Unsigned Bands in Dublin

MilanPan!c

Orando Broom wrote: »

It could be worse lads....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcibYABRm9E

That gives Sonic Youth a run for their money!

AMAZING!

Orando Broom

drumdrum wrote: »

Ah dude you've just brightened up my day!!
Thats hilarious!!

Heres another one!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjeMDvCdrtc

Holy Jaysus!!! hahahaaa!! The keyboard!!

maccored

though completely urelated, I always thought this was hilarious

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IagcDon-ZJk

bassbomber

on a more related note i feel that the scene here in dublin has far too many problems for an unsigned band to get any sort of real fanbase. im in an unsigned band and were liked enough for people we dont know to turn up, we do get an ok crowd but yet still we lack a decent amount of new fans were seeing the same people turn up. half the problem is dublin lacks any good venues and second many of the ones we do play are aimmed at people who make an effort to go see bands but yet the only people willing to do that are people who are already fans of a band. pub gigs are mainly for cover bands and in most cases a no go zone for people who want to show any sort of originallity. basically dublin is too small for a band to get big. for most of us in unsigned bands this is very frustrating. Advertising for gigs is almost disgraceful this is why bands are not getting signed here because no one knows where the hell to find the good bands.

ok my rant is over u may continue the awesome youtube vids XD

Orando Broom

bassbomber wrote: »

on a more related note i feel that the scene here in dublin has far too many problems for an unsigned band to get any sort of real fanbase. im in an unsigned band and were liked enough for people we dont know to turn up, we do get an ok crowd but yet still we lack a decent amount of new fans were seeing the same people turn up. half the problem is dublin lacks any good venues and second many of the ones we do play are aimmed at people who make an effort to go see bands but yet the only people willing to do that are people who are already fans of a band. pub gigs are mainly for cover bands and in most cases a no go zone for people who want to show any sort of originallity. basically dublin is too small for a band to get big. for most of us in unsigned bands this is very frustrating. Advertising for gigs is almost disgraceful this is why bands are not getting signed here because no one knows where the hell to find the good bands.

ok my rant is over u may continue the awesome youtube vids XD

This is an good point. There is a distinct lack of passing trade in pubs in Dublin that cater for the original band scene. The ordinary 5/8 tend want to hear the 'hits'. Pubs want to cater for this. They have no interest in having an original band. I can make more money playing covers of Don't stop Belivin' than I can doing original music (This may be about to change). Pubs tend to favour DJ's or cover bands to provide the live entertainment.

An interesting aside, Revenue is going to start pursuing musicians who are nixering (the lads who do the pub covers circuit) in a big way. It might put a lot of the original bnads competition out of business.


Now the bands themselves also have to share the blame. How many of your peers do you know have gone round to pubs not normally associated with the scene and offered their services for free? Pubs are running into trouble and have several quiet nights. How many have stepped outside the scene bubble and tried to expand their audience in different pubs. Dublin bands tend to be very passive and expect the corwd to come to them. Maybe they need to work a little harder.

I would also suggest that bands try to eschew the family and friends brigade and force themselves to work for thier audience. It's nice to support your siblins/mates etc. but you have to wean them off the tit at some point.

Waking-Dreams

Orando Broom wrote: »

They have no interest in having an original band.

Pubs have no interest in supporting original bands that don't bring in the punters. They are a business and can't thrive on half empty lounges just for the sake of giving some musicians a place to play for their own gratification. If cover bands can bring in the punters (for obvious reasons) this is not the fault of the pubs for going with what will keep them in business. They supply entertainment to keep their clientele entertained. If original bands aren't as entertaining, what choice do they have? Maybe when the economy comes back to what it was then original bands will have a better chance.

---

OT, but I absolutely LOVE those shred videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipy58SaIRhs&feature=related

maccored

theres no point in bands blaming venues. if you have an original band and cant get a gig in a venue, play one online or organise one in someones gaff - do something rather than throw the hands up in the air giving out.

OkComputerGirl

Rigsby wrote: »

I assumed by "copy cat" bands that you meant cover bands... as in a band "copying" (i.e. "covering", therefore not original ) a song.

Cover bands and original (well original for lack of a better word) bands are totally different..
Copy cat bands as in they all copy each others image and sound.. nothing original...

OkComputerGirl

odonopenmic wrote: »

I'm amazed! IMO Dublin has never been healthier or had the diversity of bands and venues there are now. I don't mean to be rude here but OP, if you are going to gigs three times a week and can't find a gig, where are on earth are you going or what exactly are you hoping to find? Personally, I can't count the number of good bands around at the moment and I think it's terrible if others can't see that either. Given that most bands play other cities too, I don't really see that there's a significant difference between the music scenes within Ireland.

