath it. Investment in education is a good investment as it helps recovery. http://bit.ly/b5KRxN

funky penguin

TouchingVirus wrote: »

ZING! Take that Prof. John Hughes

@funky penguin: LOL! Iontas is already well broken in. It's hosted easily 10 receptions at this stage, from the IASIL conference to the Anthropology conference and a few other bits and pieces

I meant personally

Kinski

Is in today's Independent...

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/hanafin-to-face-protests-at-her-former-university-2335240.html

A GUARD of "dishonour" will await Education Minister Mary Hanafin when she visits her alma mater this week. Furious students attending NUI Maynooth are planning to protest at her visit to the college on Thursday morning.
The opening of the new Iontas building will be marred by the protest, students are warning.
In a letter to NUI Maynooth president Prof John Hughes, the Students' Union said: "The Cabinet is considering further cuts to basic student services and to the third-level sector. It is unclear to us why the university should be honouring the minister, even though she is a notable graduate, at this time."

Not showing up = 'guard of dishonour'? They make it sound a little dramatic.

irish_goat

Kinski wrote: »

Is in today's Independent...

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/hanafin-to-face-protests-at-her-former-university-2335240.html




Not showing up = 'guard of dishonour'? They make it sound a little dramatic.

They are showing up.

Alt_Grrr

Kinski wrote: »

Is in today's Independent...

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/hanafin-to-face-protests-at-her-former-university-2335240.html




Not showing up = 'guard of dishonour'? They make it sound a little dramatic.

did you not read the bit about the planned protest??

Kinski

irish_goat wrote: »

They are showing up.

Alt_Grrr wrote: »

did you not read the bit about the planned protest??

Oops, my bad! I thought they were just boycotting it...must read things properly in future!

Ian Beale

Have a read of this, gave me a bit of a laugh link I think he's missing the point, student unions exist to fight for student rights and are there to support students :rolleyes:

the_observer

Word is definitely getting out. I've been talking to mates from other colleges and they're really curious about it

Rafcam

Fair play to the Student Union for taking a stand. I would love to go but have Orientation and Registration on that day. I might get a glimpse of it at some stage though.

Duddy

just found out I have Thursday off, so I'll be there
Wonder if there'll be an OFF protest against the protest?:p

banquo

/en route to protest singing rebel songs

banquo

Protest going extremely well.

TouchingVirus

Fair play to all who showed up, looks like it went well. You got face time with the Minister and the SU president got to relay the four points you folks needed to get across. Sure, the silent part of the protest was marred by the socialist party or whoever it was but even so, a good turnout and a point well made in front of RTE and TV3

Nice of one of the honourary doctorate receivers (Hans Walter Gabler) to come out and have a chat with the protesters too. As a big advocate for scholarly endeavours and such he'd most likely supports the calls for free education and better grants systems for disadvantaged students.

the_observer

That was interesting. Got a few quotes and a load of pictures out of it.

MaynoothSU

Went swimmingly. Thanks to all who showed up, you should be very proud.