Have to say as well, I'm also surprised OP, that you would bemoan bands that put style over substance and nearly in the same sentence praise Fight Like Apes??!

Trust me when i say ive seen pretty much every band in dublin. Im not a great fan of Fight Like Apes but in fairness to them, they do stand out. Theres **** all bands that stand out, thats what im trying to say. They all blend into the scene, none of them being special or anything. What bands would you recommend? Im looking forward to the HWCH festival... Im sure there'll be a few at that hopefully.

novarock

OkComputerGirl wrote: »

Trust me when i say ive seen pretty much every band in dublin. Im not a great fan of Fight Like Apes but in fairness to them, they do stand out. Theres **** all bands that stand out, thats what im trying to say. They all blend into the scene, none of them being special or anything. What bands would you recommend? Im looking forward to the HWCH festival... Im sure there'll be a few at that hopefully.

I really doubt you have seen every band in Dublin. I think you are being a bit close minded.

Orando Broom

Waking-Dreams wrote: »

Pubs have no interest in supporting original bands that don't bring in the punters. They are a business and can't thrive on half empty lounges just for the sake of giving some musicians a place to play for their own gratification. If cover bands can bring in the punters (for obvious reasons) this is not the fault of the pubs for going with what will keep them in business. They supply entertainment to keep their clientele entertained. If original bands aren't as entertaining, what choice do they have? Maybe when the economy comes back to what it was then original bands will have a better chance.

---

OT, but I absolutely LOVE those shred videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipy58SaIRhs&feature=related

I'm afraid you're wrong. If pubs aren't hosting them now they definately won't when the and if the economy comes back. Pubs in dublin are the greediest most self serving group in the country. You just need to see their attitude (away from music) to get an idea. A price freeze was their answer to the recession. It was conveinent that the price froze at the high point. that is jsut one example. You will never get venues like you would in Chicago or London as two examples because of the template for a 'successful' pub that has been laid out by the pub trade itself. This template is backward thingking and anti progression and not would owner would take the chance of running a Tuesday or wednesday night for live original music. you wander the city you'll find few if any Lounges heaving with punters. a band paying for free with twenty punters having an average of three pints would be a boost to profits. However with the shower of old fogeys that run the show the chances of it happening are practically zero. The young bar owners are only interested in opening trendy bars along the lines of Krystal or Dandelion to get their fizog's on Showbiz Ireland.

By the way I spent eight happy years in the trade and I can guarantee you were I ever in a position to open a pub I can assure you it would be the O'Donoghues of Merrion Row for the live original Irish rock scene in this century. Whatever my crowd would be would be.

And what's further more I'd turn a profit. A big profit.

drumdrum

Orando Broom wrote: »

Now the bands themselves also have to share the blame. How many of your peers do you know have gone round to pubs not normally associated with the scene and offered their services for free? Pubs are running into trouble and have several quiet nights. How many have stepped outside the scene bubble and tried to expand their audience in different pubs. Dublin bands tend to be very passive and expect the corwd to come to them. Maybe they need to work a little harder.

I would also suggest that bands try to eschew the family and friends brigade and force themselves to work for thier audience. It's nice to support your siblins/mates etc. but you have to wean them off the tit at some point.

I agree with this sentiment. In my experience bands as a whole are quite lazy. They dont put enough time into promoting their band, bring the same few mates to every gig, dont try and get feedback and blame the promoters for playing to a half empty venue. In my experience, the self-promotion way for bands ONLY pays off in the long term. Putting posters in town wherever you can about your gig is a great way to get your name out there. More than likely 99% of the people who walk by wont bother going to the gig, but more gigs and more posters and more exposure to your name and suddenly you get a "huh...Ive heard of those guys somewhere...." sort of respect and the chances of the person going to your gig or at least checking out your myspace first increases.
Yeah it sucks spending time and money printing out posters and putting up online adverts and then playing to half empty venues, but if you stick with it, you at least give yourself a proper chance in the long term. Word of mouth, especially in a scene as tiny as Dublin, is vital and can make or break a band.

Lastly, Id say that if the radios played more independent Irish music and even expanded their genres a little, pubs and such would be more open to putting on unsigned bands. WD does have a point though....pubs have bills to pay and half empty lounges arent going to pay them!

Waking-Dreams

Well, there was plenty of slots for original bands before the recession, but now that people are going out less, what do you expect these businessmen to do? Yes, some pubs will cater to original bands because there is a specific market for that, and that will be their niche. So for bands, it's a case of finding those particular places to play. However, you will have every other original band trying to get their foot in the door too. So it comes down to competition, which will always be the case. The same bands all fighting for their piece of the gig-going crowd.

A band paying for free with twenty punters having an average of three pints would be a boost to profits.

I do agree but don't bands want the fri/sat night slots? So, they will have to expect they are going to find less and less venues who will give them such a slot over cover bands for obvious reasons.

It's just business at the end of the day.

Waking-Dreams

drumdrum wrote: »

In my experience Irish bands as a whole are quite lazy. They dont put enough time into promoting their band, bring the same few mates to every gig, dont try and get feedback and blame the promoters for playing to a half empty venue.

It's true of bands in every country. We only think it's Irish bands that are worse because we live here and see it on a regular basis but it occurs globally. Saw it in Vancouver and all over Canada. You'll find examples everywhere I guess.

Can I put a suggestion out there to bands and say maybe you should work on making your gigs more of an "event", and maybe play a little less often? If you play too regularly what incentive will people have to go to your latest gig, “ack, they're always playing; I can check them out another time”... and watch as your attendences start to dwindle when everyone thinks that way.

The other thing is that people ARE going out less. They're more picky about what gigs to go to as well. I haven't attended a local gig in a year or two and I love music. But I have lots of other things I love too and I've spent more years watching local shows than I care to remember, so I'm alot more choosey about where I go. I would probably only go to a special event or if it was to meet some friends. Of course, I'm just one example, but I wonder how many people act the same way. They like live music but they just have way too many commitments and other interests. Something has got to give. As people get jobs and begin earning again, I'm sure it will bounce back. This recession is quite a nasty one but there have been others in the past remember.

drumdrum

Waking-Dreams wrote: »

It's true of bands in every country. We only think it's Irish bands that are worse because we live here and see it on a regular basis but it occurs globally. Saw it in Vancouver and all over Canada. You'll find examples everywhere I guess.

I know......guess I came across a little naive there. Old post edited!!

I agree about the going out thing.....and on another note, a lot of people that do "go out" dont necessarily drink that much. Off-licence trade has kept well in this recession with a lot of people "pre-drinking" in someones house before they hit the town, especially on a Fri / Sat night. Especially as pubs charge upwards of E5 for a pint or glass of wine. You can get a cheap full bottle of wine or six pack of beers from the off-licence for about E7/E8 these days. May taste like **** but it gets the job done.
My point is that people are even drinking less when they go into town, and they are going in later. Most places dont hit their peal until about midnight or so. A lot of venues have been offering late night slots mostly to cover bands to cater to these peaks. So not only is the scene changing but so are peoples attitudes to gigs. Ive been to many of these such places with late live bands and the **** Ive seen some of the bands having to put up with from drunked loutes is unbelievable!!

Einstein

OkComputerGirl wrote: »

I would like to get everyone's opinion on the Dublin music scene. Personally i think its very stagnant and full of copy cat bands who prefer style over substance and originality..

Opinions?

Dublin (or Ireland more specifically) doesn't have a scene. They have underaverage venues, a national broadcaster who has no interest in playing up and coming bands...and a populous who generally have no interest in Live music.

Hence, why any decent bands, who genuinely want to do something, will leave the country and head for The UK or Germany.

Waking-Dreams

drumdrum wrote: »

I know......guess I came across a little naive there. Old post edited!!

I agree about the going out thing.....and on another note, a lot of people that do "go out" dont necessarily drink that much. Off-licence trade has kept well in this recession with a lot of people "pre-drinking" in someones house before they hit the town, especially on a Fri / Sat night. Especially as pubs charge upwards of E5 for a pint or glass of wine. You can get a cheap full bottle of wine or six pack of beers from the off-licence for about E7/E8 these days. May taste like **** but it gets the job done.

My point is that people are even drinking less when they go into town, and they are going in later. Most places dont hit their peal until about midnight or so. A lot of venues have been offering late night slots mostly to cover bands to cater to these peaks. So not only is the scene changing but so are peoples attitudes to gigs. Ive been to many of these such places with late live bands and the **** Ive seen some of the bands having to put up with from drunked loutes is unbelievable!!

Nasty that. Nothing worse than a drunken heckler, because even when you do point out how much of an knob they are, over the PA with dry wit for the amusement of others, they're usually like, "what did you say? huh? Gimmie that mic there..."

Oh yeah, there's €4.99 bottle of red wine that Aldi do which does it for me.

Here's another thought.

Many people are also just going out to score. Yes, they might love music too but if you were to remove the possibility of them meeting someone, their motivation could change and any band's live show and music alone will not be as appealing (unless they're really amazing). I know lots of couples still go out too or people who already have a gf/bf and still enjoy going out with mates, but I'd wager a decent percentage of the bodies that make up an audience are single and would not be there if it weren't for the chance of meeting someone.

Is it possible, once people are in a comfy relationship they start going out less often? Speaking from experience, I'd say it's quite possible, and the older they get even moreso. Nights-in with a DVD and a take-away and off licence probably beat heading into town, more often than before.

You could say, live music is dependent on lots of single people who are there to meet others while checking out bands.

Waking-Dreams

Einstein wrote: »

Dublin (or Ireland more specifically) doesn't have a scene. They have underaverage venues, a national broadcaster who has no interest in playing up and coming bands...and a populous who generally have no interest in Live music.

Hence, why any decent bands, who genuinely want to do something, will leave the country and head for The UK or Germany.

I could honestly say the same thing about Canada, except I don't agree with your statement; I think you're only half right. There's a mix of different venues, there's also a mix of different people who like live music and those who could care less. Making generalisations doesn't help.

Broadcasters are also owned by big media corporations, and driven by their traditional economic logic; sell advertising space.

It is not in their interest to play up and coming bands, only approved playlists of top 40 artists. But anyways, you're forgetting that no one really listens to much radio except for the talk radio shows, so what's the problem? Do you think if a band doesn't get radio play they are at a big disadvantage? Explain then how lots of non-mainstream type bands who would never get radio play still manage to establish huge followings. There's more than just radio.

bassbomber

maccored wrote: »

theres no point in bands blaming venues. if you have an original band and cant get a gig in a venue, play one online or organise one in someones gaff - do something rather than throw the hands up in the air giving out.

very true alot of us need to get off our arses but even still its a massive uphill struggle which few get very far with

The Volt

It seems to me like Homestar Runner came out (I actually like these) and then dozens of bands tried to mimmick them but ended up sounding like Blink-182 with diarrhoea

Bootsy.

99% of bands in the world are like this. The standard 4-square guitar/bass/drums kind of band doesn't lend itself very well to originality or freshness.

Truly creative and unique bands like say, TV On The Radio, or even Fight Like Apes are very rare, in Dublin or anywhere else.

Waking-Dreams

bassbomber wrote: »

very true alot of us need to get off our arses but even still its a massive uphill struggle which few get very far with

Sometimes the path of least resistance never leads anywhere worthwhile. If all your musical achievements were handed to you on a silver platter, me thinks they would lose a significant amount of meaning. When we work hard at something, and it pays off, therein lies the satisfaction of true accomplishment.

As the saying goes: if you want anything worthwhile in this life, you have to work for it.

waltersobchak

Voltwad wrote: »

It seems to me like Homestar Runner came out (I actually like these) and then dozens of bands tried to mimmick them but ended up sounding like Blink-182 with diarrhoea

Massive plus one Volt.. Plus fu*king Fallout Boy didnt help matters either..

MilanPan!c

Trampoline Scene wrote: »

original music in this country not just Dublin, at the moment is a dead duck in the water for the most part, a lot of it has to do with self belief, the Irish are a highly creative people but confidence and belief is lacking unfortunately..also there is a serious amount of exploitation going on in the original music scene..take the HWCH wekkend in Dublin in October..two bands i personally know were not chosen to play in this, they're exceptional bands, with their own style..apparently 800 bands entered 100 bands were picked, 10euro entry fee!! not a lot but someones making..who picks and a lot of these things are based on having connections not having talent..personally i think it's time for bands to stop allowing themselves be exploited and work together when organising gigs, and festivals etc..

Don't know about this... I know a couple of bands with no special connections at all that made it in...

MilanPan!c

Trampoline Scene wrote: »

Cheers for reply..where are the bands based just iut of interest...

Dublin... and I don't know where the other is from... just know them through boards... [googles]

Dublin and Galway.

Waking-Dreams

Welcome TS,

Don't take any of the following as an attack on you, I just want to probe a little deeper into some of the things you said.

a lot of it has to do with self belief, the Irish are a highly creative people but confidence and belief is lacking unfortunately.

How do you ascertain this? How can you gauge who has belief and who doesn't? What's the criteria? It just has the same kind of ring to it as much of the New Age / Self-Help material that is out there.

There seems to be loads of musicians that have the self-belief and confidence in their abilities (people who think they “have what it takes”) but that doesn't correlate with being able to write a good song, which is what actually matters.

What I think is that musicians read enough interviews of popular musicians, who they admire, and who are asked by the press, “what advice do you have to give aspiring musicians?” and the answer is usually in one way or another, “oh, well, you have to believe in yourself and be confident”.

Whereas simply saying, “you have to write brilliant tunes and have a degree of luck on your side too”, would be more accurate but it doesn't have the same zing to it.

also there is a serious amount of exploitation going on in the original music scene..take the HWCH weekend in Dublin in October..two bands i personally know were not chosen to play in this, they're exceptional bands, with their own style.

Let's not have this turn into a HWCH bashing match because people you know did not get picked over someone else (which is inevitable with any kind of music competition/battle of the bands event).

However, that said, I do agree that these things are set-up with the goal of making money from bands. Yes, they provide the winning band a prize but out of curiosity, has any band gone on to great things off the back of winning one of these events? Serious question. Is there a, “Where are they now?” section on the HWCH website where you can see where the previous years' winners have gotten on?

My question would be, if your friends in those two bands are as good as you say, being exceptional and all, why would they enter a competition which can be as much about a popularity contest as about good music?

The flip-side is if they were selected and went on to win the event, they would probably give meaning to the whole thing, as HWCH being a good thing but when they don't get picked, suddenly the event is a load of crap and just a money making scam exploiting bands.

personally i think it's time for bands to stop allowing themselves be exploited

This can only come from education; trial and error. But for every band that do manage to avoid age old mistakes, there's probably 3 or 4 who won't and keep the exploitation in place. Just like people who fall for charlatans, healing crystals, psychics and the like. For every person who sees through the masquerade, there's lots who don't for their own reasons.

thejigsaw

What I have always found to be the case with Dublin is that musicians are very reluctant to get involved in anything that doesnt either sound and look exactly like their favourite bands or sound and look exactly like what is the popular thing right now.

Ive been trying to get a new band together for around two years now and what ive found time and time again is that people just cant get past the influence of what is "in" right now. Take the example of Adabesi Shank. An original band who are riding a well earned wave of success. They have their own sound, they have their own image, they have the air of artistic integrity to them and right now every cool dude muso wants a piece of them. This is the kind of success that every original band wants to have. But the problem is that musicians seem to lack the intellectual ability to be able to tell the difference between wanting to BE LIKE them and wanting to BE them. Because of this it suddenly not only becomes acceptable to start theiving their ideas/style wholesale and claim it to be some form of morphic resonance inspired genius but it becomes the norm.

I had a potential guitar player invite me round to his house to play me a recording of a song he wrote and every note, every beat, every riff could be traced back to adabesi shank.

I had a potential drummer bail on an audition because he said he found a band that was more along the lines of what he was into ( "adebisi shank, biffy clyro, tool )

These are just two of many many examples I could give.

Eventually a couple of these guys get together and start an "original" band "inspired" by their heroes. They spend a couple of years toiling it out and getting nowhere and eventually blame it all on the scene and venues and the blah blah blah

It never ever once occurs to them that they havent got an original idea worth writing on a postcard let alone signing a massively huge record deal for.

Adebisi Shank is of course just one example. Replace their name with another and add a couple more and the same template can be applied to every genre.

Now obviously nothing is created in a vacum. Every band has influences and points of reference and music wouldnt be music if it didnt but theres a difference between using your influences to create something new and inspired and being a bunch of posers lost in some sad little fantasy game of dress up as your hero.

Everyone always breaks it down to cover band and original band but i really dont think its that simple. A term ive been using for years is "genre tribute band".

Dublin, like all cities, is full of genre tribute bands that masqurade as original bands.

Right now Im making my first album on my own because i wont compromise and have other musicians bring their toxic hero worship into my music. Thats a sad thought for me but it still beats the alternative.

Waking-Dreams

Aye, negative comments are to be expected, treasured even, because friends and other local bands can't give musicians 'proper' feedback (since they have an incentive to lie and thus preserve the friendly relationship). This is true of all relationships really. People won't risk being 100% honest because it might get them into trouble or cause offence. However, by not being honest, the band are left to discover that they're not so great the hard way. At least with the Internet, there's lots of good feedback to be had from strangers, while still writing songs.

I don't see that much merit in any band competitions, insofar as they are just another opportunity to play in front of an audience; nothing more, nothing less.

wearebudapest

we are from ennis,here is our effort

http://soundcloud.com/ennis2011/sets

benestoria2

you should visit camden in London if you really wanna see tones and tones of very sylish copycat bands